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RE: Katie Holmes comes to her senses... - 3/7/2012 2:06:27 PM   
Woger


Posts: 3814
Joined: 30/9/2005
Bowfinger doen a good piss take of the celebrity cults.


Then there's the movementarians



I used to have some respect for Cruise for the way he would interact with fans but I remember talking to someone who more or less said that inorder for someone to take scientology seriously they need to be seriously, seriously f***ed in the head, since then my views have really changed and I think he is little more than a feeble minded moron.

< Message edited by Woger -- 3/7/2012 2:07:42 PM >


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Post #: 121
RE: Katie Holmes comes to her senses... - 3/7/2012 2:09:08 PM   
st3veebee


Posts: 2352
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quote:

ORIGINAL: great_badir

quote:

ORIGINAL: NinjaShortbread212
quote:

ORIGINAL: donethinking

I just hope she gets sole custody and cruise is left thinking where it all went wrong....3 divorces Tom, scientology really seems to be working for ya!



Word.


You could easily argue it the other way, though...

But yeah - I hope she does get sole custody too, otherwise that kid's gonna be turned into a mentalist. Katie Holmes seems like too level headed a person for her to lose out on this.




But...but...she married Tom Cruise in the first place. She can hardly be that sane. I also disagree with automatically siding with her regarding the custody, has there every been proof that Tom was a bad father?

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Post #: 122
RE: Katie Holmes comes to her senses... - 3/7/2012 2:14:32 PM   
NinjaShortbread212


Posts: 4536
Joined: 26/4/2011
From: Edinburger, Scottyland
quote:

ORIGINAL: Woger

Then there's the movementarians








quote:

ORIGINAL: st3veebee

quote:

ORIGINAL: great_badir

quote:

ORIGINAL: NinjaShortbread212

quote:

ORIGINAL: donethinking

I just hope she gets sole custody and cruise is left thinking where it all went wrong....3 divorces Tom, scientology really seems to be working for ya!



Word.



You could easily argue it the other way, though...

But yeah - I hope she does get sole custody too, otherwise that kid's gonna be turned into a mentalist. Katie Holmes seems like too level headed a person for her to lose out on this.





But...but...she married Tom Cruise in the first place. She can hardly be that sane. I also disagree with automatically siding with her regarding the custody, has there every been proof that Tom was a bad father?



Good point and I think that Tom very much dotes on his daughter, just you'd kind of hope and pray that she would get to avoid the Scientologist's upbringing.

Interesting Fact: If you hurt yourself (say, if you cut your finger or something), you're not allowed to express pain, you have to remain silent and have silence around you. So that you don't associate that noise with pain in the future.


< Message edited by NinjaShortbread212 -- 3/7/2012 2:15:31 PM >


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Post #: 123
RE: Katie Holmes comes to her senses... - 3/7/2012 2:17:52 PM   
Woger


Posts: 3814
Joined: 30/9/2005
With respect to children and scientology; at least the "religion" doesm't make young boys have their turtle neck chopped off (although there has been a ruling in Germany about this recently).

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Eddie: "Weve been burgaled"
Richie: You may have been, but I have never in my life. As a christian I am so tightly clenched, oh you mean burgaled
- - -
There were originally five horsemen of the apocalypse. Jack Bauer said he would travel by foot

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Post #: 124
RE: Katie Holmes comes to her senses... - 3/7/2012 2:36:34 PM   
Chief


Posts: 7773
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Banshee

quote:

ORIGINAL: Woger

With respect to children and scientology; at least the "religion" doesm't make young boys have their turtle neck chopped off (although there has been a ruling in Germany about this recently).


That's true, circumcision is fucking barbaric.

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Post #: 125
RE: Katie Holmes comes to her senses... - 3/7/2012 2:51:32 PM   
Spaldron


Posts: 10484
Joined: 6/10/2006
From: Chair

quote:

ORIGINAL: Woger





I find it unlikely that The Simpson's would take the piss out of Scientology considering Nancy Cartwright (the voice of Bart) is a member.

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Post #: 126
RE: Katie Holmes comes to her senses... - 3/7/2012 3:55:07 PM   
Invader_Ace


Posts: 1584
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Tell that to Chef.

