Register  |   Log In  |  
Sign up to our weekly newsletter    
Follow us on   
Search   
Forum Home Register for Free! Log In Moderator Tickets FAQ Users Online

Visiting university lectures without permission

 
Logged in as: Guest
  Printable Version
All Forums >> [On Another Note...] >> Off Topic >> Visiting university lectures without permission Page: [1] 2   next >   >>
Login
Message << Older Topic   Newer Topic >>
Visiting university lectures without permission - 9/12/2012 7:11:39 AM   
Powka


Posts: 132
Joined: 2/12/2008
Hey,

I was wondering if anyone has ever done this - coming into a lecture in the University to listen when one isn't suppose to be there? I know there's a word for it, but I forgot what it is. Oh and especially, if you're not even studying in that University...

Any experiences with this?

_____________________________

Well suck me sideways!
Post #: 1
RE: Visiting university lectures without permission - 9/12/2012 9:03:39 AM   
Powka


Posts: 132
Joined: 2/12/2008
Oh yeah, it's called auditing.

_____________________________

Well suck me sideways!

(in reply to Powka)
Post #: 2
RE: Visiting university lectures without permission - 9/12/2012 9:04:17 AM   
JV


Posts: 3512
Joined: 26/9/2005
From: two counties east of home
I did this when I was a student. I was at a loose end so went with my mate to her geography lecture. The geography department was huge so the lecturer didn't notice but if it's a small department they might!

_____________________________

but love is the sky and i am for you
just so long and long enough


(in reply to Powka)
Post #: 3
RE: Visiting university lectures without permission - 9/12/2012 2:29:25 PM   
Rhubarb


Posts: 24509
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: No Direction Home

quote:

ORIGINAL: Powka
I know there's a word for it, but I forgot what it is.



Stealing?

_____________________________

Team Ginge
WWLD?


quote:

ORIGINAL: FritzlFan

You organisational skills sicken me, Rhubarb.



(in reply to Powka)
Post #: 4
RE: Visiting university lectures without permission - 9/12/2012 3:08:49 PM   
Sumintelligentguy


Posts: 3743
Joined: 31/8/2006
I think JV is right, if you know the lecture will have a lot of students in then you more likely to get away with it.

Though I work in Higher Education and shouldn't really condone it.

_____________________________

"Snake? Snaaaake? SNAAAAAAAAAAAAAKE!?"

R.I.P. Punchy

(in reply to Rhubarb)
Post #: 5
RE: Visiting university lectures without permission - 9/12/2012 4:35:40 PM   
Powka


Posts: 132
Joined: 2/12/2008

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rhubarb


quote:

ORIGINAL: Powka
I know there's a word for it, but I forgot what it is.



Stealing?


Lol, stealing what exactly?


_____________________________

Well suck me sideways!

(in reply to Rhubarb)
Post #: 6
RE: Visiting university lectures without permission - 9/12/2012 4:37:38 PM   
Powka


Posts: 132
Joined: 2/12/2008
I know few lecturers who encourage this kind of behavior. And why wouldn't they? Because a) it's always better to have a bigger audience, b) what so bad about someone so eager to learn? As if Universities aren't making enough money already with their 9000k a year. Greedy bastards...

_____________________________

Well suck me sideways!

(in reply to Powka)
Post #: 7
RE: Visiting university lectures without permission - 9/12/2012 7:22:56 PM   
Rhubarb


Posts: 24509
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: No Direction Home
quote:

ORIGINAL: Powka


quote:

ORIGINAL: Rhubarb


quote:

ORIGINAL: Powka
I know there's a word for it, but I forgot what it is.



Stealing?


Lol, stealing what exactly?



An education that other people are paying for?


I used to do this all the time at uni, attending my flatmates lectures. Mostly they were pretty boring though.

_____________________________

Team Ginge
WWLD?


quote:

ORIGINAL: FritzlFan

You organisational skills sicken me, Rhubarb.



(in reply to Powka)
Post #: 8
RE: Visiting university lectures without permission - 9/12/2012 8:16:19 PM   
Powka


Posts: 132
Joined: 2/12/2008

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rhubarb

An education that other people are paying for?



Okay, wait, I gotta address this: how am I stealing education from other people? Do I take the knowledge from them with my presence?

Nah, I don't really plan on going to boring ones. I'm really interested in attending some Creative Writing, but I hear that their public is usually pretty small so I would stand out as a sore thumb, so really, no dice...

_____________________________

Well suck me sideways!

