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RE: The Avengers - 3/3/2011 6:44:39 PM   
Beno


Posts: 8124
Joined: 15/2/2007
From: Sheffield
POSSIBLE SPOILER .......

Highlight below :

Latino Review are confidently saying that Loki and The Skrulls are the big bads in The Avengers movie.


Sorry cant get a link up.

_____________________________

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Post #: 151
RE: The Avengers - 4/3/2011 12:55:34 PM   
Marwood

 

Posts: 2617
Joined: 1/10/2005
From: Only The Shadow knows

quote:

ORIGINAL: Beno

POSSIBLE SPOILER .......

Highlight below :

Latino Review are confidently saying that Loki and The Skrulls are the big bads in The Avengers movie.


Sorry cant get a link up.


Not massive shocks, Tom Hiddleston has hinted a few times before that he's part of the film and the Skrulls are long rumoured. I'll say again that I think the Skrulls will be handled more like The Ultimates Vol 1 than the classic big ass invasion (at least until the third act).

_____________________________

Bilbo: What about the Ewoks? They were rubbish.

Tim: Yeah but Jar Jar Binks makes the Ewoks look like f***ing Shaft!

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Post #: 152
RE: The Avengers - 4/3/2011 6:24:05 PM   
BatFan


Posts: 2124
Joined: 27/7/2006
quote:

ORIGINAL: Marwood


quote:

ORIGINAL: Beno

POSSIBLE SPOILER .......

Highlight below :

Latino Review are confidently saying that Loki and The Skrulls are the big bads in The Avengers movie.


Sorry cant get a link up.


Not massive shocks, Tom Hiddleston has hinted a few times before that he's part of the film and the Skrulls are long rumoured. I'll say again that I think the Skrulls will be handled more like The Ultimates Vol 1 than the classic big ass invasion (at least until the third act).


The link says Loki uses the cosmic cube to summon the Skrulls so I imagine it will be a huge invasion, just not sure when during the film it will be. Right now the film sounds like a mix of Ultimates 1 and 2 minus the invaders and the kree.

Edit: There are also reports that Marvel have shot a teaser trailer for The Avengers already which would explain what Mark Ruffalo was saying recently about him already doing motion capture as Hulk. I'd love it if the trailer was attached to the end of Captain America, it'd be just like the end of Back To The Future 2, you think it's finished and you've got a semi-cliffhanger, the credits are about to roll when... BOOM next summer! cue trailer showing the Avengers all together and maybe a hint at the story, then credits. Audience walks out thinking HOLY SHIT!

< Message edited by BatFan -- 4/3/2011 6:33:19 PM >


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Post #: 153
RE: The Avengers - 7/3/2011 10:18:38 AM   
lukeyboy


Posts: 1638
Joined: 11/10/2005
From: Saaaaf Laaandaan you slaaag!

quote:

ORIGINAL: BatFan

quote:

ORIGINAL: Marwood


quote:

ORIGINAL: Beno

POSSIBLE SPOILER .......

Highlight below :

Latino Review are confidently saying that Loki and The Skrulls are the big bads in The Avengers movie.


Sorry cant get a link up.


Not massive shocks, Tom Hiddleston has hinted a few times before that he's part of the film and the Skrulls are long rumoured. I'll say again that I think the Skrulls will be handled more like The Ultimates Vol 1 than the classic big ass invasion (at least until the third act).


The link says Loki uses the cosmic cube to summon the Skrulls so I imagine it will be a huge invasion, just not sure when during the film it will be. Right now the film sounds like a mix of Ultimates 1 and 2 minus the invaders and the kree.

Edit: There are also reports that Marvel have shot a teaser trailer for The Avengers already which would explain what Mark Ruffalo was saying recently about him already doing motion capture as Hulk. I'd love it if the trailer was attached to the end of Captain America, it'd be just like the end of Back To The Future 2, you think it's finished and you've got a semi-cliffhanger, the credits are about to roll when... BOOM next summer! cue trailer showing the Avengers all together and maybe a hint at the story, then credits. Audience walks out thinking HOLY SHIT!


Dont do that! It's too much for me to take on a Monday morning.......



_____________________________

I feel like i'm Han Solo, your Chewie and she's Ben Kenobi - and we're in that FUCKED UP bar!!

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Post #: 154
RE: The Avengers - 25/4/2011 5:08:07 PM   
film man aidy

 

Posts: 333
Joined: 8/3/2007
THOR FINAL SCENE SPOILER TO FOLLOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


THOR FINAL SCENE SPOILER TO FOLLOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Having now seen Thor, I can confirm that the post credits scene involves the cube seen in the Captain America trailer, and how it is a "limitless power source". Or something. It also shows Nick Fury in coversation with Stellan Skarsgard's Professor - apparently now possessed by Loki. As this leads straight into The Avengers, the main plot strand would seem to be Loki using the cube to cause havok on earth. Previously rumoured information about Mark Ruffalo's Hulk being possessed and taking on the rest of the Avengers would now seem to fit. If it's anything like as good as Thor was, we are in for a treat next summer. And I still can't pronounce the bloody hammer's name...

