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DC Confirms New Watchmen Comics - 2/2/2012 10:05:17 AM   
Empire Admin

 

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Post #: 1
RE: I'll be interested in what comes down - 2/2/2012 11:53:49 AM   
Wild about Wilder


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But at least he sticks by his words & didn't take a penny from the movie not many people who would do that now days.
Post #: 2
RE: It's a comic book, not a holy scripture... - 2/2/2012 1:15:08 PM   
JIm R

 

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Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Surrey
quote:

ORIGINAL: Nicky C

... if there's an audience for it, then what's the problem? Moore should get involved and steer the whole thing. His pride and refusal to get involved will mean that this (as with the movie) will not be quite as good as it could be. People and their negative attitudes, eh? Pathetic.


Not really, just an individual wishing to honour his own creation and concepts in a world where people will sell themselves for the quickest $. You'd have to look at the morals currently being held at DC if anything.  
Post #: 3
RE: It's a comic book, not a holy scripture... - 2/2/2012 1:25:32 PM   
gunstar


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I don't understand. At which point did having a modicum of integrity mean that you were pathetic and elitist? Some of these comments really make me sad. I have a sad face.

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Post #: 4
RE: I sometimes wonder... - 2/2/2012 4:01:33 PM   
horribleives

 

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Even if it's dreadful - who cares? It won't make Watchmen any less brilliant. As it is I'll be intrigued enough to read it.
And I can't really dispute the comments about Moore having a bit of a nerve considering he wrote The League Of Extraordinary Gentlemen either.
Still, fanboys love nothing more than crying like babies so I'd hate to see reason and rationality get in their way.

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Post #: 5
RE: I sometimes wonder... - 2/2/2012 4:03:28 PM   
horribleives

 

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Having said that, I agree, the title is terrible and doesn't really make sense.

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Post #: 6
RE: - 2/2/2012 4:08:54 PM   
JIm R

 

Posts: 9185
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Surrey
quote:

ORIGINAL: clarkkent

Also, why is EMPIRE MAGAZINE covering a story about a comic?



Oh that's a good one, oh that's funny, oh fantastic.....

Post #: 7
RE: Moore may be a moody git but - 2/2/2012 8:50:10 PM   
King of Kafiristan

 

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I share Moore's scorn for the adaptations of his work Hollywood has given us thus far. As far as I'm concerned, each has missed the mark by a wide margin. I was especially turned off by the marketing campaigns for V and WATCHMEN, which went out of their way to position those films as hyper faithful adapatations. James McTigue and Snyder repeatedly told the press that they approached those movies as if Moore's work was gospel, and yet when I sat in the theater I learned that they'd changed key details that completely altered the intended message of the novels (such as positioning V FOR VENDETTA as a struggle between American liberalism and conservatism, rather than a study on the meaning of anarchy). Hollywood doesn't seem to really "get" Moore, and seeing as I think rather highly of his literary accomplishments, the frustration and disgust he feels seeing his stories misinterpreted and commercialized is to me readily understandable

As far as these comics go, I don't see the point of the project - I don't think it has a legitimate reason to be, and I think it serves to cheapen (however imperceptiably) the legacy of WATCHMEN. Without Moore's voice, this is just an especially well financed form of fan fiction, and even if he were amenable to the idea of a WATCHMEN continuation, I don't think there is anything left that needs to be said when it comes to these characters

With all that said though, I'm full prepared to admit I am kind of jazzed to check out the Ozymandias series, if only because he's one of my all time favorite fictional characters, and I always wanted to see his astounding Alexandrian journey in greater detail. I won't consider any of it as cannon, but, yes, I'm pretty certain I'll get a kick out of it all the same
Post #: 8
RE: Moore may be a moody git but - 3/2/2012 3:22:54 PM   
King of Kafiristan

 

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I thought this was an excellent editorial, which basically sums up my thoughts on this whole fracas: 

http://badassdigest.com/2012/02/02/the-devins-advocate-beyond-watchmen-continues-80-years-of-creator-exploitat/

(in reply to King of Kafiristan)
Post #: 9
RE: Moore may be a moody git but - 3/2/2012 3:49:51 PM   
horribleives

 

Posts: 5098
Joined: 12/6/2009
From: The North

quote:

ORIGINAL: King of Kafiristan

I thought this was an excellent editorial, which basically sums up my thoughts on this whole fracas: 

http://badassdigest.com/2012/02/02/the-devins-advocate-beyond-watchmen-continues-80-years-of-creator-exploitat/



I was about to read that then decided not to after clicking on the Ernie Hudson link first and realising what a horrible, spiteful little person the boy who wrote it is.

