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RE: Prometheus - 31/5/2012 10:29:04 AM   
jrewing1000


Posts: 485
Joined: 23/11/2005
All this outrage about a poor review. This is what we 'pay' Empire for. Reviews.

I don't care if they don't like it. I'll still judge it for myself, it's only a guide after all. I'm a massive Ridley Scott fan and I'm fascinated with his work, whether its his best or not. It's about being invested in someone's expression, someone's art. The medium of cinema etc.

Nobody's perfect, people get these things wrong because some of the time, movies mature with age and with repeat viewings. That's art.

(in reply to Empire Admin)
Post #: 121
RE: Prometheus - 31/5/2012 10:34:44 AM   
OPEN YOUR EYES

 

Posts: 4259
Joined: 5/2/2012

quote:

ORIGINAL: jrewing1000

All this outrage about a poor review. This is what we 'pay' Empire for. Reviews.

I don't care if they don't like it. I'll still judge it for myself, it's only a guide after all. I'm a massive Ridley Scott fan and I'm fascinated with his work, whether its his best or not. It's about being invested in someone's expression, someone's art. The medium of cinema etc.

Nobody's perfect, people get these things wrong because some of the time, movies mature with age and with repeat viewings. That's art.


that is true.
And it wouldn't surprise to see this film,in time,become a cult classic.
But the hype of the film certaintly has made the viewers sit down and feel alittle more ground.

(in reply to jrewing1000)
Post #: 122
RE: Prometheus - 31/5/2012 10:39:32 AM   
jrewing1000


Posts: 485
Joined: 23/11/2005

quote:

ORIGINAL: OPEN YOUR EYES


quote:

ORIGINAL: jrewing1000

All this outrage about a poor review. This is what we 'pay' Empire for. Reviews.

I don't care if they don't like it. I'll still judge it for myself, it's only a guide after all. I'm a massive Ridley Scott fan and I'm fascinated with his work, whether its his best or not. It's about being invested in someone's expression, someone's art. The medium of cinema etc.

Nobody's perfect, people get these things wrong because some of the time, movies mature with age and with repeat viewings. That's art.


that is true.
And it wouldn't surprise to see this film,in time,become a cult classic.
But the hype of the film certaintly has made the viewers sit down and feel alittle more ground.


Yes. The hype, as usual, has been too much. I try hard to dial out of this, and avoid trailers / clips etc of films that I know I will want to see because of who's making it, who's in it, subject matter etc.

A great example that people have mentioned is Blade Runner, having fairly mediocre reviews on release, has gone on to become seen as one of the great modern classics.

Hype - you could overhype any film and it would spoil its power on release. Imagine the marketing campaign for The Godfather on the same scale. They'd hype the shit out of that movie, and at the end of the day, it's just a movie. That's why, with time, when the hype is over and all that remains is the film itself, the truth emerges.

(in reply to OPEN YOUR EYES)
Post #: 123
RE: Spoilers or what! - 31/5/2012 10:40:19 AM   
Jaybee79

 

Posts: 52
Joined: 2/11/2005

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rgirvan44

quote:

ORIGINAL: jrewing1000

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rgirvan44


quote:

ORIGINAL: jrewing1000

A disappointing review. As a rule of thumb, reviews should NEVER have to come with a spoiler warning. The point of a review is to help the public decide whether or not to see the movie. They are not for film analysis - many reviewers get this wrong, and it annoys the hell out of me.

What's the point of posting a review that will spoil the experience for the reviewer? Ok, so you put a spoiler warning on it - so then many people won't read it! Utterly baffling really.

In fact, as a long-time reader of Empire, this is quite a surprise really - I thought they respected the viewer a little more than this.


This is the review which will appear in a future magazine, long after the film has been out. Suspect that is why it isn't bothered with spoilers.


Are you telling me you never read reviews about past films you are considering watching? Jesus, I read Empire reviews of films made in the 70s that I'm considering. It's film review basics: People shouldn't have to worry about reading something in a review that will give away the story. I am constantly astonished at how many people don't care about knowing too much of a film before they see it. Eg. Sneak previews of Batman, overlong, overdrawn trailers, interviews, etc etc. It is true every time - that the less I know about a film, the more I enjoy it.