(in reply to Rhubarb)
Post #: 9
RE: Visiting university lectures without permission - 9/12/2012 8:30:47 PM   
Rhubarb


Posts: 24509
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: No Direction Home
If person A has to pay for university, and person B attends the same lectures as person A, without paying for the lectures that is basically stealing isn't it? Like downloading music that another person is paying for. Or holding a hairdresser at gunpoint and forcing him to cut your hair for free.

_____________________________

Team Ginge
WWLD?


quote:

ORIGINAL: FritzlFan

You organisational skills sicken me, Rhubarb.



(in reply to Powka)
Post #: 10
RE: Visiting university lectures without permission - 9/12/2012 8:39:29 PM   
Powka


Posts: 132
Joined: 2/12/2008

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rhubarb

If person A has to pay for university, and person B attends the same lectures as person A, without paying for the lecturesthat is basically stealing isn't it? Like downloading music that another person is paying for. Or holding a hairdresser at gunpoint and forcing him to cut your hair for free.


Well, if we were to call it "stealing" (which I still disagree with), then I'm not really stealing it from the person A, am I? If anything, I'm stealing it from the University, because they are getting paid. But, are people at the University such greedy bastards that they wouldn't let a poor student attend one single lecture for the purpose of education (not listening music, or watching a film) without paying for it? Yes, they are. Are they being reasonable? I guess it depends.

I personally would never mind someone attending the same lecture that I am when I'm paying for it and they don't. I'm paying for the full package (aka the whole course), and they are just attending one single lecture.

I also talked to a few tutors that encourage this kind of behavior and don't mind having an extra student in their class (I wouldn't too, if I were a lecturer).

Capitalists everywhere, looking for profit in every single opportunity they meet. :) Although, I wouldn't say England is like that, actually on the contrary, my experience suggest that it's not like that at all.

_____________________________

Well suck me sideways!

(in reply to Rhubarb)
Post #: 11
RE: Visiting university lectures without permission - 9/12/2012 8:44:20 PM   
Rhubarb


Posts: 24509
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: No Direction Home
Your stealing from the university, yeah.

It doesn't really matter from a moral point of view if the other people in the room mind you being there or not, it doesn't affect the principle surely?

_____________________________

Team Ginge
WWLD?


quote:

ORIGINAL: FritzlFan

You organisational skills sicken me, Rhubarb.



(in reply to Powka)
Post #: 12
RE: Visiting university lectures without permission - 9/12/2012 8:48:35 PM   
Powka


Posts: 132
Joined: 2/12/2008

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rhubarb

Your stealing from the university, yeah.

It doesn't really matter from a moral point of view if the other people in the room mind you being there or not, it doesn't affect the principle surely?


No, it doesn't, but do you always blindly follow the principles? Are you saying there is absolutely no wrong-doing, big or small, that cannot be justified?

_____________________________

Well suck me sideways!

(in reply to Rhubarb)
Post #: 13
RE: Visiting university lectures without permission - 9/12/2012 8:50:26 PM   
Rhubarb


Posts: 24509
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: No Direction Home
Like I said, I used to do this all the time at uni. I am a kleptomaniac though, so I'm not sure how good I am to ask.

_____________________________

Team Ginge
WWLD?


quote:

ORIGINAL: FritzlFan

You organisational skills sicken me, Rhubarb.



(in reply to Powka)
Post #: 14
RE: Visiting university lectures without permission - 9/12/2012 9:05:15 PM   
Olaf


Posts: 23709
Joined: 26/2/2007
From: 41N 93W
Is it balanced out by all the people who don't attend lectures? Especially since everyone has paid up front for the most part.

_____________________________

I tried to groan, Help! Help! But the tone that came out was that of polite conversation.

Empire Top 100 Albums Poll 2013: CLICK HERE

(in reply to Rhubarb)
Post #: 15
RE: Visiting university lectures without permission - 9/12/2012 9:06:23 PM   
Powka


Posts: 132
Joined: 2/12/2008

quote:

ORIGINAL: Olaf

Is it balanced out by all the people who don't attend lectures? Especially since everyone has paid up front for the most part.


Precisely.

_____________________________

Well suck me sideways!

(in reply to Olaf)
Post #: 16
RE: Visiting university lectures without permission - 10/12/2012 3:56:06 AM   
steflon


Posts: 3317
Joined: 2/9/2008
From: London

quote:

ORIGINAL: Powka


quote:

ORIGINAL: Olaf

Is it balanced out by all the people who don't attend lectures? Especially since everyone has paid up front for the most part.


Precisely.


