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RE: What overated films will be future duds?

 
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RE: What overated films will be future duds? - 12/6/2013 1:22:12 PM   
DancingClown


Posts: 4193
Joined: 8/1/2006
From: The Lot
quote:

ORIGINAL: tommyjarvis

Surely the trolls are the ones coming in here and complaining about the thread topic and not contributing anything to it? If they don't like the thread then stay out and leave it to those who want to discuss the topic at hand.

ChudMonkey's post above was a good one explaining the purpose of the thread for those who can't figure it out.


I don't think that's true, some of us have been querying the use of the word overrated as a criticism, both in general and in the so-called context of this thread, and that is perfectly relevant and justifiable. And to be honest the debate about the actual use of this word has been far more edifying and entertaining than anything the original question has thrown up.

< Message edited by DancingClown -- 12/6/2013 1:28:11 PM >


_____________________________

Astronomic Tune Boy

'The town knew darkness, and darkness was enough.'

"Storm just bleeewwww me away..."

(in reply to tommyjarvis)
Post #: 91
RE: What overated films will be future duds? - 12/6/2013 1:32:07 PM   
ChudMonkey


Posts: 130
Joined: 29/7/2007
From: London
quote:

ORIGINAL: DancingClown


quote:

ORIGINAL: tommyjarvis

Surely the trolls are the ones coming in here and complaining about the thread topic and not contributing anything to it? If they don't like the thread then stay out and leave it to those who want to discuss the topic at hand.

ChudMonkey's post above was a good one explaining the purpose of the thread for those who can't figure it out.


I don't think that's true, some of us have been querying the use of the word overrated as a criticism, both in general and in the so-called context of this thread, and that is perfectly relevant and justifiable. And to be honest the debate about the actual use of this word has been far more edifying and entertaining than anything the original question has thrown up. And Chud Monkey's post does nothing but simply dress up the weaknesses of that original question by disingenously pretending it has some kind of deeper cultural meaning.


The basic premise of this thread and my posts so far have been thus...

quote:

Therefore, those films are overrated currently and have the potential to be duds In the future.....this is only the opinion of the poster, the poster is not criticising anyone who thinks differently...they are just looking at current films that are universally loved that, in the future, may be re-evaluated by the public, critics and the movie industry in general. You see I BELIEVE that The Impossible and Zero Dark Thirty are overrated (and I don't see why it's such a problem for me to have that opinion) and I BELIEVE in the future they will be seen as duds.


How is this a disingenuous attempt at deeper cultural meaning? I watched a film that many many people like...I didn't think it was that good a film...I have the opinion that in the future people will not regard this film in quite the same way they did when it came out in 2013

That to me, is a very very simple thing to grasp

You may disagree with me that the films I have mentioned will not be seen in such a light in the future but that does not invalidate my opinion just as I have not invalidated yours...

but wait...you haven't even bothered to have an opinion have you? Just gone on and on and on about the use of the word overrated

ridiculous

< Message edited by ChudMonkey -- 12/6/2013 1:36:04 PM >


_____________________________

Top 10 of 2013 so far:
1. Mud
2. Philomena
3. Before Midnight
4. The Way Way Back
5. Spring Breakers
6. In The House
7. Django Unchained
8. Only God Forgives
9. Tattoo Nation
10. Iron Man 3

(in reply to DancingClown)
Post #: 92
RE: What overated films will be future duds? - 12/6/2013 1:38:42 PM   
MonsterCat


Posts: 7932
Joined: 24/3/2011
From: St. Albans, Hertfordshire
Here's my problem with the use of the term overrated.

More often than not, it's just a word that people throw out there when they can't critique properly. Now, that's sounds pretty ironic coming from someone who can't write reviews for shit, but at least I'm trying to explain why I didn't like a particular film.

Then there are people who use that word in an arrogant context. Dannybohy predictably used The Dark Knight Rises as an example and said that overtime people will eventually come around to his viewpoint and see it for the piece of shit it is. Now, I never had an issue with him not liking the flick, but that post was still astoundingly arrogant and that's what I called him out on. If that's trolling, well so be it. Fine.

Admittedly, there were a few posts back there when I pointlessly tried to play Dannybohy at his own game, and as a 36 year old man I should know better. Apologies for that.

< Message edited by MonsterCat -- 12/6/2013 1:41:18 PM >


_____________________________

"I am a writer, a doctor, a nuclear physicist and a theoretical philosopher. But above all, I am a man, a hopelessly inquisitive man, just like you."

Films watched in 2013

(in reply to DancingClown)
Post #: 93
RE: What overated films will be future duds? - 12/6/2013 1:50:54 PM   
rawlinson

 

Posts: 45002
Joined: 13/6/2008
From: Timbuktu. Chinese or Fictional.
I'm sure this has already been raised on thread, but how come none of the mods has locked this for being just another Unpop Opinion thread?

