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RE: Dredd (2012): Poster Traumatic Stress Disorder - 13/1/2012 10:54:21 AM

Dirk Miggler

Posts: 836
Joined: 14/1/2009

So Dreddheads bitterness towards this films production is more than just issues with "oversized" helmets and Karl Urban's Jaw bone structure ? Who knew ?????

< Message edited by Dirk Miggler -- 13/1/2012 10:56:20 AM >

(in reply to sauchieboy)

Post #: 31

RE: Dredd (2012): Poster Traumatic Stress Disorder - 13/1/2012 11:06:18 AM

Spaldron

Posts: 10487
Joined: 6/10/2006
From: Chair

quote:

ORIGINAL: Dirk Miggler

So Dreddheads bitterness towards this films production is more than just issues with "oversized" helmets and Karl Urban's Jaw bone structure ? Who knew ?????

The dude has issues that's for sure.

_____________________________

And I heard a voice in the midst of the four beasts
And I looked and behold, a pale horse
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And Hell followed with him.

(in reply to Dirk Miggler)

Post #: 32

RE: Dredd (2012): Poster Traumatic Stress Disorder - 13/1/2012 11:40:15 AM

shool

Posts: 9640
Joined: 24/3/2006
From: In The Pipe, Five by Five.

Spaldron, please either contribute, stop making snide comments about other posters or get out the thread.

We've asked you this before, dont make me get medievial on you.

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Post #: 33

RE: Dredd (2012): Poster Traumatic Stress Disorder - 13/1/2012 12:09:00 PM

Drew_231

Posts: 798
Joined: 7/5/2008

To be fair, everyones getting a bit sick of dreddhead

He's completely destroyed the previous thread, and is well on the way to doing the same here. Our people are dying senator! We must do something quickly

Anyways. Im interested in the presentation of Dredd in the film. I dont think hes ever supposed to be seen as the 'good guy' or 'hero' of the story. Take 'America' for example, where Dredds actions and stubborn commitment to uphold the law are questionable at best.
Hes not just a good cop trying to protect the city. Hes pretty much the symbol of a world where almost all personal freedom has been eliminated.

(in reply to shool)

Post #: 34

RE: Dredd (2012): Poster Traumatic Stress Disorder - 13/1/2012 12:12:52 PM

Spaldron

Posts: 10487
Joined: 6/10/2006
From: Chair

quote:

ORIGINAL: shool

Spaldron, please either contribute, stop making snide comments about other posters or get out the thread.

We've asked you this before, dont make me get medievial on you.

So others are allowed to bring it up but not me?

_____________________________

And I heard a voice in the midst of the four beasts
And I looked and behold, a pale horse
And his name that sat on him was Death
And Hell followed with him.

(in reply to shool)

Post #: 35

RE: Dredd (2012): Poster Traumatic Stress Disorder - 13/1/2012 12:16:06 PM

shool

Posts: 9640
Joined: 24/3/2006
From: In The Pipe, Five by Five.

No the others need to stop too.

Dreddheads posts are on topic and in the right thread. If you dont want to read his more "passionate" views then the best bet would be to use the block button.

_____________________________

Invisio Text for Spoilers
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"No one knows what it means, but it's provocative... It gets the people going!"

(in reply to Spaldron)

Post #: 36

RE: Dredd (2012) - 13/1/2012 12:24:09 PM

MonsterCat

Posts: 6411
Joined: 24/3/2011
From: St. Albans, Hertfordshire

quote:

ORIGINAL: shool

No the others need to stop too.

No, you're right. Sorry about the O/T post. Spaldron, maybe if we stop entertaining the guy he'll just stop and move on elsewhere?

So yeah, Urban looks the part, doesn't he?

< Message edited by MonsterCat -- 13/1/2012 12:28:29 PM >

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Post #: 37

RE: Dredd (2012): Look At His Little Willy! - 13/1/2012 4:05:24 PM

danbo1138

Posts: 7863
Joined: 10/6/2006
From: Always Outnumberd Never Outgunned!

quote:

ORIGINAL: sauchieboy

� The memories of the codpiece, the flying bikes and 'I ... am ... thelorr!' are so incongruous in tone to Dredd (2012) they'll have the same effect as your Mum showing your baby pictures to a girl you're trying to fuck.