Surely you can only state 'precisely' if you know the exact number of attendees to a lecture and count them on the way in, otherwise its a very dismissive way to agree with an excuse that agrees with you idea.

Yes this is stealing, its obtaining something that you should have paid for which you didn't, of course you can go into philosophical thought of 'how can you pay for knowledge' but, in all honesty, it'd make you sound like a pretentious arse so I don't recommend it. It also seems that you don't really care about the responses that counter your original question, you can't ask for experiences then immediately shoot down the negatives with a 'Lol' response (although the term lol does kind of suggest you really do need this Creative Writing course).

What happens if there are empty seats in the lecture and you nab the last one only to have someone who paid for the course turned away due to lack of space? Couldn't that be defined as stealing what that person has paid for?

I don't really care if you do or do not attend lectures you have paid for, I myself have stolen many things in my lifetime, my main concern here is that you started a discussion to discuss ideals which you had already made your mind up about.


_____________________________

www.twitter.com/Steflon
http://onedayiwillhavehenchmen.blogspot.com/

quote:

ORIGINAL: steffols
we can roam these vast Empire halls as awesome Stefs.

ORIGINAL: hiptobesquare_x
'and that's why Steflon is all kinds of awesome.'

(in reply to Powka)
Post #: 17
RE: Visiting university lectures without permission - 10/12/2012 8:29:51 AM   
Powka


Posts: 132
Joined: 2/12/2008
quote:

ORIGINAL: steflon

Surely you can only state 'precisely' if you know the exact number of attendees to a lecture and count them on the way in, otherwise its a very dismissive way to agree with an excuse that agrees with you idea.

Yes this is stealing, its obtaining something that you should have paid for which you didn't, of course you can go into philosophical thought of 'how can you pay for knowledge' but, in all honesty, it'd make you sound like a pretentious arse so I don't recommend it. It also seems that you don't really care about the responses that counter your original question, you can't ask for experiences then immediately shoot down the negatives with a 'Lol' response (although the term lol does kind of suggest you really do need this Creative Writing course).

What happens if there are empty seats in the lecture and you nab the last one only to have someone who paid for the course turned away due to lack of space? Couldn't that be defined as stealing what that person has paid for?

I don't really care if you do or do not attend lectures you have paid for, I myself have stolen many things in my lifetime, my main concern here is that you started a discussion to discuss ideals which you had already made your mind up about.



What if I'm the next Einstein or Welles, and you're preventing my genius from developing? Or, or, or!.. What if you're a , but you're not aware of it yet? Calm down man, get over yourself; you're reading into it too much. And FYI, my initial question, if you missed it, was "if anyone else has ever done this", and not whether this is an ethical thing to do or not. I'm not interested in your condescending opinion.

< Message edited by elab49 -- 10/12/2012 9:33:15 AM >


_____________________________

Well suck me sideways!

(in reply to steflon)
Post #: 18
RE: Visiting university lectures without permission - 10/12/2012 9:35:02 AM   
elab49


Posts: 54670
Joined: 1/10/2005
Powka. I've removed a word from your post that is not acceptable to use on this site - rules are in the Empire Online sub-forum.



_____________________________

Lips Together and Blow - blogtasticness and Glasgow Film Festival GFF13!

quote:

ORIGINAL: Deviation] LIKE AMERICA'S SWEETHEARTS TOO. IT MADE ME LAUGH A LOT AND THOUGHT IT WAS WITTY. ALSO I FEEL SLOWLY DYING INSIDE. I KEEP AGREEING WITH ELAB.


Annual Poll 2013 - All Lists Welcome

(in reply to Powka)
Post #: 19
RE: Visiting university lectures without permission - 10/12/2012 11:24:47 AM   
Powka


Posts: 132
Joined: 2/12/2008

quote:

ORIGINAL: elab49

Powka. I've removed a word from your post that is not acceptable to use on this site - rules are in the Empire Online sub-forum.




Seriously? That word is unacceptable, but swearing is okay?

_____________________________

Well suck me sideways!

(in reply to elab49)
Post #: 20
RE: Visiting university lectures without permission - 10/12/2012 11:29:41 AM   
Pigeon Army


Posts: 14612
Joined: 29/1/2006
From: Pixar HQ, George Lucas' Office.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Powka


quote:

ORIGINAL: elab49

Powka. I've removed a word from your post that is not acceptable to use on this site - rules are in the Empire Online sub-forum.




Seriously? That word is unacceptable, but swearing is okay?


Swearing is fine, because swear words generally aren't terms that have only recently fallen out of favour as derogatory slurs against the mentally and physically disabled. Don't bang this drum.

