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Joe Abercrombie - 21/10/2012 7:14:56 PM   
big dawg


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 Didn't see a thread for this, and some of us have been mentioning the books in the Locke Lamora thread, so thought I'd start one, especially with the release of Red Country this week. Just about to put it on my Kindle and make a start, really looking forward to this.

Anyone started it?

< Message edited by big dawg -- 21/10/2012 7:15:22 PM >

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RE: Joe Abercrombie - 22/10/2012 10:14:25 PM   
Hobbitonlass


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 It's next on my Kindle to read!

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RE: Joe Abercrombie - 23/10/2012 9:36:40 AM   
sharkboy


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From: Belfast
 Me too   Just have to get through Iain M Banks' new one then I'm all over this!

Since this is a general Abercrombie thread and not specific to the new release, lets get the debate started!  What do people think about the stand-alone books so far?  Personally, I loved them both.  Best Served Cold seemed to have a luke-warm reception from the critics but I thought it was one of his stronger works, and loved how he developed the themes and characters throughout the book.  The Heroes was just a welcome return to the northern clans - really can't get enough of them at the minute (I blame Skyrim!)

So, with the latest release we have 6 books set in the First Law universe with, apparently, 4 more to come.  Too much?  Not enough?  I'm conflicted on this - as much as I love the characters and the setting, I'd like to see Abercrombie put his creative touch to a new setting for a change.


Discuss.

< Message edited by sharkboy -- 23/10/2012 9:46:40 AM >

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RE: Joe Abercrombie - 23/10/2012 4:07:43 PM   
big dawg


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 I really liked Best Served Cold...thought it brought in Caul Shivers really well and threw in the introduction of Shenkt, who has the potential to be really interesting. Thought The Heroes was superb, read that through pretty quick.

I've started Red Country and it does, again, feature some re-curring characters. I've got to admit that its something I like, the little nods to previous books, so I'd be quite happy with another few books set in this "universe". From what I've read review wise of Red Country, it doesn't look like Glokta makes an appearance and I really cant see him doing another three/four books without him featuring heavily, along wth Jezal and I'd love to see him again. I think it's all going to tie in to one big story come the end.

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RE: Joe Abercrombie - 31/10/2012 10:39:29 AM   
Harry Tuttle


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 I preferred Best Served Cold to Heroes. There's not much in it but I thought BSC had the more interesting plot plus I really like the character of Caul Shivers. Heroes is still a fantastic read though.

Shockingly I haven't started Red Country yet, I've just not had the time to give it the attention it deserves. I have the house to myself this weekend though so that'll soon be rectified.

quote:

So, with the latest release we have 6 books set in the First Law universe with, apparently, 4 more to come. Too much? Not enough? I'm conflicted on this - as much as I love the characters and the setting, I'd like to see Abercrombie put his creative touch to a new setting for a change.


I'm happy to read as many First Law books as Abercrombie can write. As long as Bayaz gets fucked up, preferably by a Jezal/Logen tag team, at the series' conclusion then I'll be happy

< Message edited by Harry Tuttle -- 31/10/2012 10:40:07 AM >

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RE: Joe Abercrombie - 31/10/2012 11:39:29 AM   
Hobbitonlass


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 I've just started reading Heroes as I realised I hadn't read it (despite having the book for bloody ages!!)

Red Country will be next on the list then!

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RE: Joe Abercrombie - 5/11/2012 11:14:38 AM   
Harry Tuttle


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 I finished Red Country yesterday and I think it's gone to the top of the list as far as the stand alone stories are concerned.

***** Here Be Huge Spoilers ******






Such a great read and I broke into such a huge grin about a couple of chapters in when I read the line "better to do it than live with the fear of it". I'd already suspected Lamb may be our nine fingered friend but that confirmation made the hair on the back of my neck stand up. I'm really not sure what it is about Lamb/Logen that makes him so damned likeable. The guy is a child killing, murderous, blood thirsty brute but he knows and accepts what he is and Abercrombie characterises him so well it's difficult not to like him. T'was also nice to see what Shivers, Friendly and Pike were getting up to although I would have liked a bit more Shivers.

Talking of old characters is the Mayor the woman from the Spicer's Guild in Dagoska that Glotka spared during the siege, or was she killed by Murcatto during Best Served Cold? I can't recall her name but she's the only one who's character description seems to fit the profile of the Mayor. Also, have we been introduced to Temple before? His wife's name (which I can't recall) was familiar but I can't remember if we've met him previously.

I'm going to read the series from the start again. There's such a depth to the story telling it's easy to forget who's who.



