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RE: Top 100 Films I've Watched This Year: 2010 - 8/10/2010 3:51:22 AM   
Deviation


Posts: 27268
Joined: 2/6/2006
From: Enemies of Film HQ
It would have been good if it actually felt threatening. And to say that it is better than the terrifying, tears-inducing beauty that is The Orphanage is nothing but silliness.


PA YOU ARE A NINNY.


< Message edited by Deviation -- 8/10/2010 3:53:25 AM >


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Dpp1978
There are certainly times where calling a person a cunt is not only reasonable, it is a gross understatement.

quote:


ORIGINAL: elab49
I really wish I could go down to see Privates

(in reply to Pigeon Army)
Post #: 10051
RE: Top 100 Films I've Watched This Year: 2010 - 8/10/2010 7:30:38 AM   
Miles Messervy 007


Posts: 6884
Joined: 11/2/2009

quote:

ORIGINAL: swordsandsandals

The Thin Red Line (1998, Terrence Malick)

It's the modern equivalent to the war poems of Sassoon, Owen et al. At times brutal, at others beautiful, it captures the emotions, psychology and the feel of war like nothing else can. Phenomenal.
As you know it grew on me substantially, and I knew you'd love it, but let me play the Devil's Advocate here: Owen's "characters", except in Strange Meeting, which is like his most boring poem, don't soliloquise to the extent that all of Malick's characters do. The only thing that annoys me about TTRL is the fact that it's, as some reviewer put it, "Apocalypse Now, except the platoon is full of Kurtzes".

_____________________________

quote:

jamesbondguy:
Miles is clearly the finest film theorist of his generation

quote:

Deviation:
if it isn't ham, I'll eat a living pig.

(in reply to swordsandsandals)
Post #: 10052
RE: Top 100 Films I've Watched This Year: 2010 - 8/10/2010 8:02:41 AM   
Pigeon Army


Posts: 14612
Joined: 29/1/2006
From: Pixar HQ, George Lucas' Office.
quote:

ORIGINAL: Deviation

It would have been good if it actually felt threatening. And to say that it is better than the terrifying, tears-inducing beauty that is The Orphanage is nothing but silliness.



Now you're being silly. The Fog is absolutely threatening, because it's this impermeable, otherworldly substance that carries in it a quick, nasty death at the hands of the methodical, spine-chilling black-clad ghosts. On top of the very nature of the best, Carpenter's score is probably the best I've heard him compose, and perfectly augments the fog's ominous rolling in, and he wisely focuses on the fog's capacity to envelop - the massive size of it in the landscape shots, the way it engulfs the houses of its potential victims. About the only times it wasn't threatening involved wide shots of the fog moving into areas, and it did seem devoid of scares, yeah - it's a great example when the fog rolls onto the main street.

Also, it is better than The Orphanage - The Fog has a stronger mythos and a more tightly-woven story that manages to integrate scares and drama effectively, and it also has that brilliant Carpenter score and is much more entertaining.


_____________________________

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rinc
She's supposed to be 13! I'd want her to be very attractive though


quote:

ORIGINAL: MonsterCat
quote:

ORIGINAL: Pigeon Army
Stop being mean to Deviation

No.

(in reply to Deviation)
Post #: 10053
RE: Top 100 Films I've Watched This Year: 2010 - 8/10/2010 8:25:01 AM   
Gimli The Dwarf


Posts: 77072
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Central Park Zoo
The Fog (2005) > The Fog (1980)

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Fellow scientists, poindexters, geeks.

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Post #: 10054
RE: Top 100 Films I've Watched This Year: 2010 - 8/10/2010 12:51:34 PM   
matty_b


Posts: 14446
Joined: 19/10/2005
From: Outpost 31 calling McMurtle.
Gimli, you're on a rocket of wrong about to crash into a field of wrongness on the planet Wrong.

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ORIGINAL: Cool Breeze
Mattyb is a shining example of what the perfect Empire Forum member is.


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Post #: 10055
RE: Top 100 Films I've Watched This Year: 2010 - 8/10/2010 1:41:41 PM   
impqueen


Posts: 7474
Joined: 24/7/2006
I will try next year to be a little more productive with reviewing and such....

014. Singin’ in the Rain (Donen, 1952) USA
015. Zodiac (Fincher, 2007) USA
020. Adaptation (Jonze, 2002) USA
061. 2046 (Wong, 2004) HK
070. The New World (Malick, 2005) USA/UK
075. The Quiet American (Noyce, 2002) GER/USA/UK/FR/AUS
084. Bright Star (Campion, 2009) UK/AUS/FR (First View)
088. Punch-Drunk Love (Anderson, 2002) USA

099. C'era una volta il West / Once Upon a Time in the West (Leone, 1968) ITA/USA (First View)
If Twain believed clothes make the man, then (I believe in the case of Sergio Leone), the music maketh the film. Especially when concerning Once Upon a Time in the West, a film that has a considerable amount of flaws including a weak script with some laughable dialogue and what looks to be a desperate search for meaning where there is none, yes the railway is coming. That said I enjoyed the performances of Jason Robards and Charles Bronson and Ennio Morricone music greatly helped make the experience far more satisfying than I think it would have been and for a first viewing it was a surprising film. An absurd western I felt that intentionally or not made me chuckle a number of times, whether it will be as much fun on a second viewing I doubt very much but for now it’s in my oddly-satisfied book.

105. Che Part Two: Guerrilla (Soderbergh, 2008) USA/FR/SPN (First View)
117. The Beguiled (Siegel, 1971) USA (First View)
118. Che Part One: The Argentine (Soderbergh, 2008) USA/FR/SPN (First View)
166. L'annulaire / The Ring Finger (Bertrand, 2005) FR (First View)
173. River’s Edge (Hunter, 1986) USA (First View)
174. Harry Brown (Barber, 2009) UK (First View)


< Message edited by impqueen -- 8/10/2010 1:43:30 PM >


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Yes, always.