Sure, but if Pauline Kael threw some spoilers into a review for a 1970s flick, I am not going to be cursing her.

This whole OMG SPOILERS! thing is reaching peak critical mass. People being shouted at for discussing the latest Games of Thrones on twitter, reviews that want to talk about the plot and not just present a bland arguement that no one will care about, but get shouted at for doing so...

If folks are worried about knowing anything about the film, then just look at the star rating and don't click to read the longer review.

A film stands or falls not on how little or how much you know about it, but by how well it does those things. Is the ending of the 1960s Planet of the Apes weaker cause we know the "twist" going in? Is the 2000 remake stronger because you go in not knowing the ending?

I sympathise with people not wanting to be spoiled by the film, but really, you are taking matters into your own hands when you start reading indepth reviews ahead of time.


This might be true if this was the norm for empire reviews, however I can't think of a review for a cinema film (discounting historic re-releases) from them that has included so many spoilers. As mentioned before, this is born out that empire realised they had gone too far and added a spoiler warning and edited out some of the more major spoilers after releasing the review.

A movie shouldn't stand or fall depending on how much you know about it in advance. But I still would like to go in reasonably unspoiled so as I can enjoy it as a new discovery. I don't mind small spoilers which I expect to find in a review but not major plot points as were in the first version of the review released online.

I emphasise I have no issue with conclusions of the review (whether or not I agree I will wait until I see the movie myself and even if I think the film is better than the review claims I won't dismiss the review as everyone has different opinions which are perfectly valid to the reviewer).

(in reply to Rgirvan44)
Post #: 124
RE: Prometheus - 31/5/2012 10:45:08 AM   
OPEN YOUR EYES

 

Posts: 4259
Joined: 5/2/2012
quote:

ORIGINAL: jrewing1000


quote:

ORIGINAL: OPEN YOUR EYES


quote:

ORIGINAL: jrewing1000

All this outrage about a poor review. This is what we 'pay' Empire for. Reviews.

I don't care if they don't like it. I'll still judge it for myself, it's only a guide after all. I'm a massive Ridley Scott fan and I'm fascinated with his work, whether its his best or not. It's about being invested in someone's expression, someone's art. The medium of cinema etc.

Nobody's perfect, people get these things wrong because some of the time, movies mature with age and with repeat viewings. That's art.


that is true.
And it wouldn't surprise to see this film,in time,become a cult classic.
But the hype of the film certaintly has made the viewers sit down and feel alittle more ground.


Yes. The hype, as usual, has been too much. I try hard to dial out of this, and avoid trailers / clips etc of films that I know I will want to see because of who's making it, who's in it, subject matter etc.

A great example that people have mentioned is Blade Runner, having fairly mediocre reviews on release, has gone on to become seen as one of the great modern classics.

Hype - you could overhype any film and it would spoil its power on release. Imagine the marketing campaign for The Godfather on the same scale. They'd hype the shit out of that movie, and at the end of the day, it's just a movie. That's why, with time, when the hype is over and all that remains is the film itself, the truth emerges.


Depends what Blade Runner you watch,but again I agree.
I can see this film having a great impact on DVD/Blue Ray release.
I think there is going to be alot of much needed : added scenes or cuts.
But as Ridely himself has put it "the final cinema release is the director cut".

(in reply to jrewing1000)
Post #: 125
RE: Spoilers or what! - 31/5/2012 10:46:07 AM   
jrewing1000


Posts: 485
Joined: 23/11/2005

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jaybee79


quote:

ORIGINAL: Rgirvan44

quote:

ORIGINAL: jrewing1000

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rgirvan44


quote:

ORIGINAL: jrewing1000

A disappointing review. As a rule of thumb, reviews should NEVER have to come with a spoiler warning. The point of a review is to help the public decide whether or not to see the movie. They are not for film analysis - many reviewers get this wrong, and it annoys the hell out of me.

