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RE: Star Wars: Episode 7 - 21/11/2012 10:20:18 AM   
spark1

 

Posts: 6989
Joined: 18/11/2006

quote:

ORIGINAL: MonsterCat


quote:

ORIGINAL: Private Hudson

Oh come on, American Graffiti is a good movie. I don't see why Lucas gets all this negative criticism with people saying he can't direct or write.

Excuse me, but he made Star Wars. Possibly the most influential movie ever and one of the all time greats. That proves to me that he can write and he can direct.



It's because film is a subjective medium. Not that hard to figure out, really. Or maybe you're right and everyone else doesn't know a damn thing about Star Wars.

OK, yeah, New Hope is a high end 3/5 film and American Grafitti is cute. But for me, Empire and Jedi are good films because back then Lucas had the good idea of letting other people write and direct them.

The prequels are horrible because Lucas somehow forgot what made the other films work, and delivered an overabundance of obvious CG imagery, poor dialogue and bad acting from otherwise good actors.


but the prequels still have virtues that the haters refuse to recognise.

(in reply to MonsterCat)
Post #: 1381
RE: Star Wars: Episode 7 - 21/11/2012 10:31:01 AM   
darthbane


Posts: 5750
Joined: 27/10/2005
From: Twelve parsecs outside the Rishi maze

quote:

ORIGINAL: DancingClown


quote:

ORIGINAL: vad3r

So now that J.J. Abrams and Brad Bird have ruled themselves out, who's going to step up and resurrect the dark lord?

The correct answer is Matt Reeves. You can bet your children on it.


Fuck off.




_____________________________

"You're not safe here. No one is" Batman - Arkham City

http://www.invelos.com/dvdcollection.aspx/darthbane

(in reply to DancingClown)
Post #: 1382
RE: Star Wars: Episode 7 - 21/11/2012 10:31:04 AM   
Harry Tuttle


Posts: 7993
Joined: 12/11/2005
From: Sometime in the future.
quote:

ORIGINAL: spark1


quote:

ORIGINAL: MonsterCat


quote:

ORIGINAL: Private Hudson

Oh come on, American Graffiti is a good movie. I don't see why Lucas gets all this negative criticism with people saying he can't direct or write.

Excuse me, but he made Star Wars. Possibly the most influential movie ever and one of the all time greats. That proves to me that he can write and he can direct.



It's because film is a subjective medium. Not that hard to figure out, really. Or maybe you're right and everyone else doesn't know a damn thing about Star Wars.

OK, yeah, New Hope is a high end 3/5 film and American Grafitti is cute. But for me, Empire and Jedi are good films because back then Lucas had the good idea of letting other people write and direct them.

The prequels are horrible because Lucas somehow forgot what made the other films work, and delivered an overabundance of obvious CG imagery, poor dialogue and bad acting from otherwise good actors.


but the prequels still have virtues that the haters refuse to recognise.


True. There's Duel of the Fates, Darth Maul v Obi Wan and Qui Gonn and err..., ..., ..., ..., ..., ..., ..., ..., ..., ...

Nope, that's me spent.

_____________________________

Acting...Naturaaal

Your knowledge of scientific biological transmogrification is only outmatched by your zest for kung-fu treachery!

Blood Island. So called because it's the exact shape of some blood

(in reply to spark1)
Post #: 1383
RE: Star Wars: Episode 7 - 21/11/2012 10:43:40 AM   
darthbane


Posts: 5750
Joined: 27/10/2005
From: Twelve parsecs outside the Rishi maze

quote:

ORIGINAL: Harry Tuttle

quote:

ORIGINAL: spark1


quote:

ORIGINAL: MonsterCat


quote:

ORIGINAL: Private Hudson

Oh come on, American Graffiti is a good movie. I don't see why Lucas gets all this negative criticism with people saying he can't direct or write.

Excuse me, but he made Star Wars. Possibly the most influential movie ever and one of the all time greats. That proves to me that he can write and he can direct.



It's because film is a subjective medium. Not that hard to figure out, really. Or maybe you're right and everyone else doesn't know a damn thing about Star Wars.

OK, yeah, New Hope is a high end 3/5 film and American Grafitti is cute. But for me, Empire and Jedi are good films because back then Lucas had the good idea of letting other people write and direct them.

The prequels are horrible because Lucas somehow forgot what made the other films work, and delivered an overabundance of obvious CG imagery, poor dialogue and bad acting from otherwise good actors.


but the prequels still have virtues that the haters refuse to recognise.


