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RE: 2013 Box Office Estimates - 21/6/2013 12:41:08 AM   
Shifty Bench

 

Posts: 15398
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Land of the Scots
I'm pretty sure it'll be a hit, I doubt folk will be turned off by Jack the Giant Slayer. It's not only an X-Men film, it's a sequel to a popular X-Men film.

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RE: 2013 Box Office Estimates - 21/6/2013 12:48:04 AM   
vad3r


Posts: 4403
Joined: 3/9/2010
From: Close to Mod HQ
I doubt the majority of folk who'll watch it even know who the director is.

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quote:

ORIGINAL: horribleives
To paraphrase the great man himself:

Vad3r won't go anywhere near this.

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Post #: 272
RE: 2013 Box Office Estimates - 21/6/2013 12:53:46 AM   
Shifty Bench

 

Posts: 15398
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Land of the Scots
And those that do will remember the first two X-Men films.

< Message edited by Shifty Bench -- 21/6/2013 12:54:12 AM >


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Post #: 273
RE: 2013 Box Office Estimates - 21/6/2013 10:41:01 AM   
Cool Breeze


Posts: 2351
Joined: 9/11/2011
From: The Internet

quote:

ORIGINAL: Shifty Bench

I'm pretty sure it'll be a hit, I doubt folk will be turned off by Jack the Giant Slayer. It's not only an X-Men film, it's a sequel to a popular X-Men film.


First Class was the worst X Men film but whatever, all the X films have been box office hits.

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Post #: 274
RE: 2013 Box Office Estimates - 21/6/2013 11:21:55 AM   
Shifty Bench

 

Posts: 15398
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Land of the Scots

quote:

ORIGINAL: Cool Breeze


quote:

ORIGINAL: Shifty Bench

I'm pretty sure it'll be a hit, I doubt folk will be turned off by Jack the Giant Slayer. It's not only an X-Men film, it's a sequel to a popular X-Men film.


First Class was the worst X Men film but whatever, all the X films have been box office hits.


It was still popular though, which was my initial point. I didn't offer any personal opinion in my post.

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Post #: 275
RE: 2013 Box Office Estimates - 21/6/2013 3:13:36 PM   
directorscut


Posts: 10889
Joined: 30/9/2005

quote:

ORIGINAL: Cool Breeze

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rgirvan44

It's not beating Prometheus yet - that movie cost at least 50M less than STID and made 400M.




STID has made over $400M now.Are you still trying to convince people that its a flop?


If the studio's expectations were $600m, then yes.

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Post #: 276
RE: 2013 Box Office Estimates - 21/6/2013 3:26:31 PM   
MonsterCat


Posts: 7934
Joined: 24/3/2011
From: St. Albans, Hertfordshire
A quick look on Google says Star Trek into My Anus has made a little bit over 400 million. Now, I'm not an expert on these things but a film needs to make double its budget to level off, right? There might be a 200 million shortfall between what the studio wanted and what it ended up making, but it's not actually looking like a flop to me.

EDIT - Not that it matters to us anyway. If the film is at the very least halfway decent it's done its job.

< Message edited by MonsterCat -- 21/6/2013 3:39:02 PM >


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Post #: 277
RE: 2013 Box Office Estimates - 21/6/2013 3:46:44 PM   
Shifty Bench

 

Posts: 15398
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Land of the Scots
It's not a flop but domestically, it's a disappointment.

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Post #: 278
RE: 2013 Box Office Estimates - 22/6/2013 11:32:27 AM   
Cool Breeze


Posts: 2351
Joined: 9/11/2011
From: The Internet

quote:

ORIGINAL: Shifty Bench

It's not a flop but domestically, it's a disappointment.


Its made over $200 million domestically, i dont see how that can be a disappointment.

And altogether, it has already outgrossed the last film which makes it the highest grossing Star Trek film in history.

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Post #: 279
RE: 2013 Box Office Estimates - 22/6/2013 12:42:44 PM   
spark1

 

Posts: 7022
Joined: 18/11/2006
the real plus for 'into darkness' was an increased worldwide gross for a trek movie.

