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RE: European football - 2/5/2013 2:46:56 PM   
Olaf


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I think it was Raph Honigstein that said that 'Bayern never win the Bundesliga, they only lose it or retain it' or something like that. Their domination of the league has *always* been the status quo, it's not something that's threatening to happen.

The flipside of no team having the comparable resources to dominate German football is that any team that's well-run and has a good manager installed can emerge near the top and challenge for a couple of seasons. Hence Dortmund being able to go from nearly getting relegated to being the CL final in the space of five years. I think most German football fans just kind of accept that FC Hollywood will always be top dogs in the grand scheme of things and look forward to teams coming and going at the top of the league (just look at Werder Bremen).

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RE: European football - 2/5/2013 2:48:12 PM   
directorscut


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Professor Moriarty


quote:

ORIGINAL: Qwerty Norris

In particular, I'm fearful for the competitiveness at the top of the Bundesliga.



Well if they keep plundering the best of Borussia that's not going to help matters so much.


I wouldn't be so quick to write off Dortmund. Klopp has already proven himself to be an excellent judge of players and a wizard on the transfer market, so with an extra 30m to spend I'd expect him to greatly improve his squad. That's of course if he stays next season.

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RE: European football - 2/5/2013 5:30:01 PM   
Saltire


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From: Dundee

quote:

ORIGINAL: directorscut


quote:

ORIGINAL: Sexual Harassment Panda

Does this mean the English Media's love affair with Spanish football is finally over?


Well at least Spain had teams that got past the last-16.

(Some) People are too quick to write Barca's obituaries. The team is clearly burnt-out from 5 years of unparalleled success, both for club and country and from old age. Puyol is pretty much gone now. Xavi is 34 now, and while he could still get into Man Utd's first team, he can't performed at a top top club like Barca for an entire season anymore. They haven't got anything upfront if Messi is out. They need replenishment in some key areas but they are far from done.


Agreed, I said it preseason Barca would not win the CL this season as they didn't strengthen in defense, and even the best defense they could have mustered, most of those players (Messrs Alba, Mascherano and the legend that is Puyol (and potentially the reliable Montoya)) were missing, Abidal is brilliant for what he has achieved in coming back and is such a composed defender but you couldn't expect him to play in a tie like that just yet. Busquets and Messi also weren't in the team last night either, they were ravaged; had those players played in both matches Bayern probably still would have won the tie, but it would have been much more competitive.

A couple of good centre half's for next season, and a versatile forward to replace Villa when he leaves and Barca will give the CL a good go yet again. Footy fans shouldn't write them off just yet.

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RE: European football - 2/5/2013 5:33:43 PM   
Saltire


Posts: 1974
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From: Dundee

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sexual Harassment Panda

What I dislike about the whole thing is that people seem to always have excuses for teams like Barcelona. Things like they have an ageing team is used as a way to excuse any lesser performances, when it's any other team the same line is used as a negative against them rather than an excuse for performances.

Barcelona for me never had a plan B, and they always had two tactics they struggled to handle, high tempo attacks/pressure or solid defensive displays. The passes they completed and the work rate was fantastic but I still think they were over lauded, for me this Bayern team has been far more astute than Barcelona have ever been over the last few years and they've been far more entertaining.


Decent points but I disagree with your last point, when they were at their peak they were sensationally good to watch and because the tempo has gone out of their play just now, tiki-taka doesn't work nearly as well and hence a more direct style is needed.

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RE: European football - 2/5/2013 5:35:34 PM   
Saltire


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Joined: 5/7/2011
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sexual Harassment Panda

To elaborate it seems that in the case of Barcelona we laid them and excuse these quite frankly terrible performances because they have suffered from burn out and an ageing squad. Yet with any other team e.g. Chelsea we take a pop at them for relying too heavily on the old guard and building for the here and now instead of looking for long term and aiming for sustainable success.

I'm just bored of this Spanish love-in, particularly that with Barcelona where it appears out media will do nothing but orgasm over them and struggle to ever put them down, even their play acting antics seem to get swept under the rug. A prime example of this Spanish love-in would be last night, it was clear ITV were rooting for Madrid, all the commentary came across as such also.

I think the Germans deserve a lot of the adoration they will no no doubt receive instead of the Spanish teams, but I just hope it's a little less blinkered and one sided.


Thats the problem right there, people say they are bored of the Spanish styles, its not necessarily that, its the media's obsession with them thats the issue and why fans tire of it.

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RE: European football - 2/5/2013 5:39:31 PM   
Saltire


Posts: 1974
Joined: 5/7/2011
From: Dundee
quote:

ORIGINAL: Rhubarb


quote:

ORIGINAL: Sexual Harassment Panda



I'm just bored of this Spanish love-in, particularly that with Barcelona where it appears out media will do nothing but orgasm over them and struggle to ever put them down, even their play acting antics seem to get swept under the rug. A prime example of this Spanish love-in would be last night, it was clear ITV were rooting for Madrid, all the commentary came across as such also.

I think the Germans deserve a lot of the adoration they will no no doubt receive instead of the Spanish teams, but I just hope it's a little less blinkered and one sided.



