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RE: Doctor Who - 30/9/2012 12:12:56 AM   
elab49


Posts: 54597
Joined: 1/10/2005
quote:

ORIGINAL: Rgirvan44

So what do people feel now we have had a pretty arcless miniseries? Do they want arcs, or are they happy with the format?


I'm not sure - for me the quality of the middle 3 episodes was too poor to properly judge. I've got no issue with standalone episodes though. But this wasn't, for me, a great example of them.


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Deviation] LIKE AMERICA'S SWEETHEARTS TOO. IT MADE ME LAUGH A LOT AND THOUGHT IT WAS WITTY. ALSO I FEEL SLOWLY DYING INSIDE. I KEEP AGREEING WITH ELAB.


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Post #: 16711
RE: Doctor Who - 30/9/2012 12:14:14 AM   
Shifty Bench

 

Posts: 15398
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Land of the Scots

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hood_Man

I'm not sure what it could actually do to be honest, maybe it's the Weeping Angel version of Lenny from Of Mice and Men, big but too dumb to do anything practical


That is actually very true. It couldn't even spit at them, it was that useless. It seems to be one of those ideas that sounded much cooler on paper

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Post #: 16712
RE: Doctor Who - 30/9/2012 12:14:21 AM   
MovieAddict247


Posts: 3751
Joined: 5/6/2009

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rgirvan44

So what do people feel now we have had a pretty arcless miniseries? Do they want arcs, or are they happy with the format?


I liked it - I've enjoyed each episode though, so that might make a difference.

Also, it's a nice way to change the format (though not permanently) - a new companion halfway through is more exciting than a standard two part finale for one to leave, and a new series start for another.

And although there haven't been any major arc plotlines, all the episodes had pretty consistent themes. All in all, I've really enjoyed this run. Cannot wait for Christmas now.

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Post #: 16713
RE: Doctor Who - 30/9/2012 12:19:13 AM   
elab49


Posts: 54597
Joined: 1/10/2005
It doesn't feel like half way through in my head though. This is the (amazingly pointlessly short) series over. Xmas we get a new companion (so a normalish change over really). And then a new series some time next year I guess?

Was there a point to there only being 5 episodes at all?


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Deviation] LIKE AMERICA'S SWEETHEARTS TOO. IT MADE ME LAUGH A LOT AND THOUGHT IT WAS WITTY. ALSO I FEEL SLOWLY DYING INSIDE. I KEEP AGREEING WITH ELAB.


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Post #: 16714
RE: Doctor Who - 30/9/2012 12:19:43 AM   
originalcynic


Posts: 35
Joined: 30/9/2012
Karen was asked if she would return for the 50th Anniversary episode. She said, "I know the answer to that but I can't tell you."


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Post #: 16715
RE: Doctor Who - 30/9/2012 12:20:29 AM   
matty_b


Posts: 14563
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From: Outpost 31 calling McMurtle.
I very much liked it being arc free.

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Post #: 16716
RE: Doctor Who - 30/9/2012 12:26:33 AM   
Rgirvan44


Posts: 19049
Joined: 10/3/2006
From: Punishment Park
2013 - will Matt Smith and Moffat sign off that year or have one more series afterwards?

Still in two minds - Moffat is overseeing the year, so perhaps like this year we get a mini arc in the autumn, Smith regenerates and new Doctor for Christmas?

The River story is getting ever closer to its conclusion and I am convinced the final scene before the Dr regenerates is that night where he passes onto her the sonic before she heads to the Library.

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Post #: 16717
RE: Doctor Who - 30/9/2012 12:40:04 AM   
Shifty Bench

 

Posts: 15398
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Land of the Scots

quote:

ORIGINAL: originalcynic

Karen was asked if she would return for the 50th Anniversary episode. She said, "I know the answer to that but I can't tell you."




Do you have a source for this? In the interviews I have read she said 'no'


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Post #: 16718
RE: Doctor Who - 30/9/2012 12:46:09 AM   
originalcynic


Posts: 35
Joined: 30/9/2012
quote:

ORIGINAL: Shifty Bench


quote:

ORIGINAL: originalcynic

Karen was asked if she would return for the 50th Anniversary episode. She said, "I know the answer to that but I can't tell you."




