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RE: So what? - 27/10/2013 5:51:32 PM   
rawlinson

 

Posts: 45002
Joined: 13/6/2008
From: Timbuktu. Chinese or Fictional.
I haven't watched it in a long time, but I have memories of it being a lot of fun. If you're asking me for a genuinely great film, looking at his filmography then I'd have to go all the way back to Apocalypse Now. The three films of his that I like best, he's actually barely in.

(in reply to Deviation)
Post #: 31
RE: So what? - 27/10/2013 5:53:56 PM   
Deviation


Posts: 27284
Joined: 2/6/2006
From: Enemies of Film HQ
He hasn't even been in anything successful though, I like Indy 4, I'm insane like that, but the reception to that thing was harsh.

Oh, 42 got a good response.

_____________________________

quote:

ORIGINAL: Dpp1978
There are certainly times where calling a person a cunt is not only reasonable, it is a gross understatement.

quote:


ORIGINAL: elab49
I really wish I could go down to see Privates

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Post #: 32
RE: So what? - 27/10/2013 6:03:30 PM   
rawlinson

 

Posts: 45002
Joined: 13/6/2008
From: Timbuktu. Chinese or Fictional.
I can barely even remember Indy 4 these days. I didn't have the "oh fuck off" reaction I had to War Horse, so it's probably far from Spielberg's worst work.

(in reply to Deviation)
Post #: 33
RE: So what? - 27/10/2013 6:03:41 PM   
sanchia


Posts: 18310
Joined: 3/1/2006
From: Norwich

quote:

ORIGINAL: Dr Lenera

quote:

ORIGINAL: dseys


quote:

ORIGINAL: rawlinson


quote:

ORIGINAL: Belisarius0365

I thought I read this book when I was a teenager, but if I did it must be the only book I've ever read that I can't remember the plot, or even what it was about. But, more to the point, WHO CARES if the author doesn't approve of Gay Marriage? Marriage is a religious sacrament, so by religious rules you can't get married if you're gay. But if you're religious, then you shouldn't be getting married if you're gay, anyway...kind of a catch 22.



He's done far more than that over the past few decades. He's a vile bigot, claiming that the "dark secret" of homosexuality is a large number of gay people don't really want to be gay and it's just because they were raped as kids. Or that anti-gay laws should be on the books. Or that a gay man can marry a woman so there is no law stopping gay people getting married, and they should be happy with that rather than wanting, you know, to be able to marry someone they love. He's a repulsive little shit. Personally I don't think that has any impact on the quality of a film, but I can certainly sympathise with gay rights groups bringing his bigotry to public attention and organising boycotts of the film. Why should they spend money on a film that will benefit a man who absolutely despises them?



I'm tired of these stupid polemics. Who are you to call him (a person that you don't know) "a repulsive little shit"? If someone doesn't agree with you on a few topics, does it give him the right to call you that way? I'm sure there exists someone that may find you "narrow-minded" about something. Does it make you a narrow-minded person? This notion is purely subjective. I'm liberally thinking that everybody must be free to think WHATEVER he wants, without risking his whole career. Political-correctness is dangerous for a healthy, democratic debate.

Card struggled against the marriage law, lost the battle and admitted it. And yet, now that he's been defeated, he becomes a target and everyone's trying to crush him. Let me remind you that whenever a law is discussed, there ALWAYS are pros and cons. Then the law is (or isn't) adopted. Does it give the winning side the right to systematically destroy the career of every single one of their politic opponents?



THIS!!!!!! I mean for God's sake, what matters is the film good? Not what the author's beliefs are. Fucking ridiculous.


I would just say the book was terrible the film is as bad. Essentially eye candy which lacks any emotional depth and is poorly written. You have two good performances and the rest are rather poor. So back to the Card hating.


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Post #: 34
RE: So what? - 27/10/2013 6:08:41 PM   
MonsterCat


Posts: 7934
Joined: 24/3/2011
From: St. Albans, Hertfordshire
quote:

ORIGINAL: rawlinson

I'm even more curious about why Harrison Ford is still seen as such a great selling point, when was the last time he was in a genuinely good film? The Fugitive?