(in reply to lukeyboy)
Post #: 155
RE: The Avengers - 25/4/2011 6:40:27 PM   
musht


Posts: 1858
Joined: 21/1/2009
From: Oireland
Shooting on this started today, I didn't realise Whedon had written it with one of the blokes behind X2, I'm now even more hopeful that this will be a good team movie as opposed to a movie about a team where only one of the characters stands out

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Post #: 156
RE: The Avengers - 25/4/2011 7:00:17 PM   
Marwood

 

Posts: 2617
Joined: 1/10/2005
From: Only The Shadow knows

quote:

ORIGINAL: musht

Shooting on this started today, I didn't realise Whedon had written it with one of the blokes behind X2, I'm now even more hopeful that this will be a good team movie as opposed to a movie about a team where only one of the characters stands out


He hasn't really, Marvel had Zack Penn do some drafts ages ago and when Whedon came on board he did a page one rewrite - similarly he wrote The Incredible Hulk as a sequel to Ang Lee's Hulk and then Edward Norton himself retooled Penn's script to be a reboot with numerous changes. Anyway, from what I can gather he's not been involved since Whedon came on board and to be honest as he was one of the main writers of X-Men: The Last Stand I'd rather he was out of the picture. As for X2 he was one of many writers who contributed to that, Mike Dougherty and Dan Harris did the heavy lifting though and worked with Singer more closely on it...then he took them on to write Superman Returns.

Anyway, good to hear it's underway - what with the recent Captain America extra shooting in New York (a post credits scene apparently) it sounds like Chris Evans will be seguing straight from Cap into The Avengers.

_____________________________

Bilbo: What about the Ewoks? They were rubbish.

Tim: Yeah but Jar Jar Binks makes the Ewoks look like f***ing Shaft!

(in reply to musht)
Post #: 157
RE: The Avengers - 25/4/2011 7:50:41 PM   
musht


Posts: 1858
Joined: 21/1/2009
From: Oireland

quote:

ORIGINAL: Marwood


quote:

ORIGINAL: musht

Shooting on this started today, I didn't realise Whedon had written it with one of the blokes behind X2, I'm now even more hopeful that this will be a good team movie as opposed to a movie about a team where only one of the characters stands out


He hasn't really, Marvel had Zack Penn do some drafts ages ago and when Whedon came on board he did a page one rewrite - similarly he wrote The Incredible Hulk as a sequel to Ang Lee's Hulk and then Edward Norton himself retooled Penn's script to be a reboot with numerous changes. Anyway, from what I can gather he's not been involved since Whedon came on board and to be honest as he was one of the main writers of X-Men: The Last Stand I'd rather he was out of the picture. As for X2 he was one of many writers who contributed to that, Mike Dougherty and Dan Harris did the heavy lifting though and worked with Singer more closely on it...then he took them on to write Superman Returns.

Anyway, good to hear it's underway - what with the recent Captain America extra shooting in New York (a post credits scene apparently) it sounds like Chris Evans will be seguing straight from Cap into The Avengers.


Cheers for the clarification, all good to know stuff the article I had read totally glossed over all of this. I still trust Whedon as a filmmaker though, really hope the action is good, Iron Man 2 was a bit of a let down and that was only one hero. I think the best way to handle the fights would be the way Expendables handled the action,but make the bits in between WAY less crappy

Yeh I'd defo say his Avengers timetable will clash with the Captain America publicity tour

_____________________________

"SAVE ME, BARRY!!"

"What the hell are Regionals!?"

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Post #: 158
RE: The Avengers - 26/4/2011 11:37:14 AM   
Marwood

 

Posts: 2617
Joined: 1/10/2005
From: Only The Shadow knows
quote:

ORIGINAL: musht


quote:

ORIGINAL: Marwood


quote:

ORIGINAL: musht

Shooting on this started today, I didn't realise Whedon had written it with one of the blokes behind X2, I'm now even more hopeful that this will be a good team movie as opposed to a movie about a team where only one of the characters stands out


He hasn't really, Marvel had Zack Penn do some drafts ages ago and when Whedon came on board he did a page one rewrite - similarly he wrote The Incredible Hulk as a sequel to Ang Lee's Hulk and then Edward Norton himself retooled Penn's script to be a reboot with numerous changes. Anyway, from what I can gather he's not been involved since Whedon came on board and to be honest as he was one of the main writers of X-Men: The Last Stand I'd rather he was out of the picture. As for X2 he was one of many writers who contributed to that, Mike Dougherty and Dan Harris did the heavy lifting though and worked with Singer more closely on it...then he took them on to write Superman Returns.

Anyway, good to hear it's underway - what with the recent Captain America extra shooting in New York (a post credits scene apparently) it sounds like Chris Evans will be seguing straight from Cap into The Avengers.


Cheers for the clarification, all good to know stuff the article I had read totally glossed over all of this. I still trust Whedon as a filmmaker though, really hope the action is good, Iron Man 2 was a bit of a let down and that was only one hero. I think the best way to handle the fights would be the way Expendables handled the action,but make the bits in between WAY less crappy

Yeh I'd defo say his Avengers timetable will clash with the Captain America publicity tour


No worries, in fairness to Penn I expect a lot of his work will still end up in the shooting script as it's unlikely Whedon would have just discarded everything he'd done, unless of course he and Marvel just decided to go in a totally different direction from what Marvel and Penn had been working on already.

I think Whedon will have a great production team so the action should be solid, he's an untested filmmaker on this kind of scale so like Favreau, Singer, Raimi, Nolan etc. he'll be surrounded by pros who know that end of making a film. Re The Expendables what do you mean? The way it was shot or the pacing? If you mean shooting method I hope Whedon avoids the use of shaky cam, it suits some projects but is becoming badly overused by a lot of shitty films. In the case of The Avengers as it's a superhero team up then you actually want to see what they're doing so I'm hoping the action will be ala Iron Man/Hulk (would say Thor and Cap but I haven't seen them yet) and be exciting but y'know...not loads of cuts.