(in reply to MonsterCat)
Post #: 94
RE: What overated films will be future duds? - 12/6/2013 1:51:03 PM   
great_badir


Posts: 4658
Joined: 6/10/2005
From: A breaking rope bridge in the middle of the jungle
quote:

ORIGINAL: MonsterCat
as a 36 year old man I should know better. Apologies for that.


I should think so too, gramps.







...I'm only two years younger than you.


But I'm still younger.



Granddad.




(Grand-dad? Grandad? Grand dad?)


_____________________________

FAVE FILMS
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(in reply to MonsterCat)
Post #: 95
RE: What overated films will be future duds? - 12/6/2013 1:52:21 PM   
MonsterCat


Posts: 7932
Joined: 24/3/2011
From: St. Albans, Hertfordshire
Why I oughta, you young whippersnapper!

_____________________________

"I am a writer, a doctor, a nuclear physicist and a theoretical philosopher. But above all, I am a man, a hopelessly inquisitive man, just like you."

Films watched in 2013

(in reply to great_badir)
Post #: 96
RE: What overated films will be future duds? - 12/6/2013 1:53:00 PM   
DancingClown


Posts: 4193
Joined: 8/1/2006
From: The Lot
quote:

ORIGINAL: ChudMonkey

but wait...you haven't even bothered to have an opinion have you? Just gone on and on and on about the use of the word overrated

ridiculous


As opposed to what? You mentioned The Impossible and Zero Dark Thirty as films you don't like and you don't think they'll hold up in future years. But why not? What makes them different to the films you don't like but with which you cannot forsee their popularity dwindling? By what cultural barometer are you measuring this? What's the reasoning? There is none. Only the actual passing of time will tell. And the only relevant and intelligent posts have come from those criticising the flaws of the thread's premise. That is the opinion I have been expressing. And seeing as the thread revolves around the word overrated people are perfectly justified in questioning its validity as a lazy and churlish way of provocatively criticising something.

< Message edited by DancingClown -- 12/6/2013 1:54:51 PM >


_____________________________

Astronomic Tune Boy

'The town knew darkness, and darkness was enough.'

"Storm just bleeewwww me away..."

(in reply to ChudMonkey)
Post #: 97
RE: What overated films will be future duds? - 12/6/2013 1:57:44 PM   
great_badir


Posts: 4658
Joined: 6/10/2005
From: A breaking rope bridge in the middle of the jungle
quote:

ORIGINAL: rawlinson
I'm sure this has already been raised on thread, but how come none of the mods has locked this for being just another Unpop Opinion thread?


Just like in every (well, most) director there is a great film in there somewhere, then there is a great discussion to be had in here. Somewhere.

Or summat.

I'm split - I would like to agree with ChudMonkey's theorising, but at the same time I fall more on the side of DC's thinking.


But on that note:

ChudMonkey - I don't think anyone has taken exception to you or your interpretation of the original question, more that exception has been taken to the poster's intent, and responses to both him and Dannybohy have been, rightly or wrongly, written with previous "form" in mind.

< Message edited by great_badir -- 12/6/2013 1:58:58 PM >


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Post #: 98
RE: What overated films will be future duds? - 12/6/2013 1:58:20 PM   
tommyjarvis


Posts: 6632
Joined: 2/11/2005
From: Caught somewhere in time

quote:

ORIGINAL: rawlinson

I'm sure this has already been raised on thread, but how come none of the mods has locked this for being just another Unpop Opinion thread?


This comment comes up all the time. What's the point in that? Why not just lock every thread in Musings and have the Your Unpopular Opinion thread and nothing else?

A forum isn't going to thrive if every second thread is locked because there's another thread that touches vaguely on similar grounds.

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(in reply to rawlinson)
Post #: 99
RE: What overated films will be future duds? - 12/6/2013 2:01:29 PM   
rawlinson

 

Posts: 45002
Joined: 13/6/2008
From: Timbuktu. Chinese or Fictional.

quote:

ORIGINAL: tommyjarvis


quote:

ORIGINAL: rawlinson

I'm sure this has already been raised on thread, but how come none of the mods has locked this for being just another Unpop Opinion thread?


This comment comes up all the time. What's the point in that? Why not just lock every thread in Musings and have the Your Unpopular Opinion thread and nothing else?

A forum isn't going to thrive if every second thread is locked because there's another thread that touches vaguely on similar grounds.


It's not vaguely similar, it's identical. Hit and run opinions with no real explanation, basically revolving around "Other people think this, I disagree."

And shit threads like this are not how the forum is going to thrive.

(in reply to tommyjarvis)
Post #: 100
RE: What overated films will be future duds? - 12/6/2013 2:01:29 PM   
Coyleone


Posts: 557
Joined: 13/10/2008

quote:

ORIGINAL: great_badir

quote:

ORIGINAL: MonsterCat
as a 36 year old man I should know better. Apologies for that.


I should think so too, gramps.







...I'm only two years younger than you.


But I'm still younger.



Granddad.




(Grand-dad? Grandad? Grand dad?)



Now this...this is a good question.