LOL

Hit the nail on the head.
A shocking 'in your face' violent,blood n guts trailer would easily make folk realize that they ain't in Kansas anymore....

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Post #: 38

Dredd (2012): The Parallax Illusion - 13/1/2012 4:52:55 PM

sauchieboy

Posts: 303
Joined: 31/7/2011
From: The City Of Sauchie

quote:

furrybastard: Not generally a fan of 3D (in fact, I'm hoping there's a 2D version so I can avoid it altogether) but hopefully the first film will establish the tone and character well enough that it can get bigger, more expansive sequels!

I've never seen a film that uses the modern version of the 3D process, but I remember the old version being annoying and pointless.

Is the new process that much better and will Dredd (2012) serve as a good introduction to it?

(in reply to furrybastard)

Post #: 39

Dredd (2012): Don't You Ever Smile At A Crocodile - 14/1/2012 10:05:08 AM

sauchieboy

Posts: 303
Joined: 31/7/2011
From: The City Of Sauchie

quote:

Dirk Miggler: So Dreddhead's bitterness towards this film's production is more than just issues with "oversized" helmets and Karl Urban's Jaw bone structure ? Who knew ?????

Drew231: To be fair, everyones getting a bit sick of dreddhead He's completely destroyed the previous thread, and is well on the way to doing the same here. Our people are dying senator! We must do something quickly

Nothing Scott or anyone else says here will hurt the success of the film, and Karl Urban's life doesn't depend on us all clapping our hands to show we believe in fairies. Most people who pay to see Dredd (2012) will base their decision on what else is on at the pictures that night or available as part of Asda's two DVD's for �15 offer.

Complaints about Scott's mischief aren't, therefore, about much other than the complainer themselves, forum politics and a desire to enforce dull, counter-productive homogeneity (i). There's no such thing as a pointless post, any more than there's such a thing as a pointless film: there's only dull responses. It's up to you, the reader or viewer, to turn that lead into gold, and I don't think the Block button is the answer to anyone's problems.

The only reason I'm here is to get other people's perspective on things I've given a lot of thought to on my own. I'm not trying to change anyone else's opinion, but my own bristling fanboy outrage has subsided considerably since July. Hanging around here has been cheaper than therapy for my neurotic fretting over the new film's chances of success.

Looking back at my own earliest posts, I can see that having to distill my thoughts, and take into account the opinions of others, has given me a better perspective on what the new film can achieve. My favourite author and his most enduring creation have been given an opportunity to earn the financial rewards and mainstream recognition that Judge Dredd (1995) failed to provide: that's going to have to be enough for me, for this film.

(i) I'm talking generally, about ALL the many forums he frequents.

(in reply to Dirk Miggler)

Post #: 40

Dredd (2012): The People Know Where I Stand - 14/1/2012 10:06:57 AM

sauchieboy

Posts: 303
Joined: 31/7/2011
From: The City Of Sauchie

quote:

Drew231: I'm interested in the presentation of Dredd in the film. I don't think he's ever supposed to be seen as the 'good guy' or 'hero' of the story. Take America for example ... (h)e's not just a good cop trying to protect the city. He's pretty much the symbol of a world where almost all personal freedom has been eliminated.

jobloffski: after TDKR has come and gone, anyone who wants to go not too many years before seeing a laconic implacable hero with a square jaw looking after his city may find that gap filled by Dredd, and if Dredd gets a sequel, the Batman movies will already have done a good job of making discussion of the nature of law and order marketable

danbo1138: Blockmania and Apocalypse War for the sequels please

Thank you, Drew, thank you a thousand times. Dredd has neither hardened nor mellowed as the years have gone by, but the stories John Wagner's chosen to tell have expertly shifted readers' perceptions of his actions. Jobloffski's observation that 'there's no ... way an introductory film is going to get into the complexities of the stuff the strip looks at (over several decades) in an introductory reboot film' suggests how one of the most original and distinctive elements of the comic could be brought to the screen.