True. There's Duel of the Fates, Darth Maul v Obi Wan and Qui Gonn and err..., ..., ..., ..., ..., ..., ..., ..., ..., ...

Nope, that's me spent.


Yoda drawing his lightsaber.
Order 66.
Jango Fett.
Mace Windu.
Count Dooku.
Anakin Vs Obi Wan.
Obi Wan Vs Jango in the Asteroids.

The prequels aren't as good as the originals, but they do have lots of things going for them. I don't think that they're bad mo IRS by any means


_____________________________

"You're not safe here. No one is" Batman - Arkham City

http://www.invelos.com/dvdcollection.aspx/darthbane

(in reply to Harry Tuttle)
Post #: 1384
RE: Star Wars: Episode 7 - 21/11/2012 11:00:21 AM   
Harry Tuttle


Posts: 7993
Joined: 12/11/2005
From: Sometime in the future.
quote:

ORIGINAL: darthbane


quote:

ORIGINAL: Harry Tuttle


True. There's Duel of the Fates, Darth Maul v Obi Wan and Qui Gonn and err..., ..., ..., ..., ..., ..., ..., ..., ..., ...

Nope, that's me spent.


Yoda drawing his lightsaber.


That was badass right until he started using it.

quote:

Order 66.


That was pretty cool actually

quote:

Jango Fett.


Only served to demystify Boba Fett IMO, a poor decision.

quote:

Mace Windu.


A good character in theory, died like a punk in practise.

quote:

Count Dooku.


Totally disagree, I think Dooku is an awful character

quote:

Anakin Vs Obi Wan.


A good visual spectacle but only works with the sound off otherwise the dialogue cracks me up.

quote:

Obi Wan Vs Jango in the Asteroids.


Nice effects but again this hurts the character of Boba Fett IMO.

At one point I may not have been so harsh on them but the prequels get worse the more I watch them. I found the first 2 almost unwatchable last time around whilst the third fared little better.

Anyway coming back to the sequels and away from this prequel talk Disney have reportedly approached Lawrence Kasdan (Empire Strikes Back, Return of the Jedi and Temple of Doom) and Simon Kinberg (X-Men: First Class, Sherlock Holmes) to write episodes VIII and IX.

CLICK

Disney aren't fucking about it seems.

< Message edited by Harry Tuttle -- 21/11/2012 11:09:24 AM >


_____________________________

Acting...Naturaaal

Your knowledge of scientific biological transmogrification is only outmatched by your zest for kung-fu treachery!

Blood Island. So called because it's the exact shape of some blood

(in reply to darthbane)
Post #: 1385
RE: Star Wars: Episode 7 - 21/11/2012 12:44:55 PM   
Drew_231

 

Posts: 882
Joined: 7/5/2008

quote:

ORIGINAL: Harry Tuttle

True. There's Duel of the Fates, Darth Maul v Obi Wan and Qui Gonn and err..., ..., ..., ..., ..., ..., ..., ..., ..., ...

Nope, that's me spent.



Wow, you must have really enjoyed that scene then

(in reply to Harry Tuttle)
Post #: 1386
RE: Star Wars: Episode 7 - 21/11/2012 1:41:05 PM   
Sotto Voce

 

Posts: 803
Joined: 5/9/2009

quote:

ORIGINAL: Harry Tuttle



Anyway coming back to the sequels and away from this prequel talk Disney have reportedly approached Lawrence Kasdan (Empire Strikes Back, Return of the Jedi and Temple of Doom) and Simon Kinberg (X-Men: First Class, Sherlock Holmes) to write episodes VIII and IX.

CLICK

Disney aren't fucking about it seems.



Brilliant. Maybe my wish of the new films skewing more towards the originals is coming true. Could this be the Disney effect? Although I didn't wish it upon a star. Should have wished upon a Death Star. Is it too late to make Disney/Star Wars crossover puns?

_____________________________

All things digested have a similar hue.

(in reply to Harry Tuttle)
Post #: 1387
RE: Star Wars: Episode 7 - 21/11/2012 2:04:10 PM   
MonsterCat


Posts: 7934
Joined: 24/3/2011
From: St. Albans, Hertfordshire

quote:

ORIGINAL: spark1

but the prequels still have virtues that the haters refuse to recognise.


IMHO the virtues of the Star Wars prequels amount to a handful of admittedly cool moments, but that's not enough for me to give them a pass. All three of them are pretty fucking dreadful.

_____________________________

"I am a writer, a doctor, a nuclear physicist and a theoretical philosopher. But above all, I am a man, a hopelessly inquisitive man, just like you."

