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RE: Star Wars Episode VII For 2015?

 
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RE: Star Wars Episode VII For 2015? - 31/10/2012 12:36:47 PM   
manwihtheplan

 

Posts: 99
Joined: 11/9/2012
I think one of the great challenges for the new trilogy is to come up with a strong villain. Darth Vader was one of the greatest film villains of all time. It's going to be very hard to come up with a new character that can rival Lord Vader!


(in reply to Empire Admin)
Post #: 91
RE: Bin ep1 - 31/10/2012 12:56:44 PM   
Dannybohy


Posts: 1374
Joined: 7/1/2009

quote:

ORIGINAL: cerebusboy


quote:

ORIGINAL: fancysmith

"you've got yourself a new apprentice, now lets go kill some Jedi kids!"



Anakin has already committed infanticide long before he becomes a Sith ( the Tusken slaughter). It's established throughout the movies that Sith (e.g. the Darth Tyranous stuff) that Anakin knows full well that the Sith do evil things. Committing evil is the price he has to pay for saving Padme, which is all he cares about. People who sell their soul to the devil don't tend to pay in installments


That may be so, however in movie /timeline terms Fancysmith hit it right, he flipped quicker than a labour MPs Property portfolio!.



_____________________________

'Man of Steel!,Man of Shit!' -fairyprincess

(in reply to cerebusboy)
Post #: 92
RE: Star Wars Episode VII For 2015? - 31/10/2012 12:59:01 PM   
Dannybohy


Posts: 1374
Joined: 7/1/2009

quote:

ORIGINAL: manwihtheplan

I think one of the great challenges for the new trilogy is to come up with a strong villain. Darth Vader was one of the greatest film villains of all time. It's going to be very hard to come up with a new character that can rival Lord Vader!





Do you think so! Iconic, yes, wouldnt put him in the top ten greatest villians personally. I think its The Emperor that will be hard to rival.

_____________________________

'Man of Steel!,Man of Shit!' -fairyprincess

(in reply to manwihtheplan)
Post #: 93
Film stars opinions - 31/10/2012 12:59:54 PM   
brokenking

 

Posts: 50
Joined: 8/8/2007
I think Empire should open up its email address book and ask as many film stars what they think. First and foremost for me would be Simon Pegg / Edgar Wright / Nick Frost and Kevin Smith.


(in reply to Empire Admin)
Post #: 94
RE: Bin ep1 - 31/10/2012 1:05:54 PM   
cerebusboy


Posts: 1552
Joined: 1/5/2006

quote:

ORIGINAL: Dannybohy


quote:

ORIGINAL: cerebusboy


quote:

ORIGINAL: fancysmith

"you've got yourself a new apprentice, now lets go kill some Jedi kids!"



Anakin has already committed infanticide long before he becomes a Sith ( the Tusken slaughter). It's established throughout the movies that Sith (e.g. the Darth Tyranous stuff) that Anakin knows full well that the Sith do evil things. Committing evil is the price he has to pay for saving Padme, which is all he cares about. People who sell their soul to the devil don't tend to pay in installments


That may be so, however in movie /timeline terms Fancysmith hit it right, he flipped quicker than a labour MPs Property portfolio!.




Disagree. Isn't it ultimately an either/or decision? There's emotions etc that lead to the dark side, but deciding to be a Sith is a conscious decision. All of Episode 2 establishes that Anakin isn't able to let go/avoid attraction and affective bonds in a way that Jedi must. If the Emperor was trying to get Anakin to start off with some minor evil (like an intern starting with the photocopying and making teas ) then there wouldn't be much conflict. Anakin knows that, in order to save Padme, he has to embrace evil. And, given how powerful the Emperor knows Anakin can be, he does require the whole declaration of obedience Master/Apprentice Sith relationship to control him. There's no room really for conscious escalating of incremental evils - although, by the point that Anakin becomes a Sith, we have seen him loose the rag a lot, decapitate unarmed prisoners, slaughter tuskens etc.