(in reply to great_badir)
Post #: 101
RE: What overated films will be future duds? - 12/6/2013 2:04:05 PM   
ChudMonkey


Posts: 130
Joined: 29/7/2007
From: London
quote:

ORIGINAL: MonsterCat

Here's my problem with the use of the term overrated.

More often than not, it's just a word that people throw out there when they can't critique properly. Now, that's sounds pretty ironic coming from someone who can't write reviews for shit, but at least I'm trying to explain why I didn't like a particular film.

Then there are people who use that word in an arrogant context. Dannybohy predictably used The Dark Knight Rises as an example and said that overtime people will eventually come around to his viewpoint and see it for the piece of shit it is. Now, I never had an issue with him not liking the flick, but that post was still astoundingly arrogant and that's what I called him out on. If that's trolling, well so be it. Fine.

Admittedly, there were a few posts back there when I pointlessly tried to play Dannybohy at his own game, and as a 36 year old man I should know better. Apologies for that.


Ok so here is why I think The Impossible is overrated...

Aside from the opening tsunami and one excellent piece of body horror in the hospital the acting and dialogue is TV Movie of the Week Schmaltzy, the child actors are completely unlikable and wooden, the coincidence-laden meet-up ending is obviously not how it happened but is presented as a true representation (in the same way Argo's final action-scene was an obvious Hollywoodisation of events). This movie has been universally applauded and I believe that makes it overrated.

as for Zero Dark Thirty

My main issue with this film is that its presentation of torture is never really critiqued or criticised. When I saw the movie someone was actually cheering the US soldiers on as they tortured their prisoners (an effect I'm sure the filmmakers didn't intend). I think the film fails to deliver any real dialogue on the nature of terrorism the West's relationship with Islam or any criticism of US military tactics and for a film about the capture and execution of the world's most wanted terrorist I think that is a massive failure...and therefore I believe it to be overrated

I think I'm justified in using overrated as a description of these films based on my own opinions now...I don't expect anyone to agree with me that they are overrated, just agree that I'm entitled to my opinion


< Message edited by ChudMonkey -- 12/6/2013 2:17:35 PM >


_____________________________

Top 10 of 2013 so far:
1. Mud
2. Philomena
3. Before Midnight
4. The Way Way Back
5. Spring Breakers
6. In The House
7. Django Unchained
8. Only God Forgives
9. Tattoo Nation
10. Iron Man 3

(in reply to MonsterCat)
Post #: 102
RE: What overated films will be future duds? - 12/6/2013 2:08:37 PM   
MonsterCat


Posts: 7932
Joined: 24/3/2011
From: St. Albans, Hertfordshire

quote:

ORIGINAL: ChudMonkey

Ok so here is why I think The Impossible is overrated...

Aside from the opening tsunami and one excellent piece of body horror in the hospital the acting and dialogue is TV Movie of the Week Schmaltzy, the child actors are completely unlikable and wooden, the coincidence-laden meet-up ending is obviously not how it happened but is presented as a true representation (in the same way Argo's final action-scene was an obvious Hollywoodisation of events). This movie has been universally applauded and I believe that makes it overrated.

as for Zero Dark Thirty

My main issue with this film is that its presentation of torture is never really critiqued or criticised. When I saw the movie someone was actually cheering the US soldiers on as they tortured their prisoners (an effect I'm sure the filmmakers didn't intend). I think film fails to deliver any real dialogue on the nature of terrorism the West's relationship with Islam or any criticism of US military tactics and for a film about the capture and execution of the world's most want terrorist I think that is a massive failure...and therefore I believe it to be overrated

I think I'm justified in using overrated as a description of these films based on my own opinions now...I don't expect anyone to agree with me that they are overrated, just agree that I'm entitled to my opinion



I liked The Impossible a little bit more than you but you do raise some good points.



_____________________________

"I am a writer, a doctor, a nuclear physicist and a theoretical philosopher. But above all, I am a man, a hopelessly inquisitive man, just like you."

Films watched in 2013

(in reply to ChudMonkey)
Post #: 103
RE: What overated films will be future duds? - 12/6/2013 2:12:08 PM   
rawlinson

 

Posts: 45002
Joined: 13/6/2008
From: Timbuktu. Chinese or Fictional.

quote:

ORIGINAL: ChudMonkey


quote:

ORIGINAL: MonsterCat

Here's my problem with the use of the term overrated.

More often than not, it's just a word that people throw out there when they can't critique properly. Now, that's sounds pretty ironic coming from someone who can't write reviews for shit, but at least I'm trying to explain why I didn't like a particular film.

Then there are people who use that word in an arrogant context. Dannybohy predictably used The Dark Knight Rises as an example and said that overtime people will eventually come around to his viewpoint and see it for the piece of shit it is. Now, I never had an issue with him not liking the flick, but that post was still astoundingly arrogant and that's what I called him out on. If that's trolling, well so be it. Fine.

Admittedly, there were a few posts back there when I pointlessly tried to play Dannybohy at his own game, and as a 36 year old man I should know better. Apologies for that.


Ok so here is why I think The Impossible is overrated...

