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RE: Chicken Wing - 18/7/2012 1:26:29 PM   
Rgirvan44


Posts: 19049
Joined: 10/3/2006
From: Punishment Park
quote:

ORIGINAL: MonsterCat

I don't get the chicken wing thing.


I don't get any of it beyond LOOK AT ME. LOOK AT ME.

_____________________________

It is a far, far better thing that I do, than I have ever done; it is a far, far better rest that I go to, than I have ever known.


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Post #: 181
RE: The Dark Knight Rises - 18/7/2012 1:40:13 PM   
MonsterCat


Posts: 7934
Joined: 24/3/2011
From: St. Albans, Hertfordshire
Snobbery is the only one thing that truly annoys about this forum.

Threads like this really bring the numpties out of the woodwork.

_____________________________

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Films watched in 2013

(in reply to Rgirvan44)
Post #: 182
RE: The Dark Knight Rises - 18/7/2012 1:46:43 PM   
Rob


Posts: 2473
Joined: 30/9/2005
The annoying thing about burtbondy's post is that hardly anyone has declared the films perfect or refused to criticise Nolan and yet there's the assumption that we're all hero-worshipping him and his work. The Dark Knight rises is one of my favourite films of all time and yet I admit it has numerous flaws, plot holes etc but in no way shape or form does it detract from my enjoyment of it all.

_____________________________

Same thing happened to me when I played Neil Armstrong in Moonshot. They found me in an alley in Burbank trying to re-enter the earth's atmosphere in an old refrigerator box.

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Post #: 183
RE: Chicken Wing - 18/7/2012 1:50:40 PM   
waltham1979


Posts: 1224
Joined: 18/3/2008
From: San-Diago, which is German for 'Whales virgina'...
quote:

ORIGINAL: burtbondy

Don't let my typo lure you into thinking you're witty. It happens. I didn't calim to see the movie.


Umm...I wasn't trying to be witty?! I was just wondering if you had seen the film? You claim that all Nolan films (and by association TDKR) are full of " inconsistencies, contradictions and laughable plotholes" and whilst I feel everyone is entitled to an opinion I just wondered if you had actually seen the film that this thread is about?? Perfectly fair question...

And by the way; thank you Porntrooper for bringing the phrase ‘fuckwittery’ into my vocabulary

< Message edited by waltham1979 -- 18/7/2012 2:00:07 PM >


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I just wish stuff like, I don't know, the slow & systemic CRATERING of this country could inspire the same call-to-arms as Batman casting

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Post #: 184
RE: Crisis Averted - 18/7/2012 2:23:09 PM   
Whistler


Posts: 3133
Joined: 22/11/2006

quote:

ORIGINAL: Whistler

quote:

ORIGINAL: Scruffybobby

Can we hope that this review will prevent total site meltdown before lunchtime?

Vey happy to see a great review and very much looking forward to seeing the film at the weekend


I still reckon this thread's going to go mental - even if it is positive mentalness.


Called it.

(in reply to Whistler)
Post #: 185
RE: Chicken Wing - 18/7/2012 2:39:58 PM   
Giant Green Rabbit


Posts: 1109
Joined: 13/2/2006
From: Cloud Cuckoo Land
I really couldn't give a toss about 'fans' and 'backlashes' etc - all a wee bit childish. I just want to see a good film which is engaging in some way. Generally I've found most superhero movies to be utterly tedious and un-involving and for me the majority are kids' films with low-moderate levels of sex and violence to appeal to those older with some money in their pocket. I guess it's a matter of taste but I feel that a superhero with supernatural powers fighting crime for the good of society is inherently a child's fantasy - something that is pretty boring to indulge in, for the grown-up. It's not the complete other-worldlines; superhero movies are also largely by-the-numbers and predictable with reclusive or nerdy individuals developing superpowers through some sort of accident, challenged by some one-dimensional villain who is villainous for the sheer heck of it, who sometimes has superpowers of his own, who comes close to defeating our hero before the hero prevails and saves the day. Add a sprinkling of an attractive woman or two and the film is complete. Zzzzzzzz. The concept is worn, the plot predictable, the characters unrealistic and therefore impossible to empathize with - this goes for Spiderman, The Hulk, Wolverine, X-men and probably a number of others that I haven't seen.

So how can you make the concept work in a way which actually is involving? I'd say TIm Burton's efforts were good examples - create a completely different 'world' and make it pantomime and operatic (I think he recently described his efforts as 'Batman on Ice'). Batman Returns in particular is over-the-top, completely stylised to the point that it doesn't feel like it's set on Earth. But the styling is done so well it's enjoyable if throwaway fare.

