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RE: Frank Lampard writes about magic footballs (really) - 18/2/2013 10:55:58 PM   
Goodfella


Posts: 17377
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: North Devon

quote:

ORIGINAL: Cloud Cuckoo


quote:

ORIGINAL: Goodfella

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sinatra

CC must think all footballers are complete morons.


I don't understand the comparisons to Enid Blyton either.

Taking it well out of context there aren't we? He's probably going to write one or two series of very light-hearted books aimed mainly at kids who like football.

I don't think he's trying to win a Booker Prize.


Oh for crying out loud!! How many times do I have to repeat myself, or are you just not reading any of the above??

a) Lampard said he was basing his stories on "friends and team mates" - given his team mates include John Terry and Ashley Cole, I found this funny. They are hardly fodder for children's fiction.

b) Going from being a professional footballer to being a children's author is quite a surprising and unexpected career change - they have nothing in common. We're used to seeing footballers become pundits or managers. Enid Blyton was simply the first children's author to pop into my head, hence the example.

I never suggested at any point he was aiming for the Orange Prize for Children's Fiction! And I have now stated several times that I do not think that all footballers are morons. I am a football supporter myself. However the stereotype exists, so I referenced it.

Jesus Christ please let me not have to explain this again.


Woah nelly! Who said my comments were entirely directed at you? My comments were actually my own opinions and not totally centered at just your point of view, the Enid Blyton reference was because that was the only other children's author I saw referred too in this thread.

But to reply to your points...

a) Lampard has and has had other team-mates than just John Terry and Ashley Cole. I hardly imagine his stories are going to be about trying to get little JT to come out to play but he wouldn't because he was having too much fun with his own magical balls and little Waynie's girlyfriend. I also shouldn't imagine that children are going to be able to make the connection here, and maybe this decision by Lampard is the kind of role-model children need in footballer's, rather than the forementioned Terry and Cole, but you would rather see that knocked back would you?

b) It's not uncommon for celebrities, and Lampard is a celebrity as well as a footballer as are most top-end Premiership players, to write a book, and especially a children's series. Also I sincerely doubt he is going to be let loose on a Macbook Pro and expected to create the most sensational imaginations, he'll work closely with publishers and ghost writers as I'm sure even Lampard knows he's no Enid Blyton! But this is a sweet and, it appears at a very early stage, a refreshing career move post-football. Why should we be writing him off (no pun intended!) before it's even started?

As per your final point, a lot of footballers are morons to be honest, but Lampard has always struck me both on and off the field, to actually be in the minority that is not!

quote:

CC, the problem here is that football fans are even less intelligent than footballers.

*lights touch paper*


I take it your a rugby fan?

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Post #: 31
RE: Frank Lampard writes about magic footballs (really) - 19/2/2013 3:51:57 AM   
Cloud Cuckoo


Posts: 408
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From: Mind your own
quote:

ORIGINAL: Goodfella

Woah nelly! Who said my comments were entirely directed at you? My comments were actually my own opinions and not totally centered at just your point of view, the Enid Blyton reference was because that was the only other children's author I saw referred too in this thread.


No one said that your comments were directed entirely at me, including me. My exasperation resulted from Sinatra stating "CC must think all footballers are morons" when I had already explicitly expressed that this was not the case.

You were quoted so I could respond to your Enid Blyton comment.


quote:


But to reply to your points...

a) Lampard has and has had other team-mates than just John Terry and Ashley Cole. I hardly imagine his stories are going to be about trying to get little JT to come out to play but he wouldn't because he was having too much fun with his own magical balls and little Waynie's girlyfriend. I also shouldn't imagine that children are going to be able to make the connection here, and maybe this decision by Lampard is the kind of role-model children need in footballer's, rather than the forementioned Terry and Cole, but you would rather see that knocked back would you?



I know that Lampard has had team mates other than John Terry and Ashley Cole, that would be a pretty small team otherwise huh? Why do people keep stating the patently obvious? Lampard, as a professional footballer, has had many team mates, both domestically and internationally. Something we can agree on! It just so happens that amongst his many team mates have been proven adulterers and an alleged racist.

