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RE: Has The 'Historical Epic' Bubble Burst?

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RE: Has The 'Historical Epic' Bubble Burst? - 23/10/2006 9:48:09 PM   
doctorolorinbats1975


Posts: 6787
Joined: 30/10/2005
From: Harrow
 A favourite of mine. I think there was an Achilles: but he was no demi-god. Ironically removing that made the film suck.

As for 300, I've been turned off. Looks like sub-Mortal Kombat crap.

_____________________________

CG, stop motion, acting, animation, animatronics, whatever, it's 24 lies a second...

Critiquing words for dummies: Pretentious, overrated, sentimental, indulgent, populist.

(in reply to Timon)
Post #: 61
RE: Has The 'Historical Epic' Bubble Burst? - 23/10/2006 10:16:46 PM   
Striders Gal

 

Posts: 70
Joined: 13/5/2006
From: Swindon
 You know, I don't really get the interest in Historical epics. Don't get me wrong, once I watch them I usually enjoy them, but I have no will to watch them again anytime soon. I really didn't like Troy - Kingdom of Heaven felt like the longest film I'd seen since Titanic. However, there are some good ones, for exampe the boyfriend recently made me watch Spartacus which I enjoyed, but as I stated above, have no will to revisit anytime soon!

I dread them coming out frankly, because I'll know eventually I'll be made to watch them! How pathetic is that.....?! Don't answer!

(in reply to doctorolorinbats1975)
Post #: 62
RE: Has The 'Historical Epic' Bubble Burst? - 23/10/2006 10:42:03 PM   
Spiderwoman


Posts: 562
Joined: 6/1/2006
From: Under the stars
 It could work if they kept it more true to Historical facts than drastically exagerrating the narrative just to spice it up for example Liam Neeson as a carpenter then going off to fight the Crusades?  And Keira Knightley in the leather bra?  Brad Pitt's Troy?

Yes the film has to be sold, but to think the audience is that stupid is where it all fails.  That is where the Gladiator succeeded - fictinal character based on a true premises, the Romans, the Colosseum and the Gladiators fighting.  All believable.

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Post #: 63
RE: Has The 'Historical Epic' Bubble Burst? - 23/10/2006 10:43:20 PM   
Timon


Posts: 14545
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Bristol
quote:

ORIGINAL: Spiderwoman

It could work if they kept it more true to Historical facts than drastically exagerrating the narrative just to spice it up for example Liam Neeson as a carpenter then going off to fight the Crusades? 


(Puts geek hat on)

Actually Liam Neeson is a lord and a knight in the film, it's his son, Orlando Bloom, who is a blacksmith.

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Post #: 64
RE: Has The 'Historical Epic' Bubble Burst? - 23/10/2006 10:46:39 PM   
Spiderwoman


Posts: 562
Joined: 6/1/2006
From: Under the stars
quote:

ORIGINAL: Timon

quote:

ORIGINAL: Spiderwoman

It could work if they kept it more true to Historical facts than drastically exagerrating the narrative just to spice it up for example Liam Neeson as a carpenter then going off to fight the Crusades? 


(Puts geek hat on)

Actually Liam Neeson is a lord and a knight in the film, it's his son, Orlando Bloom, who is a blacksmith.


Sorry!  I re-tract Kingdom of Heaven bashing  - no no wait Orlando Bloom you say?  Thats just wrong.

_____________________________

What's the height of conceit?
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Post #: 65
RE: Has The 'Historical Epic' Bubble Burst? - 23/10/2006 10:49:12 PM   
Timon


Posts: 14545
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Bristol
quote:

ORIGINAL: doctorolorinbats1975

As for 300, I've been turned off. Looks like sub-Mortal Kombat crap.









For shame!

_____________________________

"I put no stock in religion. By the word 'religion', I have seen the lunacy of fanatics of every denomination be called 'The Will of God'. Holiness is in right action and courage on behalf of those who cannot defend themselves."

Twitter: @timonsingh

(in reply to doctorolorinbats1975)
Post #: 66
RE: Has The 'Historical Epic' Bubble Burst? - 23/10/2006 10:57:41 PM   
Striders Gal

 

Posts: 70
Joined: 13/5/2006
From: Swindon
 Looks pretty good to me!