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Post #: 127
RE: Katie Holmes comes to her senses... - 3/7/2012 4:31:00 PM   
sanchia


Posts: 18138
Joined: 3/1/2006
From: Norwich
quote:

ORIGINAL: st3veebee

quote:

ORIGINAL: great_badir

quote:

ORIGINAL: NinjaShortbread212
quote:

ORIGINAL: donethinking

I just hope she gets sole custody and cruise is left thinking where it all went wrong....3 divorces Tom, scientology really seems to be working for ya!



Word.


You could easily argue it the other way, though...

But yeah - I hope she does get sole custody too, otherwise that kid's gonna be turned into a mentalist. Katie Holmes seems like too level headed a person for her to lose out on this.




But...but...she married Tom Cruise in the first place. She can hardly be that sane. I also disagree with automatically siding with her regarding the custody, has there every been proof that Tom was a bad father?


If he was about to enroll her in the Sea Org (something many are saying he was planning as 7 is the age where that part can start) which is essentially the brainwashed heart of Scientology (mixed in with slave labour of 18 hour work days for $18 a day and living in basic dorms and having to work even after a twelve hour "training" regime) and if even a fifth of the claims of those who managed to get away are true then he would indeed be an awful father.

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Post #: 128
RE: Katie Holmes comes to her senses... - 3/7/2012 6:27:36 PM   
jcthefirst


Posts: 4421
Joined: 6/10/2005
From: Bangor

quote:

ORIGINAL: Spaldron


quote:

ORIGINAL: Woger





I find it unlikely that The Simpson's would take the piss out of Scientology considering Nancy Cartwright (the voice of Bart) is a member.


You can see the picture, right?

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Post #: 129
RE: Katie Holmes comes to her senses... - 3/7/2012 6:38:40 PM   
Woger


Posts: 3814
Joined: 30/9/2005

quote:

ORIGINAL: Spaldron


quote:

ORIGINAL: Woger





I find it unlikely that The Simpson's would take the piss out of Scientology considering Nancy Cartwright (the voice of Bart) is a member.


She could have lost the plot after the episode.

_____________________________

Eddie: "Weve been burgaled"
Richie: You may have been, but I have never in my life. As a christian I am so tightly clenched, oh you mean burgaled
- - -
There were originally five horsemen of the apocalypse. Jack Bauer said he would travel by foot

(in reply to Spaldron)
Post #: 130
RE: Katie Holmes comes to her senses... - 3/7/2012 7:02:24 PM   
horribleives

 

Posts: 5055
Joined: 12/6/2009
From: The North
quote:

ORIGINAL: NinjaShortbread212

Good point and I think that Tom very much dotes on his daughter, just you'd kind of hope and pray that she would get to avoid the Scientologist's upbringing.



If not I just hope and pray she isn't autistic.

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Post #: 131
RE: Katie Holmes comes to her senses... - 3/7/2012 7:04:20 PM   
horribleives

 

Posts: 5055
Joined: 12/6/2009
From: The North

quote:

ORIGINAL: Woger


quote:

ORIGINAL: Spaldron


quote:

ORIGINAL: Woger





I find it unlikely that The Simpson's would take the piss out of Scientology considering Nancy Cartwright (the voice of Bart) is a member.


She could have lost the plot after the episode.


Perhaps she just has a sense of humour where Isaac Hayes had none?


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Post #: 132
RE: Katie Holmes comes to her senses... - 3/7/2012 8:12:24 PM   
Funkyrae


Posts: 20363
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Just stick a pin in a map

quote:

ORIGINAL: NinjaShortbread212

Good point and I think that Tom very much dotes on his daughter, just you'd kind of hope and pray that she would get to avoid the Scientologist's upbringing.



But being automatically enrolled in a Catholic pre-school and having her mother's religion being the major part of her upbringing is ok?




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Post #: 133
RE: Katie Holmes comes to her senses... - 3/7/2012 8:14:55 PM   
horribleives

 

Posts: 5055
Joined: 12/6/2009
From: The North

quote:

ORIGINAL: Funkyrae


quote:

ORIGINAL: NinjaShortbread212

Good point and I think that Tom very much dotes on his daughter, just you'd kind of hope and pray that she would get to avoid the Scientologist's upbringing.



But being automatically enrolled in a Catholic pre-school and having her mother's religion being the major part of her upbringing is ok?





Dunno, but it's more okay than treating six year olds like miniature adults and making them work 12 hour shifts on an ocean liner.