< Message edited by Marwood -- 26/4/2011 11:40:20 AM >


_____________________________

Bilbo: What about the Ewoks? They were rubbish.

Tim: Yeah but Jar Jar Binks makes the Ewoks look like f***ing Shaft!

(in reply to musht)
Post #: 159
RE: The Avengers - 26/4/2011 12:02:05 PM   
Darth Marenghi

 

Posts: 3208
Joined: 10/10/2010
From: Manchester

quote:

ORIGINAL: Marwood
. As for X2 he was one of many writers who contributed to that, Mike Dougherty and Dan Harris did the heavy lifting though and worked with Singer more closely on it...then he took them on to write Superman Returns.



Indeed - Dougherty and Harris did something like twenty drafts for X2!

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Invisible Text for SPOILERS: "color=#F1F1F1" Spoiler text "/color" , then change the quotation marks to square brackets.


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Post #: 160
RE: The Avengers - 26/4/2011 1:35:44 PM   
musht


Posts: 1858
Joined: 21/1/2009
From: Oireland

quote:



Re The Expendables what do you mean? The way it was shot or the pacing? If you mean shooting method I hope Whedon avoids the use of shaky cam, it suits some projects but is becoming badly overused by a lot of shitty films. In the case of The Avengers as it's a superhero team up then you actually want to see what they're doing so I'm hoping the action will be ala Iron Man/Hulk (would say Thor and Cap but I haven't seen them yet) and be exciting but y'know...not loads of cuts.


I felt that in Expendables that in the final action scene each character had their own fight, and I felt they cut from one to other but I felt it wasn't in a way where I couldn't actually tell what was going on. With a team movie like Avengers I think they run the risk of having a final showdown with everyone working as a team however I just don't see how that work, if you look at Spider-Man 3 the final fight didn't work that well because when SM was fighting Venom I'd find myself thinking 'well where's sandman, is he just watching?' so I feel the best way to go but be down the Expendables route.

I'm presuming they won't have the Avengers face-off together against ONE main villain cause that I feel would be an absolute waste in my opinion, couldn't see that working AT ALL

_____________________________

"SAVE ME, BARRY!!"

"What the hell are Regionals!?"

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Post #: 161
RE: The Avengers - 26/4/2011 2:36:48 PM   
lukeyboy


Posts: 1638
Joined: 11/10/2005
From: Saaaaf Laaandaan you slaaag!
I'm actually a fan of the whole shaky-cam thing. It works well for certain movies like the Bourne trilogy, Narc and anyone of a plethora of low budget indie flicks I have in mind, but for The Avengers? No!

For the set pieces and I guess we're talking about the "final showdown" in particular here - we need to see an effects laden Matrix-esque set piece that would put the affore mentioned movies action scenes to shame! Sure - each character needs to have his/her own bit of screentime suring this showdown to show you what they've got, but at the end of the day it's really gotta be all about the team dynamic and how they work together in a scrap! If you've read The Ultimates and in particular The Ultimates 2 books - check out the 8 page fold out battle scene toward the end and then you're somewhere close to what I want (expect) to see! Obviously the fact that the villains of the piece are still anonamous is a speculating stumbling block - but I still think the Skrulls will play a big part along with Loki and The Hulk [in part], which IMO will make for a belter of a showdown!

_____________________________

I feel like i'm Han Solo, your Chewie and she's Ben Kenobi - and we're in that FUCKED UP bar!!

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Post #: 162
RE: The Avengers - 26/4/2011 3:18:05 PM   
musht


Posts: 1858
Joined: 21/1/2009
From: Oireland

quote:

ORIGINAL: lukeyboy

I'm actually a fan of the whole shaky-cam thing. It works well for certain movies like the Bourne trilogy, Narc and anyone of a plethora of low budget indie flicks I have in mind, but for The Avengers? No!

For the set pieces and I guess we're talking about the "final showdown" in particular here - we need to see an effects laden Matrix-esque set piece that would put the affore mentioned movies action scenes to shame! Sure - each character needs to have his/her own bit of screentime suring this showdown to show you what they've got, but at the end of the day it's really gotta be all about the team dynamic and how they work together in a scrap! If you've read The Ultimates and in particular The Ultimates 2 books - check out the 8 page fold out battle scene toward the end and then you're somewhere close to what I want (expect) to see! Obviously the fact that the villains of the piece are still anonamous is a speculating stumbling block - but I still think the Skrulls will play a big part along with Loki and The Hulk [in part], which IMO will make for a belter of a showdown!


i haven't read the books but I know what you mean, the team dynamic is important just as long as we don't get something like the final set-piece in Fantastic Four, from what I remember that was pretty disappointing.

In regards to the shaky it does work occasionally but has been overused a lot recently and has also been used badly, the A-Team Hannibal v Lynch for instance, basically couldn't tell what was going on. wouldn't work for Avengers

_____________________________

"SAVE ME, BARRY!!"

"What the hell are Regionals!?"

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Post #: 163
RE: The Avengers - 26/4/2011 5:30:00 PM   
Marwood

 

Posts: 2617
Joined: 1/10/2005
From: Only The Shadow knows

quote:

ORIGINAL: musht


quote:

ORIGINAL: lukeyboy

I'm actually a fan of the whole shaky-cam thing. It works well for certain movies like the Bourne trilogy, Narc and anyone of a plethora of low budget indie flicks I have in mind, but for The Avengers? No!