Nolan's attempts are obviously quite different. I think with Begins he really wanted to do something that was more 'realistic', gritty, that felt like it could take place in our world and in an American city. I think this makes the film more interesting than Spiderman/Hulk etc - but it also causes a rupture when the character eventually starts wondering around dressed like a bat. You don't feel that same dissonance in the Burton films because he depicts the kind of world where you thoroughly expect a woman to die and be reincarnated as a feline street-fighter. I admire what Nolan tries to do with the concept - he does make it very different to other super-hero films, but that disjuncture keeps cropping back up. It tries to be more intelligent, political even (noble families saving cities etc), but these interesting elements in the first movie are still simplistically portrayed and not explored critically enough to be truly engaging. The result is a film, that for all its merits seems to fall between two stools.

TDK is similar, but it makes even more of an effort to be politically engaging with its narrative of extra-legal action being required to protect society - those saying the films is politically right-leaning and paternalistic are definitely correct, and I suspect many of us seeing it will also think its politics are a bit naive. But altogether i feel as those concepts are elaborated upon more than in the film's precursor, it does add more to the quality of the movie as a whole. I think there are some added problems too; once again if you are going to make it gritty and realistic, don't have a character with half his face torn off (that bit could have been done more subtly). Also in truth the tale of the good man turned evil is rather rushed and unconvincing. Once again, though the film is enjoyable, the criticisms of it fall back on this dissonance between the popular and the profound.

Ultimately as summer blockbusters go I think both BB and TDK are superior fare; entertaining, stylish, engaging and more ambitious than your average superhero/comic book movie. But they arent without their flaws and inconsistencies either. Film-makers like Nolan that aim to be politically or socially engaging with blockbuster films should pretty much expect their ideas an concepts to be discussed and debated; in itself that discussion might be seen as a success of the film itself. Finally I'd say Im really looking forward to the Dark Knight Rises, because of these added elements and because unlike with something like the Amazing Spiderman (which incidentally is an awful film title), I can't at all predict what is going to unfold and how the tale will end. And unlike its arachnid cousin its likely to provoke at least a little bit of discussion after the credits have rolled.

< Message edited by Giant Green Rabbit -- 18/7/2012 4:57:18 PM >


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Post #: 186
RE: Chicken Wing - 18/7/2012 3:32:14 PM   
burtbondy


Posts: 167
Joined: 16/11/2007

quote:

ORIGINAL: superdan


quote:

ORIGINAL: burtbondy

Don't let my typo lure you into thinking you're witty. It happens. I didn't calim to see the movie.


So you just decided to launch an ad hominem attack on people who enjoyed the other two movies? While simultaneously shielding yourself by saying "Dont get angry with me now, unless you're telling me i cant have my own views on this subject"?

Yes.

(in reply to superdan)
Post #: 187
RE: Chicken Wing - 18/7/2012 3:35:54 PM   
burtbondy


Posts: 167
Joined: 16/11/2007

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rgirvan44

quote:

ORIGINAL: MonsterCat

I don't get the chicken wing thing.


I don't get any of it beyond LOOK AT ME. LOOK AT ME.

You post your endless Batman opinions to be ignored do you? If you don't underatend my post maybe you shouln't retort till you do.

(in reply to Rgirvan44)
Post #: 188
RE: Chicken Wing - 18/7/2012 3:54:23 PM   
Spaldron


Posts: 10485
Joined: 6/10/2006
From: Chair
Ah the crazy is beginning to happen already. Cant wait till Friday.

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And Hell followed with him.

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Post #: 189
RE: Chicken Wing - 18/7/2012 4:08:31 PM   
Rgirvan44


Posts: 19049
Joined: 10/3/2006
From: Punishment Park
quote:

ORIGINAL: burtbondy


quote:

ORIGINAL: Rgirvan44

quote:

ORIGINAL: MonsterCat

I don't get the chicken wing thing.


I don't get any of it beyond LOOK AT ME. LOOK AT ME.

You post your endless Batman opinions to be ignored do you? If you don't underatend my post maybe you shouln't retort till you do.


Is this the best you've got to offer? Come on - put at least a little bit of effort into it.

_____________________________

It is a far, far better thing that I do, than I have ever done; it is a far, far better rest that I go to, than I have ever known.


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Post #: 190
RE: Chicken Wing - 18/7/2012 7:36:11 PM   
Keyser Sozzled


Posts: 5999
Joined: 1/10/2006
From: Dublin
Mental thread is mental.