What's the point of posting a review that will spoil the experience for the reviewer? Ok, so you put a spoiler warning on it - so then many people won't read it! Utterly baffling really.

In fact, as a long-time reader of Empire, this is quite a surprise really - I thought they respected the viewer a little more than this.


This is the review which will appear in a future magazine, long after the film has been out. Suspect that is why it isn't bothered with spoilers.


Are you telling me you never read reviews about past films you are considering watching? Jesus, I read Empire reviews of films made in the 70s that I'm considering. It's film review basics: People shouldn't have to worry about reading something in a review that will give away the story. I am constantly astonished at how many people don't care about knowing too much of a film before they see it. Eg. Sneak previews of Batman, overlong, overdrawn trailers, interviews, etc etc. It is true every time - that the less I know about a film, the more I enjoy it.


Sure, but if Pauline Kael threw some spoilers into a review for a 1970s flick, I am not going to be cursing her.

This whole OMG SPOILERS! thing is reaching peak critical mass. People being shouted at for discussing the latest Games of Thrones on twitter, reviews that want to talk about the plot and not just present a bland arguement that no one will care about, but get shouted at for doing so...

If folks are worried about knowing anything about the film, then just look at the star rating and don't click to read the longer review.

A film stands or falls not on how little or how much you know about it, but by how well it does those things. Is the ending of the 1960s Planet of the Apes weaker cause we know the "twist" going in? Is the 2000 remake stronger because you go in not knowing the ending?

I sympathise with people not wanting to be spoiled by the film, but really, you are taking matters into your own hands when you start reading indepth reviews ahead of time.


This might be true if this was the norm for empire reviews, however I can't think of a review for a cinema film (discounting historic re-releases) from them that has included so many spoilers. As mentioned before, this is born out that empire realised they had gone too far and added a spoiler warning and edited out some of the more major spoilers after releasing the review.

A movie shouldn't stand or fall depending on how much you know about it in advance. But I still would like to go in reasonably unspoiled so as I can enjoy it as a new discovery. I don't mind small spoilers which I expect to find in a review but not major plot points as were in the first version of the review released online.

I emphasise I have no issue with conclusions of the review (whether or not I agree I will wait until I see the movie myself and even if I think the film is better than the review claims I won't dismiss the review as everyone has different opinions which are perfectly valid to the reviewer).



I entirely disagree with these opinions. Films are MUCH better when you know nothing or less about them. Storytelling is ALL about surprise and the reveal. This is where its power lies. To know what's coming is to be ahead of the storytellers.

I am not saying you can't enjoy a film if you know a lot about it. But to suggest it makes no difference is ridiculous (in my humble opinion!)

(in reply to Jaybee79)
Post #: 126
RE: Spoilers or what! - 31/5/2012 10:48:46 AM   
FoximusPrime

 

Posts: 330
Joined: 11/12/2005

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rgirvan44

quote:

ORIGINAL: jrewing1000

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rgirvan44


quote:

ORIGINAL: jrewing1000

A disappointing review. As a rule of thumb, reviews should NEVER have to come with a spoiler warning. The point of a review is to help the public decide whether or not to see the movie. They are not for film analysis - many reviewers get this wrong, and it annoys the hell out of me.

What's the point of posting a review that will spoil the experience for the reviewer? Ok, so you put a spoiler warning on it - so then many people won't read it! Utterly baffling really.

In fact, as a long-time reader of Empire, this is quite a surprise really - I thought they respected the viewer a little more than this.


This is the review which will appear in a future magazine, long after the film has been out. Suspect that is why it isn't bothered with spoilers.


Are you telling me you never read reviews about past films you are considering watching? Jesus, I read Empire reviews of films made in the 70s that I'm considering. It's film review basics: People shouldn't have to worry about reading something in a review that will give away the story. I am constantly astonished at how many people don't care about knowing too much of a film before they see it. Eg. Sneak previews of Batman, overlong, overdrawn trailers, interviews, etc etc. It is true every time - that the less I know about a film, the more I enjoy it.