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Post #: 10
RE: Moore may be a moody git but - 3/2/2012 3:59:45 PM   
King of Kafiristan

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: horribleives


quote:

ORIGINAL: King of Kafiristan

I thought this was an excellent editorial, which basically sums up my thoughts on this whole fracas: 

http://badassdigest.com/2012/02/02/the-devins-advocate-beyond-watchmen-continues-80-years-of-creator-exploitat/



I was about to read that then decided not to after clicking on the Ernie Hudson link first and realising what a horrible, spiteful little person the boy who wrote it is.


Devin Faraci is certainly a polarizing figure, I'll grant you that.

(in reply to horribleives)
Post #: 11
RE: Moore may be a moody git but - 3/2/2012 5:18:55 PM   
Wild about Wilder


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Can't see Moore being involved & It's not the 1st time DC's ripped him off without asking something came up a few months ago online about a story he created in the 80s were there would be a global sought of Superhero war Superman family vs The Marvels etc with the humans resistence being led by Batman & the other human capes anyway it got turned down by DC BUT! low & behold bits of it turned up a decade later in Kingdom Come.

(in reply to King of Kafiristan)
Post #: 12
RE: Moore may be a moody git but - 3/2/2012 6:52:00 PM   
Darth Marenghi

 

Posts: 3222
Joined: 10/10/2010
From: Manchester

quote:

ORIGINAL: King of Kafiristan

I thought this was an excellent editorial, which basically sums up my thoughts on this whole fracas: 

http://badassdigest.com/2012/02/02/the-devins-advocate-beyond-watchmen-continues-80-years-of-creator-exploitat/



The best discussions I've seen on this are:

http://it-sparkles.blogspot.com/2012/02/no-fun.html - Image Comics' publisher Eric Stephenson gives his thoughts.

http://4thletter.net/2012/02/newsarama-needs-to-do-better/ - A response to an astonishing Newsarama op-ed about the prequel series.

http://everydayislikewednesday.blogspot.com/2012/02/six-thoughts-that-occurred-to-me-after.html

http://mindlessones.com/2012/02/02/the-second-coming-of-night-owl-and-other-stories/#more-23418 - The comments in this one are worth a read too.




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(in reply to King of Kafiristan)
Post #: 13
RE: It's Moores creation, respect his wishes ...end of ... - 3/2/2012 10:25:37 PM   
JIm R

 

Posts: 9185
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Surrey
quote:

ORIGINAL: bronco3114

Personally I'd love to see these titles and I probably will be buying them. But (now I'm gonna sound completely hypocritical) I don't think these should be made. The man has expressed an explicit wish that he doesn't want it to happen. You don't have to agree but you should respect it. Yes the studio own the rights (thats why they can just ingnor him obviously) but there's something wrong with a world where a bloke can create something special and has zero control of what can be done with it creatively. The points about the reimagining of many other literary characters by Moore are irrelevant since as Straczynski misplaced point about Moore not inisiting Shuster and Siegel should have been the only ones allowed to write Superman ...the point is Shuster and Siegel didn't say hands off their creation, they and the likes of Stan Lee are happy to have their creations skewed and reimagined over the generations and fair play to them for it.


When a character is created, the author / creator has a choice - either keep complete control and earn no money or sell out when the film rights come along and make a shit load from it but know they will lose creative control over their 'baby'. Ironically where Watchmen is concerned, Moore's made no money from the film and lost creative rights to his own work.

Plus the Saturday morning Watchmen 'toon piss-take has never been so relevant

In edition, Lee was bloody clever, he ripped everyone off and shafted everyone else and it's basically a case of he's outlived the origonal creators team, he fucked over Kirby, Ditko et al and knows it. He's a nasty piece of work.



