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RE: European football - 13/3/2013 10:57:19 AM   
OPEN YOUR EYES

 

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Blink for a second and you'll miss it,well that's what I did anyway.Unbelievably quick feet and great control in dealing with Xavi's driven pass.
Just perfect.

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Post #: 361
RE: European football - 13/3/2013 11:34:26 AM   
Professor Moriarty

 

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From: the waters of Casablanca
Wonderful performance from Messi who just stepped up and played on a different level last night.

I know it is a very different position, but I just wonder what Rooney is thinking when he sits at home watching that? Barca's main man comes into his own and bangs in two goals, the team overturns the deficit and they are into the semis. Utd leave what I'm sure he considers to be their main man on the bench and they go out.

I'm still not saying that Ferguson made a mistake with his selection for that game in at the stage it was after the first leg. But its got to really rattle Rooney's cage that in the biggest game of the season for Utd he's not on the field.

Note: this doesn't mean that I think Rooney is anywhere near in the class of Messi. But I still think in his head he must consider himself as one of the top players in Europe.

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Post #: 362
RE: European football - 13/3/2013 11:53:52 AM   
OPEN YOUR EYES

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Professor Moriarty

Wonderful performance from Messi who just stepped up and played on a different level last night.

I know it is a very different position, but I just wonder what Rooney is thinking when he sits at home watching that? Barca's main man comes into his own and bangs in two goals, the team overturns the deficit and they are into the semis. Utd leave what I'm sure he considers to be their main man on the bench and they go out.

I'm still not saying that Ferguson made a mistake with his selection for that game in at the stage it was after the first leg. But its got to really rattle Rooney's cage that in the biggest game of the season for Utd he's not on the field.

Note: this doesn't mean that I think Rooney is anywhere near in the class of Messi. But I still think in his head he must consider himself as one of the top players in Europe.


But he's not been up to standard this year ,anyone can see that.
His ,arguable, best season for United was 09/10 after that he went on a slump of form and its clear to say he doesn't look the same player.

When people used to say that "if you took the aggression out of Rooney then you're getting less of a player" I think those people were right.
Rooneys aggression,determination was one of his most important assets and I frankly feel that has left him.He has become,in a odd way,to likeable on the field.The Rooney of today is a lessor player than that of Rooney in his early days.

In some ways I liken his progresion to Del Piero.Now Del Piero was a good player but in the late 90's the hype for him was at Rooneys level and most of it justifiable.Then the injuries came and Piero ended up no more than a good,good player but one that never truly showed his (imo) full potential.And I think the same can be said of Rooney,who'll go down as a very good player but one in which there was an expectation of more.

But football/sport will always produce these type of people.Players who show early potential but something somewhere just makes them go stale.
I remember the early hype of then Kolns Podolski (now at Arsenal).

United got there tactics spot on.But they crumbled once a chink was thrown into there Armour and they went out because of that but up until that point the Welbeck idea was a master stroke.
Why should Ferguson have played rooney?,just because he's a big name?
no,tactics/set-up come first for most managers and it will always be the case.You do whats right for the team not individual.

< Message edited by OPEN YOUR EYES -- 13/3/2013 8:11:38 PM >

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Post #: 363
RE: European football - 13/3/2013 12:02:12 PM   
Professor Moriarty

 

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I agree with absolutely everything you have said OYE.

In particular:
- He's not been up to standard this year
- Taking the fire out of the player has reduced his impact
- The Utd tactics were spot on in that game

I'm kind of posing the question of how can it make him feel in his head that he was left out of that starting line up in the biggest game of the season? There can be any amount of talk about how modern football is now all about the squad and he celebrated the goal for Utd. But it is still a game played by players. And if you think you are the big man, but suddenly you are not needed to lead the line, play in the hole,out on the wing or anywhere else we've seen Rooney play then thathas to hurt.

You will see in my post that I said that I was not questioning Ferguson's selection or tactics. But I am questioning how a player can feel he is pivotal to the team and the main man and then in the biggest game of the season he's watching eleven others run around ahead of him in the selection.

< Message edited by Professor Moriarty -- 13/3/2013 12:04:15 PM >

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Post #: 364
RE: European football - 13/3/2013 12:20:04 PM   
OPEN YOUR EYES

 

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no probs.

I think,like you and me have said concerning Rooney's early days and how he is in-comparison with today then, there is a major difference.
The early Rooney wouldn't have liked to have sat on the bench and see other players out there in a huge game,he would be sick with jealousy and maybe even rage,not now though.Now he seems happy to bide his time.
I generally think Ferguson would rather have a angry Rooney than one who is satisfied in his recent roles.Ferguson wanted Rooney to come off the bench and inspire United and selfishly himself yet that never materialized.Rooney frankly did nothing.

Is Rooney lacking confidence or is he just comfortable now?.