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Post #: 280
RE: 2013 Box Office Estimates - 22/6/2013 12:54:49 PM   
jackcarter


Posts: 1867
Joined: 12/1/2006
Star Trek movies 1-11 adjusted box office
http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Star_Trek_films

worldwide totals
1. TMP 139m = 445m
2. ST09 385m = 417m
3. TVH 133m = 282m
4. TWOK 97m = 234m
5. FC 146m = 216m
6. TSFS 87m = 194m
7. GEN 118m = 185m
8. TUC 98m = 166m
9. INS 112m = 159m
10.TFF 70m = 131m
11.NEM 67m = 87m

STID might get to 450 or even 475m (which would be equal to Return of the Jedi in 1983 - ok thats about $1b when adjusted but be good to see a Trek film near to or above a SW on the all time BO chart )

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Post #: 281
RE: 2013 Box Office Estimates - 22/6/2013 1:27:24 PM   
Shifty Bench

 

Posts: 15398
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Land of the Scots
quote:

ORIGINAL: Cool Breeze


quote:

ORIGINAL: Shifty Bench

It's not a flop but domestically, it's a disappointment.


Its made over $200 million domestically, i dont see how that can be a disappointment.


Do you take anything in, ever, or are you that blinded by how much you like the film?

Again- Paramount (and this is the same with any studio) expected the film to do a certain amount of cash in the US as it was a sequel to a popular film. The film took weeks to make its production budget in the US where the studio would have liked it to have made much more than that by now. Going by their estimations and expectations, the film is a disappointment domestically. Remember, the film cost $190m to make, (before marketing costs) and it has just scraped by that in the US. It has done well, overseas, so Paramount are happy about that but they do tend to like to make films for the US as well, so it is disappointing if a film doesn't do well as expected domestically.

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RE: 2013 Box Office Estimates - 23/6/2013 1:25:56 PM   
jackcarter


Posts: 1867
Joined: 12/1/2006
WWZ predictions? - maybe $75m?

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Post #: 283
RE: 2013 Box Office Estimates - 23/6/2013 1:37:09 PM   
MonsterCat


Posts: 7934
Joined: 24/3/2011
From: St. Albans, Hertfordshire

quote:

ORIGINAL: jackcarter

WWZ predictions? - maybe $75m?


I don't know, but I'm sure directorscut will have a prediction that'll be wide off the mark yet again.

80 million for Man of Steel. lolz.

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Post #: 284
RE: 2013 Box Office Estimates - 23/6/2013 4:17:05 PM   
directorscut


Posts: 10889
Joined: 30/9/2005
$66.6m.

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Post #: 285
RE: 2013 Box Office Estimates - 23/6/2013 8:57:36 PM   
Cool Breeze


Posts: 2351
Joined: 9/11/2011
From: The Internet

quote:

ORIGINAL: Shifty Bench

quote:

ORIGINAL: Cool Breeze


quote:

ORIGINAL: Shifty Bench

It's not a flop but domestically, it's a disappointment.


Its made over $200 million domestically, i dont see how that can be a disappointment.


Do you take anything in, ever, or are you that blinded by how much you like the film?

Again- Paramount (and this is the same with any studio) expected the film to do a certain amount of cash in the US as it was a sequel to a popular film. The film took weeks to make its production budget in the US where the studio would have liked it to have made much more than that by now. Going by their estimations and expectations, the film is a disappointment domestically. Remember, the film cost $190m to make, (before marketing costs) and it has just scraped by that in the US. It has done well, overseas, so Paramount are happy about that but they do tend to like to make films for the US as well, so it is disappointing if a film doesn't do well as expected domestically.


Do YOU take in anything ever?

How do you know how exactly how much money Paramount wanted to make on this film? Do you work for the studio? Im sure they would have been delighted if STID made Avengers amount of box office.Which studio would not? Just because it didnt doesnt make it a disappointment And please, enough about how much it made domestically, money is money no matter where it comes from and what counts is how much a film makes worldwide as well as at home.As of last week, STID has outgrossed the previous film in the series which is the least a studio expects of any sequel and STID has accomplished that.And it still hasnt finished its theatrical run as it hasnt opened in several territories yet so will make even more money than the previous film.

Despite an opening a little lower than expected, STID proved to show strong legs by playing well in spite of heavy competition from Iron Man 3 and Fast And Furious 6.In other words, it was popular with audiences and benefited from string word of mouth.Its a hit plain and simple.