Films watched in 2013

(in reply to spark1)
Post #: 1388
RE: Star Wars: Episode 7 - 21/11/2012 2:33:52 PM   
OPEN YOUR EYES

 

Posts: 4384
Joined: 5/2/2012
quote:

ORIGINAL: MonsterCat


quote:

ORIGINAL: spark1

but the prequels still have virtues that the haters refuse to recognise.


IMHO the virtues of the Star Wars prequels amount to a handful of admittedly cool moments, but that's not enough for me to give them a pass. All three of them are pretty fucking dreadful.


Even that is over praising them
I have no-time for the prequels because they were just rubbish,boring films.

One thing I do hope for the next batch of the Star Wars merchandising-Film franchise is more realistic visualizations than that of total CGI created sets.
Watching the 'making of..' these three prequels I was staggered to find very,very little in the form of real environments.Everything,bar the actors,was blue/green screen.Obviously George was comfy sat on his fat ass looking happy as larry.

< Message edited by OPEN YOUR EYES -- 21/11/2012 2:34:00 PM >

(in reply to MonsterCat)
Post #: 1389
RE: Star Wars: Episode 7 - 21/11/2012 2:58:53 PM   
Cool Breeze


Posts: 2351
Joined: 9/11/2011
From: The Internet

quote:

ORIGINAL: OPEN YOUR EYES

quote:

ORIGINAL: MonsterCat


quote:

ORIGINAL: spark1

but the prequels still have virtues that the haters refuse to recognise.


IMHO the virtues of the Star Wars prequels amount to a handful of admittedly cool moments, but that's not enough for me to give them a pass. All three of them are pretty fucking dreadful.


Even that is over praising them
I have no-time for the prequels because they were just rubbish,boring films.

One thing I do hope for the next batch of the Star Wars merchandising-Film franchise is more realistic visualizations than that of total CGI created sets.
Watching the 'making of..' these three prequels I was staggered to find very,very little in the form of real environments.Everything,bar the actors,was blue/green screen.Obviously George was comfy sat on his fat ass looking happy as larry.


Yet another hater who refuses to accept that filmaking techniques have changed ( and will continue to ) since the original trilogy.Care to tell me how else Lucas is supposed to film enviroments such as Mustafar,Utpau,and Kamino? These enviroments are only possible through cgi.And its not like Lucas is the only filmaker who uses this technique.Its used in many shows and films to depict enviroments that are not possible in real life.

I loved the prequels.They were great action/fantasy films and i watch them all the time.


_____________________________

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(in reply to OPEN YOUR EYES)
Post #: 1390
RE: Star Wars: Episode 7 - 21/11/2012 3:01:56 PM   
MonsterCat


Posts: 7934
Joined: 24/3/2011
From: St. Albans, Hertfordshire

quote:

ORIGINAL: OPEN YOUR EYES

One thing I do hope for the next batch of the Star Wars merchandising-Film franchise is more realistic visualizations than that of total CGI created sets.
Watching the 'making of..' these three prequels I was staggered to find very,very little in the form of real environments.Everything,bar the actors,was blue/green screen.Obviously George was comfy sat on his fat ass looking happy as larry.



Yep. Total CGI overload.

_____________________________

"I am a writer, a doctor, a nuclear physicist and a theoretical philosopher. But above all, I am a man, a hopelessly inquisitive man, just like you."

Films watched in 2013

(in reply to OPEN YOUR EYES)
Post #: 1391
RE: Star Wars: Episode 7 - 21/11/2012 3:02:37 PM   
Harry Tuttle


Posts: 7993
Joined: 12/11/2005
From: Sometime in the future.
quote:

ORIGINAL: Cool Breeze


quote:

ORIGINAL: OPEN YOUR EYES

quote:

ORIGINAL: MonsterCat


quote:

ORIGINAL: spark1

but the prequels still have virtues that the haters refuse to recognise.


IMHO the virtues of the Star Wars prequels amount to a handful of admittedly cool moments, but that's not enough for me to give them a pass. All three of them are pretty fucking dreadful.


Even that is over praising them
I have no-time for the prequels because they were just rubbish,boring films.

One thing I do hope for the next batch of the Star Wars merchandising-Film franchise is more realistic visualizations than that of total CGI created sets.
Watching the 'making of..' these three prequels I was staggered to find very,very little in the form of real environments.Everything,bar the actors,was blue/green screen.Obviously George was comfy sat on his fat ass looking happy as larry.


Yet another hater who refuses to accept that filmaking techniques have changed ( and will continue to ) since the original trilogy.Care to tell me how else Lucas is supposed to film enviroments such as Mustafar,Utpau,and Kamino? These enviroments are only possible through cgi.And its not like Lucas is the only filmaker who uses this technique.Its used in many shows and films to depict enviroments that are not possible in real life.