I think Morning Glory is a good and fun film. And not only because you get to see Rachel McAdams' beautiful backside.

Ford is genuinely funny and spry in it. EDIT - I mean the film, not McAdams' splendid ass.

< Message edited by MonsterCat -- 27/10/2013 6:10:32 PM >


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Post #: 35
RE: So what? - 27/10/2013 6:10:48 PM   
rawlinson

 

Posts: 45002
Joined: 13/6/2008
From: Timbuktu. Chinese or Fictional.
I haven't seen Morning Glory, at least not that I remember. Is it honestly worth checking out or will I want to hit you?

I don't mean to seem like I'm hating Ford, btw. I think he's given some good performances and there's some films like Raiders, Blade Runner that I would class as really strong films. But I think he's been involved with more films that are pretty shit than ones that are pretty good.

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Post #: 36
RE: So what? - 27/10/2013 6:13:58 PM   
MonsterCat


Posts: 7934
Joined: 24/3/2011
From: St. Albans, Hertfordshire
quote:

ORIGINAL: rawlinson

I haven't seen Morning Glory, at least not that I remember. Is it honestly worth checking out or will I want to hit you?



If nothing else it's worth watching for Ford and Diane Keaton flinging barbs at each other.

I think it's a funny film but as we all know you're incapable of feeling joy.

< Message edited by MonsterCat -- 27/10/2013 6:21:54 PM >


_____________________________

"I am a writer, a doctor, a nuclear physicist and a theoretical philosopher. But above all, I am a man, a hopelessly inquisitive man, just like you."

Films watched in 2013

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Post #: 37
RE: So what? - 27/10/2013 6:16:42 PM   
rawlinson

 

Posts: 45002
Joined: 13/6/2008
From: Timbuktu. Chinese or Fictional.

quote:

ORIGINAL: MonsterCat

I think it's a funny film but as we all know you're incapable of feeling joy.




The writer doesn't have a great pedigree, but I'll chuck it on Lovefilm. And if it's shit I'll nominate something in AHoF to annoy you.

(in reply to MonsterCat)
Post #: 38
RE: So what? - 27/10/2013 6:23:29 PM   
Qwerty Norris


Posts: 2079
Joined: 26/10/2005
From: Edinburgh

quote:

ORIGINAL: rawlinson

So where should his views be discussed?


I assume he has a website of his own? Or he trends on social media? If I wanted to challenge those views and those who share them, that's where I'd be heading.

On here, I'd prefer to talk about the film. But I guess that's just me...

quote:

ORIGINAL: rawlinson
If the film was a success then no doubt it would increase sales of the books and a demand for adaptations of the sequels. So whether people want to give money to someone like Card is a big issue with this film.


But he won't be the only person making money from this film. If anything, he wont even be near the top of the list of those who will profit. Furthermore, If we start going down the avenue of objecting to giving certain unsavoury people money for a project or product they're involved with, then there's a worryingly large list of other things to target - going WAY beyond the confines of cinema.

quote:

ORIGINAL: rawlinson
So if it can't be discussed in the review thread, given Empire's policy for not duplicating threads, where should it go? If anything, the controversy over Card being a cunt has gotten more attention then the film itself all over the internet so far. I'd suggest that does go hand in hand with the film getting generally average reviews.


For the record, I'm not saying there should be no discussion here. It's just that it would be a pity if the thread became solely about that subject matter when there are some decent things worth talking about in Ender's Game.

To reiterate, this is primarily a film forum (or should be). Yet so often I see threads here becoming a platform for trolls or those eager to antagonise, whose pedestal is heightened further by those who seem to relish taking the bait. It'd just be nice not to see that being replicated here as well, but I fear it will.


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2. No
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6. Good Vibrations
7. McCullin
8. Beyond the Hills
9. The Place Beyond the Pines
10. Wreck-it Ralph

(in reply to rawlinson)
Post #: 39
RE: So what? - 27/10/2013 6:25:59 PM   
elab49


Posts: 54586
Joined: 1/10/2005

quote:

ORIGINAL: rawlinson

I haven't seen Morning Glory, at least not that I remember. Is it honestly worth checking out or will I want to hit you?