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Post #: 286
RE: 2013 Box Office Estimates - 23/6/2013 9:05:49 PM   
Shifty Bench

 

Posts: 15398
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Land of the Scots
Oh for fuck's sake.




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Post #: 287
RE: 2013 Box Office Estimates - 23/6/2013 9:08:09 PM   
Cool Breeze


Posts: 2351
Joined: 9/11/2011
From: The Internet

quote:

ORIGINAL: Shifty Bench

Oh for fuck's sake.





Just checked Boxofficemojo.STID Has now made over $430 million worldwide.

Yep i guess your Seinfeld gif there is you conceding defeat in this argument.

I win.

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Post #: 288
RE: 2013 Box Office Estimates - 23/6/2013 9:35:04 PM   
Shifty Bench

 

Posts: 15398
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Land of the Scots
Actually, no, fuck it. Let's do this-

quote:

ORIGINAL: Cool Breeze

Do YOU take in anything ever?


Excellent comeback considering I am not the one blinded by their love of a film.

quote:

How do you know how exactly how much money Paramount wanted to make on this film? Do you work for the studio?

Another excellent and not at all immature comeback, well done. Of course I don't work for the studio and I have never, not once stated that I did but please, feel free to correct me. Show me any of my posts where I have said I work for Paramount. I patiently wait for said correction.

quote:

Im sure they would have been delighted if STID made Avengers amount of box office.Which studio would not? Just because it didnt doesnt make it a disappointment


Except it kind of does. Not a flop, which I emphasize again, but a disappointment.

quote:

And please, enough about how much it made domestically, money is money no matter where it comes from and what counts is how much a film makes worldwide as well as at home


Except, no US studio makes a film for only the overseas market. It is starting to get that way (the added China scenes in Iron Man 3) but right now they really would like their film to be a success at home. While money is money and they will be delighted that people overseas are giving them money, the fact that it has only just barely made it's production budget (not overall budget, mind you) back will and I guarantee you this, will leave them somewhat disappointed.

quote:

As of last week, STID has outgrossed the previous film in the series which is the least a studio expects of any sequel and STID has accomplished that.And it still hasnt finished its theatrical run as it hasnt opened in several territories yet so will make even more money than the previous film.

Despite an opening a little lower than expected, STID proved to show strong legs by playing well in spite of heavy competition from Iron Man 3 and Fast And Furious 6.In other words, it was popular with audiences and benefited from string word of mouth.Its a hit plain and simple.


No, what is plain and simple is that not only did it cost more to make than the first film, it also opened in Imax and in 3D, something that the previos film (and Fast 6) didn't do. So, although it looks as though more people are going out to see the film, this is not the case. Imax and 3D tickets cost more, sometimes a lot more. Again, I am not saying the film is a flop, I never once said that but going by what Paramount would want the sequel to a popular film to make in its opening weekend and also its opening week, STID failed. Also-

quote:

Yep i guess your Seinfeld gif there is you conceding defeat in this argument.

I win.


You child.

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Post #: 289
RE: 2013 Box Office Estimates - 23/6/2013 9:43:44 PM   
directorscut


Posts: 10889
Joined: 30/9/2005
Star Trek Into Darkness will make less than Fast and Furious 6 and Oz The Great and Powerful in the US, something not many people would have said at the start of the year.

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RE: 2013 Box Office Estimates - 23/6/2013 9:48:23 PM   
MonsterCat


Posts: 7934
Joined: 24/3/2011
From: St. Albans, Hertfordshire
Does disappointing grosses make a film any less enjoyable? Not really.

I think we would all like to see our favourite films and what-not be successful and liked by everybody, but that's not the reality of the situation.

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Films watched in 2013

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Post #: 291
RE: 2013 Box Office Estimates - 23/6/2013 9:50:40 PM   
Shifty Bench

 

Posts: 15398
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Land of the Scots
quote:

ORIGINAL: directorscut

Star Trek Into Darkness will make less than Fast and Furious 6 and Oz The Great and Powerful in the US, something not many people would have said at the start of the year.


Yeah, and Fast 6 didn't cost as much as STID, it is actually already beating it. (I haven't seen Fast 6 for clarification's sake)

quote:

ORIGINAL: MonsterCat

Does disappointing grosses make a film any less enjoyable? Not really.