Dredd might well fill Jobloffski's Bat-shaped hole in cinema schedules, but if future Dredd films pursue the idea that "(Dredd's) only a wish-fulfilment if you want him to come in and clear up hell ... (but) he's a fascist, and he's dangerous" (ii); then, when he moves on from killing criminal gangs (in the first film) to locking up democrats in the sequels, audiences will be left wondering what happened to their new hero.

It would be a betrayal of Dredd's immutable character to have him undergo a traditional transformative character arc (encountering a problem, gaining self-knowledge, and using that to overcome his difficulties), but having the audience take that journey instead (just as readers of the comic did) towards a greater understanding of exactly what Dredd is- while the character and his actions remain completely consistent- would be original and subversive.

If, as danbo suggests, The Apocalypse War is where DNA see their films heading, that would be one of the most ambitious storytelling decisions in (mainstream) film history: that story climaxes with Dredd doing pretty much The Single Wrongest Thing Ever to 'protect his city'. It'd be interesting to make an audience root for and identify with Dredd's absolutist worldview then pull the rug from under them.

For the audience, coming to realise that the guy who's just committed genocide is exactly the same guy they were cheering when he was blowing away drug dealers (in the first movie) would be an interesting experience. If his actions and attitudes haven't changed, what is it about you as a viewer that has changed?

I don't know how much scope the impending film will have to ask who and what Dredd thinks he's protecting his city from (and whether they're any worse than him), but if DNA can find time to look at such things- inbetween the gunplay and explosions- they'll have succeeded in creating a character so morally ambivalent he'll make Christian Bale's conflicted hero look like Super Ted.

(i) Screenwriter Alex Garland, quoted in last September's Empire.

(in reply to Drew_231)

Post #: 41

RE: Dredd (2012): The Parallax Illusion - 14/1/2012 10:11:30 AM

Marwood

Posts: 2617
Joined: 1/10/2005
From: Only The Shadow knows

quote:

ORIGINAL: sauchieboy

�

quote:

furrybastard: Not generally a fan of 3D (in fact, I'm hoping there's a 2D version so I can avoid it altogether) but hopefully the first film will establish the tone and character well enough that it can get bigger, more expansive sequels!

I've never seen a film that uses the modern version of the 3D process, but I remember the old version being annoying and pointless.

Is the new process that much better and will Dredd (2012) serve as a good introduction to it?

Probably not; from personal experience the inclusion of 3D on most films is a waste of time that has done nothing but add to the reputation of it being a cheap gimmick to make some more money at the box office. The only films I've seen in 3D which I'd consider enhanced by it have been Avatar and Tron Legacy - in both cases it made these alien worlds feel more immersive and was well used in the action scenes. I think to achieve that kind of impact the 3D would be best used on Dredd for any Lawmaster sequences and tours through Mega City One but as we'd discussed on the old thread it's probably less likely for the film to have large sequences of futuristic cityscapes considering the budget. Unfortunately I suspect the use of 3D on this film is going to be the usual "shit flying at you" cheapness. If that's what you're after then cool but unless the trailer convinces me that it may be used for immersion and scope then I'll be sticking to 2D if I make a visit to the cinema.

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Post #: 42

RE: Dredd (2012): The Parallax Illusion - 14/1/2012 10:19:53 AM

superdan

Posts: 7327
Joined: 31/7/2008

My gut feeling is that the film is going to have a similar look and 'feel' to Priest, the Paul Bettany movie. I hope Dredd is better than that film though.

(in reply to Marwood)

Post #: 43

RE: Dredd (2012): The Parallax Illusion - 14/1/2012 11:34:28 AM

jobloffski

Posts: 1846
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: elsewhere

Absolutely S'Boy, complexities come later. That was basically my unspoken point. And it isn't necessarily MY bat shaped hole in the film calender I was referring to, but the opening for Dredd films to get into the grey areas of 'keeping the peace' Nolan's films can be seen to have created an appetite for that could be exploited. Naturally, in more overtly contentious and violent ways, given the nature of the source material.

