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RE: stingy star rating compared to others ive read - 30/5/2012 11:15:57 PM

Nexus Wookie

Posts: 2247
Joined: 24/9/2011
From: the Godcity

quote:

ORIGINAL: directorscut

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rgirvan44

Seriously people, he wrote a whole book about Alien. I think he knows what he is talking about here...

That makes him LESS trustworthy to write a review as clearly he is obsessed with Alien and he would reject anything in Prometheus that wasn't like Alien.

THIS.

I couldn't have put it better!

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Post #: 91

RE: Alien Vault book by Ian Nathan - 30/5/2012 11:16:10 PM

Scruffybobby

Posts: 4021
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: My House

quote:

ORIGINAL: drstockd

i have never commented on this before - but for once i believe in Ian Nathan's review here isnt he the author to the excellent Alien: Vault book, furthermore these same complaints have been coming out of alot of other critical reviews, personally i like to make my own mind up and look forward to see it in the coming days?

That's a reasonable position to take and as such is entirely out of place here. You should try being a bit more mental.

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quote:

ORIGINAL: elab49 (via Gizoogle)

Gentleman, please - could our crazy-ass asses leave dis thread ta gangstas wantin ta say shit bout a funky-ass bad film?

Post #: 92

RE: Lovely but Empty - 30/5/2012 11:23:25 PM

OPEN YOUR EYES

Posts: 3465
Joined: 5/2/2012
From: Living on Lynch's quiff

quote:

ORIGINAL: Dikicon

I heard an interview with Lindelof where he spoke of expectations about the film. Explicitly it can only exact two types of response: it won't meet your expectations or it's as you expected. In essence because of the hype, trailer, twitter ad breaks and teaser TED and Wyland ads it will never surpass your expectations. And that is a core problem with the film, it isn't scary, it isn't tense, it isn't horrifying, but it is beautiful, stylish and impressive. You can't help to be blown away, but you wait so long for anything suspenseful to happen you get tired of waiting. I never thought I'd say this about this film but it's actually quite dull. There are holes in the plot when mashed with the Alien/s world, but you feel you'd be called a pedant for pointing them out, maybe rightly so. However one unforgivable thing to do to this world is to make it boring and that's what Scott has done. Like anything of beauty after a while you want something more than just a pretty view.

Yep,this is the main thing I have gathered from listening and watching many of Ridleys recent interviews.
He seems somewhat obsessed with Camerons Avatar and openly praises it as a 3D game changer.

If I'm going to be blunt I think afer Ridleys viewing of Avatar,he thought " I'm going to do this too" and what better way than to attatch it to a film he himself brought to our screens many moons ago.Marketting wise it made sense and the hype began.

So in short the only reason Ridley has made Prometheus is,not to do with script,its to do with competition against Camerons Avatar.

< Message edited by OPEN YOUR EYES -- 30/5/2012 11:24:09 PM >

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Post #: 93

RE: IAN "TW*T" NATHAN - 30/5/2012 11:32:57 PM

Pigeon Army

Posts: 14611
Joined: 29/1/2006
From: Pixar HQ, George Lucas' Office.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rgirvan44

Somewhere out there, a tingle goes down PA's back....

What's going on here?

Those of you arguing that Ian didn't like it because it "clearly" wasn't Alien, please give me the excerpts (spoiler-free since '83) where he states of implies that it's bad because it isn't like the first film in a franchise that has been all about stylistic divergence.

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Rinc
She's supposed to be 13! I'd want her to be very attractive though

quote:

ORIGINAL: MonsterCat

quote:

ORIGINAL: Pigeon Army
Stop being mean to Deviation

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Post #: 94

RE: Spoilers or what! - 30/5/2012 11:39:41 PM

maffew

Posts: 2806
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: chester

quote:

ORIGINAL: elab49

quote:

ORIGINAL: rawlinson

Anyone else vaguely amused that Maffew called people retards and instead of editing the post Elab just quoted it?

So I got bored part way through the post - sue me.