Sure, but if Pauline Kael threw some spoilers into a review for a 1970s flick, I am not going to be cursing her.

This whole OMG SPOILERS! thing is reaching peak critical mass. People being shouted at for discussing the latest Games of Thrones on twitter, reviews that want to talk about the plot and not just present a bland arguement that no one will care about, but get shouted at for doing so...

If folks are worried about knowing anything about the film, then just look at the star rating and don't click to read the longer review.

A film stands or falls not on how little or how much you know about it, but by how well it does those things. Is the ending of the 1960s Planet of the Apes weaker cause we know the "twist" going in? Is the 2000 remake stronger because you go in not knowing the ending?

I sympathise with people not wanting to be spoiled by the film, but really, you are taking matters into your own hands when you start reading indepth reviews ahead of time.


First off, I haven't seen Prometheus yet and have not read the full review because there is now a warning on it so my points are more on the prevalence of 'spoilers' in reviews in general so I think they're relevant (out of curiosity, am I right in thinking that it's a spoiler-heavy review that didn't initially mention this?). Apologies for this anyway.

I have to agree with jrewing1000 on this: certain plot points are fashioned either for a big reveal or to be gradually revealed within the context of the film for maximum effect, especially when the film is built on suspense or has a 'twist' (whether successful or not). It infuriates me when I read a spoiler in a review where it mentions / discusses something that was clearly meant to fall into this category as it absolutely takes away from the viewing experience (Kim Newman tends to be a bugger for this). It's the 'viewing experience' that's the key issue here - I for one want to be carried along by the film, but that can't happen if I've already read about what was intended to be a surprise death, the order in which characters die or some other revelation. Obviously there are some films where it can be argued that predictability is the point - the latest Final Destination and Piranha 3DD judging by their trailers (unless they're just shit), The Cabin In The Woods (to a degree) where the films maybe play with the cliches of the genre.

Rgirvan44's point about Planet of the Apes is all well and good when you've already seen it but if you haven't, you'd be wondering what all the fuss was about and, if everyone operated in this way, what would be the point to the ending - why not just have a matter-of-fact statement instead of a shock ending? To paraphrase Marvel Comics' philosophy, every viewing is somebody's first viewing.

It requires smart writing by the critic so as to allude to these things when discussing the merits or problems of the film, rather than explicitly revealing them, as it should be apparent to the reviewer what does and does not fall into the spoiler category. I've often read the suggestion that trailers shouldn't show us any footage from the third act - maybe reviews should follow suit in terms of going into specific plot details?

_____________________________

Spoiler colour: #F1F1F1

(in reply to Rgirvan44)
Post #: 127
RE: Prometheus - 31/5/2012 10:50:44 AM   
OPEN YOUR EYES

 

Posts: 4259
Joined: 5/2/2012
The problem with Ian Nathans review was its execution.
There are some good critique moments in his write-up but unfortunently the whole basis of the review reads as "this isn't Alien".
I personally feel he should rewrite it and concentrate more on the film he has just witnessed rather than going over old ground,alien fan or not.

< Message edited by OPEN YOUR EYES -- 31/5/2012 11:02:32 AM >

(in reply to OPEN YOUR EYES)
Post #: 128
RE: Spoilers or what! - 31/5/2012 10:56:17 AM   
Jaybee79

 

Posts: 52
Joined: 2/11/2005

quote:

ORIGINAL: jrewing1000


quote:

ORIGINAL: Jaybee79


quote:

ORIGINAL: Rgirvan44

quote:

ORIGINAL: jrewing1000

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rgirvan44


quote:

ORIGINAL: jrewing1000

A disappointing review. As a rule of thumb, reviews should NEVER have to come with a spoiler warning. The point of a review is to help the public decide whether or not to see the movie. They are not for film analysis - many reviewers get this wrong, and it annoys the hell out of me.

What's the point of posting a review that will spoil the experience for the reviewer? Ok, so you put a spoiler warning on it - so then many people won't read it! Utterly baffling really.