*** End Spoilers ***




Anyway, it's reported that the next three books will be a prequel trilogy. Despite Red Country portraying the beginning of an industrial revolution and the declining need for Barbarians and Mercenary's I have a bad feeling about this...

< Message edited by Harry Tuttle -- 5/11/2012 11:19:37 AM >

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RE: Joe Abercrombie - 13/11/2012 3:25:33 PM   
Harry Tuttle


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 So is everyone avoiding this thread till they've finished Red Country then?

Anyway, top 5 First Law series characters.

1. Logen
2. Glotka
3. Shivers
4. Jezal
5. Murcatto

Dogman and Morveer just miss out.

And the books in order of preference

1. The Blade Itself
2. The Last Argument of Kings
3. Before They Are Hanged
4. Red Country
5. Best Served Cold
6. The Heroes


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RE: Joe Abercrombie - 16/11/2012 10:37:32 AM   
Hobbitonlass


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SPOILERS




quote:

I'd already suspected Lamb may be our nine fingered friend but that confirmation made the hair on the back of my neck stand up.

I read that this morning and I almost said "I knew it" out loud this morning! Made me smile.

Also, earlier on when they came across Shivers, that made me smile as well!

Although less than quarter of the way through the book I'm enjoying it (and finding it a lot easier to read) far more than Heroes. I did enjoy Heroes but struggled with who was on what side).

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RE: Joe Abercrombie - 16/11/2012 11:15:55 AM   
Harry Tuttle


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Hobbitonlass


Although less than quarter of the way through the book I'm enjoying it (and finding it a lot easier to read) far more than Heroes. I did enjoy Heroes but struggled with who was on what side).


I had that issue, bloody Northmen on both sides of the battle complicating things . In the end I had a little notepad with a list of who was on each side, it made it much easier to follow. I wish I'd done that with all the books to be honest. There are a few familiar faces that crop up during the course of Red Country, some of which I only vaguely remember from the other books.

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RE: Joe Abercrombie - 16/11/2012 8:23:03 PM   
big dawg


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 Finished last night! Really enjoyed it, as I knew I would but I think I enjoyed the previous two stand alones more. I was a big fan of The Heroes. It was all a bit obvious that Lamb was Logen but I had read rumours that he was going to be in it so that was probably why it was so apparent. Again great characters, Shy, Dab Sweet and Crying Rock...would liked to have seen more of Papa Ring and I wasnt a great fan of the whole Dragon people thing. Great having Cosca back too.

According to what I've read Harry, the next Trilogy is going to be about 20-30 years after the First Law and will come back to Adua, the Kings Court and the coming of industry...which is hinted at throughout Red Country . There's an interview Joe's done recently where he says something along these lines. There's a link to it on his website. He reckons itll be a few years before we see it though, as he plans on writing all three as a whole. I really, really hope Glokta returns, and I'm pretty sure he will, along with Jezal and Bayaz.

My favourite characters, there's an awful lot to choose from but...

Sand dan Glokta
Nicomo Cosca
Black Dow
Whirrun of Bligh
The Dogman
Calder

there's loads more who've made appearances. Frost and Severard from the first trilogy were great for example. Now I'll just hang about waiting for Republic of Thieves....

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RE: Joe Abercrombie - 28/11/2012 1:45:07 PM   
Hobbitonlass


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 By the dead that was a brilliant read!

Loved the relationship that came about between Temple and Shy and the sarcasm that went with it. Made me laugh more than once. Knew there would be the meeting at the end but glad it turned out as it did. Didn't twig about Conthus either. Loved the little twists. Very gruesome!

Roll on the next one, hope it's not too many years

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RE: Joe Abercrombie - 29/11/2012 4:21:51 PM   
Harry Tuttle


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From: Sometime in the future.
quote:

ORIGINAL: big dawg

According to what I've read Harry, the next Trilogy is going to be about 20-30 years after the First Law and will come back to Adua, the Kings Court and the coming of industry...which is hinted at throughout Red Country . There's an interview Joe's done recently where he says something along these lines. There's a link to it on his website. He reckons itll be a few years before we see it though, as he plans on writing all three as a whole. I really, really hope Glokta returns, and I'm pretty sure he will, along with Jezal and Bayaz.


Yeah I've read much the same thing since. I imagine there's a very good chance we'll get the story from the POV of the sprogs of the characters we know and love. Jezal's got a few kids (including one bastard with Ardee that will have been raised by Glokta), Murcatto's got a child (probably sired by Shivers), Ro and Pit are only children in Red Country and I would absolutely love it if we found out Ferro had a child with Logen giving us a possible new conduit for the Bloody Nine. Any other kids I've overlooked?