Maffew, you've been around long enough to know the rules. Keep that kind of insult off the Board, please.

I missed the memo, sorry.. Weird, I hear that word on kids movies and have never thought anything of it, and also have never once in my life thought to use it.. First time ever right there! And never again on these boards Mr. Elab

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Post #: 95

RE: Spoilers or what! - 30/5/2012 11:41:00 PM

Scruffybobby

Posts: 4021
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: My House

quote:

ORIGINAL: maffew

quote:

ORIGINAL: elab49

quote:

ORIGINAL: rawlinson

Anyone else vaguely amused that Maffew called people retards and instead of editing the post Elab just quoted it?

So I got bored part way through the post - sue me.

Maffew, you've been around long enough to know the rules. Keep that kind of insult off the Board, please.

I missed the memo, sorry.. Weird, I hear that word on kids movies and have never thought anything of it, and also have never once in my life thought to use it.. First time ever right there! And never again on these boards Mr. Elab

Elab's a lady.

_____________________________

quote:

ORIGINAL: elab49 (via Gizoogle)

Gentleman, please - could our crazy-ass asses leave dis thread ta gangstas wantin ta say shit bout a funky-ass bad film?

(in reply to maffew)

Post #: 96

the hype machine - 30/5/2012 11:48:11 PM

the_driver

Posts: 20
Joined: 30/5/2012

This isn't the first time Empire has completely hyped a film and then trashed it in the reviews, The Invention of Lying which is don't get me wrong awful was hyped and had numerous features only to give it a one star review. The hype machine only affects the readers of the magazine while we live a reviewing culture of criminally underrating some films and overrating others, Like giving films like Tyrannosaur, Drive and the Social Network only 4 star reviews when it goes to the cinema and then when the hype has gone giving all these films five stars when they go on the review section get 5 stars after the hype dies down.
But as with most films I will reserve my judgments until I see the film.

< Message edited by the_driver -- 30/5/2012 11:49:51 PM >

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Post #: 97

RE: Spoilers or what! - 30/5/2012 11:56:40 PM

maffew

Posts: 2806
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: chester

quote:

ORIGINAL: Scruffybobby

quote:

ORIGINAL: maffew

quote:

ORIGINAL: elab49

quote:

ORIGINAL: rawlinson

Anyone else vaguely amused that Maffew called people retards and instead of editing the post Elab just quoted it?

So I got bored part way through the post - sue me.

Maffew, you've been around long enough to know the rules. Keep that kind of insult off the Board, please.

I missed the memo, sorry.. Weird, I hear that word on kids movies and have never thought anything of it, and also have never once in my life thought to use it.. First time ever right there! And never again on these boards Mr. Elab

Elab's a lady.

well well.. the learning continues.. she called... Bela?? that would make sense..hm..

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Post #: 98

RE: the hype machine - 30/5/2012 11:58:46 PM

rawlinson

Posts: 40184
Joined: 13/6/2008
From: Timbuktu. Chinese or Fictional.

quote:

ORIGINAL: the_driver

This isn't the first time Empire has completely hyped a film and then trashed it in the reviews

But why is that a problem? Three stars isn't exactly a trashing anyway, but Empire staff are only human, can't they be excited about a film based on the concept, the talent involved, etc and then feel completely disappointed in it when they watch it?

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ORIGINAL: matty_b

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ORIGINAL: matty_b

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Post #: 99

RE: the hype machine - 31/5/2012 12:03:08 AM

lamby

Posts: 97
Joined: 18/10/2005

I've got no problem if Empire or the reviewer decide to give the movie a poor/average/great review. Personally I rely more on Rottentomatoes for an overall review.

My problem with Ian's review is that the content is simply not of a 3 star review. It's more a 2 star or god forbid 1 star review. There is simply no justification of a 3 star film in what he wrote and for me is where he has gone wrong.

(in reply to rawlinson)

Post #: 100

RE: the hype machine - 31/5/2012 12:07:44 AM

Spaldron

Posts: 10487
Joined: 6/10/2006
From: Chair

Fucking hell, five pages in three hours?!!! Good luck mods.

