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Dark Knight Rises Spoiler Podcast - 24/7/2012 3:16:58 PM   
Empire Admin

 

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TDKR - 24/7/2012 3:16:58 PM   
Harry PJ

 

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In terms of sheer emotional heft (I cried at the end more than I ever have), Nolan's nailed it I think DK remains the superior film - a tighter, more accessible film.
This isn't to suggest DKR isn't completely brilliant but it's certainly more of a 'superhero movie' than DK, which was rooted in something more like reality. DKR's tone is far more closely shared with BB, the odyssean travails (God I sound like a twat) and grand scale of action clearly separate from the world we know. I'm too tired to think of a proper conculsion but you know, food for thought...

Hats off, Mr Nolan and particular mention to newcomers Anne Hathaway and Joe GL. The regular ensemble were reliably good, if Oldman's role wasn't as interesting here as it was in DK.

Comparing to Avengers without resorting to film/movie: I think the Avengers is perhaps miraculously *less flawed* than DKR and ends up being more fun but DKR has far more substantial human drama. I smiled more watching TA but DKR made me cry.

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ANSWER TO ANY INCONSISTENCIES - 24/7/2012 3:18:19 PM   
Harry PJ

 

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BECAUSE HE'S THE GOD DAMN BATMAN

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The End - 24/7/2012 3:28:13 PM   
rtleeson

 

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To make a case for Bruce surviving. The Auto-Pilot plant was revealed when they invested the Bat and Fox was told Bruce Wayne fixed it.

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The End - 24/7/2012 3:28:14 PM   
rtleeson

 

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To make a case for Bruce surviving. The Auto-Pilot plant was revealed when they invested the Bat and Fox was told Bruce Wayne fixed it.

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Post #: 5
- 24/7/2012 3:58:41 PM   
sirvolkar

 

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Great podcast :)

When I left The Avengers, I was smiling and entertained. When I left Dark Knight Rises, I wanted to watch it again. Immediately! It took me two days, but as mentioned in the podcast, I definitely enjoyed it even more the second time. As the guys mention here, there are so many subtle moments in this film. The one I liked most was the fact that during the very first time we see her, Talia uses a phrase straight out of Ra's Al Ghul mouth in Batman Begins if I;m not mistaken.

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- 24/7/2012 4:12:18 PM   
sirvolkar

 

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Great podcast :)

When I left The Avengers, I was smiling and entertained. When I left Dark Knight Rises, I wanted to watch it again. Immediately! It took me two days, but as mentioned in the podcast, I definitely enjoyed it even more the second time. As the guys mention here, there are so many subtle moments in this film. The one I liked most was the fact that during the very first time we see her, Talia uses a phrase straight out of Ra's Al Ghul mouth in Batman Begins if I;m not mistaken.

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Post #: 7
Regarding Bane's voice - 24/7/2012 4:16:56 PM   
martjensen

 

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Great film but for me The Dark Knight takes the title. Regarding Bane's voice, it was mentioned in the podcast that Tom Hardy based it upon Bartley Gorman who was the bare-knuckle boxing world champion. He was featured in a Shane Meadows short documentary years ago. Well worth a watch........King of the Gypsies. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lB0_QEh-KVs

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Post #: 8
Auto pilot - 24/7/2012 4:41:11 PM   
sowasred2012


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OK - so he fixed the autopilot on the bat, great. What I wonder is, what 'bat' were the tech guys looking at later?

Was it the original bat? Unlikely, because that means it survived the blast and then flew back to Gotham with nobody noticing. So that suggests there was more than one bat, in which case:

A: why did Bruce bother fixing the auto pilot on all of the other ones too? and B: did Bane simply not notice all of these flying machines lying around in the lab when he broke in and stole the tumblers?

Also - I'm not sure it's a plot hole, but how did nobody but Blake and Bane put two and two together and figure out Bruce was Batman? Batman disappears for eight years, and Bruce becomes a recluse for eight years. Both reappear publicly around the same time, Bane rolls around in tumblers he stole from the Wayne building, and Bruce is given a funeral around the same time Batman is given a memorial.

The funeral/memorial is why I think Blake would become a variant on Nightwing or Terry McGinnis rather than another Batman - if everyone thinks Batman is dead, nobody is gonna take a guy with a lot less experience as seriously, so it'd make sense for him to forge a new identity.