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(in reply to superdan)

Post #: 44

Dredd (2012): 3D2BAD? - 14/1/2012 11:42:20 AM

sauchieboy

Posts: 303
Joined: 31/7/2011
From: The City Of Sauchie

quote:

Marwood: the 3D would be best used on Dredd for any Lawmaster sequences and tours through Mega City One, but as we'd discussed on the old thread it's probably less likely for the film to have large sequences of futuristic cityscapes, considering the budget. Unfortunately I suspect the use of 3D on this film is going to be the usual "shit flying at you" cheapness." cheapness

That storyboard sequence Scott posted on the old thread (http://img254.imageshack.us/img254/6915/newsc23.jpg) suggests there's going to be some of The Big Meg on show, even if it is speeding by in a blur. That might be an effective use of the parallax effect on which all 3D depends: stuff in the foreground moving at a different rate across the screen than the stuff in the background plane.

Just like Shadow of the Beast on the Commodore Amiga.

< Message edited by sauchieboy -- 14/1/2012 11:45:57 AM >

(in reply to Marwood)

Post #: 45

RE: Dredd (2012): Super Position - 14/1/2012 11:57:05 AM

sauchieboy

Posts: 303
Joined: 31/7/2011
From: The City Of Sauchie

Yeah, jobloffski, that was an overly-literal statement of your position. It is, however, the strip's gradual development of its depiction of Dredd and Justice Department, that I think would set DNA's films apart from the apres-Nolan deluge. There's no contradiction between that and what you described.

Having read the script (I haven't), and without giving anything away, do you think the groundwork is laid for that kind of development?

(in reply to jobloffski)

Post #: 46

Dredd (2012): The Real McCoy - 14/1/2012 12:05:36 PM

sauchieboy

Posts: 303
Joined: 31/7/2011
From: The City Of Sauchie

quote:

superdan: My gut feeling is that the film is going to have a similar look and 'feel' to Priest, the Paul Bettany movie. I hope Dredd is better than that film though.

I haven't seen Priest, batdan, but what I hear hasn't been good. Is Urban any good in it?

I've only ever seen him in the new Star Trek and Supremely Bourne: in the latter he was effective without hogging the limelight, in the former I thought he did pretty much what the part required- he played Deforest Kelly playing McCoy.

That makes me think he'll do a decent job of serving the interests of the new film, without imposing himself on the part or trying to turn it into a star-making performance. Fingers crossed.

(in reply to superdan)

Post #: 47

RE: Dredd (2012): 3D2BAD? - 14/1/2012 12:22:08 PM

dreddhead123

Posts: 282
Joined: 23/7/2010

quote:

If, as danbo suggests, The Apocalypse War is where DNA see their films heading, that would be one of the most ambitious storytelling decisions in (mainstream) film history: that story climaxes with Dredd doing pretty much The Single Wrongest Thing Ever to 'protect his city'. It'd be interesting to make an audience root for and identify with Dredd's absolutist worldview then pull the rug from under them.

Dredd 2012 will have to be one of the biggest hits in film history* for investors to come up with the cash to fund The Apocalypse War storyline. It's far too expensive and way beyond anything DNA Films has made in the past. You would need one, possibly two major studios, to invest in that kind of Judge Dredd film. It's never going to happen. Let's not forget, Dredd 2012 is Indian financed - it's not financed by an American studio. The most realistic scenario is: Dredd 2012 makes some decent profit and Dredd 3's budget is high enough to bring the Dark Judges - or Judge Death on his own - to life (or undead life!).

*The chances of Dredd 2012 making any sizable profit are small. Gamer and Conan - released in September and August, both Lionsgate distributed, failed to attract an audience. Subject to its production budget of $45 million dollars, I estimate Dredd 2012 needs to make at the very least around $90 - 100 million worldwide to justify a sequel (this would include DVD/Blu-ray sales).