(in reply to Timon)
Post #: 67
RE: Has The 'Historical Epic' Bubble Burst? - 24/10/2006 8:32:00 AM   
unhingedmoviepigeon


Posts: 1305
Joined: 12/10/2006
From: With Cpt Reynolds on board Serenity
 I think there will always be a target audience who will watch historical epics. Obviously the demographic is forever changing and the way these movies are created will also change (as it presently is). 300 looks like a wonderful movie. I expect it won't get the kind of box office results as Gladiator or Troy but hopefully film fans everywhere will consider it worth while viewing! Do we judge this movie as a graphic novel adaptation or a historical epic? Perhaps both!
At the end of the day I just hope the movie lives up to the hype!

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Post #: 68
RE: Has The 'Historical Epic' Bubble Burst? - 24/10/2006 10:27:41 AM   
doctorolorinbats1975


Posts: 6787
Joined: 30/10/2005
From: Harrow
quote:

ORIGINAL: Timon

quote:

ORIGINAL: doctorolorinbats1975

As for 300, I've been turned off. Looks like sub-Mortal Kombat crap.









For shame!


Lovely screengrabs and all, but things that threw me off:
*A mechanical rhino charging over people.
*Giant mutant bloke.
*Gerard Butler screaming his head off.
*Persians looking medieval.
*A Spartan jumping like Spider-Man.

Really, I hope it was just the trailer, but...

_____________________________

CG, stop motion, acting, animation, animatronics, whatever, it's 24 lies a second...

Critiquing words for dummies: Pretentious, overrated, sentimental, indulgent, populist.

(in reply to Timon)
Post #: 69
RE: Has The 'Historical Epic' Bubble Burst? - 14/11/2006 9:07:26 PM   
Timon


Posts: 14545
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Bristol



NICE!  Three other posters of varying coolness are at the following link - http://www.filmz.ru/pub/61/7940_1.htm

< Message edited by Timon -- 14/11/2006 9:10:39 PM >

_____________________________

"I put no stock in religion. By the word 'religion', I have seen the lunacy of fanatics of every denomination be called 'The Will of God'. Holiness is in right action and courage on behalf of those who cannot defend themselves."

Twitter: @timonsingh

(in reply to Anglachel)
Post #: 70
RE: Has The 'Historical Epic' Bubble Burst? - 14/11/2006 9:10:22 PM   
doctorolorinbats1975


Posts: 6787
Joined: 30/10/2005
From: Harrow
 He's tall.

_____________________________

CG, stop motion, acting, animation, animatronics, whatever, it's 24 lies a second...

Critiquing words for dummies: Pretentious, overrated, sentimental, indulgent, populist.

(in reply to Timon)
Post #: 71
RE: Has The 'Historical Epic' Bubble Burst? - 14/11/2006 9:11:14 PM   
Timon


Posts: 14545
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Bristol
 And hairy.

Bloody Danes.

_____________________________

"I put no stock in religion. By the word 'religion', I have seen the lunacy of fanatics of every denomination be called 'The Will of God'. Holiness is in right action and courage on behalf of those who cannot defend themselves."

Twitter: @timonsingh

(in reply to doctorolorinbats1975)
Post #: 72
RE: Has The 'Historical Epic' Bubble Burst? - 14/11/2006 9:12:21 PM   
doctorolorinbats1975


Posts: 6787
Joined: 30/10/2005
From: Harrow
 Still Timon, can you justify to me parts of 300 that looks like Mortal Kombat? I certainly like the beauty of some of the battles.

_____________________________

CG, stop motion, acting, animation, animatronics, whatever, it's 24 lies a second...

Critiquing words for dummies: Pretentious, overrated, sentimental, indulgent, populist.

(in reply to Timon)
Post #: 73
RE: Has The 'Historical Epic' Bubble Burst? - 14/11/2006 9:20:35 PM   
Timon


Posts: 14545
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Bristol
quote:

ORIGINAL: doctorolorinbats1975

Still Timon, can you justify to me parts of 300 that looks like Mortal Kombat? I certainly like the beauty of some of the battles.


Mortal Kombat was a cheap nasty film directed by Paul W S Anderson where you didn't see anything due to editting and it was aimed at 15 yrs olds.

This is using state of the art technology to make each shot look like a vista and imploying high levels of violence to appeal to well...........15 yr olds.

Basically Doc, it's like saying my homemade sandwiches are en par with Gordon Ramsey's cooking. It's a one side battle. It's not even an argument. My sandwiches trump his cooking every time.

_____________________________

"I put no stock in religion. By the word 'religion', I have seen the lunacy of fanatics of every denomination be called 'The Will of God'. Holiness is in right action and courage on behalf of those who cannot defend themselves."