I don't mean to seem like I'm hating Ford, btw. I think he's given some good performances and there's some films like Raiders, Blade Runner that I would class as really strong films. But I think he's been involved with more films that are pretty shit than ones that are pretty good.


Please check it out - I want you to hit him!

The thread generally? I think Qwerty hits a key point - this is a discussion thread for the film and the possibility of Card earning money from it is an issue for many. It feeds into discussions elsewhere on separating a creative work from the creator, and it is a difficult discussion. Given the extremity of Card's views many also have concerns that there aren't elements filtered through the writing, although others believe that taint is not present there. This is not political correctness by any remote definition and I personally regard the use of the term as an attempt to shut down discussion.

So, remembering to leave abuse aside, discussion of this, IMO, can't really be seen as off-topic or derailing the thread. But it would, I think, be helpful if, perhaps, that aspect of the discussion might be focussed on elsewhere? I think we have a thread on the subject I mentioned above in Movie Musings eg.

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Deviation] LIKE AMERICA'S SWEETHEARTS TOO. IT MADE ME LAUGH A LOT AND THOUGHT IT WAS WITTY. ALSO I FEEL SLOWLY DYING INSIDE. I KEEP AGREEING WITH ELAB.


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Post #: 40
RE: So what? - 27/10/2013 6:27:50 PM   
matty_b


Posts: 14579
Joined: 19/10/2005
From: Outpost 31 calling McMurtle.
This thread is totally going to do a Polanski.

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Post #: 41
RE: So what? - 27/10/2013 6:46:30 PM   
rawlinson

 

Posts: 45002
Joined: 13/6/2008
From: Timbuktu. Chinese or Fictional.
I started this because of the usual kind of comment you get in these threads, a feeling that this film deserves an automatic high score simply because it's not a Marvel film. If that kind of commentary isn't seen as a problem in this thread, then it shouldn't be a problem to have a commentary about the problems that come with this film being a success. As I've already stated, I don't think Card's views impact on the quality of the film. But the idea that some people wouldn't want to give him money is surely a valid part of the discussion of this film. And as the poster in question was claiming that the film deserved to be a success out of some bizarre notion of originality, then the flipside of that success deserves a discussion too.

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Post #: 42
RE: So what? - 27/10/2013 6:48:34 PM   
rawlinson

 

Posts: 45002
Joined: 13/6/2008
From: Timbuktu. Chinese or Fictional.

quote:

ORIGINAL: matty_b

This thread is totally going to do a Polanski.


That's actually a good comparison. How many people here refuse to watch Roman Polanski films? It actually has no impact on their lives, yet they don't want to associate themselves with his work. And that's a subject that's been discussed to death here. Why is that acceptable, yet a discussion about Card's bigotry not acceptable?

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Post #: 43
RE: So what? - 27/10/2013 6:59:35 PM   
matty_b


Posts: 14579
Joined: 19/10/2005
From: Outpost 31 calling McMurtle.
I miss PA.

_____________________________

quote:

ORIGINAL: Cool Breeze
Mattyb is a shining example of what the perfect Empire Forum member is.


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Post #: 44
RE: So what? - 27/10/2013 7:10:01 PM   
rawlinson

 

Posts: 45002
Joined: 13/6/2008
From: Timbuktu. Chinese or Fictional.
Not as much as Drooch does.

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Post #: 45
RE: So what? - 27/10/2013 9:10:37 PM   
sanchia


Posts: 18310
Joined: 3/1/2006
From: Norwich

quote:

ORIGINAL: rawlinson


quote:

ORIGINAL: matty_b

This thread is totally going to do a Polanski.


That's actually a good comparison. How many people here refuse to watch Roman Polanski films? It actually has no impact on their lives, yet they don't want to associate themselves with his work. And that's a subject that's been discussed to death here. Why is that acceptable, yet a discussion about Card's bigotry not acceptable?



I refuse to watch them and tend to have reduced respect for actors who agree to work with him. Then again I agree that the rationale and actions of a creative force involved in a film can and should have a direct impact upon the decision to watch that film. That said I tend to view the opposition to Card which has been raised from this film as actually giving him publicity which the film, being as poor as it is, would not have generated in itself.

