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RE: The England Football Thread - 11/10/2013 2:52:20 PM   
OPEN YOUR EYES

 

Posts: 4259
Joined: 5/2/2012
I only knew the game was on this morning.I thought we were playing on saturday evening.
This shows my non-interest in the national game.

(in reply to Professor Moriarty)
Post #: 5911
RE: The England Football Thread - 11/10/2013 8:04:45 PM   
Scott_

 

Posts: 3883
Joined: 26/6/2008
From: Leeds
I feel like I should moan about something. I don't want to but I will anyway.

Could anybody tell me what Andros Townsend has done this season to get a start tonight? Besides being a Tottenham player...

Looking forward to finally seeing Sturridge get a game, he's looked a level above any other striker we've got.

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(in reply to OPEN YOUR EYES)
Post #: 5912
RE: The England Football Thread - 11/10/2013 8:08:24 PM   
superdan


Posts: 8044
Joined: 31/7/2008

quote:

ORIGINAL: Scott_

I feel like I should moan about something. I don't want to but I will anyway.

Could anybody tell me what Andros Townsend has done this season to get a start tonight? Besides being a Tottenham player...

Looking forward to finally seeing Sturridge get a game, he's looked a level above any other striker we've got.


To be fair he's made a lively start in these opening moments.

(in reply to Scott_)
Post #: 5913
RE: The England Football Thread - 11/10/2013 8:46:06 PM   
superdan


Posts: 8044
Joined: 31/7/2008
Lots of huff and puff from England but little invention and penetration. Fairly typical really.

(in reply to superdan)
Post #: 5914
RE: The England Football Thread - 11/10/2013 8:53:34 PM   
Olaf


Posts: 23659
Joined: 26/2/2007
From: 41N 93W
two questions:

1. why is Kyle Walker so bad
2. who voted ITV 'channel of the year'

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Post #: 5915
RE: The England Football Thread - 11/10/2013 8:59:44 PM   
superdan


Posts: 8044
Joined: 31/7/2008

quote:

ORIGINAL: Olaf

two questions:

1. why is Kyle Walker so bad
2. who voted ITV 'channel of the year'


1. I've said it before and I'll say it again, I'd be inclined to pick Jenkinson ahead of him even though he's not a starter for Arsenal. I'd also put Johnson and even Richards ahead of him too.

2. Morons.

(in reply to Olaf)
Post #: 5916
RE: The England Football Thread - 11/10/2013 9:14:04 PM   
Olaf


Posts: 23659
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From: 41N 93W
At least he's done the honourable thing and bravely gotten himself suspended for the next game. A true patriot.

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Post #: 5917
RE: The England Football Thread - 11/10/2013 9:16:47 PM   
superdan


Posts: 8044
Joined: 31/7/2008

quote:

ORIGINAL: Olaf

At least he's done the honourable thing and bravely gotten himself suspended for the next game. A true patriot.


One might even call him a lionhearted hero. On another note, not many players are as adept at scoring with their shin as Wayne Rooney.

(in reply to Olaf)
Post #: 5918
RE: The England Football Thread - 11/10/2013 9:17:24 PM   
Dirk Miggler


Posts: 1080
Joined: 14/1/2009
To be fair to Townsend he's done well

(in reply to Olaf)
Post #: 5919
RE: The England Football Thread - 11/10/2013 9:30:15 PM   
Dirk Miggler


Posts: 1080
Joined: 14/1/2009
Just as we were taking control looking likely to score another. In true English fashion the last 15 will be nailbiting !

(in reply to Dirk Miggler)
Post #: 5920
RE: The England Football Thread - 11/10/2013 9:34:33 PM   
Scott_

 

Posts: 3883
Joined: 26/6/2008
From: Leeds
Well...don't I look stupid, more than usual anyway.

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(in reply to Dirk Miggler)
Post #: 5921
RE: The England Football Thread - 11/10/2013 9:40:02 PM   
Dirk Miggler


Posts: 1080
Joined: 14/1/2009
Did you know he was born in the same hospital as David Beckham !

(in reply to Scott_)
Post #: 5922
RE: The England Football Thread - 11/10/2013 10:04:58 PM   
superdan


Posts: 8044
Joined: 31/7/2008
Good win in the end from England, no real complaints given the scoreline. Pleased for Townsend who look positive from the outset, and good to see England score half of their goals from open play against a massed defence. Poland next, which will be a much sterner test but the prize if we win is enormous.

