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RE: Osama Bin Laden Dead - 9/5/2011 9:23:42 AM   
jediwarrior


Posts: 20015
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Kilo_T_Mortal

So no one is a little uncomfortable that the US can go to a foreign country and execute someone without trial? Justice or revenge?


No the guy was a terrorist not a international leader. Ain't the first time the yanks have taken one out and won't be the last.

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Post #: 271
RE: Osama Bin Laden Dead - 9/5/2011 11:22:29 AM   
adambatman82

 

Posts: 11156
Joined: 15/12/2005

quote:

ORIGINAL: Spaldron

Just seen a report on the BBC where the locals near the compound are all denying the assault took place at all. A guy living nearby claims the US were never there and it was faked. Also another local says he knows the guy in the new photo's released and it ain't Bin Laden...


Complete bullshit. Even *if* the US were to fake such an event, do you not think they would have at least stages some kind of phoney raid, so that when the worlds media arrived to cover the story the governments story tied in with that of the locals?

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Post #: 272
RE: Osama Bin Laden Dead - 9/5/2011 4:09:30 PM   
spamandham

 

Posts: 518
Joined: 27/11/2008
quote:

ORIGINAL: Kilo_T_Mortal

So no one is a little uncomfortable that the US can go to a foreign country and execute someone without trial? Justice or revenge?



It's called murder, and it's nauseating to watch people cheer it, even if the victim was a criminal.

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Post #: 273
RE: Osama Bin Laden Dead - 9/5/2011 4:34:12 PM   
Woger


Posts: 3813
Joined: 30/9/2005
Not as nauseating as seeing people get more worked up over the death of Bin Laden than the deaths of protestors in Syria etc

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Post #: 274
RE: Osama Bin Laden Dead - 9/5/2011 4:36:10 PM   
Woger


Posts: 3813
Joined: 30/9/2005

quote:

ORIGINAL: Spaldron

Just seen a report on the BBC where the locals near the compound are all denying the assault took place at all. A guy living nearby claims the US were never there and it was faked. Also another local says he knows the guy in the new photo's released and it ain't Bin Laden...


Was it Ali G, and was his mate Dave?

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Post #: 275
RE: Osama Bin Laden Dead - 9/5/2011 5:04:18 PM   
Darth Marenghi

 

Posts: 3194
Joined: 10/10/2010
From: Manchester

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kilo_T_Mortal

So no one is a little uncomfortable that the US can go to a foreign country and execute someone without trial? Justice or revenge?


It is dodgy, although wasn't the plan to capture him?


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Post #: 276
RE: Osama Bin Laden Dead - 9/5/2011 5:32:20 PM   
Spaldron


Posts: 10485
Joined: 6/10/2006
From: Chair

quote:

ORIGINAL: adambatman82


quote:

ORIGINAL: Spaldron

Just seen a report on the BBC where the locals near the compound are all denying the assault took place at all. A guy living nearby claims the US were never there and it was faked. Also another local says he knows the guy in the new photo's released and it ain't Bin Laden...


Complete bullshit. Even *if* the US were to fake such an event, do you not think they would have at least stages some kind of phoney raid, so that when the worlds media arrived to cover the story the governments story tied in with that of the locals?


Don't shoot the messenger.


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Post #: 277
RE: Osama Bin Laden Dead - 9/5/2011 9:38:36 PM   
Fluke Skywalker


Posts: 9540
Joined: 23/4/2006
From: the dark side of the sun
quote:

ORIGINAL: Woger

Not as nauseating as seeing people get more worked up over the death of Bin Laden than the deaths of protestors in Syria etc


And of course no way near as nauseating as seeing absolutely zero justice for people like Bush and his cronies whose crimes have caused the deaths of at the very least a hundred thousand people and suffering to millions.

And another good reason for nausea is the way we don't seem to want to topple Bahrain's dictatorship where troops have been firing on protestors. (If you didn't know the US Navy's Fifth Fleet operates out of Bahrain)

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Post #: 278
RE: Osama Bin Laden Dead - 9/5/2011 9:48:32 PM   
Spaldron


Posts: 10485
Joined: 6/10/2006
From: Chair

quote:

ORIGINAL: Fluke Skywalker

quote:

ORIGINAL: Woger

Not as nauseating as seeing people get more worked up over the death of Bin Laden than the deaths of protestors in Syria etc


And of course no way near as nauseating as seeing absolutely zero justice for people like Bush and his cronies whose crimes have caused the deaths of at the very least a hundred thousand people and suffering to millions.