It just always bugs me when people say Anakin went from being a good guy to killing kiddies in one scene. Tusken raider kids are still kids! And, given that it wasn't Tusken raider kids who kidnapped Anakin's mum (you can't help what your parents do!) they were as ''innocent'' as the Jedi ones. It doesn't make much moral sense to make overmuch of a distinction between the Jedi kids and the also-innocent Tusken ones. Infanticide's still infanticide.



(in reply to Dannybohy)
Post #: 95
RE: Film stars opinions - 31/10/2012 1:07:01 PM   
cerebusboy


Posts: 1552
Joined: 1/5/2006

quote:

ORIGINAL: brokenking

I think Empire should open up its email address book and ask as many film stars what they think. First and foremost for me would be Simon Pegg / Edgar Wright / Nick Frost and Kevin Smith.




Kevin Smith's hilarious (although he did write one of the worst Batman stories ever) , but I'm not sure I want to see a new Star Wars trilogy that's mostly dick jokes

(in reply to brokenking)
Post #: 96
RE: Star Wars Episode VII For 2015? - 31/10/2012 1:07:53 PM   
cerebusboy


Posts: 1552
Joined: 1/5/2006

quote:

ORIGINAL: Dannybohy


quote:

ORIGINAL: manwihtheplan

I think one of the great challenges for the new trilogy is to come up with a strong villain. Darth Vader was one of the greatest film villains of all time. It's going to be very hard to come up with a new character that can rival Lord Vader!





Do you think so! Iconic, yes, wouldnt put him in the top ten greatest villians personally. I think its The Emperor that will be hard to rival.


Top 3 surely! I agree it's a challenge, I don't think any of the Expanded Universe Sith lords are that impressive.

(in reply to Dannybohy)
Post #: 97
RE: Star Wars Episode VII For 2015? - 31/10/2012 1:14:05 PM   
Wild about Wilder


Posts: 1655
Joined: 9/4/2010
From: Hertfordshire
Really doing it without George directing or writing is really the best news i've heard in a long while.
Don't get me wrong i've nothing against him personally it's just you felt with the latter 3 just like the South Park kids did with Indiana Jones, speaking of which could you do us a favor & leave that alone now George please.

(in reply to cerebusboy)
Post #: 98
- 31/10/2012 1:20:31 PM   
MJV90

 

Posts: 1
Joined: 31/10/2012
Hahaha! Episode VII will have no vision behind it, all it will be is a terrible, large budgeted, CGI heavy, 'child friendly' film which will be based on how much cash can be raked in from tie-in consumer products.

(in reply to Empire Admin)
Post #: 99
RE: Bin ep1 - 31/10/2012 1:24:44 PM   
fancysmith

 

Posts: 2
Joined: 25/9/2006
My point is more about the clunky, almost forced way his fall is handled in Ep3, it should have been a bigger, longer scene, it's the crux of the whole story, this point when he made the decision to become a Sith and it's handled like he's deciding between a fry up or pancakes for breakfast.

(in reply to cerebusboy)
Post #: 100
- 31/10/2012 1:25:32 PM   
Seth_Gecko

 

Posts: 521
Joined: 8/5/2006
Iam ahuge fan of Star Wars and i would love to see another film but I do think they should leave it alone.

(in reply to Empire Admin)
Post #: 101
One reason to live in hope. - 31/10/2012 1:27:54 PM   
ericcoyle

 

Posts: 79
Joined: 9/10/2009
Well, at least they couldn't possibly be as bad as those last three, could they?

Or could they?

(in reply to Empire Admin)
Post #: 102
RE: One reason to live in hope. - 31/10/2012 1:41:57 PM   
Qwerty Norris


Posts: 3971
Joined: 26/10/2005
From: Edinburgh
Playing devils advocate here, but this might not actually be a bad thing.

Even if he devised the original concept, Lucas has single-handedly been the most detrimental thing to the evolution of the star wars universe - both through his obsession of devising characters in order to sell plastic lunch boxes & toys which far too often compromise his already shit story-telling & even worse direction. It was inevitable that one of the biggest entertainment franchises of all time was not going to be allowed to stagnate & taking it out of his hands is quite frankly, a relief. Obviously a lot depends on the intentions of those at disney & who they bring in to develop future films, but being free from the shackles of its creator is a positive in this regard.