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Post #: 134
RE: Katie Holmes comes to her senses... - 3/7/2012 8:16:18 PM   
horribleives

 

Posts: 5055
Joined: 12/6/2009
From: The North
quote:

ORIGINAL: Spaldron


quote:

ORIGINAL: horribleives


quote:

ORIGINAL: Woger


quote:

ORIGINAL: Spaldron


quote:

ORIGINAL: Woger





I find it unlikely that The Simpson's would take the piss out of Scientology considering Nancy Cartwright (the voice of Bart) is a member.


She could have lost the plot after the episode.


Perhaps she just has a sense of humour where Isaac Hayes had none?



I'm sure I read somewhere they had to drop a Scientology based storyline/gag when Cartwright threatened to quit and that's how everyone found out.



Yeah, I think I read something similar. But surely in over 20 years there must've been the odd gag about it?

< Message edited by horribleives -- 3/7/2012 8:36:03 PM >
Post #: 135
RE: Katie Holmes comes to her senses... - 3/7/2012 8:17:02 PM   
Ghidorah

 

Posts: 2905
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quote:

ORIGINAL: great_badir

quote:

ORIGINAL: jcthefirst
Half the people? I thought it was just Lee and Ethan Suplee. I know they're the two main characters, but the show was hardly forcing Scientology beliefs (Scientological?) down your throat.


Quite a few of the other side cast members (including Giovanni "Vonni" Ribisi - one of a very small number of celebs raised scientologist) and crew are scientologists, but Greg Garcia (who is NOT a scientologist) claims that it's merely a coincidence, using most of the rest of the main cast (none of whom are scientologists or, at least, have said they are) and writers as proof of that.

There are quite a few theories on the web that say the basic premise of the show is very similar to certain scientologist teachings, but the response to that is usually "but if it's just telling you to be a good person, what does it matter?!?!?" There's certainly been nothing in the show (as far as I remember) about believing in alien ghosts or any promotion of cash pyramid schemes with religion as a front, but you could also argue that the whole thetan levels thing bears remarkable similarities to the spiritual well being (or otherwise) of the characters in the show.

It probably IS just coincidence - you can read anything into anything if you try hard enough.



Strange because Tom Cruise want the divorce proceedings to happen in an LA court instead of New York. It does appear Scientology has a greater influence in that area than people would like to admit.

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Post #: 136
RE: Katie Holmes comes to her senses... - 3/7/2012 9:04:43 PM   
Funkyrae


Posts: 20363
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Just stick a pin in a map

quote:

ORIGINAL: horribleives


quote:

ORIGINAL: Funkyrae


quote:

ORIGINAL: NinjaShortbread212

Good point and I think that Tom very much dotes on his daughter, just you'd kind of hope and pray that she would get to avoid the Scientologist's upbringing.



But being automatically enrolled in a Catholic pre-school and having her mother's religion being the major part of her upbringing is ok?





Dunno, but it's more okay than treating six year olds like miniature adults and making them work 12 hour shifts on an ocean liner.


Perhaps, but giving them a sense of guilt that it's almost impossible to get over (ask any Catholic girl) as well as indoctrinating them into believing that they can't be anything more than a wife or a mother doesn't exactly seem to be the best idea either.


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Post #: 137
RE: Katie Holmes comes to her senses... - 3/7/2012 9:12:18 PM   
Shifty Bench

 

Posts: 15398
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Land of the Scots

quote:

ORIGINAL: Funkyrae


quote:

ORIGINAL: horribleives


quote:

ORIGINAL: Funkyrae


quote:

ORIGINAL: NinjaShortbread212

Good point and I think that Tom very much dotes on his daughter, just you'd kind of hope and pray that she would get to avoid the Scientologist's upbringing.



But being automatically enrolled in a Catholic pre-school and having her mother's religion being the major part of her upbringing is ok?





Dunno, but it's more okay than treating six year olds like miniature adults and making them work 12 hour shifts on an ocean liner.


Perhaps, but giving them a sense of guilt that it's almost impossible to get over (ask any Catholic girl) as well as indoctrinating them into believing that they can't be anything more than a wife or a mother doesn't exactly seem to be the best idea either.



Or, she'll become an actress. The poor kid doesn't stand a chance in either situation.