I loved the prequels.They were great action/fantasy films and i watch them all the time.



I bet you anything that the next 3 films will use far less CGI than the last 3 films.

There's nowt wrong with CGI, there's nothing really wrong with using a lot of CGI either. It's criminal to use it as poorly and excessively as it was used in the prequels though and I guarantee it's usage will be pared down in the next film.

< Message edited by Harry Tuttle -- 21/11/2012 3:06:27 PM >


_____________________________

Acting...Naturaaal

Your knowledge of scientific biological transmogrification is only outmatched by your zest for kung-fu treachery!

Blood Island. So called because it's the exact shape of some blood

(in reply to Cool Breeze)
Post #: 1392
RE: Star Wars: Episode 7 - 21/11/2012 3:12:22 PM   
Cool Breeze


Posts: 2351
Joined: 9/11/2011
From: The Internet
quote:

ORIGINAL: MonsterCat


quote:

ORIGINAL: OPEN YOUR EYES

One thing I do hope for the next batch of the Star Wars merchandising-Film franchise is more realistic visualizations than that of total CGI created sets.
Watching the 'making of..' these three prequels I was staggered to find very,very little in the form of real environments.Everything,bar the actors,was blue/green screen.Obviously George was comfy sat on his fat ass looking happy as larry.



Yep. Total CGI overload.


Yes of course George should have done the sensible thing and constructed a REAL cloning facility in the middle of the ocean and filmed there.He should also have filmed the final ROTS lightsaber duel inside a REAL active volcano and cast REAL alien monsters for the arena battle in AOTC.

Oh wait, these things dont actually exist in real life do they?

< Message edited by Cool Breeze -- 21/11/2012 3:13:51 PM >


_____________________________

'' Iv played Oskar Schindler, Michael Collins, Rob Roy Mcgregor, even ZEUS for gods sake! No one is going to believe me to be a green grocer! ''

(in reply to MonsterCat)
Post #: 1393
RE: Star Wars: Episode 7 - 21/11/2012 3:18:09 PM   
OPEN YOUR EYES

 

Posts: 4384
Joined: 5/2/2012
To get the best out of CGI and practical effects/make-up is to use it wisely and at times sparingly.The more you use it in a film the more,I feel,the faults surface surrounding the plot and story.

You can easily combine real environments and CGI and there is no excuse whats so ever for lucas not to do that.
Star Trek09 did it expertly,Pans Labyrinth,Prometheus to.And for a supposed visionary director you'd have thought he'd combine both elements perfectly,yet he didn't,mainly down to laziness imo.

< Message edited by OPEN YOUR EYES -- 21/11/2012 3:19:12 PM >

(in reply to Harry Tuttle)
Post #: 1394
RE: Star Wars: Episode 7 - 21/11/2012 3:38:44 PM   
Cool Breeze


Posts: 2351
Joined: 9/11/2011
From: The Internet

quote:

ORIGINAL: OPEN YOUR EYES

To get the best out of CGI and practical effects/make-up is to use it wisely and at times sparingly.The more you use it in a film the more,I feel,the faults surface surrounding the plot and story.

You can easily combine real environments and CGI and there is no excuse whats so ever for lucas not to do that.
Star Trek09 did it expertly,Pans Labyrinth,Prometheus to.And for a supposed visionary director you'd have thought he'd combine both elements perfectly,yet he didn't,mainly down to laziness imo.


Star Trek 09 and Prometheus didnt have any scenes on Kamino,Mustafar,Utapau, or Coruscant.Planetary enviroments that can only be acheived using cgi.

ROTS in particular is one of the most stunning visual fx films iv ever seen.The opening shot of that film is just AMAZING and will be very hard to top.

_____________________________

'' Iv played Oskar Schindler, Michael Collins, Rob Roy Mcgregor, even ZEUS for gods sake! No one is going to believe me to be a green grocer! ''

(in reply to OPEN YOUR EYES)
Post #: 1395
RE: Star Wars: Episode 7 - 21/11/2012 3:52:16 PM   
MonsterCat


Posts: 7934
Joined: 24/3/2011
From: St. Albans, Hertfordshire

quote:

ORIGINAL: Cool Breeze

Yes of course George should have done the sensible thing and constructed a REAL cloning facility in the middle of the ocean and filmed there.He should also have filmed the final ROTS lightsaber duel inside a REAL active volcano and cast REAL alien monsters for the arena battle in AOTC.