No, it doesn't

quote:

I think we would all like to see our favourite films and what-not be successful and liked by everybody, but that's not the reality of the situation.


Exactly.


< Message edited by Shifty Bench -- 23/6/2013 9:51:18 PM >


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RE: 2013 Box Office Estimates - 23/6/2013 9:53:55 PM   
Cool Breeze


Posts: 2351
Joined: 9/11/2011
From: The Internet

quote:

ORIGINAL: Shifty Bench

Actually, no, fuck it. Let's do this-

quote:

ORIGINAL: Cool Breeze

Do YOU take in anything ever?


Excellent comeback considering I am not the one blinded by their love of a film.

quote:

How do you know how exactly how much money Paramount wanted to make on this film? Do you work for the studio?

Another excellent and not at all immature comeback, well done. Of course I don't work for the studio and I have never, not once stated that I did but please, feel free to correct me. Show me any of my posts where I have said I work for Paramount. I patiently wait for said correction.

quote:

Im sure they would have been delighted if STID made Avengers amount of box office.Which studio would not? Just because it didnt doesnt make it a disappointment


Except it kind of does. Not a flop, which I emphasize again, but a disappointment.

quote:

And please, enough about how much it made domestically, money is money no matter where it comes from and what counts is how much a film makes worldwide as well as at home


Except, no US studio makes a film for only the overseas market. It is starting to get that way (the added China scenes in Iron Man 3) but right now they really would like their film to be a success at home. While money is money and they will be delighted that people overseas are giving them money, the fact that it has only just barely made it's production budget (not overall budget, mind you) back will and I guarantee you this, will leave them somewhat disappointed.

quote:

As of last week, STID has outgrossed the previous film in the series which is the least a studio expects of any sequel and STID has accomplished that.And it still hasnt finished its theatrical run as it hasnt opened in several territories yet so will make even more money than the previous film.

Despite an opening a little lower than expected, STID proved to show strong legs by playing well in spite of heavy competition from Iron Man 3 and Fast And Furious 6.In other words, it was popular with audiences and benefited from string word of mouth.Its a hit plain and simple.


No, what is plain and simple is that not only did it cost more to make than the first film, it also opened in Imax and in 3D, something that the previos film (and Fast 6) didn't do. So, although it looks as though more people are going out to see the film, this is not the case. Imax and 3D tickets cost more, sometimes a lot more. Again, I am not saying the film is a flop, I never once said that but going by what Paramount would want the sequel to a popular film to make in its opening weekend and also its opening week, STID failed. Also-

quote:

Yep i guess your Seinfeld gif there is you conceding defeat in this argument.

I win.


You child.


Calling someone '' immature '' and a '' child ''.The sign of someone who is so frustrated that they have lost the argument that they have resorted to name calling.

I cant be bothered to quote your exact points but to summarize..

Im not blinded by my love for the film, i did really enjoy it but facts are facts.The film is a big financial success as it has outgrossed the previous film.

You claim to know how much Paramount wanted the film to make.Meaning either A) You work for Paramount or B) Have telepathic abilities.

So you claim that a film which doesnt make as much money as Avengers is considered a disappointment.In other news, Fast And Furious 6 is deemed a financial failure due to not making as much as Avengers Assemble and Fast 7 has now been cancelled

Yes you are right that no U.S studio makes a film solely for the overseas market.They also do not make films SOLELY for the U.S market so a lot of a films revenue comes in from international gross.STID is currently one of only four movies this year to break the $200 million barrier in the U.S so is already a big success there.It has performed extremly well overseas which makes it an even bigger success which has helped it outgross the previous Star Trek film.

This one will be a shocker for you... are you ready?... A film plays longer than its opening weekend! It actually continues playing in theatres for many weeks depending on how popular it is.So despite grossing slightly less on its opening weekend than its predecessor, the film proved to have strong legs due to good word of mouth and held up well despite strong competition from the hugely popular Fast and Iron Man franchises.to put this in comparison, The Hangover 3 opened strong, but promptly fell off the radar due to negative reviews and audiences having had enough of this franchise.

Its ok,Shifty, you tried but you lost the argument.Thank you and goodnight.