In fact, as a long-time reader of Empire, this is quite a surprise really - I thought they respected the viewer a little more than this.


This is the review which will appear in a future magazine, long after the film has been out. Suspect that is why it isn't bothered with spoilers.


Are you telling me you never read reviews about past films you are considering watching? Jesus, I read Empire reviews of films made in the 70s that I'm considering. It's film review basics: People shouldn't have to worry about reading something in a review that will give away the story. I am constantly astonished at how many people don't care about knowing too much of a film before they see it. Eg. Sneak previews of Batman, overlong, overdrawn trailers, interviews, etc etc. It is true every time - that the less I know about a film, the more I enjoy it.


Sure, but if Pauline Kael threw some spoilers into a review for a 1970s flick, I am not going to be cursing her.

This whole OMG SPOILERS! thing is reaching peak critical mass. People being shouted at for discussing the latest Games of Thrones on twitter, reviews that want to talk about the plot and not just present a bland arguement that no one will care about, but get shouted at for doing so...

If folks are worried about knowing anything about the film, then just look at the star rating and don't click to read the longer review.

A film stands or falls not on how little or how much you know about it, but by how well it does those things. Is the ending of the 1960s Planet of the Apes weaker cause we know the "twist" going in? Is the 2000 remake stronger because you go in not knowing the ending?

I sympathise with people not wanting to be spoiled by the film, but really, you are taking matters into your own hands when you start reading indepth reviews ahead of time.


This might be true if this was the norm for empire reviews, however I can't think of a review for a cinema film (discounting historic re-releases) from them that has included so many spoilers. As mentioned before, this is born out that empire realised they had gone too far and added a spoiler warning and edited out some of the more major spoilers after releasing the review.

A movie shouldn't stand or fall depending on how much you know about it in advance. But I still would like to go in reasonably unspoiled so as I can enjoy it as a new discovery. I don't mind small spoilers which I expect to find in a review but not major plot points as were in the first version of the review released online.

I emphasise I have no issue with conclusions of the review (whether or not I agree I will wait until I see the movie myself and even if I think the film is better than the review claims I won't dismiss the review as everyone has different opinions which are perfectly valid to the reviewer).



I entirely disagree with these opinions. Films are MUCH better when you know nothing or less about them. Storytelling is ALL about surprise and the reveal. This is where its power lies. To know what's coming is to be ahead of the storytellers.

I am not saying you can't enjoy a film if you know a lot about it. But to suggest it makes no difference is ridiculous (in my humble opinion!)


Just to make clear I agree with your view. I wasn't saying having the plot spoiled makes no difference. Quite the opposite. It spoils the initial viewing of going in not knowing what will happen. The only thing I agreed with is that if a film is spoilt it and you don't enjoy it at all because it has been spoiled then the film doesn't stand on it's own (or at least not repeat viewings). However my main point was that I do agree that, yes, viewing a film unspoiled is a better experience and empire dropped the ball on this one by posting a very spoiler filled review which is not their usual style.

(in reply to jrewing1000)
Post #: 129
RE: Spoilers or what! - 31/5/2012 10:56:22 AM   
jrewing1000


Posts: 485
Joined: 23/11/2005


It requires smart writing by the critic so as to allude to these things when discussing the merits or problems of the film, rather than explicitly revealing them, as it should be apparent to the reviewer what does and does not fall into the spoiler category. I've often read the suggestion that trailers shouldn't show us any footage from the third act - maybe reviews should follow suit in terms of going into specific plot details?



Yes. The best reviewers are able to offer commendation / criticism of a film without revealing any details of story that will spoil the 1st time viewing experience.

< Message edited by jrewing1000 -- 31/5/2012 10:57:10 AM >

(in reply to FoximusPrime)
Post #: 130
RE: Prometheus - 31/5/2012 10:58:40 AM   
Rgirvan44


Posts: 19037
Joined: 10/3/2006
From: Punishment Park
I wonder if film fans in the 1980s felt their viewing of Aliens was spoiled by the fact they showed the Alien Queen in the trailer...