Oh wait, these things dont actually exist in real life do they?


Facetiousness and hysterical fan boy hand flapping aside, one of problems with the films is that there's very little in the prequels that isn't artificial. Yeah of course there's things that can only be achieved by implementing CGI, but the prequels are overstuffed with the shit.

I believe even Ewan McGregor bemoaned the excess of CGI and the very few actual sets he was able to work with.


_____________________________

"I am a writer, a doctor, a nuclear physicist and a theoretical philosopher. But above all, I am a man, a hopelessly inquisitive man, just like you."

Films watched in 2013

(in reply to Cool Breeze)
Post #: 1396
RE: Star Wars: Episode 7 - 21/11/2012 3:52:39 PM   
Drew_231

 

Posts: 882
Joined: 7/5/2008

quote:

ORIGINAL: Cool Breeze

The opening shot of that film is just AMAZING and will be very hard to top.


The space battle at the climax of Mass Effect 3 topped it, I was more emotionally involved with that than with any of the prequels

Technically anything can top it. If the entire scene revolves around the effects, then there's really no substance to it at all.

(in reply to Cool Breeze)
Post #: 1397
RE: Star Wars: Episode 7 - 21/11/2012 4:20:26 PM   
darthbane


Posts: 5750
Joined: 27/10/2005
From: Twelve parsecs outside the Rishi maze

quote:

ORIGINAL: OPEN YOUR EYES

To get the best out of CGI and practical effects/make-up is to use it wisely and at times sparingly.The more you use it in a film the more,I feel,the faults surface surrounding the plot and story.

You can easily combine real environments and CGI and there is no excuse whats so ever for lucas not to do that.
Star Trek09 did it expertly,Pans Labyrinth,Prometheus to.And for a supposed visionary director you'd have thought he'd combine both elements perfectly,yet he didn't,mainly down to laziness imo.


I'm not sure I agree with this part. Surely laziness would be just to rely on older tried and tested methods rather than trying to push the boundaries of moviemaking techniques and technology.
However I do agree than there is to much CGI in the prequels, there are certainly areas where practical effects and sets would have been nicer. Exterior sets on all the world's most definitely needed to be computer generated, but watching the making of docs, it seemed odd not to construct real interiors.
I think that EPS VII would benefit from a director with a talent and vision to make the best movie with all available methods. But having said that, we haven't seen a script yet, and if it paints on a huge scale, Disney may force CGI as a way of watching the costs

_____________________________

"You're not safe here. No one is" Batman - Arkham City

http://www.invelos.com/dvdcollection.aspx/darthbane

(in reply to OPEN YOUR EYES)
Post #: 1398
RE: Star Wars: Episode 7 - 21/11/2012 4:31:10 PM   
OPEN YOUR EYES

 

Posts: 4384
Joined: 5/2/2012
quote:

ORIGINAL: darthbane


quote:

ORIGINAL: OPEN YOUR EYES

To get the best out of CGI and practical effects/make-up is to use it wisely and at times sparingly.The more you use it in a film the more,I feel,the faults surface surrounding the plot and story.

You can easily combine real environments and CGI and there is no excuse whats so ever for lucas not to do that.
Star Trek09 did it expertly,Pans Labyrinth,Prometheus to.And for a supposed visionary director you'd have thought he'd combine both elements perfectly,yet he didn't,mainly down to laziness imo.


I'm not sure I agree with this part. Surely laziness would be just to rely on older tried and tested methods rather than trying to push the boundaries of moviemaking techniques and technology.
However I do agree than there is to much CGI in the prequels, there are certainly areas where practical effects and sets would have been nicer. Exterior sets on all the world's most definitely needed to be computer generated, but watching the making of docs, it seemed odd not to construct real interiors.
I think that EPS VII would benefit from a director with a talent and vision to make the best movie with all available methods. But having said that, we haven't seen a script yet, and if it paints on a huge scale, Disney may force CGI as a way of watching the costs


Laziness was probably a tad harsh,but I did get a sense of Lucas feeling happy in a somewhat relaxed comfort zone.Plus he did moan about his travels in doing the first Star Wars film set in Tunisia.You can bet your bottom dollar had Lucas had the CGI on offer today all of those 'classic' environment would not have been used,instead we'll have something as overly convoluted and shallow like we witnessed in the prequels.

And the bold part of your post is more precisely what I was on about.
Why CGI a whole customary environment when you can ,easily,find realistic sights around the world.
The work on his previous Film was well worked,why differ so far away from it when you can beautifully combine them both.