Do you have a source for this? In the interviews I have read she said 'no'



Yes. Like the bloke / perv I am (delete as appropriate) I was reading about Jenna Louise Coleman.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-2210523/Jenna-Louise-Coleman-A-bit-TOO-exposure-Doctor-Whos-news-assistant-Fans-actress-topless-BBC-drama-thats-90-cent-sex.html?ito=feeds-newsxml

I imagine Amy will return. Surely the Doctor can meet up with the Ponds in a different part of America!

< Message edited by originalcynic -- 30/9/2012 12:49:46 AM >

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Post #: 16719
RE: Doctor Who - 30/9/2012 12:49:12 AM   
elab49


Posts: 54597
Joined: 1/10/2005
I'm not sure I'd count the Daily Mail as a reliable source?

Elsewhere, however, I have seen a similar quote attributed to Smith wrt to the 50th. http://www.entertainmentwise.com/news/88446/Karen-Gillans-Exit-On-Doctor-Who-Will-Be-Very-Final- Not sure about the site but it refers to a specific interview.


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Deviation] LIKE AMERICA'S SWEETHEARTS TOO. IT MADE ME LAUGH A LOT AND THOUGHT IT WAS WITTY. ALSO I FEEL SLOWLY DYING INSIDE. I KEEP AGREEING WITH ELAB.


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Post #: 16720
RE: Doctor Who - 30/9/2012 12:52:27 AM   
originalcynic


Posts: 35
Joined: 30/9/2012
I guess we'll have to wait and see. Depends on whether she becomes a massive movie star.

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Post #: 16721
RE: Doctor Who - 30/9/2012 1:00:12 AM   
Shifty Bench

 

Posts: 15398
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Land of the Scots

quote:

ORIGINAL: originalcynic
Yes. Like the bloke / perv I am (delete as appropriate) I was reading about Jenna Louise Coleman.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-2210523/Jenna-Louise-Coleman-A-bit-TOO-exposure-Doctor-Whos-news-assistant-Fans-actress-topless-BBC-drama-thats-90-cent-sex.html?ito=feeds-newsxml

I imagine Amy will return. Surely the Doctor can meet up with the Ponds in a different part of America!


There's no real context to that, though, they just stuck that one line in there

Here, she says otherwise- click and here click

And I'm a perv too, I watched that show just to see Coleman's breasts

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Post #: 16722
RE: Doctor Who - 30/9/2012 1:01:31 AM   
Base


Posts: 4377
Joined: 30/3/2006
From: Surrey, UK
It was New York, someone will have been looking at the Statue of Liberty!!! That was my only problem with it really, no matter what time of day it would always be seen by someone...

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Post #: 16723
RE: Doctor Who - 30/9/2012 1:06:34 AM   
Shifty Bench

 

Posts: 15398
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Land of the Scots
Just as well it wasn't set today as there are a few webcams focused on the Statue of Liberty 24 hours a day, and it would be much harder to explain

< Message edited by Shifty Bench -- 30/9/2012 1:08:09 AM >


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Post #: 16724
RE: Doctor Who - 30/9/2012 1:10:53 AM   
originalcynic


Posts: 35
Joined: 30/9/2012

quote:

ORIGINAL: originalcynic


Here, she says otherwise- click and here click



I still doubt they're gone for good but if they are it was a fitting ending. It would have been better if the jump had killed them, people would never have forgotten that!

Why was River there at the end? She wasn't there in the graveyard first time round. And would they really remember the paradox?

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Post #: 16725
RE: Doctor Who - 30/9/2012 1:15:29 AM   
Shifty Bench

 

Posts: 15398
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Land of the Scots

quote:

ORIGINAL: originalcynic
I still doubt they're gone for good but if they are it was a fitting ending. It would have been better if the jump had killed them, people would never have forgotten that!


I don't think they're gone forever either but I do believe that Gillan means it for now.

quote:

Why was River there at the end? She wasn't there in the graveyard first time round.


I thought that too, actually. It makes little sense for her to be there, unless she was in the graveyard when she got sent back in time.


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Post #: 16726
RE: Doctor Who - 30/9/2012 5:10:28 AM   
demoncleaner


Posts: 2391
Joined: 3/10/2005
From: Belfast
A 9/10 for me.

Bereft of any kind of emotional wallop...it's Rose's departure all over again. Amy and Rory can walk back into this anytime they want....so no emotional ooooomph for me about this one, plus the way it ended was like the start of a 11th Doctor series i.e. if he cared enough he could apply himself to this, if he cared he would do anything to get them back...a bit of a fudge. The death of the Doctor was the set-up of series 6 and if that demonstrates anything it's that this is a show that won't allow itself to be painted into a corner. There was a way out of this, if the Doctor cared and applied himself. The Girl Who Waited turns out to be the most emotional, definitive description of what these 3 mean to each other.