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Post #: 10056
RE: Top 100 Films I've Watched This Year: 2010 - 8/10/2010 2:26:52 PM   
rick_7


Posts: 6151
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: The internet
quote:

ORIGINAL: impqueen

099. C'era una volta il West / Once Upon a Time in the West (Leone, 1968) ITA/USA (First View)
If Twain believed clothes make the man, then (I believe in the case of Sergio Leone), the music maketh the film. Especially when concerning Once Upon a Time in the West, a film that has a considerable amount of flaws including a weak script with some laughable dialogue

Spot on.

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Post #: 10057
RE: Top 100 Films I've Watched This Year: 2010 - 8/10/2010 3:33:50 PM   
Deviation


Posts: 27268
Joined: 2/6/2006
From: Enemies of Film HQ
quote:

ORIGINAL: Pigeon Army

Now you're being silly. The Fog is absolutely threatening, because it's this impermeable, otherworldly substance that carries in it a quick, nasty death at the hands of the methodical, spine-chilling black-clad ghosts. On top of the very nature of the best, Carpenter's score is probably the best I've heard him compose, and perfectly augments the fog's ominous rolling in, and he wisely focuses on the fog's capacity to envelop - the massive size of it in the landscape shots, the way it engulfs the houses of its potential victims. About the only times it wasn't threatening involved wide shots of the fog moving into areas, and it did seem devoid of scares, yeah - it's a great example when the fog rolls onto the main street.



Yes, that is true, the fog does have its creepyness, and the score is excellent. The problem is that we hardly see anyone killed in it or truly bloody injured throughout the whole thing. It makes the ominous fog look like a minor inconvenience rather than a life threatening otherworldly vapory substance that will kill you on site.

quote:


Also, it is better than The Orphanage - The Fog has a stronger mythos and a more tightly-woven story that manages to integrate scares and drama effectively, and it also has that brilliant Carpenter score and is much more entertaining.



Sure, the mythos in The Fog is stronger (and the opening is excellent), but then the promise kinda wears off when the ghosts off come out rather useless. Compare it to the bedroom scene in The Orphanage, the car accident, the game with the ghosts and the entire final 10 minutes where Laura discovers the fate of her son, and The Fog comes out even more underwhelming.


_____________________________

quote:

ORIGINAL: Dpp1978
There are certainly times where calling a person a cunt is not only reasonable, it is a gross understatement.

quote:


ORIGINAL: elab49
I really wish I could go down to see Privates

(in reply to Pigeon Army)
Post #: 10058
RE: Top 100 Films I've Watched This Year: 2010 - 8/10/2010 7:48:03 PM   
Miles Messervy 007


Posts: 6884
Joined: 11/2/2009

quote:

ORIGINAL: rick_7

quote:

ORIGINAL: impqueen

099. C'era una volta il West / Once Upon a Time in the West (Leone, 1968) ITA/USA (First View)
If Twain believed clothes make the man, then (I believe in the case of Sergio Leone), the music maketh the film. Especially when concerning Once Upon a Time in the West, a film that has a considerable amount of flaws including a weak script with some laughable dialogue

Spot on.
Yeah, but your favourite film is a much weaker western, soz.

_____________________________

quote:

jamesbondguy:
Miles is clearly the finest film theorist of his generation

quote:

Deviation:
if it isn't ham, I'll eat a living pig.

(in reply to rick_7)
Post #: 10059
RE: Top 100 Films I've Watched This Year: 2010 - 8/10/2010 9:06:41 PM   
paul_ie86


Posts: 11422
Joined: 4/1/2007
From: Chelsea Hotel #2

44. Buried (Rodrigo Cortés, 2010)
Basically, what swords said about it a few pages back

69. Enter the Void (Gaspar Noé, 2010)
Great stuff if a bit overlong. Excellent use of the first person perspective.

91. The Omen (Richard Donner, 1976)
Pretty darn good


162. Damien: Omen II (Don Taylor, 1978)
Not as good as the first.


200. Rush Hour 3 (Brett Ratner, 2008)
Fuck this shit.

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Post #: 10060
RE: Top 100 Films I've Watched This Year: 2010 - 8/10/2010 9:07:26 PM   
paul_ie86


Posts: 11422
Joined: 4/1/2007
From: Chelsea Hotel #2
Oh yeah, and Omen II was the 200th feature of the year for me.

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Post #: 10061
RE: Top 100 Films I've Watched This Year: 2010 - 9/10/2010 12:19:44 AM   
Gimli The Dwarf


Posts: 77072
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Central Park Zoo

quote:

ORIGINAL: matty_b

Gimli, you're on a rocket of wrong about to crash into a field of wrongness on the planet Wrong.


Cool!

_____________________________

So, sir, we let him have it right up! And I have to report, sir, he did not like it, sir.

Fellow scientists, poindexters, geeks.

Yeah, Mr. White! Yeah, science!

Much more better!

(in reply to matty_b)
Post #: 10062
RE: Top 100 Films I've Watched This Year: 2010 - 9/10/2010 12:40:56 AM   
Pigeon Army


Posts: 14612
Joined: 29/1/2006
From: Pixar HQ, George Lucas' Office.
quote:

ORIGINAL: Deviation

quote:

ORIGINAL: Pigeon Army

Now you're being silly. The Fog is absolutely threatening, because it's this impermeable, otherworldly substance that carries in it a quick, nasty death at the hands of the methodical, spine-chilling black-clad ghosts. On top of the very nature of the best, Carpenter's score is probably the best I've heard him compose, and perfectly augments the fog's ominous rolling in, and he wisely focuses on the fog's capacity to envelop - the massive size of it in the landscape shots, the way it engulfs the houses of its potential victims. About the only times it wasn't threatening involved wide shots of the fog moving into areas, and it did seem devoid of scares, yeah - it's a great example when the fog rolls onto the main street.