For the set pieces and I guess we're talking about the "final showdown" in particular here - we need to see an effects laden Matrix-esque set piece that would put the affore mentioned movies action scenes to shame! Sure - each character needs to have his/her own bit of screentime suring this showdown to show you what they've got, but at the end of the day it's really gotta be all about the team dynamic and how they work together in a scrap! If you've read The Ultimates and in particular The Ultimates 2 books - check out the 8 page fold out battle scene toward the end and then you're somewhere close to what I want (expect) to see! Obviously the fact that the villains of the piece are still anonamous is a speculating stumbling block - but I still think the Skrulls will play a big part along with Loki and The Hulk [in part], which IMO will make for a belter of a showdown!


i haven't read the books but I know what you mean, the team dynamic is important just as long as we don't get something like the final set-piece in Fantastic Four, from what I remember that was pretty disappointing.

In regards to the shaky it does work occasionally but has been overused a lot recently and has also been used badly, the A-Team Hannibal v Lynch for instance, basically couldn't tell what was going on. wouldn't work for Avengers


I think a final team battle could well be played out similarly to how we've seen them in the Ultimates books too (amongst numerous other comics battles) - have them co-ordinated against a multitude of enemies and cutting back and forth between them. If the main threat is something like a Skrull army then it offers a horde for them to launch into and see all of them doing their thing.

On the subject of villains the following article has a tidbit from Marvel themselves: http://uk.movies.ign.com/articles/116/1164114p1.html

So Loki and Stellan Skarsgaard will be back in some fashion which fits with what I've read about Thor's after credits scene (spoiler). Could be cameos but I think Tom Hiddleston has hinted many times before that he could be a part of the film so this could add weight to him being a big bad - in classic Avengers fashion he could well be the guy who kicks things off but isn't the visible threat.

_____________________________

Bilbo: What about the Ewoks? They were rubbish.

Tim: Yeah but Jar Jar Binks makes the Ewoks look like f***ing Shaft!

(in reply to musht)
Post #: 164
RE: The Avengers - 27/4/2011 10:31:17 AM   
lukeyboy


Posts: 1638
Joined: 11/10/2005
From: Saaaaf Laaandaan you slaaag!
Yeah - I saw that news this morning. So it's looks like Loki might well be the main villain in The Avengers movie (i.e the one that is pulling all the strings) which kinda makes me think that The Skrulls or Kree won't in fact be in it as was previously rumoured. Obviously i'm just speculating but i'm thinking that at some point during the movie Loki's gonna posess the Hulk and Thor's gonna be wrongly accused of being a traitor and the other Avengers + S.H.I.E.L.D will turn on him. I also think (hope) that Black Widow turns out to be a traitor like in The Ultimates as she can be a pretty badass villain when she want's to be! Although whether Scarlett Johannsen can pull off the "nasty" that is required remains to be seen.

Saw the pic of the set with the chairs this morning! It's weird how as picture of some chairs and a logo can brighten up an otherwise mundane Wednesday morning!!

_____________________________

I feel like i'm Han Solo, your Chewie and she's Ben Kenobi - and we're in that FUCKED UP bar!!

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Post #: 165
RE: The Avengers - 27/4/2011 1:29:36 PM   
Wild about Wilder


Posts: 1651
Joined: 9/4/2010
From: Hertfordshire
Personaly i'd like too see Kang & Loki team up in the 1st with maybe a Masters Of  Evil in the 2nd then go all out in a 3rd with the Kree/Skrull war.

(in reply to lukeyboy)
Post #: 166
RE: The Avengers - 27/4/2011 3:17:39 PM   
Citizen Dildo

 

Posts: 179
Joined: 3/5/2007
Just saw Thor and thought the Empire review was pretty spot on.

SPOILERS

I've never read the comics. Can someone explain exactly how Loki's powers work? In the post credits sequence where he is seemingly possessing Dr Selvig, I didn't think it was particularly clear in the film that he was capable of this?

Also, is the Selvig character from the comics and does he have ties to the Hulk, per his gamma rays comment?

Finally, where's a good place to start reading if I were to pick up an Avengers book?

Cheers

_____________________________

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Post #: 167
RE: The Avengers - 27/4/2011 4:09:41 PM   
Marwood

 

Posts: 2617
Joined: 1/10/2005
From: Only The Shadow knows

quote:

ORIGINAL: Citizen Dildo

Just saw Thor and thought the Empire review was pretty spot on.

SPOILERS

I've never read the comics. Can someone explain exactly how Loki's powers work? In the post credits sequence where he is seemingly possessing Dr Selvig, I didn't think it was particularly clear in the film that he was capable of this?

Also, is the Selvig character from the comics and does he have ties to the Hulk, per his gamma rays comment?

Finally, where's a good place to start reading if I were to pick up an Avengers book?

Cheers


Loki's powers are never that clearly defined in the comics, books, cartoons or video games; at various different points in time he's been able to possess/control people, teleport, shape change, use telekinesis and telepathy, cross different times/worlds/dimensions. I think you're best off thinking of him as a sorceror type whose most used special abilities come from mental manipulation/illusions. Of course being an Asgardian/Frost Giant hybrid he's also got the same super strength, endurance etc. that they all seem to have.

Selvig's a new character I believe and as he's due to appear in The Avengers per the Disney press release I expect he functions in a similar way to Agent Coulson - created for the screen to help tie the different character films together. I suppose if he and Mark Ruffalo's Bruce Banner meet in Avengers there could be some history revealed.