_____________________________

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(in reply to OPEN YOUR EYES)
Post #: 131
RE: Prometheus - 31/5/2012 11:03:09 AM   
jrewing1000


Posts: 485
Joined: 23/11/2005

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rgirvan44

I wonder if film fans in the 1980s felt their viewing of Aliens was spoiled by the fact they showed the Alien Queen in the trailer...


Probably not. Can't remember how it was used in the trailer.

(in reply to Rgirvan44)
Post #: 132
RE: Prometheus - 31/5/2012 11:05:32 AM   
UTB


Posts: 9551
Joined: 30/9/2005
I saw MORE SPOILERS in reviews.

If this film's only three stars then save me paying to see it for fuck's sake and tell me what happens at the end.

YEAH!

(in reply to jrewing1000)
Post #: 133
RE: - 31/5/2012 11:10:27 AM   
primebhoy


Posts: 926
Joined: 7/5/2008
From: Scotland
quote:

ORIGINAL: vicandbob

Space jockey/engineer joke got boring after the first attempt.


This annoyed me more than it probably should

_____________________________

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Post #: 134
RE: Spoilers or what! - 31/5/2012 11:12:16 AM   
lankeymarlon

 

Posts: 105
Joined: 27/7/2009
Does nobody understand that a critic's review is their own personal opinion and that they have the right to voice their opinion?

I'm excited for Prometheus just as much as the next Fanboy, but I understand that someone might watch this film and not like it. That isn't going to spoil my enjoyment of the film. I didnt read the review as I'm trying to keep as clueless as possible until the screening at midnight tonight. But 3 stars is "meh". Who cares, there are plenty of positive reviews out there.

Saying that, still cant fully believe that this film is on the same level as MIB3.

(in reply to elab49)
Post #: 135
RE: Prometheus - 31/5/2012 11:16:44 AM   
MonsterCat


Posts: 7932
Joined: 24/3/2011
From: St. Albans, Hertfordshire
I haven't actually read the review yet. I just scrolled through it, checked the rating, shrugged and closed the window.

Was it / Is it truly brimming with spoilers?

_____________________________

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Films watched in 2013

(in reply to Empire Admin)
Post #: 136
RE: Prometheus - 31/5/2012 11:25:22 AM   
jobloffski

 

Posts: 1886
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: elsewhere
Not gonna read six pages of comment on a review of a film I haven't seen, but I will say this:

Why is it a problem that the thematic grandness goes out the window when the shit starts hitting the fan?

That seems entirely in keeping with the events I anticiapte: sense of wonder/hope/dicovery...then SHIT!!!! FREKY SHIT IS GOING ON AND PEOPLE ARE BEING SLAUGHTERED.

Artistically/narratively that seems absolutely appropriate, and I rather suspect Scott has made a film that he knows will be seen repeatedly, and that will then, once people have full context, be seen for the film he has made, rather that the film people hoped he would make/imagined he would make.

Go looking for the ultimate answers, you might not like what you find, and you may not survive, or even get, the answers (or understand them fully because the answers are too, well, alien to us).

Seems about right.

Film may turn out not to be what all might have hoped for, and I'm actually hoping not to be too sure on a first view and to see more of the point later. That's usually the difference between 'art' and 'entertainment'. Maybe Ridley has pulled off a bit of both and time will tell.

< Message edited by jobloffski -- 31/5/2012 11:28:12 AM >


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Post #: 137
RE: Prometheus - 31/5/2012 11:38:43 AM   
Dirk Miggler


Posts: 1080
Joined: 14/1/2009

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rgirvan44

I wonder if film fans in the 1980s felt their viewing of Aliens was spoiled by the fact they showed the Alien Queen in the trailer...


Probably not but then they probably didn't know about it beforehand or speculate about what it was after on the Internet with loads of other people who know too much shit about a film they haven't seen. I would imagine the reaction was "what the fck was that !" then put up with 6 months of pure torture waiting to find out.