Aside from the opening tsunami and one excellent piece of body horror in the hospital the acting and dialogue is TV Movie of the Week Schmaltzy, the child actors are completely unlikable and wooden, the coincidence-laden meet-up ending is obviously not how it happened but is presented as a true representation (in the same way Argo's final action-scene was an obvious Hollywoodisation of events). This movie has been universally applauded and I believe that makes it overrated.



That's not why a movie is overrated, those are problems you had with the film. Because others might not have had those problems, doesn't mean it's overrated. It means you disagree with other people. And it's far from universally applauded. 73% on Metacritic. A universally applauded film would have been scoring much higher.

quote:

My main issue with this film is that its presentation of torture is never really critiqued or criticised. When I saw the movie someone was actually cheering the US soldiers on as they tortured their prisoners (an effect I'm sure the filmmakers didn't intend). I think film fails to deliver any real dialogue on the nature of terrorism the West's relationship with Islam or any criticism of US military tactics and for a film about the capture and execution of the world's most want terrorist I think that is a massive failure...and therefore I believe it to be overrated


That's also not why the film is overrated. That's you complaining that the film was a different one to the one you wanted to see. The film is essentially a procedural on the hunt for a terrorist. It's not trying to be a definitive statement on the nature of terrorism, or the West's relationship with Islam. You're criticising it for things it's obviously not even attempted.

quote:

I think I'm justified in using overrated as a description of these films based on my own opinions now...I don't expect anyone to agree with me that they are overrated, just agree that I'm entitled to my opinion


You're perfectly entitled to dislike the films. Doesn't mean that the use of the term overrated isn't both lazy and incorrect though.

(in reply to ChudMonkey)
Post #: 104
RE: What overated films will be future duds? - 12/6/2013 2:15:11 PM   
ChudMonkey


Posts: 130
Joined: 29/7/2007
From: London

quote:

ORIGINAL: rawlinson


quote:

ORIGINAL: tommyjarvis


quote:

ORIGINAL: rawlinson

I'm sure this has already been raised on thread, but how come none of the mods has locked this for being just another Unpop Opinion thread?


This comment comes up all the time. What's the point in that? Why not just lock every thread in Musings and have the Your Unpopular Opinion thread and nothing else?

A forum isn't going to thrive if every second thread is locked because there's another thread that touches vaguely on similar grounds.


It's not vaguely similar, it's identical. Hit and run opinions with no real explanation, basically revolving around "Other people think this, I disagree."

And shit threads like this are not how the forum is going to thrive.


No it's not - read my thoughts on it

_____________________________

Top 10 of 2013 so far:
1. Mud
2. Philomena
3. Before Midnight
4. The Way Way Back
5. Spring Breakers
6. In The House
7. Django Unchained
8. Only God Forgives
9. Tattoo Nation
10. Iron Man 3

(in reply to rawlinson)
Post #: 105
RE: What overated films will be future duds? - 12/6/2013 2:16:21 PM   
ChudMonkey


Posts: 130
Joined: 29/7/2007
From: London

quote:

ORIGINAL: DancingClown

quote:

ORIGINAL: ChudMonkey

but wait...you haven't even bothered to have an opinion have you? Just gone on and on and on about the use of the word overrated

ridiculous


As opposed to what? You mentioned The Impossible and Zero Dark Thirty as films you don't like and you don't think they'll hold up in future years. But why not? What makes them different to the films you don't like but with which you cannot forsee their popularity dwindling? By what cultural barometer are you measuring this? What's the reasoning? There is none. Only the actual passing of time will tell. And the only relevant and intelligent posts have come from those criticising the flaws of the thread's premise. That is the opinion I have been expressing. And seeing as the thread revolves around the word overrated people are perfectly justified in questioning its validity as a lazy and churlish way of provocatively criticising something.


My first post gave (admittedly) vague reasons.
I have expanded in my post above



_____________________________

Top 10 of 2013 so far:
1. Mud
2. Philomena
3. Before Midnight
4. The Way Way Back
5. Spring Breakers
6. In The House
7. Django Unchained
8. Only God Forgives
9. Tattoo Nation
10. Iron Man 3

(in reply to DancingClown)
Post #: 106
RE: What overated films will be future duds? - 12/6/2013 2:18:47 PM   
DancingClown


Posts: 4193
Joined: 8/1/2006
From: The Lot

quote:

ORIGINAL: ChudMonkey


quote:

ORIGINAL: DancingClown

quote:

ORIGINAL: ChudMonkey

but wait...you haven't even bothered to have an opinion have you? Just gone on and on and on about the use of the word overrated

ridiculous


As opposed to what? You mentioned The Impossible and Zero Dark Thirty as films you don't like and you don't think they'll hold up in future years. But why not? What makes them different to the films you don't like but with which you cannot forsee their popularity dwindling? By what cultural barometer are you measuring this? What's the reasoning? There is none. Only the actual passing of time will tell. And the only relevant and intelligent posts have come from those criticising the flaws of the thread's premise. That is the opinion I have been expressing. And seeing as the thread revolves around the word overrated people are perfectly justified in questioning its validity as a lazy and churlish way of provocatively criticising something.