As for the rest of what you say, do you honestly think that I believe Lampard is going to base his stories on John Terry and his other less reputable team mates? Or do you think - just maybe - that I and others have been joking around and having fun with the possibilities?? Did everyone leave their humour detectors at the door of this thread?

I agree that Lampard is a better role model and that writing children's fiction is a noble exploit. When did I state I didn't? I wish people would stop assuming that just because I found something funny I am opposed to it! What a strange leap to make.


quote:


b) It's not uncommon for celebrities, and Lampard is a celebrity as well as a footballer as are most top-end Premiership players, to write a book, and especially a children's series. Also I sincerely doubt he is going to be let loose on a Macbook Pro and expected to create the most sensational imaginations, he'll work closely with publishers and ghost writers as I'm sure even Lampard knows he's no Enid Blyton! But this is a sweet and, it appears at a very early stage, a refreshing career move post-football. Why should we be writing him off (no pun intended!) before it's even started?



Again, I know that other celebrities write books, something you will find I commented on at length on page 1 (I can't believe we're onto page 2) of this thread, following DC's post.

I have at no stage disparaged Lampard for writing children's books - I agree that the attempt is commendable, and I also commend him for reading to his children. But it did strike me as comical, for the reasons I have already listed, and for the fact his main character is rather unimaginatively named 'Frankie'. Seeing as you mentioned it, 'magic balls' is pretty funny too.

The issue here is sense of humour. I and others found the story amusing, you and Sinatra didn't. Such is life, the world will move on. People have different senses of humour; you shouldn't castigate others for finding humour in a situation you don't, unless perhaps it is grossly offensive or insensitive. This is neither, though some posters seem to regard Lampard as a national treasure exempt from the traditional jokes and lampooning aimed at other footballers.


quote:


As per your final point, a lot of footballers are morons to be honest, but Lampard has always struck me both on and off the field, to actually be in the minority that is not!


You are arguing my case for me now, bearing in mind I have at no stage impugned Frank Lampard personally, only referenced stereotypes applying to footballers in general.

Careful though; such comments are not well met in these here comically oversensitive parts...

< Message edited by Cloud Cuckoo -- 19/2/2013 3:53:11 AM >


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Post #: 32
RE: Frank Lampard writes about magic footballs (really) - 19/2/2013 6:53:17 AM   
horribleives

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: homersimpson_esq

CC, the problem here is that football fans are even less intelligent than footballers.



Maybe, although this football fan still spotted a grammatical error in your Django Unchained review

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RE: Frank Lampard writes about magic footballs (really) - 19/2/2013 10:41:22 AM   
Juice Terry

 

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From: Fae the juice lorries, ken?
I must admit, I do find the reaction from some people to the original post a little odd. I do wonder if the post would have had the same reaction if it was made about Katie Price, prior to her first book, as models appear to suffer from the same stereotype as footballers with regards to inteligence. I may be wrong, but I don't imagine as many people would have leapt to her defence.

As for the topic itself, I say good luck to Frank. It's certainly a refreshing change to see him try his hand at writing, rather than go down the usual route of becoming a dull as dishwater pundit, or mediocre manager, as most footballers do.

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RE: Frank Lampard writes about magic footballs (really) - 19/2/2013 11:37:08 AM   
DancingClown


Posts: 4257
Joined: 8/1/2006
From: The Lot

quote:

ORIGINAL: Juice Terry

As for the topic itself, I say good luck to Frank. It's certainly a refreshing change to see him try his hand at writing, rather than go down the usual route of becoming a dull as dishwater pundit, or mediocre manager, as most footballers do.


But there's the problem for me. Most people write because it is a passion, something they felt they were born to do. If you're a writer, you write, it's not just something you "try" one day. And whether or not the books will be any good is a moot point, as it's his celebrity status that will sell them. No ground work. He's walking into a publishing deal irrespective of his ability to write. He's not creating philosophical tomes but writing good children's fiction still requires a degree of talent, surely. It's frustrating for those trying to make their way in the world of publishing with actual hard work and persistence. And if it turns out he can't write they'll be ghostwritten, for which he will still get all the attention and credit.