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Post #: 191
RE: Chicken Wing WTF? - 18/7/2012 7:55:44 PM   
Spaldron


Posts: 10485
Joined: 6/10/2006
From: Chair
As an indication of how blockbusters compare, this thread has already surpassed Spiderman by two pages, AND THE FILM ISN'T EVEN OUT YET!

_____________________________

And I heard a voice in the midst of the four beasts
And I looked and behold, a pale horse
And his name that sat on him was Death
And Hell followed with him.

(in reply to Keyser Sozzled)
Post #: 192
RE: Chicken Wing WTF? - 18/7/2012 8:24:20 PM   
UTB


Posts: 9932
Joined: 30/9/2005

quote:

ORIGINAL: Spaldron

As an indication of how blockbusters compare, this thread has already surpassed Spiderman by two pages, AND THE FILM ISN'T EVEN OUT YET!


If you remove the "this thread is going to go MENTAL" posts its probably about 3 pages.

(in reply to Spaldron)
Post #: 193
RE: Chicken Wing - 18/7/2012 9:28:29 PM   
fiercehairdo

 

Posts: 95
Joined: 6/10/2005
quote:

ORIGINAL: porntrooper


quote:

ORIGINAL: burtbondy

1% self consumed Nolan lovers.

Do fans often ingnore the inconsistencies , contradictions and laughable plotholes in Nolan's Batman's, this can olso be argued for Inception,(to a higher degree) or are the just to complicated for fanatics to comprehend. Since ive seen comparisons to the Godfather on this thread, im leaning more to the latter. Its gotten out of hand. Is the Avengers up there with 12 Angry Men now?

fiercehairdo hit made some great points and there are many people who feel the same and could level out the reviews from good to average but are beyond arguing with fanatics who shout, sctatch, spit at anybody who is not within the limits of Nolan worship.

The heavy-handed morality , holier than thou attitude and sense of pop freudianism lays waste to my gut. Dont get angry with me now, unless you're telling me i cant have my own views on this subject.

Enjoy the movie prople. I'm out.




Why do you assume everyone that praises a Nolan film is some kind of Nolan fanboy unable to criticise his films? This kind of shit is far more annoying than any misguided, blind love for a film or film maker. Here you are suggesting people will tell you off for having your view and opinion on a particular film, film series or film director, yet at the same time anyone with a view opposing yours is a deluded fanboy who's opinion is biased and born of stupidity.

Review threads really are the home of staggering levels of forum fuckwittery.



I just want to post this story about the levels some Nolan fans will go to to defend their hero. They had to close the Rotten Tomatoes Forum because of all the abusive posts aimed at negative critics of TDKR. Full story here: http://www.guardian.co.uk/film/2012/jul/18/rotten-tomatoes-dark-knight-rises

Now I am NOT dismissing everyone who loves Nolan films as blindly adoring fans. Not at all, and for the record I love Memento and like a number of his other films (I just think TDK and Inception have serious flaws). BUT I am saying that SOME Nolan fans really do refuse to engage in any discussion or questioning of their god head hero.

I got told off on here yesterday for using the phrase "fawning Nolan fanboys". Well the people attacking the negative critics on RT are the fanboys to which I was referring.


< Message edited by fiercehairdo -- 19/7/2012 9:10:19 AM >

(in reply to porntrooper)
Post #: 194
RE: Chicken Wing - 18/7/2012 9:37:10 PM   
Olaf


Posts: 23709
Joined: 26/2/2007
From: 41°N 93°W
"In one of the diplomatic cables released by WikiLeaks Putin and Medvedev are compared to Batman and Robin. It’s a useful analogy: isn’t Julian Assange, WikiLeaks’s organiser, a real-life counterpart to the Joker in Christopher Nolan’s The Dark Knight? In the film, the district attorney, Harvey Dent, an obsessive vigilante who is corrupted and himself commits murders, is killed by Batman. Batman and his friend police commissioner Gordon realise that the city’s morale would suffer if Dent’s murders were made public, so plot to preserve his image by holding Batman responsible for the killings. The film’s take-home message is that lying is necessary to sustain public morale: only a lie can redeem us. No wonder the only figure of truth in the film is the Joker, its supreme villain. He makes it clear that his attacks on Gotham City will stop when Batman takes off his mask and reveals his true identity; to prevent this disclosure and protect Batman, Dent tells the press that he is Batman – another lie. In order to entrap the Joker, Gordon fakes his own death – yet another lie.