I thought the films marketing was genius to start with. The teaser, full trailer, David and Weyland virals all amazing but I've kept away from the more recent trailers and virals, seems like overkill and with all the complaints about too many spoilers shots etc I thought better to steer clear.

(in reply to Rgirvan44)
Post #: 138
RE: Prometheus - 31/5/2012 11:50:47 AM   
superdan


Posts: 8043
Joined: 31/7/2008
Fuck me, 7 pages already? Fantastic.

(in reply to Dirk Miggler)
Post #: 139
RE: Prometheus - 31/5/2012 11:59:16 AM   
clownfoot


Posts: 7909
Joined: 26/9/2005
From: The ickle town of Fuck, Austria

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rgirvan44

I wonder if film fans in the 1980s felt their viewing of Aliens was spoiled by the fact they showed the Alien Queen in the trailer...


I only recall seeing the teaser. No dialogue, very snappy, ended with the 'this time it's war' tagline. That's all that was required. Pretty much the same as The Matrix, I only saw the 'whatisthematrix' teaser where Neo backflips out of the way of the train. That was enough for me to cream in my jeans. Two minute trailers have the potential to ruin everything... they're the George Osborne of moviedom. As viewers, we need to be more selective in what we read and watch prior to a films release, particularly if your of a disposition that spoilers will marr your enjoyment of a film.

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Post #: 140
RE: Prometheus - 31/5/2012 12:05:55 PM   
Jaybee79

 

Posts: 52
Joined: 2/11/2005
quote:

ORIGINAL: MonsterCat

I haven't actually read the review yet. I just scrolled through it, checked the rating, shrugged and closed the window.

Was it / Is it truly brimming with spoilers?


It was, but they've now edited the worse ones out. Still bear in mind that their are still some spoilers but I think they're mostly minor. The worse now left in the review is describing what the space jockey looks like and a hint as to it's nature. :D

< Message edited by Jaybee79 -- 31/5/2012 12:06:24 PM >

(in reply to MonsterCat)
Post #: 141
RE: Prometheus - 31/5/2012 12:09:51 PM   
elab49


Posts: 54428
Joined: 1/10/2005
Can I just add here as people might have forgotten?

This is a review thread and is for the discussion of the film. That includes details of the film - spoilers rules are looser in here as it is generally expected people will really only be reading once they've seen the film and this thread is here to discuss it.

So come tomorrow this thread may be full of spoilers.

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(in reply to Jaybee79)
Post #: 142
RE: Prometheus - 31/5/2012 12:12:28 PM   
MonsterCat


Posts: 7932
Joined: 24/3/2011
From: St. Albans, Hertfordshire
Yeah, I don't want to be the guy who criticises a writer (Especially when Mr Nathan is 100 times the writer I will ever be) but there really is no need to include major spoilers in a review.

Empire really need to take into account that some people will want to read reviews before checking out a particular flick.

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(in reply to Jaybee79)
Post #: 143
RE: Spoilers or what! - 31/5/2012 12:20:14 PM   
rawlinson

 

Posts: 45002
Joined: 13/6/2008
From: Timbuktu. Chinese or Fictional.

quote:

ORIGINAL: jrewing1000

A disappointing review. As a rule of thumb, reviews should NEVER have to come with a spoiler warning. The point of a review is to help the public decide whether or not to see the movie. They are not for film analysis - many reviewers get this wrong, and it annoys the hell out of me.



If you think a review is just a shopping guide, just look at the star rating and decide based on that. Although I have the feeling that pretty much everyone will have decided if they want to see this film or not before they even got near a review. If you really wanted to be completely unspoiled then you wouldn't have gone near reading it. Film reviews are meant to be film criticism, not just "I LIKED IT! FUN FOR ALL THE FAMILY!" Good film criticism requires actually interacting with the film in question, in order for the critic to explain exactly why it did or didn't work for them, and that sometimes does require spoilers.