But...

Let's concentrate on the positives. It was fulsome, downbeat quality from top to bottom. No gags, but had a lovely, fluffy, souffle-light winsome quality at the beginning of the episode that was "Manhattan" and Woody Allen at his non-creepiest.

And then it got creepy....

The words "Timey-wimey" are the compliment/criticism of Steven Moffat. And I think here we got a dry-as-a-bone nuts and bolts explorations of the Weeping Angels and a creepy introspection of Timey-Wimeyness. I wondered if the whole episode wouldn't have been sooooooooooooooo much better if it went whole hog and asked what would happen if the Weeping Angels had hold of a Time Lord in an energy battery farm?

But this wasn't a Doctor episode, it was an Amy and Rory one. Did it deliver? No, not really. Yet again Rory, wins with the best most definitive line:

"So, tell me, what's going to happen to me?"
"You'll be thrown back in time and have to live out the rest of your days in this room."
"Will Amy be there?"

An answer from a consistently nice and considered guy. Put Jesus, Gandhi, Terry Waite or the Dalai Lama in that situation and they'd probably all say the same thing "Will there be chicks / and / or golf?"

Rory wins again.

Utilmately, I thought this was quality. Inspired sci-fi, with a pronounced adherence to the importance of the characters but...at the end of the day it t'was dry-as-a-bone and a bit of a fudge.

I'll miss Karen and Arthur, of course I will.

But now, roll on Christmas and Jenna, and hopefully a deranged, benign, optimistic dalek humanoid.

9/10


Did anyone else get the Sherlock reference?

221 BC indeed


< Message edited by demoncleaner -- 30/9/2012 5:44:38 AM >

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Post #: 16727
RE: Doctor Who - 30/9/2012 5:57:58 AM   
demoncleaner


Posts: 2391
Joined: 3/10/2005
From: Belfast

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rgirvan44

2013 - will Matt Smith and Moffat sign off that year or have one more series afterwards?

Still in two minds - Moffat is overseeing the year, so perhaps like this year we get a mini arc in the autumn, Smith regenerates and new Doctor for Christmas?

The River story is getting ever closer to its conclusion and I am convinced the final scene before the Dr regenerates is that night where he passes onto her the sonic before she heads to the Library.



My own feeling about this is that Matt will leave after 2013. I hope this isn't the case, but the Doctor Who schedule for the incumbent has gone beyond exhausting to punishing. I think Matt will leave after 2013 but I think Moffat will continue. I think Moffat is a pretty joyous goblin with the history and future canon of DW, I think we've only scratched the surface of what Moffat wants to do.

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Post #: 16728
RE: Doctor Who - 30/9/2012 6:06:12 AM   
demoncleaner


Posts: 2391
Joined: 3/10/2005
From: Belfast

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rgirvan44

So what do people feel now we have had a pretty arcless miniseries? Do they want arcs, or are they happy with the format?



After last series I think it's right to call it "arc provocation". I love the fact that this 5 episode run replaced arc, with downbeat character interaction. It meant, we had a means of satisfaction about each episode and didn't compromise the departure with head-fuckery.

I do like a bit of speculation, theorising and head-fuckery and I think the arc stuff will rejuvenate and begin proper with the Christmas episode. And I think it will be all tentative questions about Jenna's character, and who she is, what she is, what she came from, blah blah, I think it was lovely that this episode run didn't compromise the Pond's departure with questions marks.

"Now's not the time for questions Doctor."
"That comes later."

Literally, if you believe Dorium.

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Post #: 16729
RE: Doctor Who - 30/9/2012 9:54:30 AM   
matty_b


Posts: 14563
Joined: 19/10/2005
From: Outpost 31 calling McMurtle.
I'd imagine the big 2013 anniversary story will be Smith's regeneration, rather than a multi-Doctor multi-companion that most are assuming will happen.

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Post #: 16730
RE: Doctor Who - 30/9/2012 9:58:08 AM   
Vadersville


Posts: 3092
Joined: 30/9/2005
I think this has been the worst series of New Who so far. A bland, disappointing episode opened the series and that set the standard for the rest of the series, all FIVE episodes of it! I think it wasa mistake to do away with the two-parters. I like stand alone episodes - Blink, The Girl in the Fireplace are some of the best episodes the show has to offer - but each week this series I've looked up at the clock 30 mins in and thought, 'Shit, they've got a lot to wrap up in 10 mins!' and each episode the edning has been the biggest let-down. All too easy resolutions, planets saved with a wiggle of the sonic screwdriver, subplots abandoned, character arc suddenly skip to the end and they all end with a fizzle rather than a bang.