And another good reason for nausea is the way we don't seem to want to topple Bahrain's dictatorship where troops have been firing on protestors. (If you didn't know the US Navy's Fifth Fleet operates out of Bahrain)



This ^




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Post #: 279
RE: Osama Bin Laden Dead - 9/5/2011 10:50:55 PM   
Woger


Posts: 3813
Joined: 30/9/2005
Yes, poor Bin Laden.

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Post #: 280
RE: Osama Bin Laden Dead - 9/5/2011 10:58:27 PM   
MonsterCat


Posts: 7932
Joined: 24/3/2011
From: St. Albans, Hertfordshire

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kilo_T_Mortal

So no one is a little uncomfortable that the US can go to a foreign country and execute someone without trial?



No. Fuck him.

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Post #: 281
RE: Osama Bin Laden Dead - 9/5/2011 11:00:45 PM   
Shifty Bench

 

Posts: 15396
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Land of the Scots
quote:

ORIGINAL: Kilo_T_Mortal

So no one is a little uncomfortable that the US can go to a foreign country and execute someone without trial? Justice or revenge?


It was clearly revenge but I'm not to going to cry for Bin Laden.


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Post #: 282
RE: Osama Bin Laden Dead - 9/5/2011 11:02:17 PM   
furrybastard

 

Posts: 5174
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Ireland
quote:

ORIGINAL: Kilo_T_Mortal

So no one is a little uncomfortable that the US can go to a foreign country and execute someone without trial? Justice or revenge?


http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/may/09/osama-bin-laden-us-pakistan-deal

Looks like Pakistan's goverment are in deeper trouble after this...

I think a trial would have been almost impossible, frankly.  In fact, he'd probably get off if they tried him for the 9/11 attacks (witnesses?  Witnesses that aren't compromised by torture/bias!?)  His Wanted information on the FBI page had him down for the 1998 attacks, not the 2001 WTC attack because solid evidence was difficult to pin down. Unless Osama was willing to plead guilty, it would have been an absolute circus.  He and Al Queda have taken credit for the attack but put any of them in a courtroom and they'll plead not guilty for obvious reasons, or argue the terrorist cell were acting of their own volition and not under any direct orders. It would be a very long, drawn-out trial that would most likely end in compromise, which wouldn't go over well with anybody I should think.

It's most definitely an argument worth having though.  The Western world has supposedly built itself on institutions like democracy and justice and it's cases like this that we need to confront and question in order to protect those values.


< Message edited by furrybastard -- 9/5/2011 11:11:51 PM >

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Post #: 283
RE: Osama Bin Laden Dead - 9/5/2011 11:15:07 PM   
Fluke Skywalker


Posts: 9540
Joined: 23/4/2006
From: the dark side of the sun
I wouldn't have had any problem executing him after a trial, but shooting him dead when unarmed and then making up a bunch of lies about how it went down before dumping him in the sea and witholding any proof of his death really isn't really the best to make people trust you. Then again they are a superpower and do what the fuck they want, and the media usefully brainwashes the sheep into believing they are they good guys.

It does make you think why they'd want to execute him in this fashion, afterall the Nazis were all tried - maybe rather unsavoury facts about his connections to various people could never be allowed to come to light - the Saudis, Pakistanis, Americans they all no doubt had their reasons for silencing the fucker.

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Post #: 284
RE: Osama Bin Laden Dead - 10/5/2011 1:02:51 AM   
furrybastard

 

Posts: 5174
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Ireland
I'm not so sure it's fair to call it an execution as we don't have all the facts and it's likely the team that went in weren't going to take any chances. Osama would have had enough time to realize what was going on (I would think...) and they must have been prepared for any eventuality, like suicide vests etc. Hell, it could have come down to the individual soldier at that precise moment. Regardless, these situations can't be distinguished as starkly right or wrong, it's more like a grey fog!

And as I said, I don't believe a fair trial would have even been realistic in this situation. Look at how much trouble they've had attempting to try Guantanoma prisoners.  It's not parallel to the Nazi trials which was a traditional army/state; these guys don't operate in the same way are are not represented or recognized as a distinct national entity. Besides, the Germans' tendency to write everything down and have orderly, detailed accounts of everything worked against them in that case!

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Post #: 285
RE: Osama Bin Laden Dead - 10/5/2011 4:56:52 AM   
Kilo_T_Mortal


Posts: 13531
Joined: 30/9/2005
Surely the difficulty in bringing a case against him means it's difficult to establish that he was resposible for September 11th? If that's the case what are they really getting him for?
I'm sure there are other people who it would be hard to put on trial, should we make this the basis for their execution?