Yes, that is true, the fog does have its creepyness, and the score is excellent. The problem is that we hardly see anyone killed in it or truly bloody injured throughout the whole thing. It makes the ominous fog look like a minor inconvenience rather than a life threatening otherworldly vapory substance that will kill you on site.


That's because the fog itself isn't killing people, it's just the sailors, and they only want to kill six people. It's not about a mass-murdering fog, it's about a sea-dog ghost story coming to life, and they don't tend to have indiscriminate killers. That we don't actually get full-on gory money-shots for every kill helps assist that, as it leaves it to our imagination, what they're doing to the body.

Further, Michael Myers kills a bare handful of people in Halloween - less than the sailors in the fog kill in The Fog, if I'm not mistaken. Would you say he isn't threatening because he barely kills anyone?

quote:


Sure, the mythos in The Fog is stronger (and the opening is excellent), but then the promise kinda wears off when the ghosts off come out rather useless. Compare it to the bedroom scene in The Orphanage, the car accident, the game with the ghosts and the entire final 10 minutes where Laura discovers the fate of her son, and The Fog comes out even more underwhelming.



But they don't come off as useless - they're out there to kill six people, and while there's some inconsistencies in the storytelling (namely, if the fog's over the town, why aren't the people at the candlelight vigil being slaughtered), and they fucking do their job. It's built like a ghost story told around the campfire, where the build-up is everything, and Carpenter gets that - the fog rolling in slowly, the knocking on the door, opening the door to find no-one outside - and yet he still gives the audience enough general death to offset how bloodless those stories often are. And in comparison to The Orphanage, it's simply strong and works better- The Orphanage coasts by on its "woman loses child" narrative and is nowhere near as creepy or entertaining. It has certain setpieces that work - the bathroom scene, the bedroom scene when Laura pours out her heart to her husband but it isn't him, the medium scene - but overall it's not as effective because it has this clear divide between the drama and the horror, and the atmosphere that it conjures during those sequences never carries effectively across the film. Belen Rueda's performance is excellent, the cinematography is lush and deep, and there are creepy setpieces, no doubt, but generally the film just doesn't maintain itself across its running time, and there wasn't really much to the lost child plot to differentiate it from, say, Silent Hill.


_____________________________

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rinc
She's supposed to be 13! I'd want her to be very attractive though


quote:

ORIGINAL: MonsterCat
quote:

ORIGINAL: Pigeon Army
Stop being mean to Deviation

No.

(in reply to Deviation)
Post #: 10063
RE: Top 100 Films I've Watched This Year: 2010 - 9/10/2010 12:43:25 AM   
swordsandsandals


Posts: 12571
Joined: 6/1/2006
From: A magical forest

quote:

ORIGINAL: paul_ie86

69. Enter the Void (Gaspar Noé, 2010)
Great stuff if a bit overlong. Excellent use of the first person perspective.



Another film added to the list of 'Films I'll Never Watch'. Largely for the POV shots I've heard about.


_____________________________

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rawlinson

Swords is right about everything.



quote:

ORIGINAL: Hood_Man

Swords smells like bum.



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Post #: 10064
RE: Top 100 Films I've Watched This Year: 2010 - 9/10/2010 1:46:31 AM   
swordsandsandals


Posts: 12571
Joined: 6/1/2006
From: A magical forest
Shoot Em Up

After the Thin Red Line most films are going to seem somewhat crap. This one was ridiculous enough to be diverting.

_____________________________

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rawlinson

Swords is right about everything.



quote:

ORIGINAL: Hood_Man

Swords smells like bum.



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Post #: 10065
RE: Top 100 Films I've Watched This Year: 2010 - 9/10/2010 1:51:04 AM   
Deviation


Posts: 27268
Joined: 2/6/2006
From: Enemies of Film HQ
quote:



That's because the fog itself isn't killing people, it's just the sailors, and they only want to kill six people. It's not about a mass-murdering fog, it's about a sea-dog ghost story coming to life, and they don't tend to have indiscriminate killers. That we don't actually get full-on gory money-shots for every kill helps assist that, as it leaves it to our imagination, what they're doing to the body.


I was referring to the sailors in the mist. Yeah, they don't have to be shown in gory money-shots, but show me they are actually doing some harm. I hardly got that these things as being threatening, just mildly menacing at times. They keep failing at getting their targets. It doesn't help my imagination to picture them as terrifying supernatural beings.

quote:


Further, Michael Myers kills a bare handful of people in Halloween - less than the sailors in the fog kill in The Fog, if I'm not mistaken. Would you say he isn't threatening because he barely kills anyone?


Really? I remember him killing quite a few, and some important major characters. It does help to heighten the tension and make other characters more vulnerable to being killed. Something The Fog could have done. The ones killed in The Fog never felt that vital.

quote:


But they don't come off as useless - they're out there to kill six people, and while there's some inconsistencies in the storytelling (namely, if the fog's over the town, why aren't the people at the candlelight vigil being slaughtered), and they fucking do their job. It's built like a ghost story told around the campfire, where the build-up is everything, and Carpenter gets that - the fog rolling in slowly, the knocking on the door, opening the door to find no-one outside - and yet he still gives the audience enough general death to offset how bloodless those stories often are.