But, ya know, anything that encourages little lads to read, I suppose....

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RE: Frank Lampard writes about magic footballs (really) - 19/2/2013 11:50:32 AM   
homersimpson_esq


Posts: 20121
Joined: 30/9/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: horribleives


quote:

ORIGINAL: homersimpson_esq

CC, the problem here is that football fans are even less intelligent than footballers.



Maybe, although this football fan still spotted a grammatical error in your Django Unchained review


Upon re-reading (and hey, thanks for reading!) I have found two omissions of the word "a" which can be attributed as typos rather than grammatical errors. What else did I miss?

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RE: Frank Lampard writes about magic footballs (really) - 19/2/2013 11:56:42 AM   
steffols


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From: Jungleland
Its a shame good, creative childrens authors are being looked over daily and because Frank Lampard is a footballer, he just is given this deal because MONEY.

We were told when I was at Uni that most publishing houses don't even look at the books they are sent. They are pushed right in the bin because they are just sent too many to deal with. This is exactly what happened to JK Rowling. If it wasn't for that one employee digging it out of the bin and reading it, we would have no Harry Potter.

There are decent, intelligent childrens authors out there being looked over every day and its the children that are suffering. But Frank Lampard has a high IQ and comes with the fame so its easy. Publishing houses are all as bad as each other these days.

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Post #: 37
RE: Frank Lampard writes about magic footballs (really) - 19/2/2013 12:55:36 PM   
Keyser Sozzled


Posts: 5999
Joined: 1/10/2006
From: Dublin
Surely that argument would hold more weight if it turns out that he's rubbish at it or it doesn't sell many copies? I can see DC's point but he correctly signed off with

quote:

But, ya know, anything that encourages little lads to read, I suppose....



If kids all love the book, regardless of the critical reception, then it's justified in and of itself.

The funny thing is I would take a view that it would be harder for someone like Lampard to be a critical success due to his past. There will be people lining the block to take a dig at him regardless of the merits of the book.



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RE: Frank Lampard writes about magic footballs (really) - 19/2/2013 1:06:12 PM   
Olaf


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It actually holds more weight when we have no idea what Frank Lampard's aptitude for writing children's books is - even if he turns out to be good at it, he wouldn't have got that publishing deal if he wasn't a famous footballer. I also don't think the discussion is about the critical reception specifically, the very fact of getting published in the first place is an even bigger hurdle to get over and Frank's been able to jump the queue (so to speak) due to his success in another field.

(edit - that pun wasn't intended, but I'm going to claim it was)

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RE: Frank Lampard writes about magic footballs (really) - 19/2/2013 1:10:51 PM   
Keyser Sozzled


Posts: 5999
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Meh, maybe you're right. I can see where DC is coming from as I know he has been banging on the door for a few years and it must be galling for this type of thing to go on. But whaddayagunnado?

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RE: Frank Lampard writes about magic footballs (really) - 19/2/2013 1:25:02 PM   
clownfoot


Posts: 7929
Joined: 26/9/2005
From: The ickle town of Fuck, Austria

quote:

ORIGINAL: steffols

Its a shame good, creative childrens authors are being looked over daily and because Frank Lampard is a footballer, he just is given this deal because MONEY.

We were told when I was at Uni that most publishing houses don't even look at the books they are sent. They are pushed right in the bin because they are just sent too many to deal with. This is exactly what happened to JK Rowling. If it wasn't for that one employee digging it out of the bin and reading it, we would have no Harry Potter.

There are decent, intelligent childrens authors out there being looked over every day and its the children that are suffering. But Frank Lampard has a high IQ and comes with the fame so its easy. Publishing houses are all as bad as each other these days.


Hmm, as a parent, can I just say this is a reactionary statement tinged with hyper-bollocks?