My first post gave (admittedly) vague reasons.
I have expanded in my post above



Where? No you haven't.


_____________________________

Astronomic Tune Boy

'The town knew darkness, and darkness was enough.'

"Storm just bleeewwww me away..."

(in reply to ChudMonkey)
Post #: 107
RE: What overated films will be future duds? - 12/6/2013 2:23:25 PM   
ChudMonkey


Posts: 130
Joined: 29/7/2007
From: London

quote:

ORIGINAL: rawlinson


quote:

ORIGINAL: ChudMonkey


quote:

ORIGINAL: MonsterCat

Here's my problem with the use of the term overrated.

More often than not, it's just a word that people throw out there when they can't critique properly. Now, that's sounds pretty ironic coming from someone who can't write reviews for shit, but at least I'm trying to explain why I didn't like a particular film.

Then there are people who use that word in an arrogant context. Dannybohy predictably used The Dark Knight Rises as an example and said that overtime people will eventually come around to his viewpoint and see it for the piece of shit it is. Now, I never had an issue with him not liking the flick, but that post was still astoundingly arrogant and that's what I called him out on. If that's trolling, well so be it. Fine.

Admittedly, there were a few posts back there when I pointlessly tried to play Dannybohy at his own game, and as a 36 year old man I should know better. Apologies for that.


Ok so here is why I think The Impossible is overrated...

Aside from the opening tsunami and one excellent piece of body horror in the hospital the acting and dialogue is TV Movie of the Week Schmaltzy, the child actors are completely unlikable and wooden, the coincidence-laden meet-up ending is obviously not how it happened but is presented as a true representation (in the same way Argo's final action-scene was an obvious Hollywoodisation of events). This movie has been universally applauded and I believe that makes it overrated.



That's not why a movie is overrated, those are problems you had with the film. Because others might not have had those problems, doesn't mean it's overrated. It means you disagree with other people. And it's far from universally applauded. 73% on Metacritic. A universally applauded film would have been scoring much higher.

quote:

My main issue with this film is that its presentation of torture is never really critiqued or criticised. When I saw the movie someone was actually cheering the US soldiers on as they tortured their prisoners (an effect I'm sure the filmmakers didn't intend). I think film fails to deliver any real dialogue on the nature of terrorism the West's relationship with Islam or any criticism of US military tactics and for a film about the capture and execution of the world's most want terrorist I think that is a massive failure...and therefore I believe it to be overrated


That's also not why the film is overrated. That's you complaining that the film was a different one to the one you wanted to see. The film is essentially a procedural on the hunt for a terrorist. It's not trying to be a definitive statement on the nature of terrorism, or the West's relationship with Islam. You're criticising it for things it's obviously not even attempted.

quote:

I think I'm justified in using overrated as a description of these films based on my own opinions now...I don't expect anyone to agree with me that they are overrated, just agree that I'm entitled to my opinion


You're perfectly entitled to dislike the films. Doesn't mean that the use of the term overrated isn't both lazy and incorrect though.


So I'm not allowed to have the opinion that a film is overrated? That is utterly ridiculous!

How dare someone say that just because something is universally applauded means no one is able to say its overrated....the very fact that so many people think its a great film is why I think its overrated...People rate it highly and I don't. Therefore I believe its overrated

Why is that so hard a concept to grasp? I really can't understand why I'm not allowed to have the opinion that a movie is overrated by the general public?



_____________________________

Top 10 of 2013 so far:
1. Mud
2. Philomena
3. Before Midnight
4. The Way Way Back
5. Spring Breakers
6. In The House
7. Django Unchained
8. Only God Forgives
9. Tattoo Nation
10. Iron Man 3

(in reply to rawlinson)
Post #: 108
RE: What overated films will be future duds? - 12/6/2013 2:24:37 PM   
ChudMonkey


Posts: 130
Joined: 29/7/2007
From: London

quote:

ORIGINAL: DancingClown


quote:

ORIGINAL: ChudMonkey


quote:

ORIGINAL: DancingClown

quote:

ORIGINAL: ChudMonkey

but wait...you haven't even bothered to have an opinion have you? Just gone on and on and on about the use of the word overrated

ridiculous


As opposed to what? You mentioned The Impossible and Zero Dark Thirty as films you don't like and you don't think they'll hold up in future years. But why not? What makes them different to the films you don't like but with which you cannot forsee their popularity dwindling? By what cultural barometer are you measuring this? What's the reasoning? There is none. Only the actual passing of time will tell. And the only relevant and intelligent posts have come from those criticising the flaws of the thread's premise. That is the opinion I have been expressing. And seeing as the thread revolves around the word overrated people are perfectly justified in questioning its validity as a lazy and churlish way of provocatively criticising something.


My first post gave (admittedly) vague reasons.
I have expanded in my post above



Where? No you haven't.



quote:

V
Ok so here is why I think The Impossible is overrated...