Best case scenario - it mirrors Rambo 2008 box office:

Rambo (Lionsgate release)

Budget: $50,000,000 - Worldwide gross $113,244,290 (not sure if that figure includes DVD/Blu-ray sales)

Worst case scenario: it mirrors Punisher: War Zone's box office:

Punisher: War Zone (Lionsgate release) 2008

Budget: $35,000,000 - Worldwide gross: $10,100,036

Punisher 3 was a third attempt to get it right. Dredd 2012 is a second attempt to get Judge Dredd right. There's no guarantee there is a large enough fanbase/audience for a second Judge Dredd film so all fans have to be realistic about its box office chances. Thinking about The Apocalypse War for Dredd 3 is like thinking about what you will buy with your lottery winnings before you've bought a ticket!

< Message edited by dreddhead123 -- 14/1/2012 12:35:01 PM >

(in reply to sauchieboy)

Post #: 48

Dredd (2012): The Numbers Racket - 14/1/2012 12:44:58 PM

sauchieboy

Posts: 303
Joined: 31/7/2011
From: The City Of Sauchie

This is an area, Scott, where I'm happy to defer to other people's knowledge and expertise. As soon as anyone starts talking the dull practicalities of film finance the monkeys in my brain start picking fleas off each other, but your figures make sobering reading.

Rambo had a built-in audience, so if your figures are accurate (and comparing like for like) it's difficult to see Dredd (2012) outstripping the former Judge Dredd star's movie. Anyone able to dispute Scott's presentation of those numbers?

And on a related note, does anyone think the forthcoming Expendables 2 could scupper the new Dredd film's chances at the box office by taking up too much of Lionsgate's promotions budget and attention, being released only weeks before Dredd (2012)?

If Stallone ruins another Judge Dredd film's chances of success we're going to have to put a hit on him.

(in reply to dreddhead123)

Post #: 49

RE: Dredd (2012): The Real McCoy - 14/1/2012 12:56:04 PM

superdan

Posts: 7327
Joined: 31/7/2008

quote:

ORIGINAL: sauchieboy

quote:

superdan: My gut feeling is that the film is going to have a similar look and 'feel' to Priest, the Paul Bettany movie. I hope Dredd is better than that film though.

I haven't seen Priest, batdan, but what I hear hasn't been good. Is Urban any good in it?

No-one is that good in it (it's a pretty poor film) but it does have a nice aesthetic to it visually. I do quite like Urban as an actor though.

quote:

Best case scenario - it mirrors Rambo 2008 box office
Worst case scenario: it mirrors Punisher: War Zone's box office

The irony there of course is that Punisher:War Zone is a much better film than Rambo '08.

(in reply to sauchieboy)

Post #: 50

RE: Dredd (2012): Super Position - 14/1/2012 1:18:06 PM

jobloffski

Posts: 1846
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: elsewhere

quote:

ORIGINAL: sauchieboy

Yeah, jobloffski, that was an overly-literal statement of your position. It is, however, the strip's gradual development of its depiction of Dredd and Justice Department, that I think would set DNA's films apart from the apres-Nolan deluge. There's no contradiction between that and what you described.

Having read the script (I haven't), and without giving anything away, do you think the groundwork is laid for that kind of development?

It presents the viciousness of the world, what the Judges are up against and pretty much a 'sole rep of the law scenario'. So there's no reason the necessary attitude under the presented circumstances couldn't be 'greyed up' a bit by Dredd having the same attitude whatever the circumstances, and the context providing the satire of how such enforcement of the law affects people who aren't perps. Also. given Dredd's placement as 'granite face' whatever the circumstances, via other Judges perhaps enjoying what they do too much, being utterly indiscriminate, letting personal rancour guide theor actions, whatever, the notion of whether those with power are necessarily suited to the fair wielding of it can be raised very easily. Then the necessity for Judges to require the power they have can be regularly reasserted via the nature of the threat in particular stories. And naturally, the acts of the main character, can be purely logical in whether they uphold the law while at the same time being excessive enough to stop Dredd being a traditional 'moral' hero.