Twitter: @timonsingh

(in reply to doctorolorinbats1975)
Post #: 74
RE: Has The 'Historical Epic' Bubble Burst? - 14/11/2006 9:22:22 PM   
doctorolorinbats1975


Posts: 6787
Joined: 30/10/2005
From: Harrow
 Erm ok. Still, it'll depend on whether the acting is good or not.

_____________________________

CG, stop motion, acting, animation, animatronics, whatever, it's 24 lies a second...

Critiquing words for dummies: Pretentious, overrated, sentimental, indulgent, populist.

(in reply to Timon)
Post #: 75
RE: Has The 'Historical Epic' Bubble Burst? - 14/11/2006 9:26:54 PM   
Timon


Posts: 14545
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Bristol
 True but that's with all films.

As long as Gerard Butler doesn't do his "shouty shouty" thing all the way through, it should be great. And you can't deny the trailer is one of the most impressive this year.

_____________________________

"I put no stock in religion. By the word 'religion', I have seen the lunacy of fanatics of every denomination be called 'The Will of God'. Holiness is in right action and courage on behalf of those who cannot defend themselves."

Twitter: @timonsingh

(in reply to doctorolorinbats1975)
Post #: 76
RE: Has The 'Historical Epic' Bubble Burst? - 14/11/2006 9:30:06 PM   
doctorolorinbats1975


Posts: 6787
Joined: 30/10/2005
From: Harrow
 True, I saw it on the big screen with The Prestige and felt the atmosphere certainly with that music (what's it called?) is unique. Still, very bizzare imagery aimed at smacking the audience Spartan schoolboy style, but I hope for another trailer aimed at drama.

_____________________________

CG, stop motion, acting, animation, animatronics, whatever, it's 24 lies a second...

Critiquing words for dummies: Pretentious, overrated, sentimental, indulgent, populist.

(in reply to Timon)
Post #: 77
RE: Has The 'Historical Epic' Bubble Burst? - 14/11/2006 9:35:59 PM   
Timon


Posts: 14545
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Bristol
quote:

ORIGINAL: doctorolorinbats1975

True, I saw it on the big screen with The Prestige and felt the atmosphere certainly with that music (what's it called?) is unique. Still, very bizzare imagery aimed at smacking the audience Spartan schoolboy style, but I hope for another trailer aimed at drama.


Music is NINE INCH NAILS - JUST LIKE YOU IMAGINED

_____________________________

"I put no stock in religion. By the word 'religion', I have seen the lunacy of fanatics of every denomination be called 'The Will of God'. Holiness is in right action and courage on behalf of those who cannot defend themselves."

Twitter: @timonsingh

(in reply to doctorolorinbats1975)
Post #: 78
RE: Has The 'Historical Epic' Bubble Burst? - 5/2/2007 7:33:29 PM   
Timon


Posts: 14545
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Bristol
 Just when you'd thought it had died, THE HISTORICAL EPIC page returns! 

Huzzah!

Anyway, it's LAST LEGION related.
 
 

Below is the new trailer in various formats. Right click and save.
It looks better than I thought it would but i'm still getting a King Arthur vibe.

Quicktime (low res i'm afraid)

AVI version

Note Kevin McKidd and Alexander Siddig



_____________________________

"I put no stock in religion. By the word 'religion', I have seen the lunacy of fanatics of every denomination be called 'The Will of God'. Holiness is in right action and courage on behalf of those who cannot defend themselves."

Twitter: @timonsingh

(in reply to Anglachel)
Post #: 79
RE: Has The 'Historical Epic' Bubble Burst? - 5/2/2007 10:12:40 PM   
Cuchulainn


Posts: 5755
Joined: 18/2/2006
From: Hell
 I have Valerio Massimo Manfredi's novel on which this is based,and it's a good read...Your comparisons to the massive shitburger that was King Arthur don't exactly inspire confidence,Ti...Christ,that was awful... 


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Post #: 80
RE: Has The 'Historical Epic' Bubble Burst? - 5/2/2007 10:25:15 PM   
lbiu


Posts: 2779
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Just 3 doors away from Heaven
quote:

As for 300, I've been turned off. Looks like sub-Mortal Kombat crap.


I actually agree, although it looks visually arresting....the action looks way over the top, the acting was just dreadful (based on trailers) and historical accuracy has been completely thrown out of the window.