The Joker wants to disclose the truth beneath the mask, convinced that this will destroy the social order. What shall we call him? A terrorist? The Dark Knight is effectively a new version of those classic westerns Fort Apache and The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance, which show that, in order to civilise the Wild West, the lie has to be elevated into truth: civilisation, in other words, must be grounded on a lie. The film has been extraordinarily popular. The question is why, at this precise moment, is there this renewed need for a lie to maintain the social system?"

- Slavoj Žižek

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Post #: 195
RE: Chicken Wing - 18/7/2012 9:43:25 PM   
fiercehairdo

 

Posts: 95
Joined: 6/10/2005

quote:

ORIGINAL: Olaf

"In one of the diplomatic cables released by WikiLeaks Putin and Medvedev are compared to Batman and Robin. It’s a useful analogy: isn’t Julian Assange, WikiLeaks’s organiser, a real-life counterpart to the Joker in Christopher Nolan’s The Dark Knight? In the film, the district attorney, Harvey Dent, an obsessive vigilante who is corrupted and himself commits murders, is killed by Batman. Batman and his friend police commissioner Gordon realise that the city’s morale would suffer if Dent’s murders were made public, so plot to preserve his image by holding Batman responsible for the killings. The film’s take-home message is that lying is necessary to sustain public morale: only a lie can redeem us. No wonder the only figure of truth in the film is the Joker, its supreme villain. He makes it clear that his attacks on Gotham City will stop when Batman takes off his mask and reveals his true identity; to prevent this disclosure and protect Batman, Dent tells the press that he is Batman – another lie. In order to entrap the Joker, Gordon fakes his own death – yet another lie.

The Joker wants to disclose the truth beneath the mask, convinced that this will destroy the social order. What shall we call him? A terrorist? The Dark Knight is effectively a new version of those classic westerns Fort Apache and The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance, which show that, in order to civilise the Wild West, the lie has to be elevated into truth: civilisation, in other words, must be grounded on a lie. The film has been extraordinarily popular. The question is why, at this precise moment, is there this renewed need for a lie to maintain the social system?"

- Slavoj Žižek


Fascinating! Do you have a link of reference to this?

(in reply to Olaf)
Post #: 196
RE: Chicken Wing - 18/7/2012 9:48:22 PM   
talpacino


Posts: 3685
Joined: 15/11/2005
From: The Royal County

quote:

ORIGINAL: Olaf

"In one of the diplomatic cables released by WikiLeaks Putin and Medvedev are compared to Batman and Robin. It’s a useful analogy: isn’t Julian Assange, WikiLeaks’s organiser, a real-life counterpart to the Joker in Christopher Nolan’s The Dark Knight? In the film, the district attorney, Harvey Dent, an obsessive vigilante who is corrupted and himself commits murders, is killed by Batman. Batman and his friend police commissioner Gordon realise that the city’s morale would suffer if Dent’s murders were made public, so plot to preserve his image by holding Batman responsible for the killings. The film’s take-home message is that lying is necessary to sustain public morale: only a lie can redeem us. No wonder the only figure of truth in the film is the Joker, its supreme villain. He makes it clear that his attacks on Gotham City will stop when Batman takes off his mask and reveals his true identity; to prevent this disclosure and protect Batman, Dent tells the press that he is Batman – another lie. In order to entrap the Joker, Gordon fakes his own death – yet another lie.

The Joker wants to disclose the truth beneath the mask, convinced that this will destroy the social order. What shall we call him? A terrorist? The Dark Knight is effectively a new version of those classic westerns Fort Apache and The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance, which show that, in order to civilise the Wild West, the lie has to be elevated into truth: civilisation, in other words, must be grounded on a lie. The film has been extraordinarily popular. The question is why, at this precise moment, is there this renewed need for a lie to maintain the social system?"

- Slavoj Žižek

Now I know there has been talk of medals being handed out for some amazing things on the forum lately but the guy who wrote that, he deserves all the medals in the world. Not as bad as the Rush Limbaugh muck though.



_____________________________

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It's a different film. It's a very different film! It's a different shark!

Suppose I shot ya..How'd that be?