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Post #: 101

RE: stingy star rating compared to others ive read - 31/5/2012 12:12:02 AM

Spaldron

Posts: 10487
Joined: 6/10/2006
From: Chair

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rgirvan44

quote:

ORIGINAL: directorscut

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rgirvan44

Seriously people, he wrote a whole book about Alien. I think he knows what he is talking about here...

That makes him LESS trustworthy to write a review as clearly he is obsessed with Alien and he would reject anything in Prometheus that wasn't like Alien.

If he was somehow incapable of seperating the two...

I agree with directorscut on this. Nathan is the last person they should've sent to review it as (going by the review) he'd spend the whole film comparing the two.

_____________________________

And I heard a voice in the midst of the four beasts
And I looked and behold, a pale horse
And his name that sat on him was Death
And Hell followed with him.

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Post #: 102

RE: Empire isn't a person - 31/5/2012 12:33:43 AM

Qwerty Norris

Posts: 3149
Joined: 26/10/2005
From: Edinburgh

So my initial fears over the inclusion of Jon "The Darkest Hour" Spaihts have proven to be valid?

Bugger...

Will see for myself all the same on Saturday.

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Post #: 103

RE: Empire isn't a person - 31/5/2012 12:54:35 AM

Phubbs

Posts: 660
Joined: 3/4/2012

This Sun I will find out for myself and review..but I'm reading allot of poor reviews right now

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Post #: 104

RE: stingy star rating compared to others ive read - 31/5/2012 1:57:30 AM

Pigeon Army

Posts: 14611
Joined: 29/1/2006
From: Pixar HQ, George Lucas' Office.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Spaldron

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rgirvan44

quote:

ORIGINAL: directorscut

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rgirvan44

Seriously people, he wrote a whole book about Alien. I think he knows what he is talking about here...

That makes him LESS trustworthy to write a review as clearly he is obsessed with Alien and he would reject anything in Prometheus that wasn't like Alien.

If he was somehow incapable of seperating the two...

I agree with directorscut on this. Nathan is the last person they should've sent to review it as (going by the review) he'd spend the whole film comparing the two.

I repeat -

quote:

Those of you arguing that Ian didn't like it because it "clearly" wasn't Alien, please give me the excerpts (spoiler-free since '83) where he states of implies that it's bad because it isn't like the first film in a franchise that has been all about stylistic divergence.

I haven't read the review yet because I'm seeing it on Saturday and want to keep as spoiler-free as possible, but surely you can back up that assertion with evidence that isn't loaded with story spoilers, just a couple of clicks and Ctrl+C, Ctrl+V.

_____________________________

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rinc
She's supposed to be 13! I'd want her to be very attractive though

quote:

ORIGINAL: MonsterCat

quote:

ORIGINAL: Pigeon Army
Stop being mean to Deviation

No.

(in reply to Spaldron)

Post #: 105

RE: Prometheus - 31/5/2012 7:44:57 AM

drews

Posts: 270
Joined: 5/10/2005
From: Wimbledon Centre Court

"Prometheus, are you seeing these reviews?"

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Post #: 106

RE: Spoilers or what! - 31/5/2012 8:08:53 AM

jonson

Posts: 8067
Joined: 30/9/2005

5 pages

In my opinion, the reviews thread shouldn't be posted in until the film has opened at least. 5 pages of utter shit, people's opinions on opinions, and 80% spam.
I think the review could have been predicted with the way the trailers have gone. First few teasers were looking like a 5 star film. The trailers got gradually longer, the premise got slightly more obvious, until the final trailer which could be stitched together to play out the entire film.
Anyway, fuck the review, Saturday at 9pm and I can't wait.

quote:

ORIGINAL: elab49

Reviewing seems to be a pretty thankless occupation IMO.

True, but I wouldn't consider it an occupation. Well, not a proper one anyway.