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Post #: 81
RE: Has The 'Historical Epic' Bubble Burst? - 6/2/2007 9:13:31 AM   
Timon


Posts: 14545
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Bristol
quote:

ORIGINAL: Cuchulainn

I have Valerio Massimo Manfredi's novel on which this is based,and it's a good read...Your comparisons to the massive shitburger that was King Arthur don't exactly inspire confidence,Ti...Christ,that was awful... 



Well.....it does in terms of style and direction. I would like to be proved wrong.

Have a look at the trailers yourself.

What's the Manfredi novel's title? I'll have to add it to my wishlist along with Lions of Al-Rassan.

_____________________________

"I put no stock in religion. By the word 'religion', I have seen the lunacy of fanatics of every denomination be called 'The Will of God'. Holiness is in right action and courage on behalf of those who cannot defend themselves."

Twitter: @timonsingh

(in reply to Cuchulainn)
Post #: 82
RE: Has The 'Historical Epic' Bubble Burst? - 6/2/2007 10:40:42 AM   
Wedge


Posts: 4494
Joined: 5/2/2006
From: 23 Railway Cuttings, East Cheam
quote:

ORIGINAL: Timon

Just when you'd thought it had died, THE HISTORICAL EPIC page returns! 

Huzzah!

Anyway, it's LAST LEGION related.
 
 

Below is the new trailer in various formats. Right click and save.
It looks better than I thought it would but i'm still getting a King Arthur vibe.

Quicktime (low res i'm afraid)

AVI version

Note Kevin McKidd and Alexander Siddig




Hmm, this has a strong whif of shite about it. 

We have a few Viking 'epics' to look forward to this year don't we?

I'm looking forward to the adaption of Pompeii in a few years.

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Post #: 83
RE: Has The 'Historical Epic' Bubble Burst? - 6/2/2007 10:59:38 AM   
Cuchulainn


Posts: 5755
Joined: 18/2/2006
From: Hell
quote:

ORIGINAL: Timon


quote:

ORIGINAL: Cuchulainn

I have Valerio Massimo Manfredi's novel on which this is based,and it's a good read...Your comparisons to the massive shitburger that was King Arthur don't exactly inspire confidence,Ti...Christ,that was awful... 



Well.....it does in terms of style and direction. I would like to be proved wrong.

Have a look at the trailers yourself.

What's the Manfredi novel's title? I'll have to add it to my wishlist along with Lions of Al-Rassan.

The Last Legion,surprisingly...
Funkyrae made a reasonably valid point in another thread where she mentioned the translation being a little sub-par...
I can't remember that aspect of the book so much,but I've read quite a few of his and certainly I recall finding some of them quite dull simply as a result of obvious discrepencies between the translation and the original Italian material...
I don't speak Italian myself,so I've no idea how good a writer Manfredi is in his original tongue,but he's very popular both in his home country and throughout the rest of continental Europe,so if that means anything...
I don't know if you ever saw a Channel 4 documentary called The Lost Legions Of Varrus,which dealt with the Germanic tribes uniting under the leadership of a Roman officer named Arminius (who was born and raised in Germany) and slaughtering several Roman legions and pre-empting the withdrawal of Rome from Germania...
That would make a great film...

_____________________________

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Post #: 84
RE: Has The 'Historical Epic' Bubble Burst? - 6/2/2007 4:26:04 PM   
Rgirvan44


Posts: 18905
Joined: 10/3/2006
From: Punishment Park
 Was there ever any word on the Gladiator sequel? The hidden extra on the Extended DVD suggested they were still working on it, a sort of Godfather 2 approach  - the rise of the little boy to Emperor, or trying to turn the Empire into the Republic with flasbacks to how Maximus became a general.

Also isn't there a Viking movie involving an alien beast coming to Earth and having to be hunted by another alien? Very Alien vs Predator...

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Post #: 85
RE: Has The 'Historical Epic' Bubble Burst? - 6/2/2007 4:58:15 PM   
Timon


Posts: 14545
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Bristol
quote:

ORIGINAL: Rgirvan44

Was there ever any word on the Gladiator sequel? The hidden extra on the Extended DVD suggested they were still working on it, a sort of Godfather 2 approach  - the rise of the little boy to Emperor, or trying to turn the Empire into the Republic with flasbacks to how Maximus became a general.


Well Ridley is busy these days and I'm sure he'd be interested and Universal would love him to do it but it seems redundant and pointless. Plus I'm sure Russel Crowe would demand a hefty paycheck.

quote:


Also isn't there a Viking movie involving an alien beast coming to Earth and having to be hunted by another alien? Very Alien vs Predator...