_____________________________

Qwerty's Top 10 of 2013 (so far)

1. Zero Dark Thirty
2. No
3. A Hijacking
4. Behind the Candelabra
5. In The Fog
6. Good Vibrations
7. McCullin
8. Beyond the Hills
9. The Place Beyond the Pines
10. Wreck-it Ralph

(in reply to ericcoyle)
Post #: 103
Ok Disney... - 31/10/2012 1:42:53 PM   
logan 5

 

Posts: 43
Joined: 8/2/2010
This is a great opportunity to address some of the imperfections of the last trilogy namely the overuse of CGI (see various Jedi temple backgrounds ) and where possible try to go back to a more set orientated feel like in the original trilogy focusing more on the human aspect rather than the CGI created ones... yes yes i know this is not going to happen primarily due to cost and time but ( and at my age it is through rose tinted glasses somewhat that i make this plea) Star Wars is primarily a story about the right of human passage so lets try and keep it there and create a fresh new (old) look to the inevitable trilogy trilogy..trilogy...

(in reply to Empire Admin)
Post #: 104
RE: Bin ep1 - 31/10/2012 2:03:35 PM   
Dannybohy


Posts: 1374
Joined: 7/1/2009
quote:

ORIGINAL: cerebusboy


quote:

ORIGINAL: Dannybohy


quote:

ORIGINAL: cerebusboy


quote:

ORIGINAL: fancysmith

"you've got yourself a new apprentice, now lets go kill some Jedi kids!"



Anakin has already committed infanticide long before he becomes a Sith ( the Tusken slaughter). It's established throughout the movies that Sith (e.g. the Darth Tyranous stuff) that Anakin knows full well that the Sith do evil things. Committing evil is the price he has to pay for saving Padme, which is all he cares about. People who sell their soul to the devil don't tend to pay in installments


That may be so, however in movie /timeline terms Fancysmith hit it right, he flipped quicker than a labour MPs Property portfolio!.




Disagree. Isn't it ultimately an either/or decision? There's emotions etc that lead to the dark side, but deciding to be a Sith is a conscious decision. All of Episode 2 establishes that Anakin isn't able to let go/avoid attraction and affective bonds in a way that Jedi must. If the Emperor was trying to get Anakin to start off with some minor evil (like an intern starting with the photocopying and making teas ) then there wouldn't be much conflict. Anakin knows that, in order to save Padme, he has to embrace evil. And, given how powerful the Emperor knows Anakin can be, he does require the whole declaration of obedience Master/Apprentice Sith relationship to control him. There's no room really for conscious escalating of incremental evils - although, by the point that Anakin becomes a Sith, we have seen him loose the rag a lot, decapitate unarmed prisoners, slaughter tuskens etc.

It just always bugs me when people say Anakin went from being a good guy to killing kiddies in one scene. Tusken raider kids are still kids! And, given that it wasn't Tusken raider kids who kidnapped Anakin's mum (you can't help what your parents do!) they were as ''innocent'' as the Jedi ones. It doesn't make much moral sense to make overmuch of a distinction between the Jedi kids and the also-innocent Tusken ones. Infanticide's still infanticide.





No, not in one scene, but if we forget the Tusken scene, as they are all scavenging scum anyway and Killing Dooku , which any sane Jedi would of done. The most potential shocking part is the slaughter of a bunch of jedi (good) children at the temple. And in movie terms, the build up to this still a few years in starwars time and mere hours in viewer time. So you have to admit the change on screen is very rushed. If you look at Breaking Bad , which ive mentioned in another thread in regards to new writers for Starwars, Vince Gilligans main character is fantastically crafted over 4 seasons and many hours of viewing time from a good guy to pretty evil badass! and those moments are priceless, thats what we should of seen happen and handled with more skill in the prequels. Anyone who has seen Breaking bad will know more clearly what im getting at, the evolution, the moment Walter guns the drug dealer hes just mowed over and then final episode/ end scene when he takes out the top bad guy!. you dont get that in the SW prequels, that HOLY SHIT..!! moment, I felt cheated personally. It was all topped off with the awful (just fucking awful) scene when the spanky new Vader does his Planet of the Apes scene!! on being told Padame is dead.