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Post #: 107

RE: stingy star rating compared to others ive read - 31/5/2012 9:04:04 AM

Rgirvan44

Posts: 18886
Joined: 10/3/2006
From: Punishment Park

quote:

ORIGINAL: Spaldron

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rgirvan44

quote:

ORIGINAL: directorscut

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rgirvan44

Seriously people, he wrote a whole book about Alien. I think he knows what he is talking about here...

That makes him LESS trustworthy to write a review as clearly he is obsessed with Alien and he would reject anything in Prometheus that wasn't like Alien.

If he was somehow incapable of seperating the two...

I agree with directorscut on this. Nathan is the last person they should've sent to review it as (going by the review) he'd spend the whole film comparing the two.

Because that is something none of us would be doing? In fact surely being such a big Alien fan means he was more likely to to defend the film?

I am pretty sure people would be up in arms if the film was reviewed by someone who had no clue about the Alien universe.

Also - if this thread isn't ten pages by the time of the midnight screenings then something is wrong...

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Post #: 108

RE: Spoilers or what! - 31/5/2012 9:04:25 AM

jrewing1000

Posts: 469
Joined: 23/11/2005

A disappointing review. As a rule of thumb, reviews should NEVER have to come with a spoiler warning. The point of a review is to help the public decide whether or not to see the movie. They are not for film analysis - many reviewers get this wrong, and it annoys the hell out of me.

What's the point of posting a review that will spoil the experience for the reviewer? Ok, so you put a spoiler warning on it - so then many people won't read it! Utterly baffling really.

In fact, as a long-time reader of Empire, this is quite a surprise really - I thought they respected the viewer a little more than this.

(in reply to jonson)

Post #: 109

RE: Spoilers or what! - 31/5/2012 9:05:38 AM

Rgirvan44

Posts: 18886
Joined: 10/3/2006
From: Punishment Park

quote:

ORIGINAL: jrewing1000

A disappointing review. As a rule of thumb, reviews should NEVER have to come with a spoiler warning. The point of a review is to help the public decide whether or not to see the movie. They are not for film analysis - many reviewers get this wrong, and it annoys the hell out of me.

What's the point of posting a review that will spoil the experience for the reviewer? Ok, so you put a spoiler warning on it - so then many people won't read it! Utterly baffling really.

In fact, as a long-time reader of Empire, this is quite a surprise really - I thought they respected the viewer a little more than this.

This is the review which will appear in a future magazine, long after the film has been out. Suspect that is why it isn't bothered with spoilers.

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Post #: 110

RE: Spoilers or what! - 31/5/2012 9:06:19 AM

Hobbitonlass

Posts: 11509
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Westeros

quote:

ORIGINAL: jonson
Anyway, fuck the review, Saturday at 9pm and I can't wait.

Yep! Friday at 6.20pm and excited! Not seen any reviews and don't intend to read any before I see it. Will make my own mind up

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Post #: 111

RE: Spoilers or what! - 31/5/2012 9:25:19 AM

steffols

Posts: 7617
Joined: 3/10/2005
From: Jungleland

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rgirvan44

quote:

ORIGINAL: jrewing1000

A disappointing review. As a rule of thumb, reviews should NEVER have to come with a spoiler warning. The point of a review is to help the public decide whether or not to see the movie. They are not for film analysis - many reviewers get this wrong, and it annoys the hell out of me.

What's the point of posting a review that will spoil the experience for the reviewer? Ok, so you put a spoiler warning on it - so then many people won't read it! Utterly baffling really.

In fact, as a long-time reader of Empire, this is quite a surprise really - I thought they respected the viewer a little more than this.

This is the review which will appear in a future magazine, long after the film has been out. Suspect that is why it isn't bothered with spoilers.

He has a point though. Even if the review is going into next months magazine by which point the majority of people wanting to see Prometheus will have seen it, it doesn't excuse the fact that they put spoilers in. They did the same thing with Avengers and I'll be honest, it annoyed me because there was no spoiler warning.

There is no need to put spoilers in the review, to need to do so is just bad reviewing etiquette and somewhat arrogant as well.