The next trilogy has to include the fall of Bayaz though. Since we found out the extent of his evil (he effectively risked destroying the whole world with the seed just for his own vengeance) I want him to be exposed for the absolute cunt he is. Hopefully the rest of the surviving Magi team up and end him because it would leave quite a bad taste for the man responsible for the death of so many people (including the fantastic Collum West) to walk away at the end.

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RE: Joe Abercrombie - 2/12/2012 6:50:44 PM   
big dawg


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 Yeah I'm with you on Bayaz, Harry. That was something that I really liked about the original trilogy, that Bayaz started as a sort of stereotypical Gandalf type then as the story has progressed he's just a scheming manipulator who's in control of everything. I mentioned Shenkt in an earlier post, he put the fear into Bayaz's second in command (name escapes me ) in Best Served Cold so I still reckon he'll have a part to play. I'm really looking forward to where it goes

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RE: Joe Abercrombie - 7/12/2012 3:10:08 PM   
Harry Tuttle


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quote:

ORIGINAL: big dawg

Yeah I'm with you on Bayaz, Harry. That was something that I really liked about the original trilogy, that Bayaz started as a sort of stereotypical Gandalf type then as the story has progressed he's just a scheming manipulator who's in control of everything. I mentioned Shenkt in an earlier post, he put the fear into Bayaz's second in command (name escapes me ) in Best Served Cold so I still reckon he'll have a part to play. I'm really looking forward to where it goes


Shenkt was one of Bayaz' apprentices though wasn't he (along with Malacus Quai and Sulfur)? To be honest I can barely remember him (isn't he an eater?).

Like I said upthread I'm going to start reading the series again, there's so much going on in the books it's easy to forget about some pretty pivotal characters.

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RE: Joe Abercrombie - 7/1/2013 2:41:12 PM   
Harry Tuttle


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 So I started re reading these a couple of weeks back and I've just finished Before They Are Hanged. For the most part I've been enjoying them just as much as the first time around apart from every chapter from the point of view of Ferro. She's such a one dimensional character I find it hard to give a fuck about her one way or another to be honest. Still, it's been handy to remind myself of the Glastrod v Juvens, Juvens v Kanedias and Order of Magi v Kanedias lore. I was a bit sketchy on that so it's been nice to bring myself back up to speed.

One thing I've found reading through them again though is that the Prophet Khalul (whom we never meet) is kind of a more sympathetic character second time around. Once you realise that Bayaz is responsible for bringing about the end of the Old Times (he had obviously been scheming and succeeded in bringing down the remaining sons of Euz, I'm not sure if this is merely implied or if it is in fact confirmed in Last Argument of Kings), the death of Tolomei, setting the Union and the Gurkish on the path to war for his own petty misguided vengeance and blighting a chunk of Adua with the Seed causing countless deaths then you can kind of forgive Khalul for breaking the Second Law in order to bring the fucker down.

I'm looking forward to finishing off the trilogy and then the stand alone books again. Although I'm not looking forward to the demise of Collum "Furious" West. That alone is reason enough to wish Bayaz a slow painful death at the hands of the Eaters.

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Blood Island. So called because it's the exact shape of some blood

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RE: Joe Abercrombie - 23/1/2013 11:05:06 AM   
Rob


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I've just finished The Blade Itself and I have to confess to being somewhat disappointed by it. For the majority of the book I struggled to see what all the praise was about as whilst there were some interesting characters the plot development was next to zero. That said the last 100 pages of so convinced me to continue with the series as I'm genuinely intrigued as to what happens next particularly with Glokta.

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RE: Joe Abercrombie - 17/2/2013 7:55:06 PM   
BigKovacs


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From: Textile Street.
 Yeah I wasn't massively impressed with The Blade Itself. Glokta was the only character with any promise and the plot went almost now where. It felt like a Song of Ice and Fire clone.

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RE: Joe Abercrombie - 17/4/2013 2:08:16 PM   
Harry Tuttle


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From: Sometime in the future.
 Anyone catch this?



I grabbed it and I thought it was alright for the most part. It felt a bit odd to begin with and I'm really not sure about the way Glotka and Logen have been drawn. Glotka looks younger than I imagined him and Logen is too pretty and nowhere near scarred enough. Luther looks about right but he's only featured on the cover. Still, it's a decent accompaniment to the books and I want to have a proper look at the rest of the characters if only to complain that they look nothing like I'd visualised them .

The fact that they look nothing like I imagined aside the drawing is pretty good if a bit cartoony at times. I'll probably keep going for a bit, once you get over the slightly jarring nature of the shift of format Abercrombie's work lends itself well to a visual format IMO.