< Message edited by Dannybohy -- 31/10/2012 2:07:39 PM >


_____________________________

'Man of Steel!,Man of Shit!' -fairyprincess

(in reply to cerebusboy)
Post #: 105
RE: Film stars opinions - 31/10/2012 2:08:46 PM   
adambatman82

 

Posts: 11156
Joined: 15/12/2005

quote:

ORIGINAL: brokenking

I think Empire should open up its email address book and ask as many film stars what they think. First and foremost for me would be Simon Pegg / Edgar Wright / Nick Frost and Kevin Smith.



Pegg and Smith have both commented on twitter. Pegg is moaning, Smith is excited about the idea.

(in reply to brokenking)
Post #: 106
Great news but......... - 31/10/2012 2:09:53 PM   
Jamie_M

 

Posts: 53
Joined: 27/6/2011
Now that Disney have the rights I'm worred,, I mean what if they make a kid friendly Star Wars movie, based around an annoying child and goofy idiotic characters and,,,, oh no, wait!

(in reply to Empire Admin)
Post #: 107
RE: Ok Disney... - 31/10/2012 2:10:41 PM   
Dannybohy


Posts: 1374
Joined: 7/1/2009

quote:

ORIGINAL: logan 5

This is a great opportunity to address some of the imperfections of the last trilogy namely the overuse of CGI (see various Jedi temple backgrounds ) and where possible try to go back to a more set orientated feel like in the original trilogy focusing more on the human aspect rather than the CGI created ones... yes yes i know this is not going to happen primarily due to cost and time but ( and at my age it is through rose tinted glasses somewhat that i make this plea) Star Wars is primarily a story about the right of human passage so lets try and keep it there and create a fresh new (old) look to the inevitable trilogy trilogy..trilogy...


Agreed. I've seen plays of human passage, good v`s evil etc done on 5x5ft stages that have left me gobsmacked and entertained. its not much to ask that a 100million dollar movie should manage this without CGI.

makes me think of all the non-CGi scenes which still look great to this day

_____________________________

'Man of Steel!,Man of Shit!' -fairyprincess

(in reply to logan 5)
Post #: 108
RE: One reason to live in hope. - 31/10/2012 2:26:26 PM   
cerebusboy


Posts: 1552
Joined: 1/5/2006

quote:

ORIGINAL: Qwerty Norris

Playing devils advocate here, but this might not actually be a bad thing.

Even if he devised the original concept, Lucas has single-handedly been the most detrimental thing to the evolution of the star wars universe - both through his obsession of devising characters in order to sell plastic lunch boxes & toys


Dude, the first Star Wars toy deal was over thirty years ago. And if Lucas wanted to make a film just to sell toys, would he really choose tax routes and intergalactic diplomacy? You might think he's a shite storyteller, but episodes I to III are telling what it's obvious the creator regards as an important story (democracies becoming dictatorships etc). There's a lot more obvious ways to make money from Star Wars (e.g.: three movies of Darth Vader killing people) than pegwarming action figures of intergalactic diplomats.

(in reply to Qwerty Norris)
Post #: 109
RE: One reason to live in hope. - 31/10/2012 2:29:32 PM   
Dannybohy


Posts: 1374
Joined: 7/1/2009

quote:

ORIGINAL: cerebusboy


quote:

ORIGINAL: Qwerty Norris

Playing devils advocate here, but this might not actually be a bad thing.

Even if he devised the original concept, Lucas has single-handedly been the most detrimental thing to the evolution of the star wars universe - both through his obsession of devising characters in order to sell plastic lunch boxes & toys


Dude, the first Star Wars toy deal was over thirty years ago. And if Lucas wanted to make a film just to sell toys, would he really choose tax routes and intergalactic diplomacy? You might think he's a shite storyteller, but episodes I to III are telling what it's obvious the creator regards as an important story (democracies becoming dictatorships etc). There's a lot more obvious ways to make money from Star Wars (e.g.: three movies of Darth Vader killing people) than pegwarming action figures of intergalactic diplomats.


yeh, they never did release that Darth Vader neck choker! so wanted one of those to take out my older sister!.