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Post #: 9
My two pence - 24/7/2012 5:09:33 PM   
Nickwantstowork

 

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Hmm.. well i think and prefer to believe that he survived. Selina was his (and her) way out, and they both road off into the sunset together.

1- Autopilot was a hint to Lucius
2- New light was a hint to Gordon
3 - Map and cave was Bruce passing the torch to Blake
4 - Alfred told him what he wished for at the start of the film, and this was Bruce way of granting it.
----------------
That said being greedy and how i loved the films, i'd rather he stayed as Batman and made Dark Knight 4; but it was a good ending for the character (peace and a chance at a potentially happy life).

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- 24/7/2012 5:28:26 PM   
calumnorth

 

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Alfred is left the money from the liquidation, I doubt he wouldn't keep it all, so that would be how Bruce and Selina can live in Italy or wherever.

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RE: Auto pilot - 24/7/2012 5:39:38 PM   
sowasred2012


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quote:

ORIGINAL: waltham1979


quote:

ORIGINAL: sowasred2012

OK - so he fixed the autopilot on the bat, great. What I wonder is, what 'bat' were the tech guys looking at later?

Was it the original bat? Unlikely, because that means it survived the blast and then flew back to Gotham with nobody noticing. So that suggests there was more than one bat, in which case:

A: why did Bruce bother fixing the auto pilot on all of the other ones too? and B: did Bane simply not notice all of these flying machines lying around in the lab when he broke in and stole the tumblers?

Also - I'm not sure it's a plot hole, but how did nobody but Blake and Bane put two and two together and figure out Bruce was Batman? Batman disappears for eight years, and Bruce becomes a recluse for eight years. Both reappear publicly around the same time, Bane rolls around in tumblers he stole from the Wayne building, and Bruce is given a funeral around the same time Batman is given a memorial.

The funeral/memorial is why I think Blake would become a variant on Nightwing or Terry McGinnis rather than another Batman - if everyone thinks Batman is dead, nobody is gonna take a guy with a lot less experience as seriously, so it'd make sense for him to forge a new identity.


I see all of your points but I'm mainly going to go with because The Dark Knight Rises wasn't a documentary and their has to be some suspension of disbelief.

All of Nolan's Bat films are filled with quite spectacular plot holes...I love 'em anyway


Oh for sure, I enjoyed the film, I was close to tears when he makes the flight, and I'll go see it at the IMAX when it's not booked out solid, I've just had a lot of fun poking holes in some of the film's logic. And, personally, I'd love for this "universe" to continue on with John Blake (sans Nolan, obviously) as the next protector of Gotham (whatever name he decides to go by), I thought his character was one of the best things about the film.

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Post #: 12
He Survived! - 24/7/2012 5:45:02 PM   
nickcentre12

 

Posts: 2
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From: norhtampton
Haven't listened to the podcast but these are my thoughts! The whole first half of the film was showing Bruce in a state of apathy; not caring about the world outside of the four walls of Wayne manor. Then putting his already broken body on the line to face up to Bane's gang, the whole of the GCPD and then finally Bane. At the point, and as pointed out by the doctor in the prison pit, Bruce didn't fear death which is why he couldn't escape the prison, and which is why he couldn't beat Bane. Following the leap of faith from the prison, Batman/Bruce had gained a healthy fear of death and wanted to live and finally enjoy his life, which allowed him to beat the snot out of Bane. My interpretation of this was that Bruce would not then just fly off into the sunset to blow up; job finished, but to save Gotham and get the life that Alfred had always envisioned for him.

By the way; what a great film and ending to the trilogy! The thing I enjoyed the most was the fact that I was never sure if Nolan would kill off any of the established characters or not! This created so much more tension than I have ever felt in a movie before; even when Doby died!

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Post #: 13
Bane Death - 24/7/2012 5:47:38 PM   
Butlerbert

 

Posts: 42
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I liked it to be honest, because you could tell he wasn't about to give a speech, he was going to blow batmans head of, just as quickly as he himself died, he got what was coming to him!

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Post #: 14
ign version - 24/7/2012 10:19:38 PM   
Richard Fi

 

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the IGN spoilercast sounds like actual film fans talking, where you guys sort of sound like the next table over in an All Bar One.