Best place to start reading Avengers is to just grab those Essential omnibuses that Marvel have released for most of their best known characters/teams. If you want to skew a bit more modern I highly recommend Mark Millar's The Ultimates Vol 1, it's a reinvention of The Avengers in a more contemporary setting and updates the core characters (Captain America, Iron Man, Thor, Hulk, Giant Man, The Wasp, Black Widow, Hawkeye and Nick Fury). It's also clearly been as much of an influence on the new films as well as the classic comics and don't be surprised if certain scenarios, dialogue or even plot points from it turn up in Whedon's film...aside from the SHIELD affiliation and African American Nick Fury that we've already seen.

_____________________________

Bilbo: What about the Ewoks? They were rubbish.

Tim: Yeah but Jar Jar Binks makes the Ewoks look like f***ing Shaft!

(in reply to Citizen Dildo)
Post #: 168
RE: The Avengers - 27/4/2011 4:21:51 PM   
lukeyboy


Posts: 1638
Joined: 11/10/2005
From: Saaaaf Laaandaan you slaaag!

quote:

ORIGINAL: Marwood


quote:

ORIGINAL: Citizen Dildo

Just saw Thor and thought the Empire review was pretty spot on.

SPOILERS

I've never read the comics. Can someone explain exactly how Loki's powers work? In the post credits sequence where he is seemingly possessing Dr Selvig, I didn't think it was particularly clear in the film that he was capable of this?

Also, is the Selvig character from the comics and does he have ties to the Hulk, per his gamma rays comment?

Finally, where's a good place to start reading if I were to pick up an Avengers book?

Cheers


Loki's powers are never that clearly defined in the comics, books, cartoons or video games; at various different points in time he's been able to possess/control people, teleport, shape change, use telekinesis and telepathy, cross different times/worlds/dimensions. I think you're best off thinking of him as a sorceror type whose most used special abilities come from mental manipulation/illusions. Of course being an Asgardian/Frost Giant hybrid he's also got the same super strength, endurance etc. that they all seem to have.

Selvig's a new character I believe and as he's due to appear in The Avengers per the Disney press release I expect he functions in a similar way to Agent Coulson - created for the screen to help tie the different character films together. I suppose if he and Mark Ruffalo's Bruce Banner meet in Avengers there could be some history revealed.

Best place to start reading Avengers is to just grab those Essential omnibuses that Marvel have released for most of their best known characters/teams. If you want to skew a bit more modern I highly recommend Mark Millar's The Ultimates Vol 1, it's a reinvention of The Avengers in a more contemporary setting and updates the core characters (Captain America, Iron Man, Thor, Hulk, Giant Man, The Wasp, Black Widow, Hawkeye and Nick Fury). It's also clearly been as much of an influence on the new films as well as the classic comics and don't be surprised if certain scenarios, dialogue or even plot points from it turn up in Whedon's film...aside from the SHIELD affiliation and African American Nick Fury that we've already seen.


Just wanted to stick my oar in and reiterrate Marwood's points on The Ultimates. Don't bother with the old school (pre-90's) incarnations of The Avengers as they haven't dated well in my opinion. Mark Millar's The Ultimates is not only the best slant on The Avengers - it's up there with the likes of Watchmen and Preacher in being one of the best Graphic Novels going IMO. Great artwork, great story and parts of it would definitely get an 18 rating were it on celluloid (i.e the Hulk ripping off Abominations arms and beating him to death with them and Tony Stark fucking the Black Widow and then wrapping a champagne bottle 'round her head!!)

Do yourself a favour and get out there and buy it!!

_____________________________

I feel like i'm Han Solo, your Chewie and she's Ben Kenobi - and we're in that FUCKED UP bar!!

(in reply to Marwood)
Post #: 169
RE: The Avengers - 27/4/2011 7:13:22 PM   
Marwood

 

Posts: 2617
Joined: 1/10/2005
From: Only The Shadow knows

quote:

ORIGINAL: lukeyboy


quote:

ORIGINAL: Marwood


quote:

ORIGINAL: Citizen Dildo

Just saw Thor and thought the Empire review was pretty spot on.

SPOILERS

I've never read the comics. Can someone explain exactly how Loki's powers work? In the post credits sequence where he is seemingly possessing Dr Selvig, I didn't think it was particularly clear in the film that he was capable of this?

Also, is the Selvig character from the comics and does he have ties to the Hulk, per his gamma rays comment?

Finally, where's a good place to start reading if I were to pick up an Avengers book?

Cheers


Loki's powers are never that clearly defined in the comics, books, cartoons or video games; at various different points in time he's been able to possess/control people, teleport, shape change, use telekinesis and telepathy, cross different times/worlds/dimensions. I think you're best off thinking of him as a sorceror type whose most used special abilities come from mental manipulation/illusions. Of course being an Asgardian/Frost Giant hybrid he's also got the same super strength, endurance etc. that they all seem to have.

Selvig's a new character I believe and as he's due to appear in The Avengers per the Disney press release I expect he functions in a similar way to Agent Coulson - created for the screen to help tie the different character films together. I suppose if he and Mark Ruffalo's Bruce Banner meet in Avengers there could be some history revealed.

Best place to start reading Avengers is to just grab those Essential omnibuses that Marvel have released for most of their best known characters/teams. If you want to skew a bit more modern I highly recommend Mark Millar's The Ultimates Vol 1, it's a reinvention of The Avengers in a more contemporary setting and updates the core characters (Captain America, Iron Man, Thor, Hulk, Giant Man, The Wasp, Black Widow, Hawkeye and Nick Fury). It's also clearly been as much of an influence on the new films as well as the classic comics and don't be surprised if certain scenarios, dialogue or even plot points from it turn up in Whedon's film...aside from the SHIELD affiliation and African American Nick Fury that we've already seen.