(in reply to Olaf)
Post #: 197
RE: Chicken Wing - 18/7/2012 9:51:48 PM   
Olaf


Posts: 23709
Joined: 26/2/2007
From: 41°N 93°W

quote:

ORIGINAL: fiercehairdo


quote:

ORIGINAL: Olaf

"In one of the diplomatic cables released by WikiLeaks Putin and Medvedev are compared to Batman and Robin. It’s a useful analogy: isn’t Julian Assange, WikiLeaks’s organiser, a real-life counterpart to the Joker in Christopher Nolan’s The Dark Knight? In the film, the district attorney, Harvey Dent, an obsessive vigilante who is corrupted and himself commits murders, is killed by Batman. Batman and his friend police commissioner Gordon realise that the city’s morale would suffer if Dent’s murders were made public, so plot to preserve his image by holding Batman responsible for the killings. The film’s take-home message is that lying is necessary to sustain public morale: only a lie can redeem us. No wonder the only figure of truth in the film is the Joker, its supreme villain. He makes it clear that his attacks on Gotham City will stop when Batman takes off his mask and reveals his true identity; to prevent this disclosure and protect Batman, Dent tells the press that he is Batman – another lie. In order to entrap the Joker, Gordon fakes his own death – yet another lie.

The Joker wants to disclose the truth beneath the mask, convinced that this will destroy the social order. What shall we call him? A terrorist? The Dark Knight is effectively a new version of those classic westerns Fort Apache and The Man Who Shot Liberty Valance, which show that, in order to civilise the Wild West, the lie has to be elevated into truth: civilisation, in other words, must be grounded on a lie. The film has been extraordinarily popular. The question is why, at this precise moment, is there this renewed need for a lie to maintain the social system?"

- Slavoj Žižek


Fascinating! Do you have a link of reference to this?



Here you are: http://www.lrb.co.uk/v33/n02/slavoj-zizek/good-manners-in-the-age-of-wikileaks

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Post #: 198
The Dark Knight Rises - 18/7/2012 11:30:12 PM   
Lazarus munkey


Posts: 1650
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From: out of nowhere
Do you have so many mental threads that you just can'y keep track anymore?

Struggling to stay up-to-date on the interweb when your mental starts to run out between movies?

Why not consolidate all of your mental into one, easily manageable thread. Here at Chris Nolan Associates, we can take the hassle out of trolling by releasing a film every few years that's guaranteed to take care of all of your pro or con needs.
It's fast, it's easy, it's simple, it's not difficult.

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Your credibility is at risk if you do not keep up mental posts on a thread.

< Message edited by Lazarus munkey -- 19/7/2012 1:26:03 AM >


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Post #: 199
RE: Epic - 19/7/2012 1:23:55 AM   
Spaldron


Posts: 10485
Joined: 6/10/2006
From: Chair
Was tempted tonight to check the torrent sites to see if this was on it yet but alas it ain't there yet. Not that I would've anyway but I was just curious.

_____________________________

And I heard a voice in the midst of the four beasts
And I looked and behold, a pale horse
And his name that sat on him was Death
And Hell followed with him.
Post #: 200
RE: Epic - 19/7/2012 2:11:41 AM   
NinjaShortbread212


Posts: 4542
Joined: 26/4/2011
From: Edinburger, Scottyland
Liar.

_____________________________

Art

(in reply to Spaldron)
Post #: 201
RE: Epic - 19/7/2012 9:25:33 AM   
porntrooper

 

Posts: 2616
Joined: 6/9/2006
From: Sheffield
Well, I'm not going to do a full write up just yet - I'll do something more substantial over the weekend as more people see it and can discuss it - but I can safely say this is a great, great movie. Just excellent stuff. Like The Dark Knight before it, it has it's flaws and I suspect that just like The Dark Knight repeat viewings will highlight it's run time. However, I felt none of that during that first viewing, my issues were more to do with some elements of the plot, or more specifically, Bane's overall plot to bring down Gotham. People that have followed production, like myself, will know a lot of what is coming, but that really doesnt distract from how well it is actually done on screen. Performances from the main cast are all really good, with only a few bit part players really raising eyebrows with odd line readings (nothing dissimilar to what we saw in Begins or Dark Knight) and the film looks great, seriously seriously great. Having been listening to Zimmers score all week I have nothing but love for it, but again there were mumurs after the screening (not least from my missus) that some elements of the sound mix were really up, meaning some parts of dialogue were missed (again, nothing dissimilar to the first two films). As blockbuster entertainment goes, and certainly as far as comic book adaptaions go, it doesnt get much better than this. Genuinely stunning in places.