Yeah, the fog in the town left me confused as well. You could be right on this, it's a shame I couldn't find it rewarding and satisfying in any way. Now shut up you ninny.

quote:

And in comparison to The Orphanage, it's simply strong and works better- The Orphanage coasts by on its "woman loses child" narrative and is nowhere near as creepy or entertaining. It has certain setpieces that work - the bathroom scene, the bedroom scene when Laura pours out her heart to her husband but it isn't him, the medium scene - but overall it's not as effective because it has this clear divide between the drama and the horror, and the atmosphere that it conjures during those sequences never carries effectively across the film. Belen Rueda's performance is excellent, the cinematography is lush and deep, and there are creepy setpieces, no doubt, but generally the film just doesn't maintain itself across its running time, and there wasn't really much to the lost child plot to differentiate it from, say, Silent Hill.



The concept of The Fog is creepier but be it with the bus scare, the crouching walls, the children's crying and their sudden appearance in the game, The Orphanage ended working better. It's even has a more interesting mystery throughout, and flows from drama to horror and back with ease and never jars while doing so. The Silent Hill comparison is a bit odd though.


_____________________________

quote:

ORIGINAL: Dpp1978
There are certainly times where calling a person a cunt is not only reasonable, it is a gross understatement.

quote:


ORIGINAL: elab49
I really wish I could go down to see Privates

(in reply to Pigeon Army)
Post #: 10066
RE: Top 100 Films I've Watched This Year: 2010 - 9/10/2010 2:10:47 AM   
Pigeon Army


Posts: 14612
Joined: 29/1/2006
From: Pixar HQ, George Lucas' Office.
quote:

ORIGINAL: Deviation

I was referring to the sailors in the mist. Yeah, they don't have to be shown in gory money-shots, but show me they are actually doing some harm. I hardly got that these things as being threatening, just mildly menacing at times. They keep failing at getting their targets. It doesn't help my imagination to picture them as terrifying supernatural beings.


By the time we get to the church, THEY HAVE BRUTALLY KILLED FIVE PEOPLE. The only targets they failed at getting initially were the main characters, because they're the protagonists and we can't kill them off until the end if we're going to kill them off. What more do you want? Should Carpenter have shown them carving up everyone at the candlelight vigil just to sate your bloodlust?

quote:


Really? I remember him killing quite a few, and some important major characters. It does help to heighten the tension and make other characters more vulnerable to being killed. Something The Fog could have done. The ones killed in The Fog never felt that vital.


In the first film, he kills Laurie's two friends, one of their boyfriends, and an unnamed driver. That's four people.

The ones killed in The Fog are side characters, yes, and I can understand why you would see it that way, but I think the threat was enough to get me on edge. When they attack the lighthouse, when they attack Stevie's house, when they attack the boat - it's clear they're indiscriminate and brutal killers, and that they keep getting close to the main characters is enough, IMO.


quote:


The concept of The Fog is creepier but be it with the bus scare, the crouching walls, the children's crying and their sudden appearance in the game, The Orphanage ended working better. It's even has a more interesting mystery throughout, and flows from drama to horror and back with ease and never jars while doing so. The Silent Hill comparison is a bit odd though.


If you're looking for a mystery, of course The Orphanage is going to be better, because The Fog isn't a damn mystery film. One's a ghost story, one's a mystery with ghosts. And I'll say it again - while The Orphanage had good setpieces with some nail-biting tension, the atmosphere just doesn't carry - the film clearly marks every horror scene out as "coming soon, get ready" with the way it's set up (the appearance of baghead in the grounds before the bathroom sequence; the prolonged period setting up for the medium sequence; the way the bedroom speech seems to be wedged between scenes and tells us nothing we don't already know) and there's just no atmosphere in the dramatic sequences, because Rueda and Fernando Cayo don't really carry that information in their performances and many of the drama scenes seem to be written as though none of this supernatural stuff is preying on anyone's mind, and if you're only going to contradict me without saying why, then I don't know why we're arguing this.

The Silent Hill comparison is totally appropriate, btw, because the films have the same basic 'parent loses child in hostile environment' narrative, and because I watched it recently. I stand by my statement that, aside from the type of horror, there's little differentiation in the way the two deal with the parents dealing with the loss of their child - in a sort of offhand way in order to propel the ideas for horror scenes along, treating the dramatic stuff in between as a necessary evil. The Orphanage just covers it up slightly better.

< Message edited by Pigeon Army -- 9/10/2010 2:13:48 AM >


_____________________________

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rinc
She's supposed to be 13! I'd want her to be very attractive though


quote:

ORIGINAL: MonsterCat
quote:

ORIGINAL: Pigeon Army
Stop being mean to Deviation

No.

(in reply to Deviation)
Post #: 10067
RE: Top 100 Films I've Watched This Year: 2010 - 9/10/2010 3:00:32 AM   
Deviation


Posts: 27268
Joined: 2/6/2006
From: Enemies of Film HQ
quote:

By the time we get to the church, THEY HAVE BRUTALLY KILLED FIVE PEOPLE. The only targets they failed at getting initially were the main characters, because they're the protagonists and we can't kill them off until the end if we're going to kill them off. What more do you want? Should Carpenter have shown them carving up everyone at the candlelight vigil just to sate your bloodlust?


YES I DEMAND CARPENTER TO SATISFY MY BLOODLUST. Or someone I did not expect to get killed.

quote:

In the first film, he kills Laurie's two friends, one of their boyfriends, and an unnamed driver. That's four people.


Thanks for reminding me.

quote:


If you're looking for a mystery, of course The Orphanage is going to be better, because The Fog isn't a damn mystery film. One's a ghost story, one's a mystery with ghosts.