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RE: Frank Lampard writes about magic footballs (really) - 19/2/2013 1:33:03 PM   
Keyser Sozzled


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No bollocks quite like Hyper-Bollocks

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RE: Frank Lampard writes about magic footballs (really) - 19/2/2013 2:16:57 PM   
Sinatra


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I should also mention that I love Frank Lampard, he is a legend and I am completely biased in my views.... or am I too late?

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RE: Frank Lampard writes about magic footballs (really) - 19/2/2013 3:40:54 PM   
Hood_Man


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Keyser Sozzled



No bollocks quite like Hyper-Bollocks

Hyper Bollocks sound like an executive desk toy designed by Clive Barker.

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RE: Frank Lampard writes about magic footballs (really) - 19/2/2013 3:47:33 PM   
horribleives

 

Posts: 5098
Joined: 12/6/2009
From: The North
quote:

ORIGINAL: homersimpson_esq


quote:

ORIGINAL: horribleives


quote:

ORIGINAL: homersimpson_esq

CC, the problem here is that football fans are even less intelligent than footballers.



Maybe, although this football fan still spotted a grammatical error in your Django Unchained review


Upon re-reading (and hey, thanks for reading!) I have found two omissions of the word "a" which can be attributed as typos rather than grammatical errors. What else did I miss?


It may just be a difference in personal style/taste rather than an error but 'Django Unchained is a dazzling mix of the mirthfulness and mercilessness' doesn't sound right to me.
I'd have gone for 'Django Unchained is a dazzling mix of the mirthful and the merciless' or simply dropped the 'the' before 'mirthfulness'.
But hey, cool review (and blog) anyway.

< Message edited by horribleives -- 19/2/2013 3:48:35 PM >


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RE: Frank Lampard writes about magic footballs (really) - 19/2/2013 3:50:08 PM   
Professor Moriarty

 

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This thread has now run longer than Frank's current contract

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RE: Frank Lampard writes about magic footballs (really) - 19/2/2013 4:30:41 PM   
superdan


Posts: 8297
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Was Tosscheeks' IQ verified by Mensa using invigilated Cattell tests? Because 150 isn't just high for a footballer, it's genius-level (Einsteins was reported to be only 10 points higher). I suspect there may need to be an asterix next to any mention of Lampards 150* IQ

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RE: Frank Lampard writes about magic footballs (really) - 19/2/2013 6:21:11 PM   
DancingClown


Posts: 4257
Joined: 8/1/2006
From: The Lot
Actually, didn't he himself appear in a sex video with Kieron Dyer? And now he's writing for kids?

Little bit unsavoury.

Although, having said that, Enid Blyton was apparently fairly psychotic who treated her kids like shit and had multiple affairs.

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RE: Frank Lampard writes about magic footballs (really) - 19/2/2013 8:20:47 PM   
Cloud Cuckoo


Posts: 408
Joined: 7/2/2013
From: Mind your own

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sinatra

I should also mention that I love Frank Lampard, he is a legend and I am completely biased in my views....


No shit.


quote:

ORIGINAL: clownfoot

quote:

ORIGINAL: steffols

There are decent, intelligent childrens authors out there being looked over every day and its the children that are suffering.


Hmm, as a parent, can I just say this is a reactionary statement tinged with hyper-bollocks?


That's pretty harsh. She has a point - the more mediocre authors are given publishing deals, the more mediocre the available reading material becomes. It's perhaps not quite as relevant to young children's fiction as to adult fiction, given young children's books are much simpler and concerned with teaching kids to read and learn, to absorb and enjoy fiction, but the logic is there. For all we know, Lampard won that contract over a retired school teacher with a specialism in young children's linguistics. It's an extreme example, I know; but who would be more likely to get the deal on merit?

My dad's favourite book when he was a boy was Ivanhoe by Sir Walter Scott. I wonder how many kids could even make it through that today? Many adults would struggle.


quote:

ORIGINAL: DancingClown

Actually, didn't he himself appear in a sex video with Kieron Dyer? And now he's writing for kids?