I will say this though, I've a feeling the finale will cause debate and will likely be hated by many. I loved the final shot, but there was also a measure of dissapointment that crept in immediately after - or maybe it was sadness due to its implications? - and I think some people will really cling to it as a reason for hating the whole movie. As a trilogy, this overall story arc across three films works perfectly and makes perfect sense. Some people will be convinced it is not true to its comic book origins, but it really really does work. Honestly, despite a few flaws, this is five star film making and a five star experience. Even people with no love for the story and how Nolan chose to portray Batman cannot deny how expertly it is done on screen. Seriously, the more I think about it, the more I love and the more I want to write. The more I want to discuss things in detail and how people feel about the finale. However, I'll wait until the weekend for more comments and discussion. I'll be seeing it again Friday, cant wait.

Also, if you choose to read Harry Knowles spoiler filled review, please note that he appears to be talking utter shit. I can really understand why some people are going to have problems with this movie, I really can, and some other negative reviews have nailed on some of the flaws I picked up. However, Harry Knowles' review is just fucking ridiculous and comes off like his Matric Reloaded review from years ago, where he got pissed that the movie didnt include werewolves and vampires to satisfy his own desires. Harry's doesnt seem capable of accepting this film, about Batman, can be approached in a different style to how he would like to see it. He makes some really bizzare criticisms (no Venom, no huge Bane, Bruce's character motivations - that one is the worst criticism as everything the guy does makes perfect perfect sense in this Nolan-verse) and compares the movie to True Lies, Rocky and every Stallone film ever. Seriously, this film has flaws, but none are the ones Harry is claiming and none stop it being anything less that great.

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Post #: 202
RE: RE: - 19/7/2012 10:46:00 AM   
bennyboy1971

 

Posts: 43
Joined: 4/7/2008
A well-reasoned review here:

http://www.aintitcool.com/node/57107

THE DARK KNIGHT RISES is a juggernaut of a movie, and that's not necessarily a compliment. At times it simply overpowers when subtlety would have worked just as well, if not better, and there's nothing in Christopher Nolan's way in this movie. He got the clout to make the movie he wanted to make, and so THE DARK KNIGHT RISES is probably the biggest scale movie you'll likely see this year, IMAX notwithstanding. By the way, IMAX is the only way to see this film - no ifs, ands, or buts about it. There are moments where even the IMAX screen doesn't feel big enough to hold in all the splendor, and if anyone gets an Oscar from this, it should be Wally Pfister.

But there are moments - only a few of them - where the movie shuts up for a moment and lets the quiet in, and for me those moments might be the most effective of the movie. Most of those involve Alfred (Michael Caine) whose face is so emotional and expressive that even Bruce Wayne (Christian Bale) can't look at it without almost breaking into tears himself. For me, Alfred is the heart of THE DARK KNIGHT RISES, and I wanted more of him, and of those moments.

It's Alfred who is desperately trying to get Bruce Wayne back into the world - 8 years have passed since THE DARK KNIGHT and the night Harvey Dent fell to his death, and for Bruce, he hasn't recovered, physically or mentally. He still pines for Rachel - he doesn't know about the letter that she gave Alfred before she died, choosing Dent over Bruce - and Wayne and Commisioner Jim Gordon (Gary Oldman) have allowed the lie that Dent died a hero's death at the hands of Batman to fester and grow. That lie has given way to the Dent Act, a provision in the law that made it easier for Gotham to prosecute organized crime. The lie is eating at Gordon too, and even young cop John Blake (Joseph Gordon-Levitt) can't break Gordon of this malaise.

However, Selina Kyle (Anne Hathaway) is in town to loot the rich and powerful, specifically the rebuilt Wayne Manor, and in particular, Bruce's fingerprints. But she's merely the harbinger of something far worse and deadly - Bane (Tom Hardy) is coming to Gotham, and he will finish what Ra's Al Ghul and the Joker failed to do - destroy Gotham in any way possible. His plan - a bit convoluted and too spoilery to go into here - involves a fusion reactor that Bruce sank much of Wayne Enterprises' finances into before discovering that it was too dangerous. Because of that venture, Wayne Enterprises is in financial trouble, and Bruce has to turn to Miranda Tate (Marion Cotillard), a wealthy philanthropist, for help.

So, the pieces are placed on the board, and for the first 40 or so minutes of THE DARK KNIGHT RISES Christopher Nolan has set the house of cards quite elegantly before taking a sledgehammer to the table. Bruce Wayne must be brought to his lowest point before he can truly save Gotham, to a place where even Lucius Fox's (Morgan Freeman) gadgets can't help him. Bane is a force of nature the likes of which Batman has never experienced - while the Joker was pure chaos, Bane has a plan in mind to break Batman in every way possible.