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Post #: 365
RE: European football - 13/3/2013 12:31:48 PM   
Harry Tuttle


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quote:

ORIGINAL: OPEN YOUR EYES

But he's not been up to standard this year ,anyone can see that.
His ,arguable, best season for United was 09/10 after that he went on a slump of form and its clear to say he doesn't look the same player.



He scored 34 goals in 44 appearances last season, the same as 09/10.

Agree with the gist of your post though, especially regarding the importance of aggression in his game. He's definitely been sub par this season but he had a great season last year.

< Message edited by Harry Tuttle -- 13/3/2013 12:32:04 PM >


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Post #: 366
RE: European football - 13/3/2013 12:33:34 PM   
Professor Moriarty

 

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From: the waters of Casablanca

quote:

ORIGINAL: OPEN YOUR EYES

Is Rooney lacking confidence or is he just comfortable now?.


Its kind of hard to believe that Rooney has already been at Utd for 10 years.

I think his best season was the one straight after Ronaldo left. It was a big hole in the team and Rooney stepped up and filled it. I think he won PFA Player of the Year.

Then his head got turned, in October 2010 he wasn't happy. I think there were two clear elements to this:
- City were wanted him and wanted to pay him mega wages
- Rooney had fears that Utd were not investing in the squad

In the end Utd put a load of money on the table for him. I don't know what his wages are, but I think around the quarter of a million mark. Honestly I don't find that too extravagant as I expect he is one of their most recognisable brand ambassadors around the world driving that huge Utd merchandising revenue.

But I'd agree that his form has dipped since then. For me he became a very one dimensional player and completely lost his touch (which is why I really don't see how there can be a long term role for him in midfield). And now he is clearly not the man. RvP is (although he is in a barren spell himself now).

So, from the options you give I'd say a lack of confidence. I think he has to be the man. He wants the team built around him, which would probably be Wellbeck knocking down the ball, Kagawa sliding through passes and Valencia knocking over crosses.

But honestly, it might just be time for him (after 10 years) to look for a new challenge somewhere else that will invigorate him. And if Utd pick up 20M and get him off their wage bill then I don't think that Ferguson will be crying too much, whatever he says elsewhere. Definitely if Ronaldo did come back (which looks unlikely this summer at least). I think Ferguson would make that change at the drop of a hat.

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Post #: 367
RE: European football - 13/3/2013 12:35:39 PM   
Dirk Miggler


Posts: 1080
Joined: 14/1/2009
Comfortable, stagnant, stale, you could use all of these words to describe where Rooney's at right now. I think he's at a critical crossroads in his career right now and if he is any sort of sportsman, professional or just any sort of man in general his questions should be of himself not of his manager or his team.

His response should be to give himself a kick up the arse and relight that fire he had in his early 20's that made him feared throughout Europe. He has the ability, despite his dips in form and never fulfilling the early promise he has still been one of the premierships most potent attacking players, it makes you wonder if success has maybe come a bit too easy to him at Utd ?. At this moment he is certainly England's Del Piero (nice parallels there OYE) but he has time to change that, can he do it though ?

< Message edited by Dirk Miggler -- 13/3/2013 12:39:41 PM >

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Post #: 368
RE: European football - 13/3/2013 12:43:15 PM   
superdan


Posts: 8043
Joined: 31/7/2008

quote:

ORIGINAL: Professor Moriarty
I'm kind of posing the question of how can it make him feel in his head that he was left out of that starting line up in the biggest game of the season? There can be any amount of talk about how modern football is now all about the squad and he celebrated the goal for Utd. But it is still a game played by players. And if you think you are the big man, but suddenly you are not needed to lead the line, play in the hole,out on the wing or anywhere else we've seen Rooney play then thathas to hurt.

You will see in my post that I said that I was not questioning Ferguson's selection or tactics. But I am questioning how a player can feel he is pivotal to the team and the main man and then in the biggest game of the season he's watching eleven others run around ahead of him in the selection.


I actually get the impression he's quite comfortable being more of a 'squad' player. He's often disappointed on the biggest occasions anyway, and carried a lot of criticism as a result. I think he's quite happy to let someone else step into that kind of limelight - as long as he still feels a valued part of the team and gets to play games and score goals. Which is fair enough if you ask me.

Of course, this is just the impression I get. I could be completely and utterly wrong

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Post #: 369
RE: European football - 13/3/2013 12:54:56 PM   
Dirk Miggler


Posts: 1080
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quote:

ORIGINAL: superdan


quote:

ORIGINAL: Professor Moriarty
I'm kind of posing the question of how can it make him feel in his head that he was left out of that starting line up in the biggest game of the season? There can be any amount of talk about how modern football is now all about the squad and he celebrated the goal for Utd. But it is still a game played by players. And if you think you are the big man, but suddenly you are not needed to lead the line, play in the hole,out on the wing or anywhere else we've seen Rooney play then thathas to hurt.

You will see in my post that I said that I was not questioning Ferguson's selection or tactics. But I am questioning how a player can feel he is pivotal to the team and the main man and then in the biggest game of the season he's watching eleven others run around ahead of him in the selection.