< Message edited by JIm R -- 3/2/2012 10:37:54 PM >
Post #: 14
RE: Moore may be a moody git but - 4/2/2012 12:06:51 AM   
furrybastard

 

Posts: 5187
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Ireland
quote:

ORIGINAL: Darth Marenghi


quote:

ORIGINAL: King of Kafiristan

I thought this was an excellent editorial, which basically sums up my thoughts on this whole fracas: 

http://badassdigest.com/2012/02/02/the-devins-advocate-beyond-watchmen-continues-80-years-of-creator-exploitat/



The best discussions I've seen on this are:

http://it-sparkles.blogspot.com/2012/02/no-fun.html - Image Comics' publisher Eric Stephenson gives his thoughts.

http://4thletter.net/2012/02/newsarama-needs-to-do-better/ - A response to an astonishing Newsarama op-ed about the prequel series.

http://everydayislikewednesday.blogspot.com/2012/02/six-thoughts-that-occurred-to-me-after.html

http://mindlessones.com/2012/02/02/the-second-coming-of-night-owl-and-other-stories/#more-23418 - The comments in this one are worth a read too.


I'll add this for good measure...

http://robot6.comicbookresources.com/2012/02/weve-come-so-far-on-before-watchmen-and-creators-rights/



(in reply to Darth Marenghi)
Post #: 15
RE: Moore may be a moody git but - 4/2/2012 12:07:49 AM   
furrybastard

 

Posts: 5187
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Ireland
quote:

ORIGINAL: Darth Marenghi

The best discussions I've seen on this are:

http://it-sparkles.blogspot.com/2012/02/no-fun.html - Image Comics' publisher Eric Stephenson gives his thoughts.

http://4thletter.net/2012/02/newsarama-needs-to-do-better/ - A response to an astonishing Newsarama op-ed about the prequel series.

http://everydayislikewednesday.blogspot.com/2012/02/six-thoughts-that-occurred-to-me-after.html

http://mindlessones.com/2012/02/02/the-second-coming-of-night-owl-and-other-stories/#more-23418 - The comments in this one are worth a read too.


I'll add this for good measure...

http://robot6.comicbookresources.com/2012/02/weve-come-so-far-on-before-watchmen-and-creators-rights/

(in reply to Darth Marenghi)
Post #: 16
RE: It's Moores creation, respect his wishes ...end of ... - 4/2/2012 12:07:59 AM   
furrybastard

 

Posts: 5187
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Ireland
quote:

ORIGINAL: Darth Marenghi

The best discussions I've seen on this are:

http://it-sparkles.blogspot.com/2012/02/no-fun.html - Image Comics' publisher Eric Stephenson gives his thoughts.

http://4thletter.net/2012/02/newsarama-needs-to-do-better/ - A response to an astonishing Newsarama op-ed about the prequel series.

http://everydayislikewednesday.blogspot.com/2012/02/six-thoughts-that-occurred-to-me-after.html

http://mindlessones.com/2012/02/02/the-second-coming-of-night-owl-and-other-stories/#more-23418 - The comments in this one are worth a read too.


I'll add this for good measure...

http://robot6.comicbookresources.com/2012/02/weve-come-so-far-on-before-watchmen-and-creators-rights/

(in reply to JIm R)
Post #: 17
RE: It's Moores creation, respect his wishes ...end of ... - 4/2/2012 12:55:22 PM   
xman88


Posts: 7
Joined: 2/2/2012
In my opinion it would be great. I will always waiting for its release.

(in reply to furrybastard)
Post #: 18
RE: It's a comic book, not a holy scripture... - 4/2/2012 5:57:05 PM   
cerebusboy


Posts: 1552
Joined: 1/5/2006


Indeed. Some of the statements on this thread make stereotypical "fanboys" look like reason itself. Read about DC using Steven (no relation) Moore's dying brother as leverage for some Watchmen prequels if you doubt who and who is not displaying "ethics" in this dispute. The characters in LoeG are largely no longer in copyright (and of course even if they were, they would be held by e.g. descendents of the original creators - which is not really the same thing as Moby Dick 2: Dick Harder, MORE Crime & Punishment etc vapid sequels being made contrary to the original creator's wishes). I find it amusing that JMS cited Superman; anyone whose read his crappy Superman stories ( http://www.comicsalliance.com/2010/12/30/worst-comics-2010-superman-grounded/ ) , or his attempt at Spider-Man, will be, if anything, more predisoposed to not let much loved stories and characters utilised by later hacks.