The american constitution and the whole assertion that it should be ensured that (I probably paraphrase slightly) whatever keeps us safe should also keep us free', along with the disparity between humanity and enforcing the is surely something that
could provide any number of opportunities for future development.

One thing I didn't mention in my assertion that the 'trapped in a residential block' can be seen to be a proxy for the city itself is the fact that people can't get out of the block, correlates with the in story world fact that they can't safely get out of the city. So, in that regard, it's an even more complete 'symbol for the city' to depict a residential area from which there is no escape, Judges versus perps and everybody else caught in the crossfire. And that theme established, from there any kind of Dredd story can be developed, Which ultimately, makes it a little more sophisticated than 'Die Hard in Mega City One'.

< Message edited by jobloffski -- 14/1/2012 1:36:44 PM >

_____________________________

Yes, dreamers dream and doers do. But if dreamers DON'T dream, doers don't have anything TO do. Everything that is only here because people exist, only exists because someone thought of it., or in other words, dreamed it.

(in reply to sauchieboy)

Post #: 51

RE: Dredd (2012): The Real McCoy - 14/1/2012 1:56:58 PM

dreddhead123

Posts: 282
Joined: 23/7/2010

quote:

This is an area, Scott, where I'm happy to defer to other people's knowledge and expertise. As soon as anyone starts talking the dull practicalities of film finance the monkeys in my brain start picking fleas off each other, but your figures make sobering reading. Rambo had a built-in audience, so if your figures are accurate (and comparing like for like) it's difficult to see Dredd (2012) outstripping the former Judge Dredd star's movie. Anyone able to dispute Scott's presentation of those numbers? And on a related note, does anyone think the forthcoming Expendables 2 could scupper the new Dredd film's chances at the box office by taking up too much of Lionsgate's promotions budget and attention, being released only weeks before Dredd (2012)? If Stallone ruins another Judge Dredd film's chances of success we're going to have to put a hit on him.

Well from what I understand - a film has to make 2 or 2.5 times its total production/marketing cost to make profit. Cinema chains take a percentage of the gross each week a film is on general release.

quote:

So generally, how much of the domestic box office revenue goes to the studios?

The percentage of revenues that the exhibitor takes in depends on the individual contract for that film � which in turn depends on how much muscle the distributor has, according to Stone.

These deals often protect the theaters from movies that bomb at the box office by giving the theaters a bigger cut of those films. So if a film only makes $10 million at the box office, the distributor will get only 45 percent of that money. But if a film makes $300 million at the box office, then the distributor gets up to 60 percent of that money.

You can actually look at the securities filings for the big theater chains, to look at how much of their ticket revenues go back to the studios, points out Stone. So for example, the latest quarterly filing by Cinemark Holdings, shows that 54.5 percent of its ticket revenues went to the distributors. So as a ballpark figure, studios generally take in around 50-55 percent of U.S. box office money.

The impact of DVD sales - this quote doesn't refer to Blu-ray sales but I assume Blu-ray now accounts for some of the profits to be made when a film is released for the home video market:

quote:

DVD rentals and sales can tack on up to $60-$100 mil for a big title and TV rights, merchandise, and many other avenues can generate income," says Chad Hartigan, a box office analyst with Exhibitor Relations.

And the studios get a much bigger cut of DVD revenues than they do of theatrical revenues, because the retailers aren't as "significant of a middle man" as the theater owners, according to Paul Dergarabedian, president of Hollywood.com's Box Office division. There are a lot of costs that go into running a movie theater, and showing movies is all the movie theater does � unlike most places where DVDs are sold.

There are some genres of film that do especially well on DVD � like horror films, which are often cheaper to make than other genres to begin with, says Dergarabedian. A horror movie might or might not break even at the theaters, but it's sure to make lots more money when it hits DVD.

But actually, the trend towards studios depending on DVD sales may have peaked already � in 2009, for the first time in a decade, theatrical box office revenue was bigger than home-video revenue, says BoxOfficeAnalysts' Stone.