I don't think I said that The Fog is poor becuase it lacked mystery. I meant that I preferred The Orphanage becuase of the mystery plot. Sorry if I worded it badly. You ninny.

quote:

if you're only going to contradict me without saying why, then I don't know why we're arguing this.


Well I'm a ninny and I am not capable of delivering them. Or I did as I said that I didn't mind the shifts from drama to horror as they never felt jarring in tone and streamed well from one scene to another (working both as drama when intended and as horror).

And I did feel it atmospheric throughout. I wasn't contradicting you (I agree that the film tended to segregated the drama from the horror moments, I didn't find it to be a problem as I thought they both worked), I was disagreeing with you on certain aspects of the film. And Rueda seemed quite preoccupied with the ghosts throughout the entire film (and the probable chance that they don't exist) and her performance does show that and her husband did seem pre-occupied with what was going on with his wife. I'll give you Cayo who was rather dull.

quote:

The Silent Hill comparison is totally appropriate, btw, because the films have the same basic 'parent loses child in hostile environment' narrative, and because I watched it recently. I stand by my statement that, aside from the type of horror, there's little differentiation in the way the two deal with the parents dealing with the loss of their child - in a sort of offhand way in order to propel the ideas for horror scenes along, treating the dramatic stuff in between as a necessary evil. The Orphanage just covers it up slightly better.


I don't think it is a fair comparison (I did consider it similar to The Others, Devil's Backbone, Don't Look Now and more Gothic horrors like The Innocents in its tone though, so Silent Hill never really came to mind), The Orphanage might have separated its drama from the horror but it was never in the way Silent Hill did. That film seemed to operate like a video game with some expositional cut-scenes in between the Darkness scenes. The drama in The Orphanage might not have always been successful or atmospheric (I disagree on this btw) but it never felt as filler as the SH film did. Rueda's possible madness, her grief, her relationship with her husband and her search for her child was as important to the film as the horror scenes (if my memory serves well, maybe I am forgetting some scenes which had little value).





_____________________________

quote:

ORIGINAL: Dpp1978
There are certainly times where calling a person a cunt is not only reasonable, it is a gross understatement.

quote:


ORIGINAL: elab49
I really wish I could go down to see Privates

(in reply to Pigeon Army)
Post #: 10068
RE: Top 100 Films I've Watched This Year: 2010 - 9/10/2010 3:14:22 AM   
Pigeon Army


Posts: 14612
Joined: 29/1/2006
From: Pixar HQ, George Lucas' Office.
quote:

ORIGINAL: Deviation
quote:


If you're looking for a mystery, of course The Orphanage is going to be better, because The Fog isn't a damn mystery film. One's a ghost story, one's a mystery with ghosts.


I don't think I said that The Fog is poor becuase it lacked mystery. I meant that I preferred The Orphanage becuase of the mystery plot. Sorry if I worded it badly. You ninny.


Now, see, that's misinterpreting what I said. You said The Orphanage "even has a more interesting mystery throughout", implying that The Fog had a mystery, which it doesn't. I was merely saying that if you're looking to The Fog for mystery, no doubt you're going to think The Orphanage is better

quote:

And Rueda seemed quite preoccupied with the ghosts throughout the entire film (and the probable chance that they don't exist) and her performance does show that and her husband did seem pre-occupied with what was going on with his wife. I'll give you Cayo who was rather dull.


It doesn't really show in the scenes where we break from the horror, though, and that's my point. The scene at the support group had Rueda mention the ghosts at depth, but it doesn't feel like the ghosts are playing into her worry; the arguments between her and her husband later in the film could be shoved into a completely ghostless film and still maintain their potency. It just seems like it was written as a mystery film about lost kids and then ghosts were shoved in, in a way. Obviously, I like the film, but this was a problem.

quote:

I don't think it is a fair comparison (I did consider it similar to The Others, Devil's Backbone, Don't Look Now and more Gothic horrors like The Innocents in its tone though, so Silent Hill never really came to mind), The Orphanage might have separated its drama from the horror but it was never in the way Silent Hill did.


You're missing why I brought up Silent Hill, because that wasn't the reason. The reason was that I felt the narrative, like in Silent Hill, coasted by on "woman loses child, shit goes down" without really going into any depth with it. That was a completely different point to the one you're trying to say I was talking about there. No doubt Rueda's worry about her son was important, but Radha Mitchell's worry about her daughter was important too - in both films, however, there was this disconnect where it just felt like we were stuck in square one for the entire time and Rueda's state of mind wasn't really investigated. She might be crazy, she might not be, it was all surface level stuff.

_____________________________

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rinc
She's supposed to be 13! I'd want her to be very attractive though


quote:

ORIGINAL: MonsterCat
quote:

ORIGINAL: Pigeon Army
Stop being mean to Deviation

No.

(in reply to Deviation)
Post #: 10069
RE: Top 100 Films I've Watched This Year: 2010 - 9/10/2010 4:06:38 AM   
Deviation


Posts: 27268
Joined: 2/6/2006
From: Enemies of Film HQ
quote:

Now, see, that's misinterpreting what I said. You said The Orphanage "even has a more interesting mystery throughout", implying that The Fog had a mystery, which it doesn't. I was merely saying that if you're looking to The Fog for mystery, no doubt you're going to think The Orphanage is better


Bad wording from my part. I apologize. You win this round Gadget.

However......

quote:

in a sort of offhand way in order to propel the ideas for horror scenes along, treating the dramatic stuff in between as a necessary evil.


I did take that as suggesting that drama scenes were something of a filler and set-up for and between the horror scenes ala Silent Hill did, which I would disagree with. And especially not on the level SH did, as I certainly don't remember The Orphanage being that artificial (and on a different note, The Orphanage was also much more focused, as it didn't lose the entire child searching plot to a cult and revenge plot). It was that comment I mostly responded too.