Empire's pop at Bleeding Cool was a bit childish too IMHO. There's no shame in being scooped!

(in reply to gunstar)
Post #: 19
RE: It's Moores creation, respect his wishes ...end of - 4/2/2012 10:00:03 PM   
Darth Marenghi

 

Posts: 3222
Joined: 10/10/2010
From: Manchester
quote:

ORIGINAL: cerebusboy

Empire's pop at Bleeding Cool was a bit childish too IMHO. There's no shame in being scooped!



Yeah, just noticed that now. Rich Johnston is well known for his connections in the comics industry and was always the most likely person to get to this story before anyone else. Poor show Empire, poor show...

< Message edited by Darth Marenghi -- 4/2/2012 10:02:21 PM >


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(in reply to cerebusboy)
Post #: 20
RE: I'll be interested in what comes down - 4/2/2012 11:16:20 PM   
cerebusboy


Posts: 1552
Joined: 1/5/2006


"Elitist" in the pejorative sense? It is to LOL. Moore's work is indeed among the 'elite' which is to say "best" of comics, in a way that Ennis' (!) knock-off nonsense is not
Post #: 21
RE: Moore may be a moody git but - 4/2/2012 11:22:02 PM   
cerebusboy


Posts: 1552
Joined: 1/5/2006

quote:

ORIGINAL: fish that roared


quote:

This reeks of the Star Wars prequels and we all know how well they turned out


Except it, er, doesn't. The Star Wars universe is (legally, and, Kurtz and Kershner aside, morally) Lucas'. You might think the prequels suck balls, but it's Lucas' story and he can do what he wants. I read Batman comics because Batman is a great character, even in the hands of not-great writers.How true is that of the Watchmen characters?
Post #: 22
RE: I'll be interested in what comes down - 4/2/2012 11:27:12 PM   
cerebusboy


Posts: 1552
Joined: 1/5/2006

quote:

ORIGINAL: alsybroth

Yes, Watchmen is a great comic and a bonafide classic, but Moore tuly is a stuck-up holier-than-thou elitist and let's face it, like stated above he DID start off by expanding on the Swamp Thing beofre creating V For Vendetta and Watchmen.
So many other comic book writers do this; Garth Ennis worked on the Punisher and Hellblazer before he created his own masterpiece, Preacher - you don't see him growing a beard like some vagrant monk spouting delusions of granduer do ya?

Oh, and if any of the fanboy plebs start shouting NOOOOOO, remember you can choose not read them and stick to the original. OK, rant over.



Hmm, lots of 'normal' people know and read Alan Moore (lots of people who don't call themselves comics fans have still heard of or read Watchmen), whereas I think you'll find that people who use words like "masterpiece" (!) in relation to Garth Ennis (!) tend to be "fanboys". And 'plebs' as the defenders of the 'elitist' Moore? Your logic, in so far as it exists, is absurd.

Post #: 23
RE: I sometimes wonder... - 4/2/2012 11:36:53 PM   
cerebusboy


Posts: 1552
Joined: 1/5/2006
quote:

ORIGINAL: horribleives

Even if it's dreadful - who cares? It won't make Watchmen any less brilliant. As it is I'll be intrigued enough to read it.
And I can't really dispute the comments about Moore having a bit of a nerve considering he wrote The League Of Extraordinary Gentlemen either.
Still, fanboys love nothing more than crying like babies so I'd hate to see reason and rationality get in their way.



The difference between "reason" and "rationality" being....?

And of course LoeG is a crappy analogy. On top of the fact that the characters it uses are mostly not in copyright, there's the fact that Moore is taking otherwise moribund characters and making something new and exciting with them. That's the precise opposite of letting hacks like JMS piss all over one of the greatest graphic novels ever written.



< Message edited by cerebusboy -- 4/2/2012 11:46:07 PM >

(in reply to horribleives)
Post #: 24
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