< Message edited by OPEN YOUR EYES -- 21/11/2012 4:35:36 PM >

(in reply to darthbane)
Post #: 1399
RE: Star Wars: Episode 7 - 21/11/2012 4:56:49 PM   
Sotto Voce

 

Posts: 803
Joined: 5/9/2009
I think it was not just the CG that was a problem in the prequels, but the fact that they seemed to throw in every visual idea they could think of if it looked cool. It was all a bit much, and became a distraction from the story. I think when you shove so many amazing things down the viewer's retina, it reinforces the fact that its not real and hurts the beleivability- no matter how visually real it all looks.

_____________________________

All things digested have a similar hue.

(in reply to OPEN YOUR EYES)
Post #: 1400
RE: Star Wars: Episode 7 - 21/11/2012 6:55:46 PM   
rich


Posts: 5045
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Neo Kobe

quote:

ORIGINAL: Harry Tuttle


Excuse me, but he made Star Wars. Possibly the most influential movie ever and one of the all time greats. That proves to me that he can write and he can direct.


quote:


Fluke. All the overwhelming evidence since confirms it.



The more control and ease he got = the worse the film that was released as a result became. Not that difficult to see this effect in motion over the years. Film is a collaborative effort. George didn't create it alone, otherwise he'd know how to replicate it without so many birth defects.

_____________________________

Meanwhile...

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Post #: 1401
RE: Star Wars: Episode 7 - 21/11/2012 8:14:53 PM   
Private Hudson


Posts: 1839
Joined: 30/9/2005

quote:

ORIGINAL: spark1


quote:

ORIGINAL: MonsterCat


quote:

ORIGINAL: Private Hudson

Oh come on, American Graffiti is a good movie. I don't see why Lucas gets all this negative criticism with people saying he can't direct or write.

Excuse me, but he made Star Wars. Possibly the most influential movie ever and one of the all time greats. That proves to me that he can write and he can direct.



It's because film is a subjective medium. Not that hard to figure out, really. Or maybe you're right and everyone else doesn't know a damn thing about Star Wars.

OK, yeah, New Hope is a high end 3/5 film and American Grafitti is cute. But for me, Empire and Jedi are good films because back then Lucas had the good idea of letting other people write and direct them.

The prequels are horrible because Lucas somehow forgot what made the other films work, and delivered an overabundance of obvious CG imagery, poor dialogue and bad acting from otherwise good actors.


but the prequels still have virtues that the haters refuse to recognise.


Sorry, two things.

Star Wars (1977) is Star Wars for me. Not Episode IV or A New Hope. It is the one where Greedo shoots first. And to give it 3 out of 5, well I think even the most ardent critic of Star Wars has to agree that it was and still is 'unmissable' if we use Empire's terminology, which by very definition would qualify it as 5 stars.

Of course film is subjective, but many things in life is subjective. However, if we have 1 million people and 999,999 agree that a film, book or piece of music is good and 1 person doesn't, then it means your taste is questionable according to the norm.

Your opinion may be that Lucas cannot write or direct. I cite evidence American Graffiti and Star Wars. Two accepted classic films. Two 5 star movies by quite a few critics. And they were box office hits also. To have one hit as a director is pretty good, to have two, well that means you are pretty good.

Is Tarantino a better director than Lucas? Who knows. Tarantino is loved by critics who write for movie magazines, yet when it comes to the public, who makes the most money? Lucas obviously.

And to be honest, if people slate Lucas for the prequels, which is another common criticism, then Tarantino should hold his head in shame for the dreadful Death Proof. One of the worst movies I have ever seen in the pictures. Up there with The Blair Witch Project... which caused a mini riot in Glasgow... objects were thrown at the screen in disgust! (Not by me, I hasten to add!).

BTW I do not know everything about Star Wars, but when people come on and just be contrary for the sake of it without an argument, it just looks childish.

For example, if Lucas wasn't such a great director, then why do we remember the opening scene of Star Wars? The ships flying over our heads is pretty iconic. Good direction, surely? Classic even?

And we have the Binary Sunset as it is called. Someone once called it the best moment of teenage yearning in the history of cinema. And no, it wasn't Corporal Hicks or even Ripley!

As for dialogue, well what makes good dialogue?

I can still remember classic lines from Star Wars:

"Once I was but the learner; now I am the Master!"

"Help me Obi-Wan Kenobi, you're my only hope!"

"The Force will be with you... always".

But a brilliant script is not just about dialogue. What about the iconic characters Lucas created?

Darth Vader is perhaps the most iconic and memorable movie villain of all time. Surely that alone would seal Lucas's greatness?