_____________________________

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Post #: 293
RE: 2013 Box Office Estimates - 23/6/2013 10:06:35 PM   
Rebel scum


Posts: 3483
Joined: 2/1/2006
Fuck it, this is an exercise in pointlessness but,

quote:

ORIGINAL: Cool Breeze

Im not blinded by my love for the film, i did really enjoy it but facts are facts.The film is a big financial success as it has outgrossed the previous film.


Not in the US it hasn't, in fact it's still about $40m behind. That's the disappointment. It doesn't matter if it made back its budget or it did well overseas, it's dropped off in the lucrative and important US market by a large degree. That must be disappointing for Paramount, especially when Man of Steel has almost outgrossed it domestically when it's only been out two weeks. STID was Paramount's summer tentpole film and it's only done okay. I bet they were hoping it'd hit big too since GI Joe DID flop.

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Post #: 294
RE: 2013 Box Office Estimates - 23/6/2013 10:09:41 PM   
matty_b


Posts: 14579
Joined: 19/10/2005
From: Outpost 31 calling McMurtle.
quote:

ORIGINAL: Cool Breeze


quote:

ORIGINAL: Shifty Bench

Actually, no, fuck it. Let's do this-

quote:

ORIGINAL: Cool Breeze

Do YOU take in anything ever?


Excellent comeback considering I am not the one blinded by their love of a film.

quote:

How do you know how exactly how much money Paramount wanted to make on this film? Do you work for the studio?

Another excellent and not at all immature comeback, well done. Of course I don't work for the studio and I have never, not once stated that I did but please, feel free to correct me. Show me any of my posts where I have said I work for Paramount. I patiently wait for said correction.

quote:

Im sure they would have been delighted if STID made Avengers amount of box office.Which studio would not? Just because it didnt doesnt make it a disappointment


Except it kind of does. Not a flop, which I emphasize again, but a disappointment.

quote:

And please, enough about how much it made domestically, money is money no matter where it comes from and what counts is how much a film makes worldwide as well as at home


Except, no US studio makes a film for only the overseas market. It is starting to get that way (the added China scenes in Iron Man 3) but right now they really would like their film to be a success at home. While money is money and they will be delighted that people overseas are giving them money, the fact that it has only just barely made it's production budget (not overall budget, mind you) back will and I guarantee you this, will leave them somewhat disappointed.

quote:

As of last week, STID has outgrossed the previous film in the series which is the least a studio expects of any sequel and STID has accomplished that.And it still hasnt finished its theatrical run as it hasnt opened in several territories yet so will make even more money than the previous film.

Despite an opening a little lower than expected, STID proved to show strong legs by playing well in spite of heavy competition from Iron Man 3 and Fast And Furious 6.In other words, it was popular with audiences and benefited from string word of mouth.Its a hit plain and simple.


No, what is plain and simple is that not only did it cost more to make than the first film, it also opened in Imax and in 3D, something that the previos film (and Fast 6) didn't do. So, although it looks as though more people are going out to see the film, this is not the case. Imax and 3D tickets cost more, sometimes a lot more. Again, I am not saying the film is a flop, I never once said that but going by what Paramount would want the sequel to a popular film to make in its opening weekend and also its opening week, STID failed. Also-

quote:

Yep i guess your Seinfeld gif there is you conceding defeat in this argument.

I win.


You child.


Calling someone '' immature '' and a '' child ''.The sign of someone who is so frustrated that they have lost the argument that they have resorted to name calling.

I cant be bothered to quote your exact points but to summarize..

Im not blinded by my love for the film, i did really enjoy it but facts are facts.The film is a big financial success as it has outgrossed the previous film.

You claim to know how much Paramount wanted the film to make.Meaning either A) You work for Paramount or B) Have telepathic abilities.

So you claim that a film which doesnt make as much money as Avengers is considered a disappointment.In other news, Fast And Furious 6 is deemed a financial failure due to not making as much as Avengers Assemble and Fast 7 has now been cancelled

Yes you are right that no U.S studio makes a film solely for the overseas market.They also do not make films SOLELY for the U.S market so a lot of a films revenue comes in from international gross.STID is currently one of only four movies this year to break the $200 million barrier in the U.S so is already a big success there.It has performed extremly well overseas which makes it an even bigger success which has helped it outgross the previous Star Trek film.