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Post #: 46
RE: So what? - 28/10/2013 12:20:29 PM   
Dr Lenera

 

Posts: 3761
Joined: 19/10/2005
In the near future, a hostile alien race called the Formics have attacked Earth. If not for the legendary heroics of International Fleet Commander Mazer Rackham, all would have been lost. In preparation for the next attack, Colonel Graff and the International Military are training the best young children in tough military academies. Ender Wiggin is a shy lonely boy who deals with a bully by not only defeating the other boy but beating him viciously so he never bullies him again, winning not just the current battle but pre-empting any future attacks. Graff sees that his method might make him a suitable candidate for training, and pulls the boy from school to enrol him in a boot camp where he quickly makes progress, but makes some enemies along the wayÖ.


Enderís Game is an odd one really, a simplistic, rushed and rather dull movie, sort of Harry Potter meets Starship Troopers, that gets rather good and even quite deep towards the endÖ.only for it to then suddenly end. Orson Scottís Cardís novel has been planned as a film for a very long time, with the writer himself having written two scripts, but he claims that director Gavin Hoodís screenplay was all his own. Yes, the same Gavin Hood that helped make such a mess of X-Men: Origins, but directorially at least Enderís Game is a much better film. For a start you can actually see whatís going on in the action scenes. Heís made a very tight film with no lags in the pacing, but itís also a film that seems to rush through parts of its story too quickly. I havenít read the novel, but itís obvious that, despite expanding the time scale from a year to several years, a great deal has been condensed or is just mentioned in passing. There is much involving Ender, his family and background that seems missing or is aluded to so briefly that one can miss it. For example, Ender seems to be afraid of becoming his older brother Peter, who gets hardly any screen time, but we donít know why. Of course things like raising the age of the children may have been done to get the all-important ĎPG-13í rating.

The first half of Enderís Game seems especially rushed, with Enderís progression through battle school coming across as absurdly easy. Character types and situations weíve all seen before are rehashed yet again, such as the tough sergeant, the bully, the only friend and the mastermind manipulating everything. Most of the running time is devoted to Ender and the other recruits in the ĎBattle Roomí, where they have to carry out increasingly difficult exercises in zero gravity. One of the major stumbling blocks in filming this project up to now has been the lack of the right technology to make the zero gravity sequences work. Theyíve certainly got it now, the scenes coming across as being very convincing. Sadly, theyíre also very repetitive and my mind drifted away to things like: why the hell do they need all these children with all the amazing weapons they have? So much makes little sense and whole film feels like a condensed version of a three hour film. It all rushes towards a pretty boring computer game-style battle, but then gives us a downbeat twist which I certainly didnít work out before hand though many others seem to have done. The final scenes have a surprising power and really ram home the anti-war theme.

In fact, the story resounds with lofty themes, like the embracing of values which we consider abhorrent to protect our real values, or the effects of unreasonably high expectations of someone. In fact, there is a great unevenness between the intelligence of the themes and the superficiality of everything else. Itís as if in order to get the teenage audience which most producers seem to think is the most important audience out there, they had to dumb things down. Technically the Battle Room is a marvel of interesting design and some of the design of the spacecraft and weapons is noteworthy. The cast mostly come up trumps, though Ben Kingsley does another funny turn replete with Maori facial tattoos [why couldnít they have just got a Maori? Oh wait a minute....it's because Kingsley, who can play any nationality, was available....silly me]. Harrison Ford looks like heís enjoying himself, and Asa Butterfield certainly makes you believe his characterís intelligence and eventual horror.

There has been much talk of Cardís anti-homosexual statements, with many deciding to boycott the film. Frankly, I donít think it matters. If we all refused to see films because we didnít agree with the views of someone involved in it, we wouldnít see many films. Iím more concerned about the state of film music today. For Enderís Game, James Horner was booted off and replaced by Steven Jablonsky, a purveyor in the deadening Remote Control music factory sound. You know what I mean: the same bloody rhythmic patterns, the same bloody drum loops, etc. We are now at a stage where decent composers have to either copy this style [as Patrick Doyle is doing] or bugger off because the idiots in suits thinks this is what film music should be, just sonic wallpaper, devoid of melody, emotion or originality. Actually the Enderís Game score has a few good moments amidst the general dross, but it really is a very bad time for film music in Hollywood at the moment and Hans Zimmer had a lot to answer for. In the mean time, Enderís Game is serviceable, but overall feels like a horribly chopped up version of a much bigger and better film.