You speak of Outlander (Future Film Thread)! Interesting stuff. I can't wait for this.

The sci-fi action/adventure film stars Jim Caviezel, Sophia Myles, Jack Huston, Ron Perlman and John Hurt. The film is helmed by Howard McCain from a screenplay he wrote with Dirk Blackman, and produced by Ascendant Pictures/VIP Medienfronds 4 in association with Rising Star.

Outlander begins when a space craft crashes into the majestic fjords of ancient Norway and into the time of the Vikings. From the wreckage emerge two bitter enemies: a soldier from another world - Kainan - and a bloodthirsty creature known as the Moorwen. Man and monster both seeking revenge for violence committed against them. As the Moorwen ravages the Viking world, killing everything in its path, Kainan forms an unlikely alliance with the primitive but fierce warriors. Combining his advanced technology with ancient Iron Age weapons, the hero leads a desperate attempt to kill the monster - before it destroys them all.

The Moorwen has been designed by famed monster/creature creator Patrick Tatopoulos. In addition, the film's conceptual art and design was done by the team of conceptual artists (Iain McCaig and Ninth Ray) behind the Star Wars trilogy.


On another subject.....King Arthur. The Theatrical Version was flawed and rather rubbish but I was just wondering if anyone had seen the Director's Cut and if it had improved it any what. I of course doubt it, but it would be interesting to know.

< Message edited by Timon -- 6/2/2007 5:23:45 PM >

_____________________________

"I put no stock in religion. By the word 'religion', I have seen the lunacy of fanatics of every denomination be called 'The Will of God'. Holiness is in right action and courage on behalf of those who cannot defend themselves."

Twitter: @timonsingh

(in reply to Rgirvan44)
Post #: 86
RE: Has The 'Historical Epic' Bubble Burst? - 6/2/2007 5:33:59 PM   
Cuchulainn


Posts: 5755
Joined: 18/2/2006
From: Hell
quote:

ORIGINAL: Timon
On another subject.....King Arthur. The Theatrical Version was flawed and rather rubbish but I was just wondering if anyone had seen the Director's Cut and if it had improved it any what. I of course doubt it, but it would be interesting to know.

The director's cut is flawed and rubbish too,but with more gore...
It makes me want to wash my brain just thinking about it...

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Post #: 87
RE: Has The 'Historical Epic' Bubble Burst? - 6/2/2007 6:07:20 PM   
Axel Foley


Posts: 731
Joined: 15/10/2005
I need more time to address this issue (rather than the five minute burst before I leave work), so will come back to this.

Anyway I think historical epics will always be made, there just need to be good enough stories to tell, made by accomplished artists. The mistake that has been made by studios post-Gladiator is that people are just interested in any old bobbins. What Gladiator had was a strong set of characters, a gripping story and superb action.

King Arthur is a case in point (director’s cut isn’t much different beyond knocking out some of the sappy romance – so I wouldn’t bother, although Keira wearing that outfit is still quite a draw). Clive Owen was a dull lead, lacking the charisma and animalistic nature of Crowe and the supporting cast were poorly written. You need a Commodus and a Lucilla and a Gracchus and a Proximo and a Juba and a (you get the idea). Given it does have a kick ass conclusion, but there’s absolutely nothing else there: it is devoid of substance and emotional pull.

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Post #: 88
RE: Has The 'Historical Epic' Bubble Burst? - 7/2/2007 11:42:50 AM   
Timon


Posts: 14545
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Bristol



Could Pathfinder be bobbins? Or the next Conan?

_____________________________

"I put no stock in religion. By the word 'religion', I have seen the lunacy of fanatics of every denomination be called 'The Will of God'. Holiness is in right action and courage on behalf of those who cannot defend themselves."

Twitter: @timonsingh

(in reply to Axel Foley)
Post #: 89
RE: Has The 'Historical Epic' Bubble Burst? - 7/2/2007 12:02:02 PM   
Cuchulainn


Posts: 5755
Joined: 18/2/2006
From: Hell
 I honestly can't see it reaching the lofty heights of Conan The Barbarian...and hasn't it been delayed already? That's usually not a good sign...
However,it's a pretty good concept and the artwork is very impressive...it's so long since I saw the trailer I can't remember it...
I reckon it has potential if they don't slap a PG on it or whatever...

_____________________________

"Give 'em Hell 54th!!!"

(in reply to Timon)
Post #: 90
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