For those keeping score, or needing an easy reference point, THE DARK KNIGHT RISES simply isn't as good as THE DARK KNIGHT, and a lot of that may be due to expectations that the audience may have. When Nolan made BATMAN BEGINS, he brought some real-world semblance into a very comic-booky origin story, possibly to make fans of the character happy as well as other, less-steeped in Batman lore audience members. THE DARK KNIGHT, in comparison, is mostly real-world, inspired by Michael Mann's HEAT and even crime films like THE GODFATHER. The Joker may be an over-the-top villain, but in the way he was written, as well as performed by Heath Ledger, the character became very believable. THE DARK KNIGHT also had its politics to play with - the War on Terror is very prevalent in that film, some places fairly obvious and some not so obvious - and it really felt like the movie was a commentary on America at the time.

THE DARK KNIGHT RISES, though, gives the audience a bit of a tonal whiplash. This third film is very much a comic book movie, much more reminiscent of the first film than the second. Some of the plot contrivances represent nothing close to reality, and any political statements that the movie might want to make are lost in the scale and the bluster of it all. You can sense at moments that the movie might be wanting to comment on the whole Occupy movement, and even the Tea Party movement, but THE DARK KNIGHT RISES isn't sophisticated enough to follow through with those ideas, and really, it shouldn't have even bothered, because the movie works best when it dispenses with the serious, weighty self-importance.

This movie, more so than the other two, is about Bruce Wayne's struggle, and Bale has never been better as Bruce Wayne/Batman. Even the gravelly voice of Batman feels subdued, beaten. Wayne is a ghost of a man, barely in his own skin, wanting nothing more than to fall away from the world, and Bale plays him with a hesitancy and a subtlety that's been missing from the first two movies. But that may be due to the arc of the character - this isn't the cocksure Batman of the first two films. Gotham may have won something when Harvey Dent died, but Bruce has lost everything, and Bale finds that pain in the character and makes it palpable.

Anne Hathaway also does good work as Selina Kyle - she adds a good bit of physicality to the role and plays Kyle as a conflicted jewel thief who is intrigued by Bruce Wayne even as she tries to rob him blind. She also knows how to handle herself in a fight, and even when her conscience eats at her she is still a very self-reliant character. She's never mentioned as Catwoman, by the way, but the movie doesn't have to; her presence does that all by itself.

Tom Hardy's Bane isn't nearly as charismatic as Heath Ledger's Joker, of course, but Hardy has the harder part in a lot of ways here. His face is mostly covered by a mask, and his voice guttural even through the rich British accent, Hardy has to put most of his performance in his eyes and his physical presence. He dominates the screen when he's on, and you can believe that this is the man who could easily defeat Batman in hand-to-hand combat. We've seen Bruce at his most frail, and with Bane Hardy has made a villain that could easily crush anyone who stands in his way.

My favorite performance, though, lies with Joseph Gordon-Levitt, the optimist of the piece and the ray of hope that shines through an otherwise pretty bleak movie. His John Blake is a cop who wants to do the right thing, who looks at Wayne and sees a fellow orphan, and even serves as a kind of inspiration to Jim Gordon and Batman. It's during the heavy midsection, when Batman is at the lowest he can sink, that Gordon-Levitt ups his game and becomes the hero that the audience needs. There's a vitality to his role that makes us pay attention when he's onscreen; even when his story gets clunky he charms us through the rougher parts of the plot.

And does this plot get rough. Those complaining of the various plot issues of THE DARK KNIGHT might want to pop their knuckles and go to work - from a daylight chase scene that inexplicably turns into night, to the convoluted plot and some of the twists that defy logic, Christopher Nolan blasts through these story issues with a confidence that either audiences won't notice, or they'll be enjoying the movie's bombast too much to care. It reminded me, actually, of Nolan's THE PRESTIGE - when the third act revelations come in for that movie, you're either on board or you aren't, especially with some of the odder plot turns. Like BEGINS and DARK KNIGHT before it, there is very little grace in the story, but it's Nolan's skill as a director that plows through and smoothes out the edges. In retrospect, people will unravel this movie like a cheap sweater, but while you're on the ride, you're just having too much fun to notice. The last hour, especially, is Nolan unleashed and it's worth seeing a great director, with his wonderful toys, fully at play.