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Post #: 138
RE: Katie Holmes comes to her senses... - 3/7/2012 9:15:19 PM   
horribleives

 

Posts: 5055
Joined: 12/6/2009
From: The North

quote:

ORIGINAL: Funkyrae


quote:

ORIGINAL: horribleives


quote:

ORIGINAL: Funkyrae


quote:

ORIGINAL: NinjaShortbread212

Good point and I think that Tom very much dotes on his daughter, just you'd kind of hope and pray that she would get to avoid the Scientologist's upbringing.



But being automatically enrolled in a Catholic pre-school and having her mother's religion being the major part of her upbringing is ok?





Dunno, but it's more okay than treating six year olds like miniature adults and making them work 12 hour shifts on an ocean liner.


Perhaps, but giving them a sense of guilt that it's almost impossible to get over (ask any Catholic girl) as well as indoctrinating them into believing that they can't be anything more than a wife or a mother doesn't exactly seem to be the best idea either.



True, I'm no fan of catholicism but I'm sure I'm not the only person who knows plenty of people who were brought up catholic and didn't turn out that way. Whether the shackles of being told from a young age you're not a human being but the soul of a dead alien are easier or harder to cast off is open to debate.


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Post #: 139
RE: Katie Holmes comes to her senses... - 3/7/2012 9:16:20 PM   
horribleives

 

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Mind, I know the odd catholic who grew up to batshit insane too so what do I know.

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Post #: 140
RE: Katie Holmes comes to her senses... - 3/7/2012 9:56:58 PM   
Rinc


Posts: 12813
Joined: 2/10/2005
From: A park bench, with a newspaper quilt

quote:

ORIGINAL: horribleives


quote:

ORIGINAL: Funkyrae


quote:

ORIGINAL: horribleives


quote:

ORIGINAL: Funkyrae


quote:

ORIGINAL: NinjaShortbread212

Good point and I think that Tom very much dotes on his daughter, just you'd kind of hope and pray that she would get to avoid the Scientologist's upbringing.



But being automatically enrolled in a Catholic pre-school and having her mother's religion being the major part of her upbringing is ok?





Dunno, but it's more okay than treating six year olds like miniature adults and making them work 12 hour shifts on an ocean liner.


Perhaps, but giving them a sense of guilt that it's almost impossible to get over (ask any Catholic girl) as well as indoctrinating them into believing that they can't be anything more than a wife or a mother doesn't exactly seem to be the best idea either.



True, I'm no fan of catholicism but I'm sure I'm not the only person who knows plenty of people who were brought up catholic and didn't turn out that way. Whether the shackles of being told from a young age you're not a human being but the soul of a dead alien are easier or harder to cast off is open to debate.



My mum, sisters and aunties didn't turn out that way either. Don't know if they feel any guilt but they were never indoctrinated to believe they should just be a wife or mother.

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Post #: 141
RE: Katie Holmes comes to her senses... - 3/7/2012 10:12:13 PM   
great_badir


Posts: 4662
Joined: 6/10/2005
From: A breaking rope bridge in the middle of the jungle
quote:

ORIGINAL: Ghidorah
It does appear Scientology has a greater influence in that area than people would like to admit.


I don't think anyone is under the illusion that scientology doesn't have a major influence on Hollywood - after all, most of the highest power scientologists (who aren't leaders of the church) are involved in showbiz in one form or another.


With regards catholicism (you'll notice I'm giving all of them lower case first letters - on purpose), I don't think anyone should be indoctrinated into anything and should be allowed to make their own choice when they are old enough (a little piece of me dies every time I hear a right-on veggie or vegan who has bought their child up on the same restrictive diets, without giving them a chance to form their own opinion). However, there is still a major difference between scientology and most other religions - with scientology, if you leave it you are ex-communicated from your life and your family, as has been said many times. If you then criticise, there's a good chance you'll be ostracised by everyone. In most cases with most other religions, if you leave those religions the worst that can happen is your mum and your priest will be a bit naused off with you for a little bit. Granted, there is the odd exception, but they are just that - exceptions. With scientology, it is not only common practice, but almost "religious" law.


< Message edited by great_badir -- 3/7/2012 10:13:13 PM >


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Post #: 142
RE: Katie Holmes comes to her senses... - 4/7/2012 12:10:37 AM   
Spaldron


Posts: 10484
Joined: 6/10/2006
From: Chair
I think Funlyrae is being a tad presumptuous about da Catholics no?