_____________________________

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rinc
She's supposed to be 13! I'd want her to be very attractive though


quote:

ORIGINAL: MonsterCat
quote:

ORIGINAL: Pigeon Army
Stop being mean to Deviation

No.

(in reply to Powka)
Post #: 21
RE: Visiting university lectures without permission - 10/12/2012 12:34:10 PM   
superdan


Posts: 8320
Joined: 31/7/2008
I like to think you pay to attend the university, rather than one specific course. Then again, I'd also be inclined to think that if the lecturer wants to turf you out of a class you haven't registered for he's well within his rights.

(in reply to Pigeon Army)
Post #: 22
RE: Visiting university lectures without permission - 10/12/2012 12:48:23 PM   
elab49


Posts: 54670
Joined: 1/10/2005
The fees are assigned to the course and that college/faculty/ etc though - and they only get cost shares based on matriculated numbers on the course. I like your idea better though.



_____________________________

Lips Together and Blow - blogtasticness and Glasgow Film Festival GFF13!

quote:

ORIGINAL: Deviation] LIKE AMERICA'S SWEETHEARTS TOO. IT MADE ME LAUGH A LOT AND THOUGHT IT WAS WITTY. ALSO I FEEL SLOWLY DYING INSIDE. I KEEP AGREEING WITH ELAB.


Annual Poll 2013 - All Lists Welcome

(in reply to superdan)
Post #: 23
RE: Visiting university lectures without permission - 10/12/2012 5:38:21 PM   
Sumintelligentguy


Posts: 3743
Joined: 31/8/2006

quote:

ORIGINAL: elab49

The fees are assigned to the course and that college/faculty/ etc though - and they only get cost shares based on matriculated numbers on the course. I like your idea better though.




In a lot of cases, fees are distributed among courses because some cost more to run than others.

I think lectures are becoming more and more obsolete nowadays in favour of tutorials and seminars where classes are smaller and you get to express your ideas.

_____________________________

"Snake? Snaaaake? SNAAAAAAAAAAAAAKE!?"

R.I.P. Punchy

(in reply to elab49)
Post #: 24
RE: Visiting university lectures without permission - 10/12/2012 5:45:58 PM   
elab49


Posts: 54670
Joined: 1/10/2005
Courses run at a loss are getting rarer. Although there is always excess cash but that's because most of the fee doesn't cover teaching - it's siphoned off to fund unfunded research often carried out by people that the students won't see hide nor hair of in 3-5 years of teaching

_____________________________

Lips Together and Blow - blogtasticness and Glasgow Film Festival GFF13!

quote:

ORIGINAL: Deviation] LIKE AMERICA'S SWEETHEARTS TOO. IT MADE ME LAUGH A LOT AND THOUGHT IT WAS WITTY. ALSO I FEEL SLOWLY DYING INSIDE. I KEEP AGREEING WITH ELAB.


Annual Poll 2013 - All Lists Welcome

(in reply to Sumintelligentguy)
Post #: 25
RE: Visiting university lectures without permission - 10/12/2012 5:57:45 PM   
Sumintelligentguy


Posts: 3743
Joined: 31/8/2006

quote:

ORIGINAL: elab49

Courses run at a loss are getting rarer. Although there is always excess cash but that's because most of the fee doesn't cover teaching - it's siphoned off to fund unfunded research often carried out by people that the students won't see hide nor hair of in 3-5 years of teaching


Unless they have purpose on a wider scale - eg maintaining the reputation of a University

Some academics just aren't natural teachers though, so they are there to place their institution on the world stage in terms of research.

But back on topic - I wouldn't really object to someone attending a lecture. However, a creative writing workshop, or any type of teaching that has a practical element is stealing imo.

_____________________________

"Snake? Snaaaake? SNAAAAAAAAAAAAAKE!?"

R.I.P. Punchy

(in reply to elab49)
Post #: 26
RE: Visiting university lectures without permission - 10/12/2012 6:03:56 PM   
elab49


Posts: 54670
Joined: 1/10/2005
Whether auditing was theft was kind of the topic - so defining whether it's theft kind of is as well. Kind of. Maybe

While research, some of it, can be more widely beneficial the problem remains that it isn't properly funded so it gets kicked back into increasing student fees which, ultimately, aren't entirely for teaching. Current climate even reputation courses are up for grabs - it's not just ancient history and latin anymore.

Glasgow eg suffered some very negative press when it was in the process of ditching it's highly regarded School of Nursing. The resulting publicity finally gave it a form of reprieve.