George Lucas company LucasFilm recently claimed Return of the Jedi has never made any profit:

http://www.slashfilm.com/lucasfilm-tells-darth-vader-that-return-of-the-jedi-hasnt-made-a-profit/

Films can make huge money at the box office but it doesn't mean they're profitable for the studio. This is some weird twilight zone aspect of film making:

quote:

profit and loss are in the eye of the beholder � a lot of people were shocked when leaked financial statements showed that Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix had allegedly lost $167 million, despite $967 million in global revenues.

http://www.deadline.com/2010/07/studio-shame-even-harry-potter-pic-loses-money-because-of-warner-bros-phony-baloney-accounting/

You need to be an accountant to understand that (a crooked accountant!).

I think approx $100 million worldwide gross would be the sort of figure to guarantee a third Judge Dredd film.

(in reply to superdan)

Post #: 52

RE: Dredd (2012): The Real McCoy - 14/1/2012 1:57:18 PM

dreddhead123

Posts: 282
Joined: 23/7/2010

Repeated post! Now deleted.

< Message edited by dreddhead123 -- 14/1/2012 2:00:31 PM >

(in reply to superdan)

Post #: 53

Dredd (2012): The Second Last Action Hero - 14/1/2012 2:05:03 PM

sauchieboy

Posts: 303
Joined: 31/7/2011
From: The City Of Sauchie

quote:

No-one is that good in it (it's a pretty poor film) but it does have a nice aesthetic to it visually. I do quite like Urban as an actor though.

Yeah, the trailer I saw for Priest at least looked good. Max Von Sydow's in it too, which is just another of the weird connections between this new Dredd film and its predecessor (like Stallone having a movie distributed by the same company at the same time as Dredd (2012)). I'm not superstitious, but I hope such coincidencies are just that, and not portents of things to come.

quote:

Best case scenario - Dredd mirrors Rambo 2008 box office
Worst case scenario: Dredd mirrors Punisher: War Zone's box office

The irony there of course is that Punisher:War Zone is a much better film than Rambo '08.

I've only seen Rambo, which leads me to another point. Dredd's got a relatively clear field hasn't it? I can't remember the last Action film I was genuinely excited about. Everyone seems to make Bourne-lite or toy licenses nowadays. If Karl and Co come up with a nasty Action film for grown-ups, they don't have a ton of competition.

< Message edited by sauchieboy -- 14/1/2012 2:06:58 PM >

(in reply to superdan)

Post #: 54

Dredd (2012): The (tax) Returns Of The Jedi - 14/1/2012 2:18:15 PM

sauchieboy

Posts: 303
Joined: 31/7/2011
From: The City Of Sauchie

Thanks, Scott; you can be a useful little helper monkey when you play nice, Pal. That Lucasfilm link Scott posted is illuminating and utterly shameful.

No wonder John Wagner's still bitching about his screen-credit-and-not-much-else experience of the first Judge Dredd film. Let's hope that Lawyer he hired for the Button Man negotiations helped out when DNA were after the rights for Dredd (2012).

(in reply to dreddhead123)

Post #: 55

RE: Dredd (2012): The Second Last Action Hero - 14/1/2012 2:34:14 PM

dreddhead123

Posts: 282
Joined: 23/7/2010

quote:

. If Karl and Co come up with a nasty Action film for grown-ups, they don't have a ton of competition.

Well, this is a nasty action film for grown-ups.... didn't do that well...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P2g94xQmtHw

Similar budget to Dredd (50 million), similar release date (September), same distributor (Lionsgate), well-known actor in the lead (Gerard Butler), violent action (similar to Dredd).

quote:

Gamer was not a box office success. It opened with just $3.3 million and ranked fourth at the box office. In total, the film earned $9,156,057 in its opening weekend. Overall, the film grossed $20,534,907 in the United States and Canadian box office with a worldwide cumulative of $39,383,813.

The film failed to recoup its original production budget.

It's impossible to accurately predict how well Dredd 2012 will do. However, based on Gamer, I'd say Dredd's chances of big box office success are small. Another example would be 2011's Killer Elite. An action film released in September - budget 66 million, worldwide gross of $52,962,024.