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Post #: 143
RE: Katie Holmes comes to her senses... - 4/7/2012 12:26:41 AM   
elab49


Posts: 54577
Joined: 1/10/2005
quote:

ORIGINAL: Spaldron

I think Funlyrae is being a tad presumptuous about da Catholics no?


It sounds more as if Funky is speaking from what is clearly an unpleasant experience which is a bit different.


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Post #: 144
RE: Katie Holmes comes to her senses... - 4/7/2012 12:34:22 AM   
NinjaShortbread212


Posts: 4536
Joined: 26/4/2011
From: Edinburger, Scottyland
quote:

ORIGINAL: sanchia

If he was about to enroll her in the Sea Org (something many are saying he was planning as 7 is the age where that part can start) which is essentially the brainwashed heart of Scientology (mixed in with slave labour of 18 hour work days for $18 a day and living in basic dorms and having to work even after a twelve hour "training" regime) and if even a fifth of the claims of those who managed to get away are true then he would indeed be an awful father.



Don't get me started on the bloody Sea Org!

quote:

ORIGINAL: Funkyrae

quote:

ORIGINAL: NinjaShortbread212

Good point and I think that Tom very much dotes on his daughter, just you'd kind of hope and pray that she would get to avoid the Scientologist's upbringing.




But being automatically enrolled in a Catholic pre-school and having her mother's religion being the major part of her upbringing is ok?



I never said that. Plus, I had a strict Catholic upbringing and have also worked as a Staff member in Edinburgh's Scientologist Org.

Having experience in this matter and having witnessed first hand both religions, I know what I would choose for my children.


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Post #: 145
RE: Katie Holmes comes to her senses... - 4/7/2012 12:41:05 AM   
Shifty Bench

 

Posts: 15398
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Land of the Scots

quote:

ORIGINAL: elab49

quote:

ORIGINAL: Spaldron

I think Funlyrae is being a tad presumptuous about da Catholics no?


It sounds more as if Funky is speaking from what is clearly an unpleasant experience which is a bit different.



Which, from what I've read in this thread, is what Ninj is also doing


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Post #: 146
RE: Katie Holmes comes to her senses... - 4/7/2012 12:50:25 AM   
elab49


Posts: 54577
Joined: 1/10/2005
I wasn't saying otherwise - I just wouldn't characterise Funky's comments in the way Spaldron worded his post. Speaking from personal experience wouldn't be 'presumptious'. 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Deviation] LIKE AMERICA'S SWEETHEARTS TOO. IT MADE ME LAUGH A LOT AND THOUGHT IT WAS WITTY. ALSO I FEEL SLOWLY DYING INSIDE. I KEEP AGREEING WITH ELAB.


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Post #: 147
RE: Katie Holmes comes to her senses... - 4/7/2012 1:11:19 AM   
Shifty Bench

 

Posts: 15398
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Land of the Scots
I know a few Catholic girls who haven't had the same terrible experiences Funky has apparently had. Girls who are very happy with their lives and religion. I'm not defending any religion. I think it's all a bag of shite, but from what I have read, both ladies have had bad experiences, it doesn't help if anyone (including Spaldron) go on the defensive.



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Post #: 148
RE: Katie Holmes comes to her senses... - 4/7/2012 1:17:41 AM   
elab49


Posts: 54577
Joined: 1/10/2005
Hence the comment regarding Spaldron's post. It wasn't an endorsement of Funky's point of view or any form of statement on how generally it could be applied.

I could go further than you in that I don't know any women brought up Catholic who would have such an extreme view either. The only person I know with limitations placed on them (or the attempt to - she found lots of way around it ) was actually Church of Scotland!


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Deviation] LIKE AMERICA'S SWEETHEARTS TOO. IT MADE ME LAUGH A LOT AND THOUGHT IT WAS WITTY. ALSO I FEEL SLOWLY DYING INSIDE. I KEEP AGREEING WITH ELAB.


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Post #: 149
RE: Katie Holmes comes to her senses... - 4/7/2012 1:44:03 AM   
Lazarus munkey


Posts: 1650
Joined: 20/3/2006
From: out of nowhere
The methods of Scientology are insane and it baffles me how any right-thinking adult can do this to another human, especially a child.

Giving them wine and saying it's the blood of someone who's his own father and ghost who sacrificed himself to himself as an apology to himself for what we did because he predetermined we would?

That's more like it.

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