The lack of arc this series has also been disappointing. When RTD first relaunched the series, each arc merely consisted of a word or phrase repeated over and over each episode, then Moffat came online with Series 5 and wove an elaborate story that tied all the individual ones together and made the series itself feel like one big journey. here we just get lots of supposed foreboding and increasingly annoying winks at the audeince to remind us the Ponds are leaving soon, which turns out to backfire really badly. Building up an entire series around two characters' depature (even a five episode one) means that said exit has a lot to live up to and Angels Take Manhattan was a poor enough episode anyway, but when you pin it as series finale and the exit of two of the best companions this show has ever had then it fails miserably.

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Post #: 16731
RE: Doctor Who - 30/9/2012 2:14:37 PM   
originalcynic


Posts: 35
Joined: 30/9/2012
Hmm, I don't know. I look back on them and the first, fourth and fifth were very good. The Dinosaurs on a spaceship episode / Western episode were poor though.

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Post #: 16732
RE: Doctor Who - 30/9/2012 2:41:19 PM   
Darth Marenghi

 

Posts: 3217
Joined: 10/10/2010
From: Manchester

quote:

ORIGINAL: matty_b

I'd imagine the big 2013 anniversary story will be Smith's regeneration



A friend of mind really hates this idea (Mind you, he hates Moffat Who generally ) - he makes the argument that the 2013 anniversary show should be about celebrating the show as a whole, rather than the end of one Doctor's life. I'm not sure I agree with him but it's food for thought.

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Post #: 16733
RE: Doctor Who - 30/9/2012 3:19:23 PM   
matty_b


Posts: 14563
Joined: 19/10/2005
From: Outpost 31 calling McMurtle.
Oh, there's always going to be moaners.

Thing is, the 50th anniversary is probably going to be disappointing anyway - simply because everyone has their own ideas on what it should be and the pressure on it to match expectations will be huge.

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Post #: 16734
RE: Doctor Who - 30/9/2012 3:26:58 PM   
elab49


Posts: 54597
Joined: 1/10/2005
I think that sounds a fair point. It would be nice for the focus to be on the show rather than another 'who who who' press invasion on the ID of the next one.

I'd settle for a well-written epi though.


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Deviation] LIKE AMERICA'S SWEETHEARTS TOO. IT MADE ME LAUGH A LOT AND THOUGHT IT WAS WITTY. ALSO I FEEL SLOWLY DYING INSIDE. I KEEP AGREEING WITH ELAB.


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Post #: 16735
RE: Doctor Who - 30/9/2012 4:47:36 PM   
Shifty Bench

 

Posts: 15398
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Land of the Scots
What some people may be feeling right now-



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Post #: 16736
RE: Doctor Who - 30/9/2012 8:06:14 PM   
Fluke Skywalker


Posts: 9540
Joined: 23/4/2006
From: the dark side of the sun
So basically whats stopping Dr Who going back in time and telling a younger Amy to not bother going on this specific adventure thus saving both her and Rory?

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Post #: 16737
RE: Doctor Who - 30/9/2012 8:09:14 PM   
elab49


Posts: 54597
Joined: 1/10/2005
The whole point in time - same reason he can't any of his adventures. It's already happened. Else it'll go paradox and that will be bad. 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Deviation] LIKE AMERICA'S SWEETHEARTS TOO. IT MADE ME LAUGH A LOT AND THOUGHT IT WAS WITTY. ALSO I FEEL SLOWLY DYING INSIDE. I KEEP AGREEING WITH ELAB.


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Post #: 16738
RE: Doctor Who - 30/9/2012 8:15:05 PM   
Rgirvan44


Posts: 19049
Joined: 10/3/2006
From: Punishment Park
Is this why the TARDIS doesn't return until Amy is older? Because the Doctor tells her that he will return at a future point, thus creating a fixed point?

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Post #: 16739
RE: Doctor Who - 30/9/2012 8:15:05 PM   
Fluke Skywalker


Posts: 9540
Joined: 23/4/2006
From: the dark side of the sun
Can he go and visit them in Manhattan though?

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Post #: 16740
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