Rating: 5/10

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Post #: 47
RE: So what? - 28/10/2013 12:36:03 PM   
AxlReznor

 

Posts: 1623
Joined: 2/12/2010
From: Great Britain
quote:

ORIGINAL: rawlinson


quote:

ORIGINAL: matty_b

This thread is totally going to do a Polanski.


That's actually a good comparison. How many people here refuse to watch Roman Polanski films? It actually has no impact on their lives, yet they don't want to associate themselves with his work. And that's a subject that's been discussed to death here. Why is that acceptable, yet a discussion about Card's bigotry not acceptable?


Possibly because being a bigot and a cunt are currently not actually illegal, but being a child rapist is.

I'm of the belief that tedious assholes are making money from us all the time, so giving this particular tedious asshole money doesn't really make any difference. Especially when apparently none of his beliefs have any impact on this particular work.

Plus, I'm pretty sure that other than writing the novel the film is based on, he actually has nothing to do with the film whatsoever.

(in reply to rawlinson)
Post #: 48
RE: So what? - 28/10/2013 6:04:35 PM   
sanchia


Posts: 18310
Joined: 3/1/2006
From: Norwich

quote:

ORIGINAL: AxlReznor

quote:

ORIGINAL: rawlinson


quote:

ORIGINAL: matty_b

This thread is totally going to do a Polanski.


That's actually a good comparison. How many people here refuse to watch Roman Polanski films? It actually has no impact on their lives, yet they don't want to associate themselves with his work. And that's a subject that's been discussed to death here. Why is that acceptable, yet a discussion about Card's bigotry not acceptable?


Possibly because being a bigot and a cunt are currently not actually illegal, but being a child rapist is.

I'm of the belief that tedious assholes are making money from us all the time, so giving this particular tedious asshole money doesn't really make any difference. Especially when apparently none of his beliefs have any impact on this particular work.

Plus, I'm pretty sure that other than writing the novel the film is based on, he actually has nothing to do with the film whatsoever.


He has a cameo.


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Post #: 49
RE: So what? - 29/10/2013 9:43:06 AM   
AxlReznor

 

Posts: 1623
Joined: 2/12/2010
From: Great Britain
quote:

ORIGINAL: sanchia


quote:

ORIGINAL: AxlReznor

quote:

ORIGINAL: rawlinson


quote:

ORIGINAL: matty_b

This thread is totally going to do a Polanski.


That's actually a good comparison. How many people here refuse to watch Roman Polanski films? It actually has no impact on their lives, yet they don't want to associate themselves with his work. And that's a subject that's been discussed to death here. Why is that acceptable, yet a discussion about Card's bigotry not acceptable?


Possibly because being a bigot and a cunt are currently not actually illegal, but being a child rapist is.

I'm of the belief that tedious assholes are making money from us all the time, so giving this particular tedious asshole money doesn't really make any difference. Especially when apparently none of his beliefs have any impact on this particular work.

Plus, I'm pretty sure that other than writing the novel the film is based on, he actually has nothing to do with the film whatsoever.


He has a cameo.



In that case, fuck that guy!

The film itself isn't very promising considering most of the comments I've seen about it. I'll probably give it a go at some point, but won't go to see it at the cinema.

(in reply to sanchia)
Post #: 50
RE: Er, I thought it was okay - 1/11/2013 8:31:07 AM   
sanchia


Posts: 18310
Joined: 3/1/2006
From: Norwich
One thing which can be said. The controversy certainly seemed to boost up the comments level as it appears not many people are watching the film itself.