Aside from the opening tsunami and one excellent piece of body horror in the hospital the acting and dialogue is TV Movie of the Week Schmaltzy, the child actors are completely unlikable and wooden, the coincidence-laden meet-up ending is obviously not how it happened but is presented as a true representation (in the same way Argo's final action-scene was an obvious Hollywoodisation of events). This movie has been universally applauded and I believe that makes it overrated.

as for Zero Dark Thirty

My main issue with this film is that its presentation of torture is never really critiqued or criticised. When I saw the movie someone was actually cheering the US soldiers on as they tortured their prisoners (an effect I'm sure the filmmakers didn't intend). I think the film fails to deliver any real dialogue on the nature of terrorism the West's relationship with Islam or any criticism of US military tactics and for a film about the capture and execution of the world's most wanted terrorist I think that is a massive failure...and therefore I believe it to be overrated

I think I'm justified in using overrated as a description of these films based on my own opinions now...I don't expect anyone to agree with me that they are overrated, just agree that I'm entitled to my opinion


unless you have difficulty reading...yes I have

_____________________________

Top 10 of 2013 so far:
1. Mud
2. Philomena
3. Before Midnight
4. The Way Way Back
5. Spring Breakers
6. In The House
7. Django Unchained
8. Only God Forgives
9. Tattoo Nation
10. Iron Man 3

(in reply to DancingClown)
Post #: 109
RE: What overated films will be future duds? - 12/6/2013 2:25:10 PM   
DancingClown


Posts: 4193
Joined: 8/1/2006
From: The Lot
Yeah, we get why you don't like them but are you going to answer my question?

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(in reply to ChudMonkey)
Post #: 110
RE: What overated films will be future duds? - 12/6/2013 2:28:04 PM   
rawlinson

 

Posts: 45002
Joined: 13/6/2008
From: Timbuktu. Chinese or Fictional.

quote:

ORIGINAL: ChudMonkey


quote:

ORIGINAL: rawlinson


quote:

ORIGINAL: tommyjarvis


quote:

ORIGINAL: rawlinson

I'm sure this has already been raised on thread, but how come none of the mods has locked this for being just another Unpop Opinion thread?


This comment comes up all the time. What's the point in that? Why not just lock every thread in Musings and have the Your Unpopular Opinion thread and nothing else?

A forum isn't going to thrive if every second thread is locked because there's another thread that touches vaguely on similar grounds.


It's not vaguely similar, it's identical. Hit and run opinions with no real explanation, basically revolving around "Other people think this, I disagree."

And shit threads like this are not how the forum is going to thrive.


No it's not - read my thoughts on it


I already have. The only difference from this thread to unpopular opinion is that this is an even more arrogant thread because it's essentially saying "One day I'll be proved right and you'll all see!!!" This thread is no different to the idiots who run into review threads and post "How dare you only give this film 4 stars when it clearly deserves five!" or "You're punishing good film-making by only giving this two stars!!!!!!!"

It all amount to the same thing, some people can't stand that the general consensus on a film is different to their opinion, instead of just offering critiques on films, they offer critiques on the people by throwing around statements like overrated. Because if a film is overrated, those who rate it higher must be wrong.

quote:

So I'm not allowed to have the opinion that a film is overrated? That is utterly ridiculous!

How dare someone say that just because something is universally applauded means no one is able to say its overrated....the very fact that so many people think its a great film is why I think its overrated...People rate it highly and I don't. Therefore I believe its overrated

Why is that so hard a concept to grasp? I really can't understand why I'm not allowed to have the opinion that a movie is overrated by the general public?


Because the entire concept of a film being overrated is nonsense. For a film to be overrated it would first have to be able to be objectively measured on a rating scale. That can't happen. So as I've already explained, calling a film overrated says nothing about a film, your thoughts on a film, or anything of the kind. All it says that some people liked a film more than you and therefore you think they're wrong. Try criticising the film instead of the people.

(in reply to ChudMonkey)
Post #: 111
RE: What overated films will be future duds? - 12/6/2013 2:29:09 PM   
DancingClown


Posts: 4193
Joined: 8/1/2006
From: The Lot
quote:

ORIGINAL: ChudMonkey


quote:

ORIGINAL: DancingClown


quote:

ORIGINAL: ChudMonkey


quote:

ORIGINAL: DancingClown

quote:

ORIGINAL: ChudMonkey

but wait...you haven't even bothered to have an opinion have you? Just gone on and on and on about the use of the word overrated

ridiculous


As opposed to what? You mentioned The Impossible and Zero Dark Thirty as films you don't like and you don't think they'll hold up in future years. But why not? What makes them different to the films you don't like but with which you cannot forsee their popularity dwindling? By what cultural barometer are you measuring this? What's the reasoning? There is none. Only the actual passing of time will tell. And the only relevant and intelligent posts have come from those criticising the flaws of the thread's premise. That is the opinion I have been expressing. And seeing as the thread revolves around the word overrated people are perfectly justified in questioning its validity as a lazy and churlish way of provocatively criticising something.