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Post #: 15
RE: Dark Knight Rises Spoiler Podcast - 25/7/2012 6:42:04 AM   
alamo1

 

Posts: 10
Joined: 1/5/2008
On the subject of the Bat and auto-pilot.

Since they were all prototypes, it stands to reason that only the one that came in black was fully functional and the others would only be powered when needed through external power sources that needed to be brought in, preventing their use by Bane etc.. as for them all having auto pilot, all Bruce did was apply a software update to the programming of the machines thereby upgrade them.


< Message edited by alamo1 -- 25/7/2012 7:00:06 AM >

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RE: Auto pilot - 25/7/2012 8:39:42 AM   
waltham1979


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From: San-Diago, which is German for 'Whales virgina'...
quote:

ORIGINAL: sowasred2012


quote:

ORIGINAL: waltham1979


quote:

ORIGINAL: sowasred2012

OK - so he fixed the autopilot on the bat, great. What I wonder is, what 'bat' were the tech guys looking at later?

Was it the original bat? Unlikely, because that means it survived the blast and then flew back to Gotham with nobody noticing. So that suggests there was more than one bat, in which case:

A: why did Bruce bother fixing the auto pilot on all of the other ones too? and B: did Bane simply not notice all of these flying machines lying around in the lab when he broke in and stole the tumblers?

Also - I'm not sure it's a plot hole, but how did nobody but Blake and Bane put two and two together and figure out Bruce was Batman? Batman disappears for eight years, and Bruce becomes a recluse for eight years. Both reappear publicly around the same time, Bane rolls around in tumblers he stole from the Wayne building, and Bruce is given a funeral around the same time Batman is given a memorial.

The funeral/memorial is why I think Blake would become a variant on Nightwing or Terry McGinnis rather than another Batman - if everyone thinks Batman is dead, nobody is gonna take a guy with a lot less experience as seriously, so it'd make sense for him to forge a new identity.


I see all of your points but I'm mainly going to go with because The Dark Knight Rises wasn't a documentary and their has to be some suspension of disbelief.

All of Nolan's Bat films are filled with quite spectacular plot holes...I love 'em anyway


Oh for sure, I enjoyed the film, I was close to tears when he makes the flight, and I'll go see it at the IMAX when it's not booked out solid, I've just had a lot of fun poking holes in some of the film's logic. And, personally, I'd love for this "universe" to continue on with John Blake (sans Nolan, obviously) as the next protector of Gotham (whatever name he decides to go by), I thought his character was one of the best things about the film.


I am willing to bet my left testicle that this won't be the last Batman film in this universe. They said after Begins their would be no sequel; after The Dark Knight Nolan said he wouldn't come back for a third AND Bale rescently back-tracked and said he would do another if Nolan was on board...I think their will be a long break but I have a feeling we will see Nolan's cup of tea and long coat directing a growling another growling Batman film.

Personally if they did I would love them to do the story line where a 'new' Batman has gone a little nuts and Wayne has to come out of retirement to stop him.

< Message edited by waltham1979 -- 25/7/2012 9:47:55 AM >


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RE: Auto pilot - 25/7/2012 1:45:52 PM   
jobloffski

 

Posts: 1892
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: elsewhere
quote:

ORIGINAL: sowasred2012

OK - so he fixed the autopilot on the bat, great. What I wonder is, what 'bat' were the tech guys looking at later?

Was it the original bat? Unlikely, because that means it survived the blast and then flew back to Gotham with nobody noticing. So that suggests there was more than one bat, in which case:

A: why did Bruce bother fixing the auto pilot on all of the other ones too? and B: did Bane simply not notice all of these flying machines lying around in the lab when he broke in and stole the tumblers?

Also - I'm not sure it's a plot hole, but how did nobody but Blake and Bane put two and two together and figure out Bruce was Batman? Batman disappears for eight years, and Bruce becomes a recluse for eight years. Both reappear publicly around the same time, Bane rolls around in tumblers he stole from the Wayne building, and Bruce is given a funeral around the same time Batman is given a memorial.

The funeral/memorial is why I think Blake would become a variant on Nightwing or Terry McGinnis rather than another Batman - if everyone thinks Batman is dead, nobody is gonna take a guy with a lot less experience as seriously, so it'd make sense for him to forge a new identity.