Also, why the hell are you re-watching Silent Hill? I saw it twice and even that was once too many.


_____________________________

quote:

ORIGINAL: Dpp1978
There are certainly times where calling a person a cunt is not only reasonable, it is a gross understatement.

quote:


ORIGINAL: elab49
I really wish I could go down to see Privates

(in reply to Pigeon Army)
Post #: 10070
RE: Top 100 Films I've Watched This Year: 2010 - 9/10/2010 4:11:03 AM   
Deviation


Posts: 27268
Joined: 2/6/2006
From: Enemies of Film HQ
Yeah and you're a ninny. Forgot to say that. 

_____________________________

quote:

ORIGINAL: Dpp1978
There are certainly times where calling a person a cunt is not only reasonable, it is a gross understatement.

quote:


ORIGINAL: elab49
I really wish I could go down to see Privates

(in reply to Deviation)
Post #: 10071
RE: Top 100 Films I've Watched This Year: 2010 - 9/10/2010 5:26:08 AM   
Pigeon Army


Posts: 14612
Joined: 29/1/2006
From: Pixar HQ, George Lucas' Office.
quote:

ORIGINAL: Deviation

quote:

in a sort of offhand way in order to propel the ideas for horror scenes along, treating the dramatic stuff in between as a necessary evil.


I did take that as suggesting that drama scenes were something of a filler and set-up for and between the horror scenes ala Silent Hill did, which I would disagree with. And especially not on the level SH did, as I certainly don't remember The Orphanage being that artificial (and on a different note, The Orphanage was also much more focused, as it didn't lose the entire child searching plot to a cult and revenge plot).


I'm not saying it's filler - I've acknowledged that The Orphanage is far more focused than Silent Hill and I've said that Rueda losing Simon and trying to find him is important in the context of the film - and that's a bit of bad wording on my behalf, I admit. I'm trying to say that the story doesn't really evolve as it should, and the narrative itself is treated in an offhand way. We're stuck in a constant state of "woman loses kid, sees ghosts", and it doesn't really go any further than those five words - there's no bigger picture to be painted, there's no deep themes analysed, there's no real narrative style emulated or interrogated. It's a very surface-level film - not one where the drama is filler, just one where the drama isn't doing anything.

quote:


Also, why the hell are you re-watching Silent Hill? I saw it twice and even that was once too many.


Because, not unlike The Orphanage, it's highly impressive visually. No doubt if I'd seen The Orphanage before the deadline for the visuals list closed, it would've been on my list with Silent Hill.


< Message edited by Pigeon Army -- 9/10/2010 5:27:48 AM >


_____________________________

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rinc
She's supposed to be 13! I'd want her to be very attractive though


quote:

ORIGINAL: MonsterCat
quote:

ORIGINAL: Pigeon Army
Stop being mean to Deviation

No.

(in reply to Deviation)
Post #: 10072
RE: Top 100 Films I've Watched This Year: 2010 - 9/10/2010 9:29:53 AM   
matty_b


Posts: 14446
Joined: 19/10/2005
From: Outpost 31 calling McMurtle.
quote:

ORIGINAL: Deviation

quote:

By the time we get to the church, THEY HAVE BRUTALLY KILLED FIVE PEOPLE. The only targets they failed at getting initially were the main characters, because they're the protagonists and we can't kill them off until the end if we're going to kill them off. What more do you want? Should Carpenter have shown them carving up everyone at the candlelight vigil just to sate your bloodlust?


YES I DEMAND CARPENTER TO SATISFY MY BLOODLUST. Or someone I did not expect to get killed.



Did you expect the nice old babysitting lady to get killed? Or the priest at the end?

And while they're not important, the sailors at the boat are offed in a particularly unpleasant way, which I think helps establish the brutal nature of the ghosts.


_____________________________

quote:

ORIGINAL: Cool Breeze
Mattyb is a shining example of what the perfect Empire Forum member is.


(in reply to Deviation)
Post #: 10073
RE: Top 100 Films I've Watched This Year: 2010 - 9/10/2010 3:55:24 PM   
Deviation


Posts: 27268
Joined: 2/6/2006
From: Enemies of Film HQ
quote:

I'm not saying it's filler - I've acknowledged that The Orphanage is far more focused than Silent Hill and I've said that Rueda losing Simon and trying to find him is important in the context of the film - and that's a bit of bad wording on my behalf, I admit. I'm trying to say that the story doesn't really evolve as it should, and the narrative itself is treated in an offhand way. We're stuck in a constant state of "woman loses kid, sees ghosts", and it doesn't really go any further than those five words - there's no bigger picture to be painted, there's no deep themes analysed, there's no real narrative style emulated or interrogated. It's a very surface-level film - not one where the drama is filler, just one where the drama isn't doing anything.


That is a fair criticism.

quote:

Because, not unlike The Orphanage, it's highly impressive visually. No doubt if I'd seen The Orphanage before the deadline for the visuals list closed, it would've been on my list with Silent Hill.


You could also play Silent Hill 2, it is visually spectacular, has most of the same monsters and a plot that can be called the horror version of Solaris too. And even if you did, then play that again.

quote:

Did you expect the nice old babysitting lady to get killed? Or the priest at the end?

And while they're not important, the sailors at the boat are offed in a particularly unpleasant way, which I think helps establish the brutal nature of the ghosts.


Sadly I did. Especially the priest.