In fairness, ITV needed to root for Real yesterday because if they didn't get back into the game - which was a long shot which they admitted (Roy Keane summed up their chances quite bluntly) then it was not a contest, and one which people wouldn't watch.

Barca have deserved all the praise they have got over the last few years, and were a couple of years ago, arguably the best team anyone had ever seen. The current Barca team has got stale, and while Messi has somehow got even better, an over-realiance on him (which is bizarrely fascinating that players as good as the ones they have are always looking for him) has made them less formiddable. Similarly, Bayern deserve a lot of praise for the way they play, and I don't see how the praise would be unblinkered - they're either great or they are not great. And they are pretty great.


The reason they went for Real is for their sycophantic drooling over Mourinho and Ronaldo because they were great in England. Sky were the same prematch the other night showing snippets of Ronaldo running down the field celebrating in their advertisement of the match - what were Dortmund not worth mentioning?

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Post #: 606
RE: European football - 2/5/2013 5:41:59 PM   
Saltire


Posts: 1974
Joined: 5/7/2011
From: Dundee

quote:

ORIGINAL: Qwerty Norris

quote:

ORIGINAL: MOTH


The curious thing is that if he believes this, Bayern seem a curious choice, since it seems they are well through their own cycle - this would be the second year of a 3 year cycle, so what can Guardiola do to freshen things up for another 2-3 years?


Well, signing Gotze & possibly Lewandowski for a start. The likes of Kroos, Alaba, Martinez, Badstuber & Muller are all under 25, whilst the likes of Robben, Ribery, Schweinsteiger, Dante & Neuer are at the pinnacle of their careers and should sustain those levels for at least another 2 or 3 seasons (probably much longer in Neuer's case). Make no mistake, this team aint going away any time soon. They may well dominate the rest (or most) of this decade. In particular, I'm fearful for the competitiveness at the top of the Bundesliga.

As for Barca, they are far from a team in crisis, but they definitely need reinforcements if they're to sustain the levels everyone has come to expect from them over the past five years or so. For my money they still have the best central midfield in world football (although Xavi admittedly has probably peaked), they're just severely lacking options at the back and are too reliant on Messi in the final third. A bit of presence & leadership at both ends of the park & they'll be fine.





A disappointment for me is the lack of faith in Thiago, who is a fine young player and deserves a chance to show his worth, especially when Xavi looks fatigued as he has this last month.

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Post #: 607
RE: European football - 2/5/2013 5:56:46 PM   
OPEN YOUR EYES

 

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Dortmund aren't getting much of a looking either way concerning the amount of praise they duly deserve.
Not taking anything away from Bayern,who's two results against Barca were without doubt astonishing,but they are a major financial force compared to Dortmund,who,when they do spend big its usually from the assets they move-on/sell.

Again I'm not taking anything away from Bayern and I'm not leeching on the side of (Dortmund) the underdogs,but I generally admire Dortmund more than the power-house that is Munchen.

Hopefully its a great final either way.

< Message edited by OPEN YOUR EYES -- 2/5/2013 5:57:12 PM >

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Post #: 608
RE: European football - 2/5/2013 6:06:24 PM   
Nexus Wookie


Posts: 2333
Joined: 24/9/2011
From: the Godcity

quote:

ORIGINAL: directorscut


quote:

ORIGINAL: Professor Moriarty


quote:

ORIGINAL: Qwerty Norris

In particular, I'm fearful for the competitiveness at the top of the Bundesliga.



Well if they keep plundering the best of Borussia that's not going to help matters so much.


I wouldn't be so quick to write off Dortmund. Klopp has already proven himself to be an excellent judge of players and a wizard on the transfer market, so with an extra 30m to spend I'd expect him to greatly improve his squad. That's of course if he stays next season.


What a thing it would be if Dortmund were to end up winning the final! And lets not forget they have a great record against Bayern, one can only hope!

But either way, the two most worthy teams went through, and i don't know about this 'German' crap, but i'm looking forward to the final.

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RE: European football - 2/5/2013 8:05:42 PM   
directorscut


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At their best I find Dortmund to be more exciting than Bayern. Their passing, movement and combination play is dazzling to watch and I think their demolition of Madrid at home was more impressive than Bayern over Barca. I certainly won't be surprised if they beat Bayern in the final.

< Message edited by directorscut -- 2/5/2013 8:06:27 PM >


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RE: European football - 2/5/2013 9:26:14 PM   
Qwerty Norris


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From: Edinburgh
They can absolutely do it. All 3 games (soon to be 4 after this weekend) have been pretty close this season. Their defence is pretty average (the only one I rate in that back 4/5 is Pisczek - and that's not for his defensive qualities), but Dortmund under Klopp don't win games by defending well - one of the many reasons I've taken a shine to them.

Additionally, all the pressure is on Bayern.

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Post #: 611
RE: European football - 13/5/2013 9:56:29 PM   
Professor Moriarty

 

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Takes a brave man to do this (Gattuso sacked by FC Sion), wonder if they got Joe Jordan in for the job

Full marks to the ref for stopping the Milan vs Roma game for racist chants against 11 goals in 11 games Balotelli. Less marks for the 50K Euro fine.