As the final entry in a very successful trilogy, THE DARK KNIGHT RISES is a fitting end. It's big in scale - bigger than the first two by far, and I was surprised where this movie was willing to go in some sequences. THE DARK KNIGHT feels almost intimate by comparison. And still, one can't help but feel that Christopher Nolan should have simply embraced the comic book nature of the material and not planted one foot in reality and one foot in fantasy. That more than anything else gives the movie a confusing tone - when the movie cuts loose and doesn't even attempt to stay close to reality the movie really takes off; although THE DARK KNIGHT's reality-inspired storyline works better for that film, this movie seems more aware of its pulp-comic roots. But it's almost as if Nolan is embarrassed that he's making a comic book movie here, and that's unfortunate. THE DARK KNIGHT RISES is a good movie, and at times almost touches greatness. It's a hard job to approach this material without being silly, and while THE DARK KNIGHT RISES skirts it from time to time, it feels like the movie takes itself too seriously, almost as if Nolan's afraid of going there. It's in the quieter character moments, and when the movie lets go and embraces its nature, that the movie really soars.

Nordling, out. Follow me on Twitter!




(in reply to matty_b)
Post #: 203
RE: The Dark Knight Rises - 19/7/2012 10:57:47 AM   
BelfastBoy

 

Posts: 587
Joined: 30/11/2005
I can't be bothered to trawl through pages of ranting from those who haven't seen the film, but here's a question for those who have - is it possible to say whether or not Liam Neeson, Cillian Murphy, Ken Watanabe etc appear or not? If the answer involves spoilers, then obviously don't post them!

(in reply to Empire Admin)
Post #: 204
RE: The Dark Knight Rises - 19/7/2012 11:18:26 AM   
Rgirvan44


Posts: 19049
Joined: 10/3/2006
From: Punishment Park
quote:

ORIGINAL: BelfastBoy

I can't be bothered to trawl through pages of ranting from those who haven't seen the film, but here's a question for those who have - is it possible to say whether or not Liam Neeson, Cillian Murphy, Ken Watanabe etc appear or not? If the answer involves spoilers, then obviously don't post them!


How wouldn't these answers involve spoilers? The very fact they would be answered are spoilers.

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Post #: 205
RE: The Dark Knight Rises - 19/7/2012 11:42:03 AM   
Rob


Posts: 2473
Joined: 30/9/2005

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rgirvan44

quote:

ORIGINAL: BelfastBoy

I can't be bothered to trawl through pages of ranting from those who haven't seen the film, but here's a question for those who have - is it possible to say whether or not Liam Neeson, Cillian Murphy, Ken Watanabe etc appear or not? If the answer involves spoilers, then obviously don't post them!


How wouldn't these answers involve spoilers? The very fact they would be answered are spoilers.


Agreed. Please can no one answer that in here.

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(in reply to Rgirvan44)
Post #: 206
RE: The Dark Knight Rises - 19/7/2012 11:47:43 AM   
porntrooper

 

Posts: 2616
Joined: 6/9/2006
From: Sheffield
Yea, an answer to those questions are spoilers if the answer is a yes or no....

It does raise the question though, when will discussion of the film in the thread be allowed to include spoilers (tagged obviously)?? Cos I know I am chomping at the bit to discuss this flick with people!

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Post #: 207
RE: The Dark Knight Rises - 19/7/2012 11:53:25 AM   
Whistler


Posts: 3133
Joined: 22/11/2006

quote:

ORIGINAL: porntrooper

Yea, an answer to those questions are spoilers if the answer is a yes or no....

It does raise the question though, when will discussion of the film in the thread be allowed to include spoilers (tagged obviously)?? Cos I know I am chomping at the bit to discuss this flick with people!


Open up a thread in favourite films, spoilers can go in there. If anyone complains it's their own fault for being in a favourite film thread without having seen the film.

(in reply to porntrooper)
Post #: 208
RE: The Dark Knight Rises - 19/7/2012 2:25:35 PM   
adambatman82

 

Posts: 11156
Joined: 15/12/2005

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rgirvan44

quote:

ORIGINAL: BelfastBoy

I can't be bothered to trawl through pages of ranting from those who haven't seen the film, but here's a question for those who have - is it possible to say whether or not Liam Neeson, Cillian Murphy, Ken Watanabe etc appear or not? If the answer involves spoilers, then obviously don't post them!


How wouldn't these answers involve spoilers? The very fact they would be answered are spoilers.


I'm baffled as to why anyone would want to know any of that before seeing the film.

Saw it last night, loved it very much. The perfect finale to a series I've really enjoyed. Working on a full review at the moment.

(in reply to Rgirvan44)
Post #: 209
RE: More Right Wing Bat Politics - 19/7/2012 2:43:44 PM   
drews


Posts: 271
Joined: 5/10/2005
From: Wimbledon Centre Court
Just took delivery of my Batman Begins/ The Dark Knight blu-rays. That should get me in the mood for some TDKR.

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