_____________________________

'Man of Steel!,Man of Shit!' -fairyprincess

(in reply to cerebusboy)
Post #: 110
Somewhere, Mark Hammill is doing push-ups for the first... - 31/10/2012 2:37:44 PM   
Jamie_M

 

Posts: 53
Joined: 27/6/2011
Someone from Disney better be on the phone to Harrison Ford right now,, with a big fat massive cheque in their hand

(in reply to Empire Admin)
Post #: 111
RE: Bin ep1 - 31/10/2012 2:38:54 PM   
cerebusboy


Posts: 1552
Joined: 1/5/2006

quote:

ORIGINAL: Dannybohy

quote:

ORIGINAL: cerebusboy


quote:

ORIGINAL: Dannybohy


quote:

ORIGINAL: cerebusboy


quote:

ORIGINAL: fancysmith

"you've got yourself a new apprentice, now lets go kill some Jedi kids!"



Anakin has already committed infanticide long before he becomes a Sith ( the Tusken slaughter). It's established throughout the movies that Sith (e.g. the Darth Tyranous stuff) that Anakin knows full well that the Sith do evil things. Committing evil is the price he has to pay for saving Padme, which is all he cares about. People who sell their soul to the devil don't tend to pay in installments


That may be so, however in movie /timeline terms Fancysmith hit it right, he flipped quicker than a labour MPs Property portfolio!.




Disagree. Isn't it ultimately an either/or decision? There's emotions etc that lead to the dark side, but deciding to be a Sith is a conscious decision. All of Episode 2 establishes that Anakin isn't able to let go/avoid attraction and affective bonds in a way that Jedi must. If the Emperor was trying to get Anakin to start off with some minor evil (like an intern starting with the photocopying and making teas ) then there wouldn't be much conflict. Anakin knows that, in order to save Padme, he has to embrace evil. And, given how powerful the Emperor knows Anakin can be, he does require the whole declaration of obedience Master/Apprentice Sith relationship to control him. There's no room really for conscious escalating of incremental evils - although, by the point that Anakin becomes a Sith, we have seen him loose the rag a lot, decapitate unarmed prisoners, slaughter tuskens etc.

It just always bugs me when people say Anakin went from being a good guy to killing kiddies in one scene. Tusken raider kids are still kids! And, given that it wasn't Tusken raider kids who kidnapped Anakin's mum (you can't help what your parents do!) they were as ''innocent'' as the Jedi ones. It doesn't make much moral sense to make overmuch of a distinction between the Jedi kids and the also-innocent Tusken ones. Infanticide's still infanticide.





No, not in one scene, but if we forget the Tusken scene, as they are all scavenging scum anyway and Killing Dooku , which any sane Jedi would of done. The most potential shocking part is the slaughter of a bunch of jedi (good) children at the temple. And in movie terms, the build up to this still a few years in starwars time and mere hours in viewer time. So you have to admit the change on screen is very rushed. If you look at Breaking Bad , which ive mentioned in another thread in regards to new writers for Starwars, Vince Gilligans main character is fantastically crafted over 4 seasons and many hours of viewing time from a good guy to pretty evil badass! and those moments are priceless, thats what we should of seen happen and handled with more skill in the prequels. Anyone who has seen Breaking bad will know more clearly what im getting at, the evolution, the moment Walter guns the drug dealer hes just mowed over and then final episode/ end scene when he takes out the top bad guy!. you dont get that in the SW prequels, that HOLY SHIT..!! moment, I felt cheated personally. It was all topped off with the awful (just fucking awful) scene when the spanky new Vader does his Planet of the Apes scene!! on being told Padame is dead.




The tuskens are still sentient creatures. You (or I!) might just regard them as scavenging scum, but it's obvious that the Jedi wouldn't exactly be down with slaughtering them, so Anakin *has* already morally transgressed way before the time period of Revenge of the Sith. And people go on about how it's understandable, not that bad etc because the Tuskens killed Anakin's mum - but Anakin still having attachments to his Mum (and his secret relationship with Padme) is in itself indicative of how screwed up a Jedi he is!