< Message edited by superdan -- 11/10/2013 10:06:03 PM >

(in reply to Dirk Miggler)
Post #: 5923
RE: The England Football Thread - 12/10/2013 6:40:24 AM   
Dirk Miggler


Posts: 1080
Joined: 14/1/2009
Chuffed for Townsend it was a fine debut and wonderfully struck goal. Sturridge and Rooney were quiet but came to life in second half. I'm struggling to see the point in Lampard in this game, if he's in that deeper lying role Hodgson would do as well to just play Carrick from the off. Welbeck had an indifferent game but he seems to have a a knack of producing the goods in an England shirt being involved in 2 of the goals again.

Still unsure about Walker but I like that Hodgson has been sticking with him and giving him a fair chance. Personally I would like to see a fit Micah Richards in there.

I might get a few disagreeing with me but I think we should now have Baines as first choice LB and have Shaw deputising. I like Cole as a player, he's been a great servant but I think it would benefit us in the long run if Shaw was given a chance in the squad and was on the plane to Brazil. If we qualify that is.

I was happy with the performance only because I expected us to make a lot harder work of it (like England always do) but from the start I thought we looked comfortable and a goal would come eventually. Certainly won't get carried away though and Tues is by no means a foregone conclusion.

< Message edited by Dirk Miggler -- 12/10/2013 6:42:39 AM >

(in reply to superdan)
Post #: 5924
RE: The England Football Thread - 12/10/2013 10:22:31 AM   
Skiba


Posts: 4328
Joined: 24/11/2005
From: London
Some nice stuff played, particularly right before they scored. Sturridge has to be first choice up front...as Dirk said, quiet first half but some quality touches and movement in the second half.

I'd still take Cole and Baines for left back...I'd prefer Cole up against someone like Ronaldo but Baines should be first choice as he offers so much more going forward, and obviously set-pieces

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Post #: 5925
RE: The England Football Thread - 12/10/2013 10:26:43 AM   
galvatron


Posts: 1203
Joined: 1/10/2005

quote:

ORIGINAL: Skiba

Some nice stuff played, particularly right before they scored. Sturridge has to be first choice up front...as Dirk said, quiet first half but some quality touches and movement in the second half.

I'd still take Cole and Baines for left back...I'd prefer Cole up against someone like Ronaldo but Baines should be first choice as he offers so much more going forward, and obviously set-pieces


At the World Cup I'm not convinced playing Rooney and Sturridge together will give England the midfield solidity required against the top teams. Both will be too high up the pitch and will be passed by. I'd go three in the middle and Rooney up top on his own.



(in reply to Skiba)
Post #: 5926
RE: The England Football Thread - 12/10/2013 10:42:16 AM   
OPEN YOUR EYES

 

Posts: 4259
Joined: 5/2/2012
I thought everyone did well,though I'm slightly bemused about the amount of criticism being leveled at Walker.

(in reply to galvatron)
Post #: 5927
RE: The England Football Thread - 12/10/2013 11:10:02 AM   
Flatulent_Bob


Posts: 7969
Joined: 30/9/2005

quote:

ORIGINAL: Olaf

At least he's done the honourable thing and bravely gotten himself suspended for the next game. A true patriot.

I agree that he shouldn't be starting for England, but he's actually a nice guy. If that counts for anything.

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Oh my God! They banned Kenny!


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Post #: 5928
RE: The England Football Thread - 13/10/2013 10:19:38 AM   
Dirk Miggler


Posts: 1080
Joined: 14/1/2009

quote:

ORIGINAL: galvatron


quote:

ORIGINAL: Skiba

Some nice stuff played, particularly right before they scored. Sturridge has to be first choice up front...as Dirk said, quiet first half but some quality touches and movement in the second half.

I'd still take Cole and Baines for left back...I'd prefer Cole up against someone like Ronaldo but Baines should be first choice as he offers so much more going forward, and obviously set-pieces


At the World Cup I'm not convinced playing Rooney and Sturridge together will give England the midfield solidity required against the top teams. Both will be too high up the pitch and will be passed by. I'd go three in the middle and Rooney up top on his own.





I don't think they would be biggest problem fit and firing against better teams who will look to play (unlike Montenegro) they will cause problems but I worry more about our inability to keep the ball under pressure and the defence which I think will get torn apart against the likes of Argentina, Spain, Brazil etc although Jagielka has looked quite solid, Cahill is far too error prone and I think the two biggest culprits when it come to giving away possession even on fri where we had a lot of the ball were Lampard and Gerrard.

I think if Hodgson is gonna go with a 4-2-3-1 then he must play Carrick with Gerrard.

(in reply to galvatron)
Post #: 5929
RE: The England Football Thread - 14/10/2013 11:48:14 PM   
ElephantBoy

 

Posts: 8113
Joined: 13/4/2006
At the moment just based on form I would pick Baines ahead of Cole. Like someone said in a big world cup game against one of the big nations Cole's experience might edge it for him, but we can always cross that bridge where we come to it. Now is the time for Baines to get his chance full-time.