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Post #: 112

RE: Spoilers or what! - 31/5/2012 9:27:38 AM

steffols

Posts: 7617
Joined: 3/10/2005
From: Jungleland

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rgirvan44

quote:

ORIGINAL: jrewing1000

A disappointing review. As a rule of thumb, reviews should NEVER have to come with a spoiler warning. The point of a review is to help the public decide whether or not to see the movie. They are not for film analysis - many reviewers get this wrong, and it annoys the hell out of me.

What's the point of posting a review that will spoil the experience for the reviewer? Ok, so you put a spoiler warning on it - so then many people won't read it! Utterly baffling really.

In fact, as a long-time reader of Empire, this is quite a surprise really - I thought they respected the viewer a little more than this.

This is the review which will appear in a future magazine, long after the film has been out. Suspect that is why it isn't bothered with spoilers.

He has a point though. Even if the review is going to be in a later magazine which by that point the majority of people wanting to see Prometheus will have seen it, it doesn't excuse the need to put spoilers in the review. They did the same thing with Avengers and I'll be honest, it annoyed me as there was no spoiler warning and I wasn't expecting it.

To put spoilers in a review is unneeded and bad reviewing etiquette. It's also somewhat arrogant.

_____________________________

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Post #: 113

RE: Dear God............ - 31/5/2012 9:27:48 AM

steffols

Posts: 7617
Joined: 3/10/2005
From: Jungleland

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rgirvan44

quote:

ORIGINAL: jrewing1000

A disappointing review. As a rule of thumb, reviews should NEVER have to come with a spoiler warning. The point of a review is to help the public decide whether or not to see the movie. They are not for film analysis - many reviewers get this wrong, and it annoys the hell out of me.

What's the point of posting a review that will spoil the experience for the reviewer? Ok, so you put a spoiler warning on it - so then many people won't read it! Utterly baffling really.

In fact, as a long-time reader of Empire, this is quite a surprise really - I thought they respected the viewer a little more than this.

This is the review which will appear in a future magazine, long after the film has been out. Suspect that is why it isn't bothered with spoilers.

Post #: 114

RE: Poor review - 31/5/2012 9:31:31 AM

jmebaby25

Posts: 245
Joined: 28/6/2006
From: Manchester

quote:

ORIGINAL: dragon_irl

I wonder what Kim Newman has to say about it........

This is a snippet from Kim Newman: " Bluntly, Alien was a simple film about people whose most pressing question was would they live through the next five minutes, while Prometheus is a complex movie about people asking big questions about the nature of the universe. It�s just that Alien�s lost patrol/body count/runaround story takes place in a universe that has been thought about deeply and which contains mysteries that connected with audiences � we loved the film because it had a sense of knowing more than it told, which added to its horrors and mysteries. Alien is awesome in the old-fashioned sense of �with awe�. Prometheus seems to feel that any exciting genre elements are token, even as its deep thoughts are ultimately shallow."

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Post #: 115

RE: Spoilers or what! - 31/5/2012 9:32:16 AM

jrewing1000

Posts: 469
Joined: 23/11/2005

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rgirvan44

quote:

ORIGINAL: jrewing1000

A disappointing review. As a rule of thumb, reviews should NEVER have to come with a spoiler warning. The point of a review is to help the public decide whether or not to see the movie. They are not for film analysis - many reviewers get this wrong, and it annoys the hell out of me.

What's the point of posting a review that will spoil the experience for the reviewer? Ok, so you put a spoiler warning on it - so then many people won't read it! Utterly baffling really.

In fact, as a long-time reader of Empire, this is quite a surprise really - I thought they respected the viewer a little more than this.

This is the review which will appear in a future magazine, long after the film has been out. Suspect that is why it isn't bothered with spoilers.

Are you telling me you never read reviews about past films you are considering watching? Jesus, I read Empire reviews of films made in the 70s that I'm considering. It's film review basics: People shouldn't have to worry about reading something in a review that will give away the story. I am constantly astonished at how many people don't care about knowing too much of a film before they see it. Eg. Sneak previews of Batman, overlong, overdrawn trailers, interviews, etc etc. It is true every time - that the less I know about a film, the more I enjoy it.