(in reply to jrewing1000)
Post #: 144
RE: stingy star rating compared to others ive read - 31/5/2012 12:21:28 PM   
rawlinson

 

Posts: 45002
Joined: 13/6/2008
From: Timbuktu. Chinese or Fictional.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rgirvan44


quote:

ORIGINAL: Spaldron


quote:

ORIGINAL: Rgirvan44


quote:

ORIGINAL: directorscut


quote:

ORIGINAL: Rgirvan44

Seriously people, he wrote a whole book about Alien. I think he knows what he is talking about here...


That makes him LESS trustworthy to write a review as clearly he is obsessed with Alien and he would reject anything in Prometheus that wasn't like Alien.


If he was somehow incapable of seperating the two...


I agree with directorscut on this. Nathan is the last person they should've sent to review it as (going by the review) he'd spend the whole film comparing the two.


Because that is something none of us would be doing? In fact surely being such a big Alien fan means he was more likely to to defend the film?

I am pretty sure people would be up in arms if the film was reviewed by someone who had no clue about the Alien universe.


Of course they would. And if Nathan had loved the film then you'd have a group of people complaining that of course he'd love it because he's such a big fan of the series.

(in reply to Rgirvan44)
Post #: 145
RE: Spoilers or what! - 31/5/2012 12:42:59 PM   
jrewing1000


Posts: 485
Joined: 23/11/2005


Good film criticism requires actually interacting with the film in question, in order for the critic to explain exactly why it did or didn't work for them, and that sometimes does require spoilers.


There's a difference between film criticism and film reviews.

I'm talking about reviews. There are plenty of ways to intimate at the contents of a story without actually giving away what happens. I've read these kind of reviews all the time in Empire. It just takes a lot of care and attention. And more importantly, respect for the storytelling experience / process.

< Message edited by jrewing1000 -- 31/5/2012 12:44:03 PM >

(in reply to rawlinson)
Post #: 146
RE: Spoilers or what! - 31/5/2012 12:46:54 PM   
rawlinson

 

Posts: 45002
Joined: 13/6/2008
From: Timbuktu. Chinese or Fictional.

quote:

ORIGINAL: jrewing1000



Good film criticism requires actually interacting with the film in question, in order for the critic to explain exactly why it did or didn't work for them, and that sometimes does require spoilers.


There's a difference between film criticism and film reviews.



No, there's not. Film reviewing is film criticism. That's why they're called critics.

(in reply to jrewing1000)
Post #: 147
RE: Oh boo-hoo! - 31/5/2012 12:47:01 PM   
Deviation


Posts: 27267
Joined: 2/6/2006
From: Enemies of Film HQ

quote:

ORIGINAL: Pelle

So it's a piece of fcking shit. Grow up and get used to it.


Nathan didn't exactly say that.

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Post #: 148
RE: Oh boo-hoo! - 31/5/2012 12:47:34 PM   
rawlinson

 

Posts: 45002
Joined: 13/6/2008
From: Timbuktu. Chinese or Fictional.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Deviation


quote:

ORIGINAL: Pelle

So it's a piece of fcking shit. Grow up and get used to it.


Nathan didn't exactly say that.


Don't you wish he had though?

(in reply to Deviation)
Post #: 149
RE: Spoilers or what! - 31/5/2012 12:49:55 PM   
jrewing1000


Posts: 485
Joined: 23/11/2005

quote:

ORIGINAL: rawlinson


quote:

ORIGINAL: jrewing1000



Good film criticism requires actually interacting with the film in question, in order for the critic to explain exactly why it did or didn't work for them, and that sometimes does require spoilers.


There's a difference between film criticism and film reviews.



No, there's not. Film reviewing is film criticism. That's why they're called critics.


Yes of course film reviews are film criticism, but surely you accept the difference between film reviews and film analysis? Reviews are specifically about informing the public about whether a film is something they would want to see or not. They are part of the film release process. Film criticism can be at any point in time, 50 years after a film.

I'm just trying to specify that film reviews have their own rules to maximise the viewing experience.

(in reply to rawlinson)
Post #: 150
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