I see some nervy moments tomorrow (of course!) but think we should be able to see it though. We really don't won't to be taking the chance on a play-off.

Its a shame for Walker I see him as a regular in the future and I have not been that convinced with Jones or Smiling as of late, but hopefully they can do a good enough job.

(in reply to Dirk Miggler)
Post #: 5930
RE: The England Football Thread - 15/10/2013 7:28:56 AM   
superdan


Posts: 8044
Joined: 31/7/2008

quote:

ORIGINAL: ElephantBoy

At the moment just based on form I would pick Baines ahead of Cole. Like someone said in a big world cup game against one of the big nations Cole's experience might edge it for him, but we can always cross that bridge where we come to it. Now is the time for Baines to get his chance full-time.

I see some nervy moments tomorrow (of course!) but think we should be able to see it though. We really don't won't to be taking the chance on a play-off.

Its a shame for Walker I see him as a regular in the future and I have not been that convinced with Jones or Smiling as of late, but hopefully they can do a good enough job.


It baffles me that it's one of them that is expected to cover for Walker at RB, since it's not the preferred position for either of them. We are actually quite flush with decent RB's' at the moment (which makes a change from the 1990's/2000's) and yet we still find ourselves having to play people there who are better in other positions. Not that either of them are terrible at RB of course, just that it seems a daft situation.

(in reply to ElephantBoy)
Post #: 5931
RE: The England Football Thread - 15/10/2013 7:29:44 AM   
galvatron


Posts: 1203
Joined: 1/10/2005
I think Baines has been better than Cole for several years now he just doesn't have the big name behind him. I'm sure if he played for United he'd play every game for England. I've also suggested playing both Cole and Baines on the left flank.

(in reply to ElephantBoy)
Post #: 5932
RE: The England Football Thread - 15/10/2013 8:18:55 AM   
jonson


Posts: 8919
Joined: 30/9/2005

quote:

ORIGINAL: galvatron

I think Baines has been better than Cole for several years now he just doesn't have the big name behind him. I'm sure if he played for United he'd play every game for England. I've also suggested playing both Cole and Baines on the left flank.


I wouldn't say several years but possibly the last season. Baines's problem is lack of big match experience - which you point out by saying he would have played more if he had been a Utd player - quite possibly.
The one thing you can say about Cole is, he has played in far bigger matches than anyone in the England team. It goes a long way, Baines is just unlucky to have been around at the same time as the best English player in his position for 25 years (if not longer IMO)

As for tonight, well, I can see an England win confidently, then obvious cause for celebration and the great tabloid build up to winning it/not making it past the group stages.
However if I hear 1 more mention of 1973, Polish keepers, dodgy builders or John fucking irritating twat Motson reminiscing about his crap interview with Alf Ramsey, I'll scream. And the same goes for Harry Redknapp, another tosspot who likes a quote and a photo at this time of the year.

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Post #: 5933
RE: The England Football Thread - 15/10/2013 9:33:13 AM   
Dirk Miggler


Posts: 1080
Joined: 14/1/2009
Reading the paper this morning (yesterday's paper) the stats would suggest Baines is better all round leading Cole in interceptions, tackles won and clearances, obviously he's ahead in the attacking stats. I'm no stats man myself so take that as you will but I also don't fully agree to the suggestion that Cole is the better defender, the only edge he has on Baines is the experience and the only way Baines is going to get that big game experience is by playing in them so playing Baines and dropping him at first sign of a Germany or Brazil is not the way to go for me, for all we know he could turn out to be far better than Cole in that scenario but until he is tested we will never know.

(in reply to jonson)
Post #: 5934
RE: The England Football Thread - 15/10/2013 9:49:59 AM   
jonson


Posts: 8919
Joined: 30/9/2005

quote:

ORIGINAL: Dirk Miggler

Reading the paper this morning (yesterday's paper) the stats would suggest Baines is better all round leading Cole in interceptions, tackles won and clearances, obviously he's ahead in the attacking stats. I'm no stats man myself so take that as you will but I also don't fully agree to the suggestion that Cole is the better defender, the only edge he has on Baines is the experience and the only way Baines is going to get that big game experience is by playing in them so playing Baines and dropping him at first sign of a Germany or Brazil is not the way to go for me, for all we know he could turn out to be far better than Cole in that scenario but until he is tested we will never know.



Oh, I agree, but we'll never know, because no football manager would be prepared to take the risk. Perhaps Baines's goals (over Ashley's lack of) may be the difference between winning the World Cup and not, but what Roy does know is he'll never be criticised for playing Cole over Baines. I think the England managers job is more reputation damage limitation rather than being allowed the freedom to pick who he wants.