My first post gave (admittedly) vague reasons.
I have expanded in my post above



Where? No you haven't.



quote:

V
Ok so here is why I think The Impossible is overrated...

Aside from the opening tsunami and one excellent piece of body horror in the hospital the acting and dialogue is TV Movie of the Week Schmaltzy, the child actors are completely unlikable and wooden, the coincidence-laden meet-up ending is obviously not how it happened but is presented as a true representation (in the same way Argo's final action-scene was an obvious Hollywoodisation of events). This movie has been universally applauded and I believe that makes it overrated.

as for Zero Dark Thirty

My main issue with this film is that its presentation of torture is never really critiqued or criticised. When I saw the movie someone was actually cheering the US soldiers on as they tortured their prisoners (an effect I'm sure the filmmakers didn't intend). I think the film fails to deliver any real dialogue on the nature of terrorism the West's relationship with Islam or any criticism of US military tactics and for a film about the capture and execution of the world's most wanted terrorist I think that is a massive failure...and therefore I believe it to be overrated

I think I'm justified in using overrated as a description of these films based on my own opinions now...I don't expect anyone to agree with me that they are overrated, just agree that I'm entitled to my opinion


unless you have difficulty reading...yes I have


No you haven't. My question was about WHY you think they will be duds in the future! As opposed to films you still don't like but which you DON'T think will be duds in the future.

If anyone's having trouble reading...

quote:

ORIGINAL: DancingClown



As opposed to what? You mentioned The Impossible and Zero Dark Thirty as films you don't like and you don't think they'll hold up in future years. But why not? What makes them different to the films you don't like but with which you cannot forsee their popularity dwindling? By what cultural barometer are you measuring this? What's the reasoning?
There is none. Only the actual passing of time will tell. And the only relevant and intelligent posts have come from those criticising the flaws of the thread's premise. That is the opinion I have been expressing. And seeing as the thread revolves around the word overrated people are perfectly justified in questioning its validity as a lazy and churlish way of provocatively criticising something.


See? You said this thread was different because it asked how those films would be perceived in years to come. Well, go on then!!!

< Message edited by DancingClown -- 12/6/2013 2:30:35 PM >


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Astronomic Tune Boy

'The town knew darkness, and darkness was enough.'

"Storm just bleeewwww me away..."

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Post #: 112
RE: What overated films will be future duds? - 12/6/2013 2:30:41 PM   
ChudMonkey


Posts: 130
Joined: 29/7/2007
From: London

quote:

ORIGINAL: DancingClown

Yeah, we get why you don't like them but are you going to answer my question?


As to why they won't be regarded highly in the future? For the very reasons stated....the films will not be remembered so fondly in years to come.

The Impossible is a forgettable TV Movie - I honestly don't think anyone will be discussing it in 10 years time like the will with say, Django Unchained or The Life Of Pi - because of the issues with the film that I've listed

Zero Dark Thirty is due to its political significance...in 10 years time I believe people will look back at it as a vacuous account of a very major political event...the whole War On Terror is a subject that is rife for any number of movies and I'm sure better will come along in the future making Zero Dark Thirty an insignificant blip in the history of cinema




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Top 10 of 2013 so far:
1. Mud
2. Philomena
3. Before Midnight
4. The Way Way Back
5. Spring Breakers
6. In The House
7. Django Unchained
8. Only God Forgives
9. Tattoo Nation
10. Iron Man 3

(in reply to DancingClown)
Post #: 113
RE: What overated films will be future duds? - 12/6/2013 2:34:31 PM   
MonsterCat


Posts: 7932
Joined: 24/3/2011
From: St. Albans, Hertfordshire
quote:

ORIGINAL: ChudMonkey

Zero Dark Thirty is due to its political significance...in 10 years time I believe people will look back at it as a vacuous account of a very major political event...the whole War On Terror is a subject that is rife for any number of movies and I'm sure better will come along in the future making Zero Dark Thirty an insignificant blip in the history of cinema



That's pretty presumptuous and just a touch arrogant. That's pretty much the problem I had with Dannybohy's post.


< Message edited by MonsterCat -- 12/6/2013 2:38:02 PM >


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Post #: 114
RE: What overated films will be future duds? - 12/6/2013 2:36:24 PM   
Rebel scum


Posts: 3483
Joined: 2/1/2006

quote:

ORIGINAL: ChudMonkey


The Impossible is a forgettable TV Movie - I honestly don't think anyone will be discussing it in 10 years time like the will with say, Django Unchained or The Life Of Pi - because of the issues with the film that I've listed



You mean that film which becomes vacuous and empty once you remove the OMG PRETTY? When special effects get better, Life of Pi will be shown to have the depth and complexity of a tech demo.

This is obviously just bollocks hypothesizing, but I think it's in the spirit of the thread.