The relative apathy for R (18) rated action films - and those released outside of the summer and winter seasons - would suggest Dredd 2012 has a hard challenge to appeal to enough film goers. If you really are John Wagner, Sauchieboy, I reckon you should downscale your box office expectations for Dredd 2012 because action films like Gamer, Conan, Killer Elite, Crank: High Voltage, The Mechanic suggest Dredd 2012 will most likely make around $40 - 60 million worldwide rather than $100 million. I don't think $40 - 60 million will be enough to warrant a third Judge Dredd film.

I think DNA and Lionsgate are asking for trouble making Dredd R rated. I think they should lower the rating to try to appeal to younger teenagers and even some dads. R rating is too risky and there's enough examples of R rated action films underperforming. 20th Century Fox released Die Hard 4 as PG 13. They knew this would increase the potential box office. Previous Die Hard films - R rated in the US.

R rated Dredd - based on a cult British comic strip - and a reboot of the 1995 film (which not many people liked!) - is too risky.

I think Dredd 2012's trailer will be like Gamer's. I've never seen Gamer but the trailer looks quite good. Lots of action and some cool shots.

< Message edited by dreddhead123 -- 14/1/2012 3:03:16 PM >

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Post #: 56

RE: Dredd (2012): The Second Last Action Hero - 14/1/2012 2:59:26 PM

DARKO_DONNIE_DONUT

Posts: 195
Joined: 14/1/2012

There are some comic icons that can switch over to other mediums,problem is i'm not sure Judge Dredd is one.
Heres hoping im wrong.

(in reply to dreddhead123)

Post #: 57

RE: Dredd (2012): The Second Last Action Hero - 14/1/2012 3:03:54 PM

jobloffski

Posts: 1846
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: elsewhere

It all comes down to whether or not a film is a load of arse, and Gamer isARSE

In slightly more grown up terms, it has a rather cool central conceit that nobody really knew how to turn into a story. The story would have been better if people were being captured for the game for the first half and escaping for the second. Then there might have been some character building for Butler's role and focus for the film that relied on people thinking the central conceit was so cool, nothing else was needed. If Dredd is no better than Gamer, it's fucked.

< Message edited by jobloffski -- 14/1/2012 3:09:36 PM >

_____________________________

Yes, dreamers dream and doers do. But if dreamers DON'T dream, doers don't have anything TO do. Everything that is only here because people exist, only exists because someone thought of it., or in other words, dreamed it.

(in reply to dreddhead123)

Post #: 58

RE: Dredd (2012): The Second Last Action Hero - 14/1/2012 3:07:37 PM

superdan

Posts: 7327
Joined: 31/7/2008

^ Truth.

D'oh, stupid new page. I was agreeing with jobloffski's assertion that Gamer is arse.

< Message edited by superdan -- 14/1/2012 3:17:37 PM >

(in reply to jobloffski)

Post #: 59

RE: Dredd (2012): The Second Last Action Hero - 14/1/2012 3:35:59 PM

dreddhead123

Posts: 282
Joined: 23/7/2010

quote:

There are some comic icons that can switch over to other mediums,problem is i'm not sure Judge Dredd is one.
Heres hoping im wrong

The appeal of 2000AD is because it's a comic. I know that's stating the obvious but what I mean is the appeal of Judge Dredd does originate from the format - the art, the panels, the old newsprint paper, the cliffhanger end panel each week. It's that sort of 'comic page vibe' that you can't fully translate to a film.

When a film is made you're forced to accept a different version - the Danny Cannon version and the new Pete 'not fired, honestly, I wasn't!' Travis version.

You're stuck with a defined interpretation of Judge Dredd and his world. Alex Garland has his vision and we'll have to see if it captures enough of the comic strip 'vibe'. If he's a real fan there's a chance he can, but the overall tone of the screenplay does suggest Garland's inspiration didn't come from John Wagner's work but the action flick: Die Hard.

< Message edited by dreddhead123 -- 14/1/2012 3:38:21 PM >

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Post #: 60