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Post #: 51
RE: Er, I thought it was okay - 1/11/2013 12:44:58 PM   
No Diggity

 

Posts: 31
Joined: 16/1/2013
Its all too rushed,,,too easy,,,,and too boring. Maybe im getting a little old for these films, but i kept asking myself why these snot nosed kids were left to defeat the ants...and the focus on strategy????? spolier his way to beat the ants and the bullies is the same....form a ball and the guy in the middle will be safe...brilliant....1/5...don't waste your money

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Post #: 52
RE: Please make it stop - 3/11/2013 4:07:12 PM   
dseys

 

Posts: 180
Joined: 10/8/2012

quote:

ORIGINAL: PhilG1

Terrible film...in fact probably the worst I've seen in a long long time, if ever. The story line was childish, the acting wooden, the characters were pathetic, bordering on comical, and the dialogue was like something out of Bill and Ben.



Didn't you just describe Thor: The Dark World?
Post #: 53
RE: Please make it stop - 4/11/2013 10:54:32 AM   
PhilG1

 

Posts: 1
Joined: 31/10/2013
Not seen Thor 2...dont think I will going off the 1st one...cant be any worse than enders game, can it? Surely not.

(in reply to dseys)
Post #: 54
RE: Please make it stop - 12/11/2013 5:05:27 PM   
kumar


Posts: 5229
Joined: 2/10/2005
Complete bore fest.

Very frustrated with this film. Clunky dialogue, poor child performances, rubbishy effects. Began to get fed up toward the end just before I realised what was happening. Puzzling ending too. Wasnt surprised to see Gavin Hoods name attached to this. The only thing that redeemed this movie was the fact I went to see Thor 2 in the evening.

Dont waste your time

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Post #: 55
RE: Please make it stop - 12/11/2013 7:12:01 PM   
dseys

 

Posts: 180
Joined: 10/8/2012

quote:

ORIGINAL: PhilG1

Not seen Thor 2...dont think I will going off the 1st one...cant be any worse than enders game, can it? Surely not.


Yep, it can. And it is.

Finally saw Ender's Game, didn't particularly liked it but it's not as bad as many would suggest here. Thor 2 on the other hand is a mess from start to finish, which is a shame because Marvel is now one of the most powerful studios on Hollywood, they can do exactly what they want with their movies, so why not dare some originality/creativity instead of just filling the blanks with this shitty B-movie screenplay, rushed action scenes, bland directing and a few jokes to make the movie look "fresh, bold and daring" and get good reviews from critics who otherwise would hate it?

But sadly it's easier to attack someone who's already on the ground.

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Post #: 56
RE: Please make it stop - 12/11/2013 9:11:19 PM   
sanchia


Posts: 18310
Joined: 3/1/2006
From: Norwich
However look at which film performed and which has not done very well and which is considered to have entertained and which is considered to be bland, poorly acted, uninspired and dull. It appears that almost unanimously the latter has been applied to this particular film by the few whom have watched it. Having seen the both they are incomparable in style and plot and you may as well compare Tinker Tailor Soldier Spy with The Bourne Identity in that they are very different styles of film and very different plots etc.

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Post #: 57
RE: Please make it stop - 14/11/2013 4:22:55 PM   
dseys

 

Posts: 180
Joined: 10/8/2012
Fully disagree. Both Thor 2 and Ender's Game are CGI-loaded sci-fi movies aimed at young people, they can be compared. And Thor 2 is a Marvel post-Avengers sequel, it means that whether it's good or bad it'll have a huge, huge box-office success. I sincerely believe that if someone had made the exact same movie without any well-known characters (let's say a complete new franchise with same plot, same villain and same directing "skills"), it would have been trashed by everybody.

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Post #: 58
RE: So what? - 31/12/2013 9:59:03 AM   
chang

 

Posts: 103
Joined: 28/12/2013
A commendable sc-fi drama, this serious film offers up some great themes and some grand visuals.

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Post #: 59
I liked it - 20/1/2014 11:53:45 AM   
Gram Woods

 

Posts: 58
Joined: 18/3/2010
It did move to fast and a lot was lost because of it but having read the book before I thought it wasn't bad. An extra half hour would have helped a lot, more battle room and simulation room scenes. As it is, it did feel rushed and it was difficult to empathise with anyone. Proper sci-fi though this and deserves more than 2 stars, I give it 7/10(ffs Empire drop the 5 star bollocks!) which would be 3.5 on here but the swines wont let me give a half, so I'll round up rather than down :P

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