Just wanted to stick my oar in and reiterrate Marwood's points on The Ultimates. Don't bother with the old school (pre-90's) incarnations of The Avengers as they haven't dated well in my opinion. Mark Millar's The Ultimates is not only the best slant on The Avengers - it's up there with the likes of Watchmen and Preacher in being one of the best Graphic Novels going IMO. Great artwork, great story and parts of it would definitely get an 18 rating were it on celluloid (i.e the Hulk ripping off Abominations arms and beating him to death with them and Tony Stark fucking the Black Widow and then wrapping a champagne bottle 'round her head!!)

Do yourself a favour and get out there and buy it!!


Unfortunately those events happened in The Ultimates Vol 2, to my mind one of the worst follow ups to a fantastic series/GN since Frank Miller decided to start dicking about with Batman again (Strikes Again was from the same writer as Returns? How?!!!).

Vol 1 was Millar actually doing some clever reinvention ala Superman: Red Son but Vol 2 is him going off into his weird world a bit too much. In this case imo only Vol 1 is worth a read, don't even get me started on Vol 3, Ultimate Avengers and New Ultimates.

Also Brian Michael Bendis' New Avengers series was pretty damn good until all the Skrull nonsense started up, first couple of GN collections in particular were great and gives me hope that if Marvel ever get Spider-Man back in house film-wise they'd try and throw him in with some of those characters for a new team.



_____________________________

Bilbo: What about the Ewoks? They were rubbish.

Tim: Yeah but Jar Jar Binks makes the Ewoks look like f***ing Shaft!

(in reply to lukeyboy)
Post #: 170
RE: The Avengers - 27/4/2011 9:46:29 PM   
musht


Posts: 1858
Joined: 21/1/2009
From: Oireland
I've finally seen Thor, frankly even more excited about Avengers as Hemsworth was great as was Hiddleton.

Few things though, I'm presuming the warriors three won't be appearing in the Avengers and same goes for Idris Elba.

Also I haven't read the comics so [POST CREDIT SCENE SPOILER] does the power source in the post credit scene resemble anything from the comics, does it give us any clues has to who Loki might be working with in the Avengers, I'm presuming said power source is going to be used to open another bridge

_____________________________

"SAVE ME, BARRY!!"

"What the hell are Regionals!?"

"color=#F1F1F1" Spoiler text "/color"

(in reply to Marwood)
Post #: 171
RE: The Avengers - 27/4/2011 11:41:54 PM   
adambatman82

 

Posts: 11156
Joined: 15/12/2005

quote:

ORIGINAL: musht

I've finally seen Thor, frankly even more excited about Avengers as Hemsworth was great as was Hiddleton.

Few things though, I'm presuming the warriors three won't be appearing in the Avengers and same goes for Idris Elba.

Also I haven't read the comics so [POST CREDIT SCENE SPOILER] does the power source in the post credit scene resemble anything from the comics, does it give us any clues has to who Loki might be working with in the Avengers, I'm presuming said power source is going to be used to open another bridge


SPOILER

It's the cosmic cube. Its the McGuffin in Captain America by all accounts too, the object that The Red Skull is looking for.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cosmic_Cube

(in reply to musht)
Post #: 172
RE: The Avengers - 28/4/2011 9:58:12 AM   
Marwood

 

Posts: 2617
Joined: 1/10/2005
From: Only The Shadow knows

quote:

ORIGINAL: musht

I've finally seen Thor, frankly even more excited about Avengers as Hemsworth was great as was Hiddleton.

Few things though, I'm presuming the warriors three won't be appearing in the Avengers and same goes for Idris Elba.

Also I haven't read the comics so [POST CREDIT SCENE SPOILER] does the power source in the post credit scene resemble anything from the comics, does it give us any clues has to who Loki might be working with in the Avengers, I'm presuming said power source is going to be used to open another bridge


Likewise, if Chris Evans can also knock it out of the park as Cap I'll be even more excited for the teamup - Hemsworth and RDJ have been excellent in their roles. No offense to Mark Ruffalo but I still wish Edward Norton and Marvel could have worked things out, would have been great to see him share the screen with these guys.

Nothing's been announced, the known cast so far is Jackson (Fury), Downey (Iron Man), Evans (Cap), Hemsworth (Thor), Ruffalo (Banner), Johannson (Widow), Renner (Hawkeye), Smulders (Maria Hill - new to the screen), Gregg (Agent Coulson), Hiddleston (Loki) and Skarsgaard (Selvig). There are probably more names to be announced but so far at least no mention of Elba, Stevenson et al. I really liked them in Thor and hope they get a lot more to do in possible sequels, I expect Thor will be up in Asgard at some point in Avengers - considering the bridge to earth was destroyed at the end of his solo outing you'd expect him to first be seen there, maybe Heimdall or the warriors will cameo?

It does lead me to wonder if any of the supporting characters from the solo films will feature other than the announced - pretty sure Gwyneth Paltrow and Natalie Portman have both said they're not going to be in the film but does anyone else think a Don Cheadle/Heimdall/Odin/Warriors/Happy Hogan/Betty Ross/General Ross cameo would work? Seems kind of weak to have built this shared universe but cut out all the (surviving) supporting cast.

_____________________________

Bilbo: What about the Ewoks? They were rubbish.

Tim: Yeah but Jar Jar Binks makes the Ewoks look like f***ing Shaft!