The Emperor had to goad Anakin into killing Dooku, who is a fallen Jedi. I don't think most Jedi would have killed him in the circumstances.

Never seen Breaking Bad, but I love some Wire-style realism. But Star Wars - even the supposedly Perfect Original Trilogy - is another kind of storytelling; mainly visual, perfunctory dialogue etc. I think the fall isn't rushed in 'Star Wars time'. It's established in Clones that Anakin wants the power to save the ones he love. And we get all of the 'seduction' scenes in Sith (like the great opera one) before Anakin falls. I think that's a more compelling story than Anakin just getting gradually evil until he ends up a Sith. Surely when Mace dies Anakin is out of choices? Anakin sells his soul to the devil to save Padme. The 'devil' knows this. I don't see why it would be more 'realistic' at that point for Anakin to do some lesser-grade evil - he's the Emperor's bitch, and they both know it.

Tangent, but: that Natalie Portman Miss Dior perfume ad came on when I was typing this....who wouldn't go to the Dark Side for her ?!


(in reply to Dannybohy)
Post #: 112
RE: One reason to live in hope. - 31/10/2012 2:42:22 PM   
cerebusboy


Posts: 1552
Joined: 1/5/2006

quote:

ORIGINAL: Dannybohy


quote:

ORIGINAL: cerebusboy


quote:

ORIGINAL: Qwerty Norris

Playing devils advocate here, but this might not actually be a bad thing.

Even if he devised the original concept, Lucas has single-handedly been the most detrimental thing to the evolution of the star wars universe - both through his obsession of devising characters in order to sell plastic lunch boxes & toys


Dude, the first Star Wars toy deal was over thirty years ago. And if Lucas wanted to make a film just to sell toys, would he really choose tax routes and intergalactic diplomacy? You might think he's a shite storyteller, but episodes I to III are telling what it's obvious the creator regards as an important story (democracies becoming dictatorships etc). There's a lot more obvious ways to make money from Star Wars (e.g.: three movies of Darth Vader killing people) than pegwarming action figures of intergalactic diplomats.


yeh, they never did release that Darth Vader neck choker! so wanted one of those to take out my older sister!.



lol. They did do that force trainer where, using biowave feedback, you use your mind to move a ball up a tube. A Dark Side telekinesis toy would be cool

(in reply to Dannybohy)
Post #: 113
RE: One reason to live in hope. - 31/10/2012 2:46:32 PM   
Sotto Voce

 

Posts: 796
Joined: 5/9/2009

quote:

ORIGINAL: Qwerty Norris

Playing devils advocate here, but this might not actually be a bad thing.

Even if he devised the original concept, Lucas has single-handedly been the most detrimental thing to the evolution of the star wars universe - both through his obsession of devising characters in order to sell plastic lunch boxes & toys which far too often compromise his already shit story-telling & even worse direction. It was inevitable that one of the biggest entertainment franchises of all time was not going to be allowed to stagnate & taking it out of his hands is quite frankly, a relief. Obviously a lot depends on the intentions of those at disney & who they bring in to develop future films, but being free from the shackles of its creator is a positive in this regard.


Exactly. The prequels could have been good if he'd got other people to write and direct. The overall story is fine, its the nuts and bolts that were wrong.

_____________________________

All things digested have a similar hue.

(in reply to Qwerty Norris)
Post #: 114
RE: Bin ep1 - 31/10/2012 2:56:02 PM   
Dannybohy


Posts: 1374
Joined: 7/1/2009

quote:

ORIGINAL: cerebusboy


quote:

ORIGINAL: Dannybohy

quote:

ORIGINAL: cerebusboy


quote:

ORIGINAL: Dannybohy


quote:

ORIGINAL: cerebusboy


quote:

ORIGINAL: fancysmith

"you've got yourself a new apprentice, now lets go kill some Jedi kids!"