< Message edited by elab49 -- 10/12/2012 6:05:36 PM >


_____________________________

Lips Together and Blow - blogtasticness and Glasgow Film Festival GFF13!

quote:

ORIGINAL: Deviation] LIKE AMERICA'S SWEETHEARTS TOO. IT MADE ME LAUGH A LOT AND THOUGHT IT WAS WITTY. ALSO I FEEL SLOWLY DYING INSIDE. I KEEP AGREEING WITH ELAB.


Annual Poll 2013 - All Lists Welcome

(in reply to Sumintelligentguy)
Post #: 27
RE: Visiting university lectures without permission - 10/12/2012 6:10:20 PM   
Olaf


Posts: 23709
Joined: 26/2/2007
From: 41N 93W
Lectures are rubbish compared to seminars/small group learning. Even if you're got the most insightful and charismatic lecturer in the world, they'll still more useful in an environment where you can ask questions and properly discuss the material. (It's also impossible for interlopers to sit in on them, so there's that if you're so inclined.)

_____________________________

I tried to groan, Help! Help! But the tone that came out was that of polite conversation.

Empire Top 100 Albums Poll 2013: CLICK HERE

(in reply to elab49)
Post #: 28
RE: Visiting university lectures without permission - 10/12/2012 6:17:31 PM   
Sumintelligentguy


Posts: 3743
Joined: 31/8/2006
quote:

ORIGINAL: elab49

Whether auditing was theft was kind of the topic - so defining whether it's theft kind of is as well. Kind of. Maybe

While research, some of it, can be more widely beneficial the problem remains that it isn't properly funded so it gets kicked back into increasing student fees which, ultimately, aren't entirely for teaching. Current climate even reputation courses are up for grabs - it's not just ancient history and latin anymore.

Glasgow eg suffered some very negative press when it was in the process of ditching it's highly regarded School of Nursing. The resulting publicity finally gave it a form of reprieve.


I'm going to have to disagree with you there. Indeed, student fees aren't used entirely for teaching but that's because student's are paying for an experience and not just a degree. I think this has always been the case but has become more prominent (with more funds invested into things other than research) over the last five years due to a number of factors including:

1) The economic downturn has changed the perception of a degree in that it has to lead to something ie a job. A degree has market value, and has been on top of the agenda in recent years. Universities have had to cater to this new need by investing more in links to employers. It's such a shame though because now students aren't doing a degree to broaden their intellectual capacity, but as a means to get a job.

2) The National Student Survey was introduced about 6 years ago and universities have realised that they have to do well on this to secure higher student recruitment. As a result, more resources have been put in to enhance the student experience and make them feel they are at home at their university.

Edit



to counter the formality there

< Message edited by Sumintelligentguy -- 10/12/2012 6:18:33 PM >


_____________________________

"Snake? Snaaaake? SNAAAAAAAAAAAAAKE!?"

R.I.P. Punchy

(in reply to elab49)
Post #: 29
RE: Visiting university lectures without permission - 10/12/2012 6:25:03 PM   
elab49


Posts: 54670
Joined: 1/10/2005
I'm on the side that questions the value of the NSS tbh - did you read Mary Beard's recent piece on it?

I'm not sure many Russell Group universities structure the teaching fee/grant allocation in quite that way. And in many of them funding for teaching has the perception of being quite tight which, frankly, it shouldn't be. Years ago I took oversight on the first couple of years of the Transparency Review and I wasn't overly impressed with the figures I saw or the use of funding.

_____________________________

Lips Together and Blow - blogtasticness and Glasgow Film Festival GFF13!

quote:

ORIGINAL: Deviation] LIKE AMERICA'S SWEETHEARTS TOO. IT MADE ME LAUGH A LOT AND THOUGHT IT WAS WITTY. ALSO I FEEL SLOWLY DYING INSIDE. I KEEP AGREEING WITH ELAB.


Annual Poll 2013 - All Lists Welcome

(in reply to Sumintelligentguy)
Post #: 30
Page:   [1] 2   next >   >>
All Forums >> [On Another Note...] >> Off Topic >> Visiting university lectures without permission Page: [1] 2   next >   >>
Jump to:





New Messages No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages Locked w/o New Messages
 Post New Thread
 Reply to Message
 Post New Poll
 Submit Vote
 Delete My Own Post
 Delete My Own Thread
 Rate Posts


Movie News|Empire Blog|Movie Reviews|Future Films|Features|Video Interviews|Image Gallery|Competitions|Forum|Magazine|Resources
Forum Software © ASPPlayground.NET Advanced Edition 2.4.5 ANSI

0.734