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Post #: 612
RE: European football - 15/5/2013 5:37:39 PM   
horribleives

 

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I see Ribery got terribly upset at being covered in booze during Bayern's title-winning celebrations. With good reason too - a 30 year old muslim man being sprayed with alcohol is clearly far worse than a 16 year old prostitute being sprayed with spunk.

< Message edited by horribleives -- 15/5/2013 5:38:07 PM >


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RE: European football - 15/5/2013 6:31:31 PM   
Saltire


Posts: 1974
Joined: 5/7/2011
From: Dundee

quote:

ORIGINAL: horribleives

I see Ribery got terribly upset at being covered in booze during Bayern's title-winning celebrations. With good reason too - a 30 year old muslim man being sprayed with alcohol is clearly far worse than a 16 year old prostitute being sprayed with spunk.


Haha

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Post #: 614
RE: European football - 15/5/2013 7:10:51 PM   
Ultimo Lee

 

Posts: 1738
Joined: 17/7/2007
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All crap apparently

Boateng @JB17Official "Me and my bro Ribry everything is Fine it was nonalcohol Beer so all Good"

And posted this pic



Isn't that nice

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Post #: 615
RE: European football - 15/5/2013 9:52:31 PM   
Goodfella


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Christ, just look at Michel Platini's face!? Tell me again how we're being melodramatic about an anti-English feeling running through UEFA, and FIFA for that matter.

I really can't stand the prick.

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RE: European football - 15/5/2013 10:07:36 PM   
directorscut


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Goodfella

Christ, just look at Michel Platini's face!? Tell me again how we're being melodramatic about an anti-English feeling running through UEFA, and FIFA for that matter.

I really can't stand the prick.


You're being melodramatic about an anti-English feeling running through UEFA.

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RE: European football - 17/5/2013 11:14:30 PM   
directorscut


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Hell yeah Atletico!

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RE: European football - 17/5/2013 11:17:28 PM   
Nexus Wookie


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Well done to Athletico for winning the Copa beating Real at home in the process. The only downer was the atrocious play acting from both sides. But well done nonetheless. And against Real and Mourinho all i can do is but Lol!

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RE: European football - 17/5/2013 11:21:21 PM   
MOTH

 

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that was great fun. from a vaguely support-the-underdog stance at the start, I ended up a fervent Atletico fan by the end and would have wept bitterly if they'd lost

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RE: European football - 17/5/2013 11:40:20 PM   
directorscut


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It brought a tear to my eye when John Terry lifted the cup.

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RE: European football - 17/5/2013 11:53:14 PM   
MOTH

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: directorscut

It brought a tear to my eye when John Terry lifted the cup.



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RE: European football - 18/5/2013 12:23:57 AM   
Saltire


Posts: 1974
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From: Dundee
Absolute quality, superb from Atletico tonight, a great match, and to get their first win over Real in 14 years not only to win the Copa del Rey but to do it at the Bernabeu too was sensational. Mourinho the failure, yay!

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RE: European football - 18/5/2013 8:45:26 AM   
OPEN YOUR EYES

 

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I bet Real will be glad to see the back of Mourinho.

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RE: European football - 18/5/2013 9:45:11 AM   
Professor Moriarty

 

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That had a bit of everything, didn't it? Knocked last week's FA Cup Final into a cocked hat.

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RE: European football - 18/5/2013 9:56:56 AM   
OPEN YOUR EYES

 

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I just browsed through the highlights.Seemed like there was abit of play acting.

So I would expect this to be Mourinho's last competitive final for Real,and maybe even Ronaldo's.
And I wouldn't be surprised if they left for the same club.

< Message edited by OPEN YOUR EYES -- 18/5/2013 10:15:17 AM >

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RE: European football - 18/5/2013 11:44:15 AM   
Sexual Harassment Panda


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quote:

ORIGINAL: OPEN YOUR EYES

I just browsed through the highlights.Seemed like there was abit of play acting.

So I would expect this to be Mourinho's last competitive final for Real,and maybe even Ronaldo's.
And I wouldn't be surprised if they left for the same club.


That would only happen if Mourinho left for PSG. I highly doubt they'd link up again if Mourinho went back to Chelsea.

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RE: European football - 18/5/2013 12:30:04 PM   
OPEN YOUR EYES

 

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I cant imagine Ronaldo saying no if a Chelsea offer came on the table that out-does other possible offers.

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RE: European football - 18/5/2013 12:58:51 PM   
Saltire


Posts: 1974
Joined: 5/7/2011
From: Dundee

quote:

ORIGINAL: OPEN YOUR EYES

I bet Real will be glad to see the back of Mourinho.



Definitely, they feel he has dragged their name through the mud these last three years and for not much success either.

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RE: European football - 18/5/2013 2:40:10 PM   
Ultimo Lee

 

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You've got to hand it to him though he's managed to united Madrid, he's hated by both Real and Atletico supporters.

He was booed by both sets of fans last night.

Ronaldo will stay in Madrid and i wouldn't be shocked to see Mourinho at PSG, Chelsea is a much bigger job now than it was when he left.

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