(in reply to musht)
Post #: 173
RE: The Avengers - 28/4/2011 10:23:46 AM   
lukeyboy


Posts: 1638
Joined: 11/10/2005
From: Saaaaf Laaandaan you slaaag!

quote:

ORIGINAL: Marwood


quote:

ORIGINAL: lukeyboy


quote:

ORIGINAL: Marwood


quote:

ORIGINAL: Citizen Dildo

Just saw Thor and thought the Empire review was pretty spot on.

SPOILERS

I've never read the comics. Can someone explain exactly how Loki's powers work? In the post credits sequence where he is seemingly possessing Dr Selvig, I didn't think it was particularly clear in the film that he was capable of this?

Also, is the Selvig character from the comics and does he have ties to the Hulk, per his gamma rays comment?

Finally, where's a good place to start reading if I were to pick up an Avengers book?

Cheers


Loki's powers are never that clearly defined in the comics, books, cartoons or video games; at various different points in time he's been able to possess/control people, teleport, shape change, use telekinesis and telepathy, cross different times/worlds/dimensions. I think you're best off thinking of him as a sorceror type whose most used special abilities come from mental manipulation/illusions. Of course being an Asgardian/Frost Giant hybrid he's also got the same super strength, endurance etc. that they all seem to have.

Selvig's a new character I believe and as he's due to appear in The Avengers per the Disney press release I expect he functions in a similar way to Agent Coulson - created for the screen to help tie the different character films together. I suppose if he and Mark Ruffalo's Bruce Banner meet in Avengers there could be some history revealed.

Best place to start reading Avengers is to just grab those Essential omnibuses that Marvel have released for most of their best known characters/teams. If you want to skew a bit more modern I highly recommend Mark Millar's The Ultimates Vol 1, it's a reinvention of The Avengers in a more contemporary setting and updates the core characters (Captain America, Iron Man, Thor, Hulk, Giant Man, The Wasp, Black Widow, Hawkeye and Nick Fury). It's also clearly been as much of an influence on the new films as well as the classic comics and don't be surprised if certain scenarios, dialogue or even plot points from it turn up in Whedon's film...aside from the SHIELD affiliation and African American Nick Fury that we've already seen.


Just wanted to stick my oar in and reiterrate Marwood's points on The Ultimates. Don't bother with the old school (pre-90's) incarnations of The Avengers as they haven't dated well in my opinion. Mark Millar's The Ultimates is not only the best slant on The Avengers - it's up there with the likes of Watchmen and Preacher in being one of the best Graphic Novels going IMO. Great artwork, great story and parts of it would definitely get an 18 rating were it on celluloid (i.e the Hulk ripping off Abominations arms and beating him to death with them and Tony Stark fucking the Black Widow and then wrapping a champagne bottle 'round her head!!)

Do yourself a favour and get out there and buy it!!


Unfortunately those events happened in The Ultimates Vol 2, to my mind one of the worst follow ups to a fantastic series/GN since Frank Miller decided to start dicking about with Batman again (Strikes Again was from the same writer as Returns? How?!!!).
Vol 1 was Millar actually doing some clever reinvention ala Superman: Red Son but Vol 2 is him going off into his weird world a bit too much. In this case imo only Vol 1 is worth a read, don't even get me started on Vol 3, Ultimate Avengers and New Ultimates.

Also Brian Michael Bendis' New Avengers series was pretty damn good until all the Skrull nonsense started up, first couple of GN collections in particular were great and gives me hope that if Marvel ever get Spider-Man back in house film-wise they'd try and throw him in with some of those characters for a new team.




We'll have agree to disagree then - I actually thought it got better after Volume 1! Each to their own n'that!

I still haven't actually seen Thor yet - i've got tickets booked for tomorrow morning during the Royal Wedding so I can miss the pompous bastards exchanging vows. If I come out of the flicks and the wedding's still on and Thor was as good as i have heard - i might watch it twice!!

_____________________________

I feel like i'm Han Solo, your Chewie and she's Ben Kenobi - and we're in that FUCKED UP bar!!

(in reply to Marwood)
Post #: 174
RE: The Avengers - 28/4/2011 11:49:31 AM   
JIm R

 

Posts: 9185
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Surrey
Luke, it's freekin' awesome and better than any two chinless wonders getting hitched anytime.

(in reply to lukeyboy)
Post #: 175
RE: The Avengers - 28/4/2011 1:18:22 PM   
lukeyboy


Posts: 1638
Joined: 11/10/2005
From: Saaaaf Laaandaan you slaaag!

quote:

ORIGINAL: JIm R

Luke, it's freekin' awesome and better than any two chinless wonders getting hitched anytime.


Glad to hear it Jim! "Freekin' awesome" is all the incentive I need. I'm still hearing that Hemsworth is a little un-charismatic and is acted off screen by Hopkins and Hiddlestone though. Any truth to this?

_____________________________

I feel like i'm Han Solo, your Chewie and she's Ben Kenobi - and we're in that FUCKED UP bar!!

(in reply to JIm R)
Post #: 176
RE: The Avengers - 28/4/2011 2:46:29 PM   
JIm R

 

Posts: 9185
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Surrey
quote:

ORIGINAL: lukeyboy


quote:

ORIGINAL: JIm R

Luke, it's freekin' awesome and better than any two chinless wonders getting hitched anytime.


Glad to hear it Jim! "Freekin' awesome" is all the incentive I need. I'm still hearing that Hemsworth is a little un-charismatic and is acted off screen by Hopkins and Hiddlestone though. Any truth to this?


To be honest, I personally thought Loki actor, Tom H, took all the honours, he is exactly what was needed from Loki, Hemsworth does what he needs to do, no more, no less, Hopkins is his usual self, in his later years, he seems to have taken this earnest 'father' role and run with it.
 