I could go on, but the footy is on! Seriously, as others have said, Lucas is an easy target. But cast your minds back to when Star Wars changed the world... Lucas was the darling of the media and the public. But things and times change I suppose.

However, I believe that in 100 years George Lucas will be remembered as an all time great scriptwriter and director.


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(in reply to spark1)
Post #: 1402
RE: Star Wars: Episode 7 - 21/11/2012 8:17:52 PM   
Private Hudson


Posts: 1839
Joined: 30/9/2005

quote:

ORIGINAL: MonsterCat


quote:

ORIGINAL: Cool Breeze

Yes of course George should have done the sensible thing and constructed a REAL cloning facility in the middle of the ocean and filmed there.He should also have filmed the final ROTS lightsaber duel inside a REAL active volcano and cast REAL alien monsters for the arena battle in AOTC.

Oh wait, these things dont actually exist in real life do they?


Facetiousness and hysterical fan boy hand flapping aside, one of problems with the films is that there's very little in the prequels that isn't artificial. Yeah of course there's things that can only be achieved by implementing CGI, but the prequels are overstuffed with the shit.

I believe even Ewan McGregor bemoaned the excess of CGI and the very few actual sets he was able to work with.



Oh yeah, that;s from Ewan McGregor who has appeared in some of the worst movies ever and likes to get his knob out.

How many blockbusters has he directed? Or written? Or how many Oscars has he won?

Ewan is quite well known back home here in Scotland for opening his mouth and letting his belly rumble... usually followed by the classic "I was misquoted" apology.


_____________________________

Watch my spoof movie of FULL METAL JACKET here:

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(in reply to MonsterCat)
Post #: 1403
RE: Star Wars: Episode 7 - 21/11/2012 8:20:00 PM   
Private Hudson


Posts: 1839
Joined: 30/9/2005

quote:

ORIGINAL: Cool Breeze


quote:

ORIGINAL: OPEN YOUR EYES

quote:

ORIGINAL: MonsterCat


quote:

ORIGINAL: spark1

but the prequels still have virtues that the haters refuse to recognise.


IMHO the virtues of the Star Wars prequels amount to a handful of admittedly cool moments, but that's not enough for me to give them a pass. All three of them are pretty fucking dreadful.


Even that is over praising them
I have no-time for the prequels because they were just rubbish,boring films.

One thing I do hope for the next batch of the Star Wars merchandising-Film franchise is more realistic visualizations than that of total CGI created sets.
Watching the 'making of..' these three prequels I was staggered to find very,very little in the form of real environments.Everything,bar the actors,was blue/green screen.Obviously George was comfy sat on his fat ass looking happy as larry.


Yet another hater who refuses to accept that filmaking techniques have changed ( and will continue to ) since the original trilogy.Care to tell me how else Lucas is supposed to film enviroments such as Mustafar,Utpau,and Kamino? These enviroments are only possible through cgi.And its not like Lucas is the only filmaker who uses this technique.Its used in many shows and films to depict enviroments that are not possible in real life.

I loved the prequels.They were great action/fantasy films and i watch them all the time.



Excellent point. If Lucas had used 'old' technology and FX from the era of Star Wars or Empire or Jedi, then he would have been laughed at and slagged off as being out of touch.

The man can't win.

Mind you does he care?


_____________________________

Watch my spoof movie of FULL METAL JACKET here:

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(in reply to Cool Breeze)
Post #: 1404
RE: Star Wars: Episode 7 - 21/11/2012 8:31:06 PM   
DancingClown


Posts: 4236
Joined: 8/1/2006
From: The Lot
quote:

ORIGINAL: Private Hudson

Oh yeah, that;s from Ewan McGregor who has appeared in some of the worst movies ever and likes to get his knob out.


What are these "worst films ever"? That sounds a bit childish. And he's done some nudity, so what? How does that relate to the validity of his opinion?

quote:

How many blockbusters has he directed? Or written? Or how many Oscars has he won?


Having actually appeared in the films he is certainly in a better position than yourself to talk about the practical and artistic experiences of working with green scene. And Oscars? What the fuck has that got to do with anything? Lucas hasn't won any either. Ridiculous point.

Even the great Ian Mckellen apparently got frustrated with the green-screen filming The Hobbit.

And I'm not a prequel hater by the way. They're flawed but fun. But you're starting to sound very shrill, aggressive, and trollish.

Then again you probably fit right in in this thread.


< Message edited by DancingClown -- 21/11/2012 8:37:04 PM >


_____________________________

Astronomic Tune Boy

'The town knew darkness, and darkness was enough.'