_____________________________

quote:

ORIGINAL: Dpp1978
There are certainly times where calling a person a cunt is not only reasonable, it is a gross understatement.

quote:


ORIGINAL: elab49
I really wish I could go down to see Privates

(in reply to matty_b)
Post #: 10074
RE: Top 100 Films I've Watched This Year: 2010 - 9/10/2010 5:02:38 PM   
elab49


Posts: 54433
Joined: 1/10/2005
quote:

ORIGINAL: Deviation

quote:

I'm not saying it's filler - I've acknowledged that The Orphanage is far more focused than Silent Hill and I've said that Rueda losing Simon and trying to find him is important in the context of the film - and that's a bit of bad wording on my behalf, I admit. I'm trying to say that the story doesn't really evolve as it should, and the narrative itself is treated in an offhand way. We're stuck in a constant state of "woman loses kid, sees ghosts", and it doesn't really go any further than those five words - there's no bigger picture to be painted, there's no deep themes analysed, there's no real narrative style emulated or interrogated. It's a very surface-level film - not one where the drama is filler, just one where the drama isn't doing anything.


That is a fair criticism.



I just don't agree that it is. What we have is a brilliant central performance showing the impact of the loss of the son - grief and a descent into madness. That is the big picture, it's done with a good deal of skill and far more character work than the genre tends to. Perhaps that is why it seems unexpected and some viewers might expect more? But I see it as her story and the impact it has on her - that's the drama.

_____________________________

Lips Together and Blow - blogtasticness and Glasgow Film Festival GFF13!

quote:

ORIGINAL: Deviation] LIKE AMERICA'S SWEETHEARTS TOO. IT MADE ME LAUGH A LOT AND THOUGHT IT WAS WITTY. ALSO I FEEL SLOWLY DYING INSIDE. I KEEP AGREEING WITH ELAB.


Annual Poll 2013 - All Lists Welcome

(in reply to Deviation)
Post #: 10075
RE: Top 100 Films I've Watched This Year: 2010 - 9/10/2010 5:11:42 PM   
Deviation


Posts: 27268
Joined: 2/6/2006
From: Enemies of Film HQ
I don't agree with it either and am more on your side on this issue, but his criticism of it isn't terribly constructed. And I haven't seen The Orphanage since its release.




_____________________________

quote:

ORIGINAL: Dpp1978
There are certainly times where calling a person a cunt is not only reasonable, it is a gross understatement.

quote:


ORIGINAL: elab49
I really wish I could go down to see Privates

(in reply to elab49)
Post #: 10076
RE: Top 100 Films I've Watched This Year: 2010 - 10/10/2010 12:28:56 AM   
Pigeon Army


Posts: 14612
Joined: 29/1/2006
From: Pixar HQ, George Lucas' Office.
quote:

ORIGINAL: elab49

I just don't agree that it is. What we have is a brilliant central performance showing the impact of the loss of the son - grief and a descent into madness. That is the big picture, it's done with a good deal of skill and far more character work than the genre tends to. Perhaps that is why it seems unexpected and some viewers might expect more? But I see it as her story and the impact it has on her - that's the drama.


It's a very good performance, no doubt, but there's really little in the writing that distinguishes it from any other horror film dealing with this issue. Rueda cries and broods for 100 minutes, but I didn't come out knowing anything more about the character or feeling any more sympathy for her than I did Radha Mitchell in Silent Hill. It's all well and good, but it's something I've seen hundreds of times before, and while the performance valiantly pushes it above that, the story still coasts by on that basic premise without doing a hell of a lot with it - anything brought to the character is brought by Rueda, not by the script. And this is my overall point - it's satisfied with "woman loses child, sees ghosts" and not going any further. Rueda's excellent, but that's only so much in a film that feels threadbare narratively-speaking.


_____________________________

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rinc
She's supposed to be 13! I'd want her to be very attractive though


quote:

ORIGINAL: MonsterCat
quote:

ORIGINAL: Pigeon Army
Stop being mean to Deviation

No.

(in reply to elab49)
Post #: 10077
RE: Top 100 Films I've Watched This Year: 2010 - 10/10/2010 9:51:01 PM   
Miles Messervy 007


Posts: 6884
Joined: 11/2/2009
Almost forgot. Very consistent month:

FILMS WATCHED IN SEPTEMBER 2010


Features:


1. Reservoir Dogs (1992, Tarantino) RW 10 imdb review


2. La double vie de Véronique [The Double Life of Veronique] (1991, Kieślowski) 9 imdb review


3. Scott Pilgrim vs. the World (2010, Wright) C 9 imdb review


4. Trainspotting (1996, Boyle) 8 imdb review


5. Liebe ist kälter als der Tod [Love is Colder Than Death] (1969, Fassbinder) 8 imdb review


6. Gregory’s Girl (1981, Forsyth) 8 imdb review


7. Troll 2 (1990, Fragasso) 8 imdb review


8. Le boucher [The Butcher] (1970, Chabrol) 8 imdb review


9. La carrière de Suzanne [Suzanne’s Career] (1963, Rohmer) 8 imdb review


10. Dressed to Kill (1980, De Palma) 8 imdb review


11. Il gattopardo [The Leopard] (1963, Visconti) C 8 imdb review


12. Que la bête meure [This Man Must Die] (1969, Chabrol) 8 imdb review


13. Lola rennt [Run Lola Run] (1998, Tykwer) 8 imdb review


14. The Blue Dahlia (1946, Marshall) 8 imdb review


15. La femme infidéle [The Unfaithful Wife] (1969, Chabrol) 8 imdb review


16. Les biches [The Does] (1968, Chabrol) 8 imdb review


17. Hail the Conquering Hero (1944, P. Sturges) 8 imdb review


18. The Great Dictator (1940, Chaplin) 8 imdb review


19. Batman Begins (2005, Nolan) 8 imdb review


20. Moulin Rouge! (2001, Luhrmann) 8 imdb review


21. Casino (1995, Scorsese) 8 imdb review


22. The Odd Couple (1968, Saks) 7 imdb review


23. Contes immoraux [Immoral Tales] (1974, Borowczyk) 7 imdb review


24. All I Desire (1953, Sirk) 7 imdb review


25. Mrs. Doubtfire (1993, Columbus) 7 imdb review


26. Rebel Without a Cause (1955, N. Ray) 7 imdb review


27. Primer (2004, Carruth) 7 imdb review


28. You Only Live Once (1938, Lang) 7 imdb review


29. Every Thing You Always Wanted to Know About Sex * But Were Afraid to Ask (1972, Allen) 7 imdb review

Shorts:

1. The Cat Concerto (1947, Hanna/Barbera) {7 mins} RW 10 imdb review
2. Nuit et brouillard [Night and Fog] (1955, Resnais) {30 mins} 9 imdb review
3. Antoine et Colette [Antoine and Colette] (1962, Truffaut) {30 mins} 8 imdb review
4. La boulangère de Monceau [The Girl at the Monceau Bakery] (1963, Rohmer) {23 mins} 8 imdb review
5. The Critic (1963, Pintoff) {3 mins} RW 8 imdb review
6. Whistle and I'll Come to You (1968, Miller) {42 mins} 8 imdb review
7. Hra s kameny (1965, Švankmajer) {8 mins} RW 8 imdb review
8. The Grandmother (1970, Lynch) {34 mins} 5 imdb review


See code, ratings, and a brief explanation on shorts in the initial post.

Stats:
Films seen by decade (+shorts)
20s: 0 (+0)
30s: 1 (+0)
40s: 3 (+1)
50s: 2 (+1)
60s: 7 (+5)
70s: 3 (+1)
80s: 2 (+0)
90s: 7 (+0)
00s: 3 (+0)
10s: 1 (+0)

Average rating for features: 7.9
Average rating for shorts: 8.0
Average rating for cinema viewing: 8.5
Average rating for re-watches: 9.0

Directors with more than one feature:
Claude Chabrol - 4

Directors with one feature:
Quentin Tarantino, Krzysztof Kieślowski, Edgar Wright, Danny Boyle, Rainer Werner Fassbinder, Bill Forsyth, Claudio Fragasso, Éric Rohmer, Brian De Palma, Luchino Visconti, Tom Tykwer, George Marshall, Preston Sturges, Charlie Chaplin, Christopher Nolan, Baz Luhrmann, Martin Scorsese, Gene Saks, Walerian Borowczyk, Douglas Sirk, Chris Columbus, Nicholas Ray, Shane Carruth, Fritz Lang, Woody Allen

_____________________________

quote:

jamesbondguy:
Miles is clearly the finest film theorist of his generation

quote:

Deviation:
if it isn't ham, I'll eat a living pig.

(in reply to Deviation)
Post #: 10078
RE: Top 100 Films I've Watched This Year: 2010 - 12/10/2010 9:07:01 AM   
MOTH

 

Posts: 3362
Joined: 3/10/2005
From: Sittin' on the dock of the bay
The King of Marvin Gardens (Bob Rafelson, 1972)
Meh, watch Five Easy Pieces instead (4/10)

_____________________________

I've only gone and set up a blog! This week I've been mostly reviewing The Lego Movie and Wadjda. Click: The Fast Picture Show

(in reply to Miles Messervy 007)
Post #: 10079
RE: Top 100 Films I've Watched This Year: 2010 - 12/10/2010 9:15:57 AM   
Gimli The Dwarf


Posts: 77072
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Central Park Zoo
72. Of Time and The City (1st view, 2008, Terence Davies) - 4/5*

Terence Davies ode to Liverpool, which is something I find quite odd because Liverpool's a dump. To be sure, it has a spectacular cathedral (the Anglican one, not the one that looks like a funnel), the largest cathedral and the fifth largest in the world. If you can be bothered to venture into the supposedly swanky but rather crap Albert Dock there's the excellent Maritime Museum and the Slavery Museum. The Royal Liver Building, Port of Liverpool Building and the Cunard Building help to give Liverpool it's instantly recognisable skyline, and there's also the White Star Building in well. In fact, the maritime history of the city is fascinating, everything from the Titanic connections to the once bustling port. Inland a bit and the Walker Art Gellery is excellent (housing two of my favourite paintings), St George's Hall is worth a visit (it's in Downey Jr's Sherlock Holmes!) and the rather stupidly named World Museum Liverpool has many great exhibits (but it's not as good as once was).

But is any of that what Liverpool is generally famous for today. Of course not. It's all about two teams of overpayed twerps who kick a ball round a field, 4 mop-heads who could barely sing and a crap soap opera. Then there's those bloody awful lamb-bananas (look them up), The Yellow Duckmarine (don't ask) and the shopping centre Liverpool One which is really 4 decent stores and about 17 billion clothing shops. No, Liverpool has some great aspects, they just happen to be in Liverpool. It's not my favourite city.

But that's all just me having a moan and his excellent documentary has little to do with any of that, though Davies does seem upset that the Liverpool of his youth has now gone, an idea that's conveyed quite brilliantly through archive footage, newsreel, stunning music and his own thoughtful voiceover. In the last year or so I've seen four of Davies' feature films and loved them all. Perhaps it's time to try The House Of Mirth again, having giving it a lowly 2 stars 3 or 4 years back.


99. Buried (1st view, 2010, Rodrigo Cortés) - 4/5*
Inventive and suspenseful.



_____________________________

So, sir, we let him have it right up! And I have to report, sir, he did not like it, sir.

Fellow scientists, poindexters, geeks.

Yeah, Mr. White! Yeah, science!

Much more better!

(in reply to Miles Messervy 007)
Post #: 10080
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