A story ran way back when filming had just begun, evidently Hopkins and Hemsworth had a tete a' tete on set and Hopkins demanded Hemsworth 'upped his game', Hemsworth certainly gets more 'comfortable' as the film progresses, he's just not a natural comemdian which the funnier material required a 'lighter' touch, but drama is no problem too him, it's very rare that someone can do both.
 
I would say though Portman is 'lost' within it all, not that she doesn't have the heart for it or it's not material that suits, it is, but having acted her chops off for Black Swan, here, she looks like she wasn't at the races if that makes sense.
 
 

(in reply to lukeyboy)
Post #: 177
RE: The Avengers - 28/4/2011 2:58:28 PM   
KeithM


Posts: 862
Joined: 31/7/2008
quote:

ORIGINAL: lukeyboy
Glad to hear it Jim! "Freekin' awesome" is all the incentive I need. I'm still hearing that Hemsworth is a little un-charismatic and is acted off screen by Hopkins and Hiddlestone though. Any truth to this?


None whatsoever.

Loki and Odin's roles are more nuanced and subtle perhaps - and they're both at the top of their game - but Hemsworth more than matches them - he brings a great physicality to his role, but more than that, the arc his character goes through in the film requires him to display a good range (from brash, cocky, almost stupid arrogance, through berserker rages, to quiet, easy masculine charm, a sense of humour, humility, wisdom... fear not; the trailers don't do him justice - the man can act.

As for uncharismatic... well, that's completely the opposite to what he is. He has "it". I compare his performance to Reeve from Superman the Movie - not in any derivative or imitative way, but in that he exudes an easy charm - a 'charisma' if you will - that totally sells it. He is to Thor what RDJ was to Iron Man.

Hopefully you will have seen it for yourself by now and can judge for yourself... and if not, why not? Get yerself to the cinema man!



< Message edited by KeithM -- 28/4/2011 3:00:30 PM >

(in reply to lukeyboy)
Post #: 178
RE: The Avengers - 28/4/2011 3:23:38 PM   
Wild about Wilder


Posts: 1651
Joined: 9/4/2010
From: Hertfordshire
Agree by the looks of things Ultimates is probably the way to go but make sure it's The Ultimates as there is now an Ultimate Avengers aswell + 3 different Avengers titles in the mainstream range New Avengers, Avengers & Secret Avengers. Ooops almost forgot Avengers Acadamy .Phew!  
Still not as bad as the Batman titles.

< Message edited by Wild about Wilder -- 28/4/2011 3:24:59 PM >

(in reply to lukeyboy)
Post #: 179
RE: The Avengers - 28/4/2011 3:26:25 PM   
musht


Posts: 1858
Joined: 21/1/2009
From: Oireland

quote:

ORIGINAL: Marwood


quote:

ORIGINAL: musht

I've finally seen Thor, frankly even more excited about Avengers as Hemsworth was great as was Hiddleton.

Few things though, I'm presuming the warriors three won't be appearing in the Avengers and same goes for Idris Elba.

Also I haven't read the comics so [POST CREDIT SCENE SPOILER] does the power source in the post credit scene resemble anything from the comics, does it give us any clues has to who Loki might be working with in the Avengers, I'm presuming said power source is going to be used to open another bridge


Likewise, if Chris Evans can also knock it out of the park as Cap I'll be even more excited for the teamup - Hemsworth and RDJ have been excellent in their roles. No offense to Mark Ruffalo but I still wish Edward Norton and Marvel could have worked things out, would have been great to see him share the screen with these guys.

Nothing's been announced, the known cast so far is Jackson (Fury), Downey (Iron Man), Evans (Cap), Hemsworth (Thor), Ruffalo (Banner), Johannson (Widow), Renner (Hawkeye), Smulders (Maria Hill - new to the screen), Gregg (Agent Coulson), Hiddleston (Loki) and Skarsgaard (Selvig). There are probably more names to be announced but so far at least no mention of Elba, Stevenson et al. I really liked them in Thor and hope they get a lot more to do in possible sequels, I expect Thor will be up in Asgard at some point in Avengers - considering the bridge to earth was destroyed at the end of his solo outing you'd expect him to first be seen there, maybe Heimdall or the warriors will cameo?

It does lead me to wonder if any of the supporting characters from the solo films will feature other than the announced - pretty sure Gwyneth Paltrow and Natalie Portman have both said they're not going to be in the film but does anyone else think a Don Cheadle/Heimdall/Odin/Warriors/Happy Hogan/Betty Ross/General Ross cameo would work? Seems kind of weak to have built this shared universe but cut out all the (surviving) supporting cast.


I was under the impression that War Machine was going to feature in The Avengers, maybe I'm wrong but I have that in my head for some reason. [spoiler for those who haven't seen Incredible Hulk] It would make sense for General Ross to cameo given RDJ's cameo in Incredible Hulk which we now know is set after Iron Man 2.

I'm OK with the love interests not featuring as this film is going to be crowded enough as it is however it would make sense to have Betty Ross in there if Hulk is going to be a Loki-possessed villain, also isn't she a scientist so I wouldn't be surprised if she had a small role.

What you said about the warriors and have a bit of this set in Asgard makes sense however I hope there's more Thor projects and they felt a bit too comical to me so would like to see more of them, and you can never have too much Idris Elba in a film

_____________________________

"SAVE ME, BARRY!!"

"What the hell are Regionals!?"

"color=#F1F1F1" Spoiler text "/color"

(in reply to Marwood)
Post #: 180
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