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Post #: 5935
RE: The England Football Thread - 15/10/2013 10:29:29 AM   
Frank Castle


Posts: 2677
Joined: 14/10/2005
From: Parts Unknown

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rinc


quote:

ORIGINAL: Flatulent_Bob

At the moment who would be the stand out coach to replace Roy? That is the problem, just as much as the poor performances.


Current English managers in the PL:

Ian Hollloway
Steve Bruce
Alan Pardew
Sam Allardyce

Oh dear


Ian holloway all the way least he would be entertaining

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Post #: 5936
RE: The England Football Thread - 15/10/2013 10:32:50 AM   
galvatron


Posts: 1203
Joined: 1/10/2005

quote:

ORIGINAL: Dirk Miggler

Reading the paper this morning (yesterday's paper) the stats would suggest Baines is better all round leading Cole in interceptions, tackles won and clearances, obviously he's ahead in the attacking stats. I'm no stats man myself so take that as you will but I also don't fully agree to the suggestion that Cole is the better defender, the only edge he has on Baines is the experience and the only way Baines is going to get that big game experience is by playing in them so playing Baines and dropping him at first sign of a Germany or Brazil is not the way to go for me, for all we know he could turn out to be far better than Cole in that scenario but until he is tested we will never know.



I think Baines is ahead of Cole in several facets of his game. The stats also back this up. I think Cole's declined in the last three seasons.

(in reply to Dirk Miggler)
Post #: 5937
RE: The England Football Thread - 15/10/2013 11:40:05 AM   
Dirk Miggler


Posts: 1080
Joined: 14/1/2009
quote:

ORIGINAL: jonson

quote:

ORIGINAL: Dirk Miggler

Reading the paper this morning (yesterday's paper) the stats would suggest Baines is better all round leading Cole in interceptions, tackles won and clearances, obviously he's ahead in the attacking stats.

I'm no stats man myself so take that as you will but I also don't fully agree to the suggestion that Cole is the better defender, the only edge he has on Baines is the experience and the only way Baines is going to get that big game experience is by playing in them so playing Baines and dropping him at first sign of a Germany or Brazil is not the way to go for me, for all we know he could turn out to be far better than Cole in that scenario but until he is tested we will never know.



Oh, I agree, but we'll never know, because no football manager would be prepared to take the risk. Perhaps Baines's goals (over Ashley's lack of) may be the difference between winning the World Cup and not, but what Roy does know is he'll never be criticised for playing Cole over Baines. I think the England managers job is more reputation damage limitation rather than being allowed the freedom to pick who he wants.


Agreed and that's one of the biggest problems with the national side.

With everything that's going on with the FA and Dyke, expectations being as low as they have ever been and obviously this is all depending on if we win tonight, I don't see a better opportunity for an England manager to really shake things up. Issue a rallying call that if you do the buisness this year for your club your going to get your chance and it's up to you to take it. Forget sentiment this is about building for the future. At the moment the likes of Lampard, Milner, Lennon (granted he's injured at the moment but no doubt would have been in the squad if fit) aren't doing anything that Lallana, Redmond, Barkley, Morrison aren't doing for their clubs, same as Cole with Baines and Shaw.

If you want the balance of experience and youth then take Gerrard, he's the captain, a leader, has a wealth of experience and more importantly still carrys that aura about him that top players and clubs still respect and fear. Also there is still Rooney, Harte, Johnson, Walcott all with great experience and recent good form. They will more than likely be in the first 11 and with them in the side that can strike a good balance with the young bucks coming through.



< Message edited by Dirk Miggler -- 15/10/2013 11:46:34 AM >

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Post #: 5938
RE: The England Football Thread - 15/10/2013 1:25:45 PM   
horribleives

 

Posts: 4976
Joined: 12/6/2009
From: The North
The Baines/Cole thing doesn't really bother me - choosing between two great left backs is far less worrying than having no good right backs.

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Post #: 5939
RE: The England Football Thread - 15/10/2013 3:29:17 PM   
Dirk Miggler


Posts: 1080
Joined: 14/1/2009
quote:

ORIGINAL: horribleives

The Baines/Cole thing doesn't really bother me - choosing between two great left backs is far less worrying than having no good right backs.


I don't think right back is that much of a problem area, Richards, Johnson and Walker ain't that bad a selection to choose from. Richards get criticised for his defensive play but I would still rate him ahead of Walker and Johnson in that area of their games.

The more worrying area for me is in the centre of defence, I don't have much confidence in Cahill so Jones and Smalling really need to step it up and progress this year. Caulker made the right move for his career in the long run but I fear despite any good form he shows he will be overlooked due to his playing for Cardiff City.

< Message edited by Dirk Miggler -- 15/10/2013 3:30:34 PM >

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Post #: 5940
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