Anakin has already committed infanticide long before he becomes a Sith ( the Tusken slaughter). It's established throughout the movies that Sith (e.g. the Darth Tyranous stuff) that Anakin knows full well that the Sith do evil things. Committing evil is the price he has to pay for saving Padme, which is all he cares about. People who sell their soul to the devil don't tend to pay in installments


That may be so, however in movie /timeline terms Fancysmith hit it right, he flipped quicker than a labour MPs Property portfolio!.




Disagree. Isn't it ultimately an either/or decision? There's emotions etc that lead to the dark side, but deciding to be a Sith is a conscious decision. All of Episode 2 establishes that Anakin isn't able to let go/avoid attraction and affective bonds in a way that Jedi must. If the Emperor was trying to get Anakin to start off with some minor evil (like an intern starting with the photocopying and making teas ) then there wouldn't be much conflict. Anakin knows that, in order to save Padme, he has to embrace evil. And, given how powerful the Emperor knows Anakin can be, he does require the whole declaration of obedience Master/Apprentice Sith relationship to control him. There's no room really for conscious escalating of incremental evils - although, by the point that Anakin becomes a Sith, we have seen him loose the rag a lot, decapitate unarmed prisoners, slaughter tuskens etc.

It just always bugs me when people say Anakin went from being a good guy to killing kiddies in one scene. Tusken raider kids are still kids! And, given that it wasn't Tusken raider kids who kidnapped Anakin's mum (you can't help what your parents do!) they were as ''innocent'' as the Jedi ones. It doesn't make much moral sense to make overmuch of a distinction between the Jedi kids and the also-innocent Tusken ones. Infanticide's still infanticide.





No, not in one scene, but if we forget the Tusken scene, as they are all scavenging scum anyway and Killing Dooku , which any sane Jedi would of done. The most potential shocking part is the slaughter of a bunch of jedi (good) children at the temple. And in movie terms, the build up to this still a few years in starwars time and mere hours in viewer time. So you have to admit the change on screen is very rushed. If you look at Breaking Bad , which ive mentioned in another thread in regards to new writers for Starwars, Vince Gilligans main character is fantastically crafted over 4 seasons and many hours of viewing time from a good guy to pretty evil badass! and those moments are priceless, thats what we should of seen happen and handled with more skill in the prequels. Anyone who has seen Breaking bad will know more clearly what im getting at, the evolution, the moment Walter guns the drug dealer hes just mowed over and then final episode/ end scene when he takes out the top bad guy!. you dont get that in the SW prequels, that HOLY SHIT..!! moment, I felt cheated personally. It was all topped off with the awful (just fucking awful) scene when the spanky new Vader does his Planet of the Apes scene!! on being told Padame is dead.




The tuskens are still sentient creatures. You (or I!) might just regard them as scavenging scum, but it's obvious that the Jedi wouldn't exactly be down with slaughtering them, so Anakin *has* already morally transgressed way before the time period of Revenge of the Sith. And people go on about how it's understandable, not that bad etc because the Tuskens killed Anakin's mum - but Anakin still having attachments to his Mum (and his secret relationship with Padme) is in itself indicative of how screwed up a Jedi he is!

The Emperor had to goad Anakin into killing Dooku, who is a fallen Jedi. I don't think most Jedi would have killed him in the circumstances.

Never seen Breaking Bad, but I love some Wire-style realism. But Star Wars - even the supposedly Perfect Original Trilogy - is another kind of storytelling; mainly visual, perfunctory dialogue etc. I think the fall isn't rushed in 'Star Wars time'. It's established in Clones that Anakin wants the power to save the ones he love. And we get all of the 'seduction' scenes in Sith (like the great opera one) before Anakin falls. I think that's a more compelling story than Anakin just getting gradually evil until he ends up a Sith. Surely when Mace dies Anakin is out of choices? Anakin sells his soul to the devil to save Padme. The 'devil' knows this. I don't see why it would be more 'realistic' at that point for Anakin to do some lesser-grade evil - he's the Emperor's bitch, and they both know it.

Tangent, but: that Natalie Portman Miss Dior perfume ad came on when I was typing this....who wouldn't go to the Dark Side for her ?!