(in reply to Rgirvan44)

Post #: 116

RE: Spoilers or what! - 31/5/2012 9:37:58 AM

efc91

Posts: 253
Joined: 5/9/2008
From: Liverpool

I will watch and decide for myself. I think I will enjoy it wasn't expecting to to be as good as the first two Aliens anyway.

As for all the mixed reviews I will put that down to poor marketing.

(in reply to jrewing1000)

Post #: 117

RE: Dear God............ - 31/5/2012 9:42:05 AM

Dirk Miggler

Posts: 823
Joined: 14/1/2009

Didn't read all the review through fear of being spoiled. The 3 stars must mean he did enjoy the film but the tone of the review from what i've read seems one of overall disappointment. Going in expecting greatness and the more than frequent references/comparisons to Alien and Aliens suggest he was always going to be though.

Overall the initiall reaction seems mixed to positive, and with a film with these sort of themes I'm hardly suprised. I'm still really excited for this film.

< Message edited by Dirk Miggler -- 31/5/2012 9:49:22 AM >

(in reply to steffols)

Post #: 118

RE: What the hell Empire?! - 31/5/2012 9:53:26 AM

Scruffybobby

Posts: 4021
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: My House

Only 2 stars on denofgeek. Eeek.

Will post again once I've seen it. Keeping my hopes up. The next 14 hours will be looooonnnngggg

_____________________________

quote:

ORIGINAL: elab49 (via Gizoogle)

Gentleman, please - could our crazy-ass asses leave dis thread ta gangstas wantin ta say shit bout a funky-ass bad film?

Post #: 119

RE: Spoilers or what! - 31/5/2012 9:54:48 AM

Rgirvan44

Posts: 18886
Joined: 10/3/2006
From: Punishment Park

quote:

ORIGINAL: jrewing1000

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rgirvan44

quote:

ORIGINAL: jrewing1000

A disappointing review. As a rule of thumb, reviews should NEVER have to come with a spoiler warning. The point of a review is to help the public decide whether or not to see the movie. They are not for film analysis - many reviewers get this wrong, and it annoys the hell out of me.

What's the point of posting a review that will spoil the experience for the reviewer? Ok, so you put a spoiler warning on it - so then many people won't read it! Utterly baffling really.

In fact, as a long-time reader of Empire, this is quite a surprise really - I thought they respected the viewer a little more than this.

This is the review which will appear in a future magazine, long after the film has been out. Suspect that is why it isn't bothered with spoilers.

Are you telling me you never read reviews about past films you are considering watching? Jesus, I read Empire reviews of films made in the 70s that I'm considering. It's film review basics: People shouldn't have to worry about reading something in a review that will give away the story. I am constantly astonished at how many people don't care about knowing too much of a film before they see it. Eg. Sneak previews of Batman, overlong, overdrawn trailers, interviews, etc etc. It is true every time - that the less I know about a film, the more I enjoy it.

Sure, but if Pauline Kael threw some spoilers into a review for a 1970s flick, I am not going to be cursing her.

This whole OMG SPOILERS! thing is reaching peak critical mass. People being shouted at for discussing the latest Games of Thrones on twitter, reviews that want to talk about the plot and not just present a bland arguement that no one will care about, but get shouted at for doing so...

If folks are worried about knowing anything about the film, then just look at the star rating and don't click to read the longer review.

A film stands or falls not on how little or how much you know about it, but by how well it does those things. Is the ending of the 1960s Planet of the Apes weaker cause we know the "twist" going in? Is the 2000 remake stronger because you go in not knowing the ending?

I sympathise with people not wanting to be spoiled by the film, but really, you are taking matters into your own hands when you start reading indepth reviews ahead of time.

< Message edited by Rgirvan44 -- 31/5/2012 9:55:44 AM >

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It is a far, far better thing that I do, than I have ever done; it is a far, far better rest that I go to, than I have ever known.

(in reply to jrewing1000)

Post #: 120