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Post #: 115
RE: What overated films will be future duds? - 12/6/2013 2:41:39 PM   
ChudMonkey


Posts: 130
Joined: 29/7/2007
From: London

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rebel scum


quote:

ORIGINAL: ChudMonkey


The Impossible is a forgettable TV Movie - I honestly don't think anyone will be discussing it in 10 years time like the will with say, Django Unchained or The Life Of Pi - because of the issues with the film that I've listed



You mean that film which becomes vacuous and empty once you remove the OMG PRETTY? When special effects get better, Life of Pi will be shown to have the depth and complexity of a tech demo.
This is obviously just bollocks hypothesizing, but I think it's in the spirit of the thread.


I actually agree with you about Life Of Pi....I just think that people will still be making those OMG PRETTY statements in 10, 20, 30 years time about it so it won't be a dud

_____________________________

Top 10 of 2013 so far:
1. Mud
2. Philomena
3. Before Midnight
4. The Way Way Back
5. Spring Breakers
6. In The House
7. Django Unchained
8. Only God Forgives
9. Tattoo Nation
10. Iron Man 3

(in reply to Rebel scum)
Post #: 116
RE: What overated films will be future duds? - 12/6/2013 2:44:20 PM   
ChudMonkey


Posts: 130
Joined: 29/7/2007
From: London

quote:

ORIGINAL: MonsterCat

quote:

ORIGINAL: ChudMonkey

Zero Dark Thirty is due to its political significance...in 10 years time I believe people will look back at it as a vacuous account of a very major political event...the whole War On Terror is a subject that is rife for any number of movies and I'm sure better will come along in the future making Zero Dark Thirty an insignificant blip in the history of cinema



That's pretty presumptuous and just a touch arrogant. That's pretty much the problem I had with Dannybohy's post.



How is it arrogant? I just believe there will be better, more in depth accounts of the whole affair that will make Zero Dark Thirty redundant...just like how we learn more and more about our past and people write better and better history books about the events

_____________________________

Top 10 of 2013 so far:
1. Mud
2. Philomena
3. Before Midnight
4. The Way Way Back
5. Spring Breakers
6. In The House
7. Django Unchained
8. Only God Forgives
9. Tattoo Nation
10. Iron Man 3

(in reply to MonsterCat)
Post #: 117
RE: What overated films will be future duds? - 12/6/2013 2:45:43 PM   
Rebel scum


Posts: 3483
Joined: 2/1/2006
If the only saving grace of a film is visual effects, it's a dud. The Star Wars prequels still have pretty decent visual effects, but they're seen as duds since everything else is terrible. Same for Transformers and the POTC films post-Black Pearl.
Some people had a very different reaction to Life of Pi than me and were claiming it's a deep and layered story about God or some shit. I disagree and find the film shallow even compared to the book, but I'm not going to argue that in ten years everyone who felt that way is suddenly going to go "Wait a minute! Life of Pi sucked!"

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Post #: 118
RE: What overated films will be future duds? - 12/6/2013 2:49:00 PM   
DancingClown


Posts: 4193
Joined: 8/1/2006
From: The Lot
quote:

ORIGINAL: ChudMonkey


quote:

ORIGINAL: MonsterCat

quote:

ORIGINAL: ChudMonkey

Zero Dark Thirty is due to its political significance...in 10 years time I believe people will look back at it as a vacuous account of a very major political event...the whole War On Terror is a subject that is rife for any number of movies and I'm sure better will come along in the future making Zero Dark Thirty an insignificant blip in the history of cinema



That's pretty presumptuous and just a touch arrogant. That's pretty much the problem I had with Dannybohy's post.



How is it arrogant? I just believe there will be better, more in depth accounts of the whole affair that will make Zero Dark Thirty redundant...just like how we learn more and more about our past and people write better and better history books about the events


Or you could argue that a more recent account of an event like this is more valid and trustworthy, as opposed to accounts in years to come where myth and whitewash could take precedence over fact.

< Message edited by DancingClown -- 12/6/2013 2:54:11 PM >


_____________________________

Astronomic Tune Boy

'The town knew darkness, and darkness was enough.'

"Storm just bleeewwww me away..."

(in reply to ChudMonkey)
Post #: 119
RE: What overated films will be future duds? - 12/6/2013 2:49:09 PM   
Rebel scum


Posts: 3483
Joined: 2/1/2006
quote:

ORIGINAL: ChudMonkey

How is it arrogant? I just believe there will be better, more in depth accounts of the whole affair that will make Zero Dark Thirty redundant...just like how we learn more and more about our past and people write better and better history books about the events


I dunno, it's meant to be a representation of one person's viewpoint of a historic event as it happened. Those sorts of historiographies are much more interesting, since it's free from hindsight and much more immediate (and even more reliable than later books). While I'm sure not many people loved ZDT as much as I do, I'd equate it with something like All Quiet On The Western Front in terms of its perspective, impact and effectiveness.

EDIT - What DC said . Though no retelling is bias-free, ZDT struck me as as reliable a take as we might ever get.

< Message edited by Rebel scum -- 12/6/2013 2:50:08 PM >


_____________________________

"We are not safe! A dark menace rises to the east! Duckies go quack! Cows go moo! I want ice cream. Verily, will you two hobbits join my quest?"

(in reply to ChudMonkey)
Post #: 120
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