Whaaaaaat?? Not the noble stereotype-breaking St Frankie?! Not that unimpeachable role model, that glowing beacon of good behaviour the devil led me to giggle at??

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RE: Frank Lampard writes about magic footballs (really) - 19/2/2013 11:06:31 PM   
Sexual Harassment Panda


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Has anyone actually seen his publishing deal? Are we certain of it being a money making deal? Could it not be charitable or in fact funded by his own bank balance because of his want to promote reading to kids?

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RE: Frank Lampard writes about magic footballs (really) - 19/2/2013 11:13:51 PM   
Hood_Man


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Even if they did give him a publishing deal because of who he was, it was a lifetime of dedication and hard work that got him where he is today. He hasn't lucked out, he's just reaping the benefits of his achievements.

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RE: Frank Lampard writes about magic footballs (really) - 19/2/2013 11:23:24 PM   
Sexual Harassment Panda


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Very true, there's surely also an argument to be had for sure thing deals like Franks giving these publishers more income and therefore allowing them to invest in lesser known riskier projects/authors.

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RE: Frank Lampard writes about magic footballs (really) - 19/2/2013 11:23:31 PM   
Rinc


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From: A park bench, with a newspaper quilt

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hood_Man

Even if they did give him a publishing deal because of who he was, it was a lifetime of dedication and hard work that got him where he is today. He hasn't lucked out, he's just reaping the benefits of his achievements.


If that's the case, would it be ok to make him a teacher, a carpenter, a pilot or the CEO of a multi-national, just because he worked hard at football?

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RE: Frank Lampard writes about magic footballs (really) - 19/2/2013 11:28:07 PM   
Sexual Harassment Panda


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Rinc


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hood_Man

Even if they did give him a publishing deal because of who he was, it was a lifetime of dedication and hard work that got him where he is today. He hasn't lucked out, he's just reaping the benefits of his achievements.


If that's the case, would it be ok to make him a teacher, a carpenter, a pilot or the CEO of a multi-national, just because he worked hard at football?


That's a bit of a tame argument? Listing professions that require qualifications, or a reliable ability to ensure the safety and well being of others isn't really comparable.

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RE: Frank Lampard writes about magic footballs (really) - 19/2/2013 11:35:38 PM   
Rinc


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sexual Harassment Panda


quote:

ORIGINAL: Rinc


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hood_Man

Even if they did give him a publishing deal because of who he was, it was a lifetime of dedication and hard work that got him where he is today. He hasn't lucked out, he's just reaping the benefits of his achievements.


If that's the case, would it be ok to make him a teacher, a carpenter, a pilot or the CEO of a multi-national, just because he worked hard at football?


That's a bit of a tame argument? Listing professions that require qualifications, or a reliable ability to ensure the safety and well being of others isn't really comparable.


No it's not a tame argument. Saying Lampard is reaping the benefits of working hard in one profession to gain employment in another totally different profession that has no links to it is ridiculous. So I'm using equally ridiculous professions as examples. Not just that, those professions all require a certain amount of skill, as does being a children's author. So hard work in another profession is completely irrelevant.

But just for you, I won't use examples that ensure the safety of others or need qualifications (which carpenters and CEOs don't really). Would Lampard deserve a commission for a portrait, a place in a professional orchestra or a five album deal because he worked hard at football?

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Post #: 55
RE: Frank Lampard writes about magic footballs (really) - 19/2/2013 11:44:21 PM   
Sexual Harassment Panda


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Rinc


quote:

ORIGINAL: Sexual Harassment Panda


quote:

ORIGINAL: Rinc


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hood_Man

Even if they did give him a publishing deal because of who he was, it was a lifetime of dedication and hard work that got him where he is today. He hasn't lucked out, he's just reaping the benefits of his achievements.


If that's the case, would it be ok to make him a teacher, a carpenter, a pilot or the CEO of a multi-national, just because he worked hard at football?