"Storm just bleeewwww me away..."

(in reply to Private Hudson)
Post #: 1405
RE: Star Wars: Episode 7 - 21/11/2012 8:38:43 PM   
Deviation


Posts: 27284
Joined: 2/6/2006
From: Enemies of Film HQ
Also, making a great film some 30 years ago does not make you an overall great director, especially when you directed absolutely nothing in between, your last three have had a lukewarm reception, and have only another that is considered an American classic. Star Wars ANH was very well directed, the prequels made Sommers dignified.



_____________________________

quote:

ORIGINAL: Dpp1978
There are certainly times where calling a person a cunt is not only reasonable, it is a gross understatement.

quote:


ORIGINAL: elab49
I really wish I could go down to see Privates

(in reply to DancingClown)
Post #: 1406
RE: Star Wars: Episode 7 - 21/11/2012 8:43:46 PM   
Scott_

 

Posts: 4184
Joined: 26/6/2008
From: Leeds

quote:

ORIGINAL: DancingClown

quote:

ORIGINAL: Private Hudson

Oh yeah, that;s from Ewan McGregor who has appeared in some of the worst movies ever and likes to get his knob out.


What are these "worst films ever"? That sounds a bit childish. And he's done some nudity, so what? How does that relate to the validity of his opinion?


I can think of 3...

_____________________________

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Check out my top 21 films - http://www.empireonline.com/forum/tm.asp?m=3188740

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(in reply to DancingClown)
Post #: 1407
RE: Star Wars: Episode 7 - 21/11/2012 8:48:49 PM   
DancingClown


Posts: 4236
Joined: 8/1/2006
From: The Lot

quote:

ORIGINAL: Scott_


quote:

ORIGINAL: DancingClown

quote:

ORIGINAL: Private Hudson

Oh yeah, that;s from Ewan McGregor who has appeared in some of the worst movies ever and likes to get his knob out.


What are these "worst films ever"? That sounds a bit childish. And he's done some nudity, so what? How does that relate to the validity of his opinion?


I can think of 3...




_____________________________

Astronomic Tune Boy

'The town knew darkness, and darkness was enough.'

"Storm just bleeewwww me away..."

(in reply to Scott_)
Post #: 1408
RE: Star Wars: Episode 7 - 21/11/2012 9:00:19 PM   
homersimpson_esq


Posts: 20118
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Springfield

quote:

ORIGINAL: Cool Breeze

Star Trek 09 and Prometheus didnt have any scenes on Kamino,Mustafar,Utapau, or Coruscant.Planetary enviroments that can only be acheived using cgi.


Because Vulcan and LV 223 are actual real planets that Star Trek 2009 and Prometheus actually visited for location shooting.

Fucking weak argument, and you know it.

_____________________________

That deep-browed Homer ruled as his demesne.


Bristol Bad Film Club
A place where movie fans can come and behold some of the most awful films ever put to celluloid.

(in reply to Cool Breeze)
Post #: 1409
RE: Star Wars: Episode 7 - 21/11/2012 9:34:29 PM   
Keyser Sozzled


Posts: 5999
Joined: 1/10/2006
From: Dublin

quote:

ORIGINAL: Cool Breeze

quote:

ORIGINAL: MonsterCat


quote:

ORIGINAL: OPEN YOUR EYES

One thing I do hope for the next batch of the Star Wars merchandising-Film franchise is more realistic visualizations than that of total CGI created sets.
Watching the 'making of..' these three prequels I was staggered to find very,very little in the form of real environments.Everything,bar the actors,was blue/green screen.Obviously George was comfy sat on his fat ass looking happy as larry.



Yep. Total CGI overload.


Yes of course George should have done the sensible thing and constructed a REAL cloning facility in the middle of the ocean and filmed there.He should also have filmed the final ROTS lightsaber duel inside a REAL active volcano and cast REAL alien monsters for the arena battle in AOTC.

Oh wait, these things dont actually exist in real life do they?


Hahahahaha, that genuinely made me laugh. Oh wait, you were being serious? Jesus...

What a weird little argument. The attack on the Death Star is exactly the same, as is the attack on said Death Star. Also pretty sure Jabba's Palace isn't in Norwich (although...) He has done miniature work on "exotic" locations in the original trilogy. He simply went balls deep with CGI in the preqs and some of it (a lot of it actually) looks terrible.

And whats worse is I'm pretty sure you know it.


_____________________________

I have no idea who any of them are, apart from Terry Pratchett who I know has got a beard and keeps going on about killing himself but never does.

(in reply to Cool Breeze)
Post #: 1410
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