Depends. Would be quite the psychological advantage over an opponent, to have apparently risen from the grave to fight crime. Batman/his symbol would truly have become more than a man, he would have become an idea, and apparently, a wraith, immortal, everlasting.

Which would allow a continuation to flow directly from established continuity without a whole new legend having to be built up. Kinda squanders the 'everlasting symbol' thing to do anything but make the man in the suit irrelevant, and the symbol all important.

Nolan's already achieved that, though. So there may be nowhere fro the story to go in a 200m+ movie that cant escalate above TDKR unless the villains threaten the world at large.

So I'm guessing it's over. Nightwing or whatever for comics/animated stuff(which most of the cinema audience wont touch with a barge pole) and a reboot, new wayne, new gotham, new batman for the cinema audience.

Batman, against the odds created by Batman and Robin has effectively become a new Bond type scenario. Ever renewable, simple by recasting.



< Message edited by jobloffski -- 25/7/2012 1:52:48 PM >


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- 25/7/2012 3:46:57 PM   
smcdonagh

 

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Joined: 20/7/2011
I am unsure if I liked this film. I loved the other 2. On the plus side I love the continuity of all 3. 1 story over 3 films. Also loved the return of batman sequence and the first fight with bane. On the minus side not enough batman. Also massive plotholes. How can a person recover from a broken back in 5 months. How was he able to make the climb and jump with his bad knee. I also think he should have died at the end.

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Is he not Dead! - 28/7/2012 9:27:37 AM   
AaronGallagher1

 

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From: Luton
I must say my assumption was that when Alfred sees Bruce Wayne at the end, it was just him imagining it as per his story earlier told to Bruce.

This was just him day dreaming that Bruce had found hapiness with a wife.

Sorry if this is not an original idea put out there.

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Is he not Dead! - 28/7/2012 11:17:31 AM   
AaronGallagher1

 

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From: Luton
I must say my assumption was that when Alfred sees Bruce Wayne at the end, it was just him imagining it as per his story earlier told to Bruce.

This was just him day dreaming that Bruce had found hapiness with a wife.

Sorry if this is not an original idea put out there.

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Post #: 21
RE: Is he not Dead! - 29/7/2012 10:34:07 AM   
elab49


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quote:

ORIGINAL: AaronGallagher1

I must say my assumption was that when Alfred sees Bruce Wayne at the end, it was just him imagining it as per his story earlier told to Bruce.

This was just him day dreaming that Bruce had found hapiness with a wife.

Sorry if this is not an original idea put out there.


It was a widespread idea that seemed to originally come from people who'd missed part of the end of the film. Fox/auto-pilot, Gordon on the roof etc.


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The Dark Knight Rises Spoiler Podcast - 29/7/2012 12:30:46 PM   
Filmfan 2


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Just changing the thread title back so no-one is spoiled whilst browsing the index. Seriously, shame on you, AaronGallagher1!

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Post #: 23
RE: The Dark Knight Rises Spoiler Podcast - 29/7/2012 12:33:41 PM   
Ref


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From: Leicester
Just changing the title for the forum, just in-case.

EDIT: Nicely done, FilmFan - great minds and all that.

< Message edited by Ref -- 29/7/2012 12:34:29 PM >


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Post #: 24
The Ending - 30/7/2012 7:48:15 PM   
Oyin

 

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The boys suggested that TDKR has a similar ending to Avengers but if you remember very well, they all have an eerily similar ending to Angels n Demons where the carmelengo takes the bomb into the sky and parachutes down. Dan Brown is the originator of such endings.

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RE: The Dark Knight Rises Spoiler Podcast - 31/7/2012 8:33:18 AM   
AaronGallagher1

 

Posts: 8
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From: Luton
Apologies for the spoiler. I thought the title was already about spoilers and the previous posts about "making a case for batman surbiving" and the funeral talk.

But apologies anyway.

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Post #: 26
Ending shots - 9/8/2012 2:16:43 PM   
mmmpieisgood


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I think the ending could have been improved if we hadn't seen the table with Bruce and Selina - instead showing Alfred looking up, clearly looking at the table he always looks at, and giving some kind of a knowing smile. Cut to credits. More ambiguity and can easily be read either way.

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Post #: 27
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