This one will be a shocker for you... are you ready?... A film plays longer than its opening weekend! It actually continues playing in theatres for many weeks depending on how popular it is.So despite grossing slightly less on its opening weekend than its predecessor, the film proved to have strong legs due to good word of mouth and held up well despite strong competition from the hugely popular Fast and Iron Man franchises.to put this in comparison, The Hangover 3 opened strong, but promptly fell off the radar due to negative reviews and audiences having had enough of this franchise.

Its ok,Shifty, you tried but you lost the argument.Thank you and goodnight.





_____________________________

quote:

ORIGINAL: Cool Breeze
Mattyb is a shining example of what the perfect Empire Forum member is.


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Post #: 295
RE: 2013 Box Office Estimates - 23/6/2013 10:09:56 PM   
Shifty Bench

 

Posts: 15398
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Land of the Scots
quote:

ORIGINAL: Cool Breeze
Calling someone '' immature '' and a '' child ''.The sign of someone who is so frustrated that they have lost the argument that they have resorted to name calling.

Not frustrated at all, you were acting like a child so I called a child.

quote:

You claim to know how much Paramount wanted the film to make.Meaning either A) You work for Paramount or B) Have telepathic abilities.


Or I have this magical box called 'the internet'.

quote:

you claim that a film which doesnt make as much money as Avengers is considered a disappointment.

I did no such thing. I didn't even mention The Avengers, you did. I said a film that doesn't make as much money as expected is a disappointment. The Avengers made more than expected. STID did not, therefore it is a disappointment. The fact that the film used in this scenario was The Avengers is neither here nor there. Hence my not actually naming it.


quote:

This one will be a shocker for you... are you ready?... A film plays longer than its opening weekend! It actually continues playing in theatres for many weeks depending on how popular it is.So despite grossing slightly less on its opening weekend than its predecessor, the film proved to have strong legs due to good word of mouth and held up well despite strong competition from the hugely popular Fast and Iron Man franchises.to put this in comparison, The Hangover 3 opened strong, but promptly fell off the radar due to negative reviews and audiences having had enough of this franchise.


This just cements the idea that you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about. Of course a film plays longer than its opening weekend but opening weekend numbers matter. Again....fucking AGAIN....I am not saying the film is a flop but it didn't open as well as expected and hasn't actually made as much money as hoped or an IMAX 3D film and a sequel to a popular film is expected to.

quote:

Its ok,Shifty, you tried but you lost the argument.Thank you and goodnight.


What argument is that exactly? Can you tell me just what it is I am saying that is wrong? All I see is me stating the fact that the film is not a flop but didn't open as well as Paramount hoped. How exactly is that me losing the argument? It is the truth.


< Message edited by Shifty Bench -- 23/6/2013 10:10:38 PM >


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Post #: 296
RE: 2013 Box Office Estimates - 23/6/2013 10:12:22 PM   
matty_b


Posts: 14579
Joined: 19/10/2005
From: Outpost 31 calling McMurtle.
quote:

ORIGINAL: Shifty Bench



quote:

You claim to know how much Paramount wanted the film to make.Meaning either A) You work for Paramount or B) Have telepathic abilities.


Or I have this magical box called 'the internet'.







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quote:

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Post #: 297
RE: 2013 Box Office Estimates - 23/6/2013 10:44:45 PM   
DancingClown


Posts: 4257
Joined: 8/1/2006
From: The Lot
And it's a KO from The Bench!



Eat floor, Darth Breeze.

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Post #: 298
RE: 2013 Box Office Estimates - 23/6/2013 10:58:22 PM   
jackcarter


Posts: 1867
Joined: 12/1/2006
quote:

ORIGINAL: directorscut

$66.6m.


sim to 2012 - so maybe WWZ will also pull in over 700m as its basically 2012 with zombies (or the I Am Legend prequel that didnt happen)

< Message edited by jackcarter -- 23/6/2013 11:02:02 PM >

(in reply to directorscut)
Post #: 299
RE: 2013 Box Office Estimates - 23/6/2013 11:08:15 PM   
Dirk Miggler


Posts: 1106
Joined: 14/1/2009
Sequels don't always gross more than there predecessors. STID It's a decent film, earned a fair amount of coin and we will probably get a sequel on a reduced budget. Happy days lets move on

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Post #: 300
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