I actually get the impression he's quite comfortable being more of a 'squad' player. He's often disappointed on the biggest occasions anyway, and carried a lot of criticism as a result. I think he's quite happy to let someone else step into that kind of limelight - as long as he still feels a valued part of the team and gets to play games and score goals. Which is fair enough if you ask me.

Of course, this is just the impression I get. I could be completely and utterly wrong



That's a hell of a lot money he demands for someone who's happy to be a squad player

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Post #: 370
RE: European football - 13/3/2013 12:56:39 PM   
superdan


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Dirk Miggler
That's a hell of a lot money he demands for someone who's happy to be a squad player



And he gets paid it! Who's the mug, him or the club? He'll never earn the money he's on right now again, fucking kick back lad and enjoy it I say

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Post #: 371
RE: European football - 13/3/2013 12:59:40 PM   
horribleives

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Professor Moriarty

Its kind of hard to believe that Rooney has already been at Utd for 10 years..



Definitely, especially as he's actually been there just over 8 and a half

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Post #: 372
RE: European football - 13/3/2013 1:03:44 PM   
Professor Moriarty

 

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From: the waters of Casablanca

quote:

ORIGINAL: horribleives


quote:

ORIGINAL: Professor Moriarty

Its kind of hard to believe that Rooney has already been at Utd for 10 years..



Definitely, especially as he's actually been there just over 8 and a half


Do I look like Carol Vorderman

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Post #: 373
RE: European football - 13/3/2013 1:07:28 PM   
Professor Moriarty

 

Posts: 9869
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From: the waters of Casablanca

quote:

ORIGINAL: superdan


quote:

ORIGINAL: Dirk Miggler
That's a hell of a lot money he demands for someone who's happy to be a squad player



And he gets paid it! Who's the mug, him or the club? He'll never earn the money he's on right now again, fucking kick back lad and enjoy it I say



Is that you Winston Bogarde

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Post #: 374
RE: European football - 13/3/2013 1:11:44 PM   
Dirk Miggler


Posts: 1080
Joined: 14/1/2009

quote:

ORIGINAL: superdan


quote:

ORIGINAL: Dirk Miggler
That's a hell of a lot money he demands for someone who's happy to be a squad player



And he gets paid it! Who's the mug, him or the club? He'll never earn the money he's on right now again, fucking kick back lad and enjoy it I say



Props to the agent on that one....

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Post #: 375
RE: European football - 13/3/2013 1:18:56 PM   
horribleives

 

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Didn't Rooney once say he'd like to finish his career back at Everton or did I imagine that? Even if he did, I can't see it happening now - the days of players taking that much of a pay-cut are long gone - though you can imagine the extra challenge bringing out the best in him.

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RE: European football - 13/3/2013 7:45:17 PM   
directorscut


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I see those rumours of Arsenal fielding a weakened team were typical media bollox.

Still no chance.

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RE: European football - 13/3/2013 7:48:47 PM   
directorscut


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RE: European football - 13/3/2013 7:52:35 PM   
OPEN YOUR EYES

 

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RE: European football - 13/3/2013 7:59:24 PM   
MOTH

 

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A double whammy of excitement on RTE as Arsenal score and George Hamilton's voice went so supersonic his commentary got cut off.


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RE: European football - 13/3/2013 8:28:28 PM   
James2183


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This game is poor. So many misplaced passes.

What's the average age of both teams tonight?

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RE: European football - 13/3/2013 8:39:47 PM   
directorscut


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Bayern obviously complacent. Thought they could win this at a canter. Hopefully Arsenal pick things up in the second half.

Giroud was *this* close to having a serious injury, buggering the rest of Arsenal's season (even moreso). Didn't I tell you to buy another striker Wenger? Didn't I?

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RE: European football - 13/3/2013 8:57:27 PM   
directorscut


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Gustavo is exactly the type of player Arsenal need and would immeasurably imrprove the team. Hope Wenger is paying attention.

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RE: European football - 13/3/2013 9:05:10 PM   
directorscut


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Now would be a good time to take Rosicky off...

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RE: European football - 13/3/2013 9:15:13 PM   
directorscut


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Come on Gervinho! Show your worth!

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RE: European football - 13/3/2013 9:28:36 PM   
directorscut


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Gotta love that typical German steeley resolve!



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RE: European football - 13/3/2013 9:30:36 PM   
Skiba


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If 5mins of injury time comes up then it's gameover...Bayern will bottle it!

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RE: European football - 13/3/2013 9:35:58 PM   
directorscut


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Aw shucks.


Hopefully Wenger doesn't see this match as confirmation that the squad is good enough.

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RE: European football - 13/3/2013 9:46:36 PM   
James2183


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Well I think it's safe to say the next Champions League winners are going to be Spanish

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Post #: 389
RE: European football - 13/3/2013 9:49:25 PM   
OPEN YOUR EYES

 

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I said Arsenal will win.

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