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Post #: 286
RE: Osama Bin Laden Dead - 10/5/2011 7:20:58 AM   
sanchia


Posts: 17995
Joined: 3/1/2006
From: Norwich

quote:

ORIGINAL: Darth Marenghi


quote:

ORIGINAL: Kilo_T_Mortal

So no one is a little uncomfortable that the US can go to a foreign country and execute someone without trial? Justice or revenge?


It is dodgy, although wasn't the plan to capture him?


Apparently they have admitted they never planned a live capture.

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Post #: 287
RE: Osama Bin Laden Dead - 11/5/2011 8:39:40 PM   
white mage

 

Posts: 181
Joined: 29/11/2007
From: Hollow Bastion
All I can say is took them long enough to find him. What I don't understand is why it was on the front of the Sun that supporters are targeting Prince Harry over Bin Larden's death. The Bristish soliders didn't kill him did they? It was the American soliders.

< Message edited by white mage -- 11/5/2011 8:40:40 PM >


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Post #: 288
RE: Osama Bin Laden Dead - 11/5/2011 9:09:20 PM   
Keyser Sozzled


Posts: 5993
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From: Dublin
Well that sounds like the usual sound, incisive geopolitical journalism I would expect from the Sun.

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Post #: 289
RE: Osama Bin Laden Dead - 16/5/2011 3:41:35 PM   
Cruisecontroller


Posts: 4426
Joined: 28/4/2006
His death is a definite blow to Al Qiedia but I`m not sure if it will make the world a safer place. This isn`t like the sucide of Hitler meaning the final end of the Nazis reign in mainland Europe Al Qiedia well just replace him with someone else and if anything will step up their campaign in revenge. There HQ has been inflitrated but he wasn`t running the whole organization. I can understand New Yorkers wanting to celebrate his death after what they`ve been through but no matter how evil someone is I couldn`t rejoice at their death. Then again I haven`t been affected by 9/11 and the death of a loved one as a result like they probably have.

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Post #: 290
RE: Osama Bin Laden Dead - 16/5/2011 6:56:48 PM   
Darth Marenghi

 

Posts: 3194
Joined: 10/10/2010
From: Manchester

quote:

ORIGINAL: sanchia


quote:

ORIGINAL: Darth Marenghi


quote:

ORIGINAL: Kilo_T_Mortal

So no one is a little uncomfortable that the US can go to a foreign country and execute someone without trial? Justice or revenge?


It is dodgy, although wasn't the plan to capture him?


Apparently they have admitted they never planned a live capture.


Ah. Well I have to say I'm with Kilo on this one then.


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Post #: 291
RE: Osama Bin Laden Dead - 18/5/2011 10:58:52 AM   
Mike_003

 

Posts: 22
Joined: 14/5/2011
quote:

ORIGINAL: Cruisecontroller

His death is a definite blow to Al Qiedia but I`m not sure if it will make the world a safer place. This isn`t like the sucide of Hitler meaning the final end of the Nazis reign in mainland Europe Al Qiedia well just replace him with someone else and if anything will step up their campaign in revenge. There HQ has been inflitrated but he wasn`t running the whole organization. I can understand New Yorkers wanting to celebrate his death after what they`ve been through but no matter how evil someone is I couldn`t rejoice at their death. Then again I haven`t been affected by 9/11 and the death of a loved one as a result like they probably have.


Yes, somehow true. I accept you words that this is not the end. Yes, this is just the dawn and we need to finish all the terrorists. They are agitated now and will surely take some step to fight against Americans. Now we actually need to fasten our operations.

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Post #: 292
RE: Osama Bin Laden Dead - 18/5/2011 12:54:25 PM   
Keyser Sozzled


Posts: 5993
Joined: 1/10/2006
From: Dublin
Eh, what?

How do you propose to fasten your operations, invade somewhere else?

Bin Laden was an evil mofo, no doubt and in my opinion the world is a little better with him not in it. But to use his death as a justification for other means stikes me as part of the reason the US has got themselves into trouble with the Foreign affairs policy already.

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Post #: 293
RE: Osama Bin Laden Dead - 18/5/2011 1:23:25 PM   
Titanm21


Posts: 1170
Joined: 18/10/2006
From: The Womb
"Yes, this is just the dawn and we need to finish all the terrorists"

The more you kill the more there will be... the invasion of Iraq showed us that. Maybe if we could find a way to work alongside those in the middle east instead of going down the war option we can create more understanding between all parties and find a peaceful solution.