< Message edited by Harry Tuttle -- 17/4/2013 4:35:53 PM >

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Blood Island. So called because it's the exact shape of some blood

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RE: Joe Abercrombie - 17/4/2013 2:24:45 PM   
paul_ie86


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 I liked his collaboration with Janet Fitch,

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RE: Joe Abercrombie - 17/4/2013 4:22:30 PM   
Hobbitonlass


Posts: 11497
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From: Westeros
quote:

ORIGINAL: Harry Tuttle

Anyone catch this?



Catch what?

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RE: Joe Abercrombie - 17/4/2013 4:33:48 PM   
Harry Tuttle


Posts: 7496
Joined: 12/11/2005
From: Sometime in the future.
quote:

ORIGINAL: Hobbitonlass


quote:

ORIGINAL: Harry Tuttle

Anyone catch this?



Catch what?




Is the rest of my post, regarding the comic, not showing or something?

I'm confused .

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Your knowledge of scientific biological transmogrification is only outmatched by your zest for kung-fu treachery!

Blood Island. So called because it's the exact shape of some blood

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Post #: 22
RE: Joe Abercrombie - 17/4/2013 4:47:04 PM   
Hobbitonlass


Posts: 11497
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Westeros
 It's only when I quote the whole message that I realise there is supposed to be an image there, doesn't show otherwise. No idea you were talking about a comic

Actually, if I paste that link into another browser I just get a blank page

< Message edited by Hobbitonlass -- 17/4/2013 4:48:34 PM >

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RE: Joe Abercrombie - 18/4/2013 9:24:56 PM   
big dawg


Posts: 664
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 Is it a graphic novel? Genuinely when reading the books, I thought they'd work really well as one

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Post #: 24
RE: Joe Abercrombie - 18/4/2013 11:36:47 PM   
Harry Tuttle


Posts: 7496
Joined: 12/11/2005
From: Sometime in the future.
 It's a monthly title at the moment. No doubt there'll be a collected edition once the run is finished but I can imagine that'll be a while in coming. As I said, the first issue didn't even get as far as introducing Jezal. Then again there'll probably be a few volumes so I guess the first trade will be released a bit after the 5th or 6th issue.

It's worth a read, I enjoyed the first issue and I'll probably continue to pick it up.

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Your knowledge of scientific biological transmogrification is only outmatched by your zest for kung-fu treachery!

Blood Island. So called because it's the exact shape of some blood

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Post #: 25
RE: Joe Abercrombie - 19/4/2013 7:59:58 AM   
sanchia


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From: Norwich
 I must admit that the character design differs very much from how I imagined Ninefingers to be and had a bit of trouble associating the character with the image in my head.

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RE: Joe Abercrombie - 19/4/2013 9:11:55 AM   
Harry Tuttle


Posts: 7496
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From: Sometime in the future.
quote:

ORIGINAL: sanchia

I must admit that the character design differs very much from how I imagined Ninefingers to be and had a bit of trouble associating the character with the image in my head.


Totally agree. The Ninefingers in my had is far more gnarled and scarred. The one in the comic is pretty much a pretty boy with a single scar across his face. Also, as I stated above, Glotka looks a bit too young for me. Frost and Severard were about right but seeing as they're pretty much masked I guess you can't really go far wrong.

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Your knowledge of scientific biological transmogrification is only outmatched by your zest for kung-fu treachery!

Blood Island. So called because it's the exact shape of some blood

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Post #: 27
RE: Joe Abercrombie - 19/4/2013 9:21:35 AM   
sanchia


Posts: 16691
Joined: 3/1/2006
From: Norwich
quote:

ORIGINAL: Harry Tuttle

Totally agree. The Ninefingers in my had is far more gnarled and scarred. The one in the comic is pretty much a pretty boy with a single scar across his face. Also, as I stated above, Glotka looks a bit too young for me. Frost and Severard were about right but seeing as they're pretty much masked I guess you can't really go far wrong.


These were pretty much the same problems I had, I thought Ninefingers had a bit of a mashed nose and lots of scars (he is the long haired character in the forefront of the comic cover above). Glotka other than having a few teeth missing did not look like a person who had endured horrible torture (the character on the left of the comic cover).

Then again I doubt they have the time for drawing lots of scars and the art continuity would be a problem as a result.


< Message edited by sanchia -- 19/4/2013 9:22:27 AM >

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RE: Joe Abercrombie - 19/4/2013 9:41:56 AM   
Hobbitonlass


Posts: 11497
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Westeros
 Managed to find an image of the cover and is the middle character supposed to be Ninefingers?? If it is then that is way way off what I have in my head. Much older, much less pretty. Square jawed, flat nose and generally all round gruffness!

I might still read them though

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