Ok, good argument! maybe I am being unfair on the scenes and the limitations of movie time to get across a more subtle change, a TV series can afford it. I still maintain that the whole change could have been told much better in the same time span with better actors, writing etc and we do not the get the pay off moments we should of had. I will also factor in that Haydens acting in both movies was shocking and perhaps detrimental to the scenes you mention.
I like it that you haven't seen breaking bad, you will hopefully watch all four seasons one day and then go "oohh shit yeh, I see what that douchebag who hates Chris Nolan and Bryan Singer on Empire forums was talking about now!"

And yes, There isnt a dark place I wouldn't go for Portman



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'Man of Steel!,Man of Shit!' -fairyprincess

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Post #: 115
RE: One reason to live in hope. - 31/10/2012 2:59:00 PM   
Dannybohy


Posts: 1374
Joined: 7/1/2009

quote:

ORIGINAL: cerebusboy


quote:

ORIGINAL: Dannybohy


quote:

ORIGINAL: cerebusboy


quote:

ORIGINAL: Qwerty Norris

Playing devils advocate here, but this might not actually be a bad thing.

Even if he devised the original concept, Lucas has single-handedly been the most detrimental thing to the evolution of the star wars universe - both through his obsession of devising characters in order to sell plastic lunch boxes & toys


Dude, the first Star Wars toy deal was over thirty years ago. And if Lucas wanted to make a film just to sell toys, would he really choose tax routes and intergalactic diplomacy? You might think he's a shite storyteller, but episodes I to III are telling what it's obvious the creator regards as an important story (democracies becoming dictatorships etc). There's a lot more obvious ways to make money from Star Wars (e.g.: three movies of Darth Vader killing people) than pegwarming action figures of intergalactic diplomats.


yeh, they never did release that Darth Vader neck choker! so wanted one of those to take out my older sister!.



lol. They did do that force trainer where, using biowave feedback, you use your mind to move a ball up a tube. A Dark Side telekinesis toy would be cool



I bought one of those Yoda jedi training things when I was far to old for it, and without a word of lie I can tell you ended up booting that green little shit across the garden into a stonewall. The Dark side am I . Shit toy


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'Man of Steel!,Man of Shit!' -fairyprincess

(in reply to cerebusboy)
Post #: 116
RE: Star Wars: Episode VII For 2015 - 31/10/2012 2:59:29 PM   
Fit Kisto

 

Posts: 476
Joined: 15/8/2007

quote:

ORIGINAL: Artoo02

So happy. Haters: ignore it and move on with your lives.



Never! There hasn't been a better opportunity to act bitter and entitled since 1999, so this must not be wasted.

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There is no Swamp Ape. It was invented for people who can't find the actual world fascinating. Y'know?

(in reply to Artoo02)
Post #: 117
RE: Bin ep1 - 31/10/2012 2:59:57 PM   
The Hooded Man


Posts: 2773
Joined: 12/7/2006
Given the pressure to make this kiddy friendly there'll be no chance of Wire or Breaking Bad style gripping realism.

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Counting the minutes until the over zealous mods lock this thread too.

(in reply to Dannybohy)
Post #: 118
RE: Bin ep1 - 31/10/2012 3:10:16 PM   
Dannybohy


Posts: 1374
Joined: 7/1/2009

quote:

ORIGINAL: The Hooded Man

Given the pressure to make this kiddy friendly there'll be no chance of Wire or Breaking Bad style gripping realism.


I didnt mention Breaking Bad in terms of gripping realism, only in terms of storytelling (good person going bad). At the end of the day this is about Spaceships, wizards and aliens!! noone wants a movie about a galaxy far far away in a deep recession.

_____________________________

'Man of Steel!,Man of Shit!' -fairyprincess

(in reply to The Hooded Man)
Post #: 119
RE: Star Wars Episode VII For 2015? - 31/10/2012 3:19:06 PM   
drews


Posts: 271
Joined: 5/10/2005
From: Wimbledon Centre Court
I can feel the force already.

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When an opportunity in a fight presents itself, "I" don't hit, "it" hits all by itself. - BRUCE LEE

Beer: The cause of, and solution to, all of life's problems. - HOMER SIMPSON

#8 member of The Wire fan club. PM Dantes Inferno to join.

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