Or we could just blow the fuck out of anyone and everything until we win... cause that'll work out I'm sure

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Post #: 294
RE: Osama Bin Laden Dead - 19/5/2011 8:33:42 AM   
Mike_003

 

Posts: 22
Joined: 14/5/2011
Look my friend, its absolutely impossible t kill all the terrorists. With agitation, more will grow up. The best way is to find a peaceful solution or else, it will never end. The good teachings will only help. It will take time, but work will be done.

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Post #: 295
RE: Osama Bin Laden Dead - 7/8/2011 4:14:03 PM   
Spaldron


Posts: 10485
Joined: 6/10/2006
From: Chair
So anyone see the news the other day about the 31 US special forces killed when their helicopter got shot down in Afghan? Apparently 20 of them were part of the squad that "killed" Bin Laden.

So first we're told that Bin Laden was killed in a US raid on his compound, despite some claims he's been dead for years (if he even existed in the first place) and contrary to some eyewitnesses in the area who saw no raid at all. Then they quickly bury him at sea without providing a shred of evidence proving they had him in the first place, and the white house refuses to release photo's of his corpse (if there was one).

And now the troops who we're told were involved in his assassination are shot down by a simple Taliban rocket, despite instances of this kind of attack being extremely rare and the fact that US helicopters have anti missile capabilities and one carrying special forces would probably have had extra protection. All potential witnesses to the original raid and/or what really happened are nicely done away with.

Convenient eh?

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And I looked and behold, a pale horse
And his name that sat on him was Death
And Hell followed with him.

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Post #: 296
RE: Osama Bin Laden Dead - 7/8/2011 4:15:58 PM   
Rgirvan44


Posts: 19037
Joined: 10/3/2006
From: Punishment Park
If Bin Laden wasn't killed at the compound why did Al Queda issue a release confirming it had happened?

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Post #: 297
RE: Osama Bin Laden Dead - 7/8/2011 4:19:23 PM   
Hood_Man


Posts: 12116
Joined: 30/9/2005

quote:

ORIGINAL: Spaldron

So anyone see the news the other day about the 31 US special forces killed when their helicopter got shot down in Afghan? Apparently 20 of them were part of the squad that "killed" Bin Laden.

So first we're told that Bin Laden was killed in a US raid on his compound, despite some claims he's been dead for years (if he even existed in the first place) and contrary to some eyewitnesses in the area who saw no raid at all. Then they quickly bury him at sea without providing a shred of evidence proving they had him in the first place, and the white house refuses to release photo's of his corpse (if there was one).

And now the troops who we're told were involved in his assassination are shot down by a simple Taliban rocket, despite instances of this kind of attack being extremely rare and the fact that US helicopters have anti missile capabilities and one carrying special forces would probably have had extra protection. All potential witnesses to the original raid and/or what really happened are nicely done away with.

Convenient eh?

You've got to change your avatar if you're going to post conspiracy theories

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Post #: 298
RE: Osama Bin Laden Dead - 7/8/2011 4:19:30 PM   
Rgirvan44


Posts: 19037
Joined: 10/3/2006
From: Punishment Park
And what the heck do you mean by "if he ever existed?"

You need to stop reading the crazy dude.


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Post #: 299
RE: Osama Bin Laden Dead - 7/8/2011 4:45:14 PM   
horribleives

 

Posts: 4975
Joined: 12/6/2009
From: The North
quote:

ORIGINAL: Spaldron

So anyone see the news the other day about the 31 US special forces killed when their helicopter got shot down in Afghan? Apparently 20 of them were part of the squad that "killed" Bin Laden.

So first we're told that Bin Laden was killed in a US raid on his compound, despite some claims he's been dead for years (if he even existed in the first place) and contrary to some eyewitnesses in the area who saw no raid at all. Then they quickly bury him at sea without providing a shred of evidence proving they had him in the first place, and the white house refuses to release photo's of his corpse (if there was one).

And now the troops who we're told were involved in his assassination are shot down by a simple Taliban rocket, despite instances of this kind of attack being extremely rare and the fact that US helicopters have anti missile capabilities and one carrying special forces would probably have had extra protection. All potential witnesses to the original raid and/or what really happened are nicely done away with.

Convenient eh?


Not all a of them, there were plenty of other eyewitnesses at the scene who have described the raid, as well as the other special forces involved who weren't part of the squad just killed in Afghanistan.

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