That's a bit of a tame argument? Listing professions that require qualifications, or a reliable ability to ensure the safety and well being of others isn't really comparable.


No it's not a tame argument. Saying Lampard is reaping the benefits of working hard in one profession to gain employment in another totally different profession that has no links to it is ridiculous. So I'm using equally ridiculous professions as examples. Not just that, those professions all require a certain amount of skill, as does being a children's author. So hard work in another profession is completely irrelevant.

But just for you, I won't use examples that ensure the safety of others or need qualifications (which carpenters and CEOs don't really). Would Lampard deserve a commission for a portrait, a place in a professional orchestra or a five album deal because he worked hard at football?


Well they weren't comparable, earning your way to the top of a profession and being offered an opportunity in another where the only risk is a lack of sales isn't the same as letting said person fly a plane with no qualifications or training. I'd argue a carpenter with no training could put users or the public in danger if the products are poorly constructed.

I'd be happy for Frank or anyone else to give painting a go, again the only risk is his artwork not selling, he could if he wanted join an orchestra but there's not really a ghost writing equivalent in that situation so he may struggle if he cannot play a relevant instrument, and as for the record deal? The same is done with actors everyday, so why not a footballer?


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RE: Frank Lampard writes about magic footballs (really) - 19/2/2013 11:57:54 PM   
Deviation


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I like that Lampard is writing a book. We might get the literature equivalent of Shaq O' Neal's acting career.

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Post #: 57
RE: Frank Lampard writes about magic footballs (really) - 19/2/2013 11:59:04 PM   
Rinc


Posts: 12838
Joined: 2/10/2005
From: A park bench, with a newspaper quilt
quote:

ORIGINAL: Sexual Harassment Panda

Well they weren't comparable, earning your way to the top of a profession and being offered an opportunity in another where the only risk is a lack of sales isn't the same as letting said person fly a plane with no qualifications or training. I'd argue a carpenter with no training could put users or the public in danger if the products are poorly constructed.


Never said they were comparable, as I inferred in my last post, I was being ridiculous for ridiculousness sake. If you want to be pedantic about it then fine.


quote:

ORIGINAL: Sexual Harassment Panda

I'd be happy for Frank or anyone else to give painting a go, again the only risk is his artwork not selling, he could if he wanted join an orchestra but there's not really a ghost writing equivalent in that situation so he may struggle if he cannot play a relevant instrument, and as for the record deal? The same is done with actors everyday, so why not a footballer?


I'm really just playing devil's advocate here because at no point have I said I've got a real problem with Lampard's deal. He might well have really proved himself to the publishers and might have something quite exciting up his sleeve. Not only that but I like anything that gets kids reading (even Twilight - to a point ). But I do in general have a problem with people suggesting others deserve a job because they worked hard in a totally different and unrelated profession. Otherwise where's my book deal because I've worked bloody hard?

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(in reply to Sexual Harassment Panda)
Post #: 58
RE: Frank Lampard writes about magic footballs (really) - 20/2/2013 12:04:50 AM   
Deviation


Posts: 27284
Joined: 2/6/2006
From: Enemies of Film HQ
I worked bloody hard (at doing nothing special) and I want a book deal. I'll call it "The 10th Circle of Hell: The athletes who attempted to get into the crafts and arts, with the fine exception of Dwayne Johnson because he was already half-an-actor".

< Message edited by Deviation -- 20/2/2013 12:05:17 AM >


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Dpp1978
There are certainly times where calling a person a cunt is not only reasonable, it is a gross understatement.

quote:


ORIGINAL: elab49
I really wish I could go down to see Privates

(in reply to Rinc)
Post #: 59
RE: Frank Lampard writes about magic footballs (really) - 20/2/2013 12:08:17 AM   
Rinc


Posts: 12838
Joined: 2/10/2005
From: A park bench, with a newspaper quilt

quote:

ORIGINAL: Deviation

I worked bloody hard (at doing nothing special)


It's hard work watching lots of films. You should give yourself more credit.

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(in reply to Deviation)
Post #: 60
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