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RE: Avatar - 24/11/2010 1:22:28 PM   
TheFuzz_1989


Posts: 399
Joined: 16/9/2010
First time I saw it I thought it was AMAZING. But now that I think about it, like people are saying, when you go past the effects (which are undeniably fantastic) it really is nothing special. No good dialogue, no gun porn, no grunts (or some form of macho-ism), nothing compared to Cameron's other films. The story itself lacked depth, and I DO care about story more than gun porn, grunts and dialogue. No doubt, the actors were great and yes, it was emotional, but it just didn't resonate with me as a standout film.

Little off-topic but I gotta say: between Avatar and The Hurt Locker... the Oscar should have gone to Up.

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Post #: 151
RE: Avatar - 24/11/2010 6:17:20 PM   
juanvasquez


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quote:

ORIGINAL: TheFuzz_1989

Little off-topic but I gotta say: between Avatar and The Hurt Locker... the Oscar should have gone to Up.


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Post #: 152
RE: Avatar - 25/11/2010 10:55:04 AM   
pete_traynor


Posts: 3010
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From: Balboa Towers, Balboa Island, CA

quote:

ORIGINAL: juanvasquez


quote:

ORIGINAL: TheFuzz_1989

Little off-topic but I gotta say: between Avatar and The Hurt Locker... the Oscar should have gone to Up.


No quarrel from me sir!


Nothing I saw came close to Up that year!

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Post #: 153
RE: Avatar - 25/11/2010 8:00:25 PM   
vad3r


Posts: 4403
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quote:

ORIGINAL: pete_traynor


quote:

ORIGINAL: juanvasquez


quote:

ORIGINAL: TheFuzz_1989

Little off-topic but I gotta say: between Avatar and The Hurt Locker... the Oscar should have gone to Up.


No quarrel from me sir!


Nothing I saw came close to Up that year!


It wasn't even in the top 3 animated films of the year for me (fantastic opening 10 mins, the rest is Dreamworks deleted scenes).
Cloudy With A Chance Of Meatballs, Fantastic Mr Fox and Coraline are far superior.

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Post #: 154
RE: Avatar - 26/11/2010 12:17:22 PM   
pete_traynor


Posts: 3010
Joined: 28/11/2006
From: Balboa Towers, Balboa Island, CA

quote:

ORIGINAL: vad3r


quote:

ORIGINAL: pete_traynor


quote:

ORIGINAL: juanvasquez


quote:

ORIGINAL: TheFuzz_1989

Little off-topic but I gotta say: between Avatar and The Hurt Locker... the Oscar should have gone to Up.


No quarrel from me sir!


Nothing I saw came close to Up that year!


It wasn't even in the top 3 animated films of the year for me (fantastic opening 10 mins, the rest is Dreamworks deleted scenes).
Cloudy With A Chance Of Meatballs, Fantastic Mr Fox and Coraline are far superior.


Utter nonsense! But to each their own

Of those I only saw Fantastic Mr Fox. Really good little film. But for me, not a patch on Up!


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Post #: 155
RE: Avatar - 26/11/2010 5:40:26 PM   
Tech_Noir

 

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I just wanted to state that the extended cut of Avatar makes me like the film a whole lot more.

I love the shot of Jake in the alley with the light reflected in the puddle, foreshadowing the bio-luminance of Pandora.

Grace's tears when she sees Jake being accepted as "one of the people" also means something now after being told of her previous experiences.

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Post #: 156
RE: Avatar - 27/11/2010 8:28:17 PM   
hampstead bandit

 

Posts: 381
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I just wanted to state that the extended cut of Avatar makes me like the film a whole lot more.

totally agree

I traded in my vanilla Avatar HD Blu-Ray for the extended version as it was available in an exchange shop in London for a few more $$

the extra material fundamentally changed the viewing experience, in my humble opinion

not just the extra material (the 'earth' footage at the very start is fantastic) but the "pacing" of the film changes with the extended edit, and allows the film to breathe without feeling overlong

I have seen Avatar twice in the cinema (3D and 2D) and then several times at home in the theatrical release, but found the extended version a different experience and much more enjoyable

the feature length special features give a real insight into the sheer spectacle of bringing Avatar to the screen and the incredible challenges faced by James Cameron and his team

highly recommended to Avatar fans, or even perhaps to those who did not think much of the theatrical release

5/5

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Post #: 157
RE: Avatar - 28/11/2010 8:28:36 AM   
TheFuzz_1989


Posts: 399
Joined: 16/9/2010
Sound like the extended edition is worth buying. I might check it out, if it benefits the film like you guys say so.

Doubt there will be anything as good as sentries in there, BUT I'm sure it will be satisfying.

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Post #: 158
RE: Avatar - 1/12/2010 10:27:45 PM   
shool


Posts: 10114
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From: In The Pipe, Five by Five.
Just finished watching the Extended version. The extra footage does a great job of fleshing out back story, Graces in particular.

This film has gone down in a lot of peoples estimation in hindsight, not in mine though. I still think its first class. 5/5


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Post #: 159
AVATAR - 25/12/2010 12:55:15 PM   
Snake-Eyes


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From: ZONE 2
Well, I now own the 'extended edition' - my Xmas gift from my younger bro - it's weird 'cos I only saw AVATAR once, IMAX when it was first released last year. Thing I'm looking forward to the most are the extras i.e. the documentaries.

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Post #: 160
RE: AVATAR - 29/12/2010 9:42:21 AM   
Timon


Posts: 14588
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Bristol
I got the extended Blu Ray for Christmas and watched it last night, and I thought it was excellent. All the additional scenes with Grace really fleshed her out and I enjoyed seeing future Earth with its lack of greenery.

Overall, still a feast for the eyes and a exciting few hours.


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Post #: 161
RE: AVATAR - 29/12/2010 10:40:09 AM   
Tech_Noir

 

Posts: 20199
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I always thought the opening of the theatrical cut felt very choppy, like a recap from a TV show.

And while I like seeing Earth in the extended cut it should have been grittier. The bar was so bright it reminded me the bar in Attack of The Clones.

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Post #: 162
RE: AVATAR - 29/12/2010 2:42:31 PM   
The Hooded Man


Posts: 2773
Joined: 12/7/2006
Still think it's an excellent genre film that shows a hell of a lot of imagination, even though for some reason I keep thinking that Skull Island in Peter Jackson's King Kong did a better job of giving us an alien landscape inhabited by weird creatures.

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Post #: 163
RE: AVATAR - 25/1/2011 1:14:43 PM   
pete_traynor


Posts: 3010
Joined: 28/11/2006
From: Balboa Towers, Balboa Island, CA

Have been watching the extended cut in sessions, as frankly I can’t really be bothered to sit and watch it in one go anymore. Most of the extended footage thus far looks nice but adds little/nothing to the overall experience. But last night I got to the scene of Grace talking to Jake about what had happened to her school. To be honest, I was legitimately shocked. It was a rather brilliant and beautifully acted scene that had real emotional heft and even brought a slight tear to the eye. This insight into character was all too lacking in the film and moments like these were pretty much absent from the original cut. I think chopping that scene was a poor editorial choice myself. It was rare in the film as it showed the director coaxing out really great performances, to go along with those pretty pixels.

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Post #: 164
RE: Avatar - 3/2/2011 11:48:32 AM   
jackamla

 

Posts: 6
Joined: 3/2/2011
Avatar brings us as close as the film has never gone to visit an alien world. Creatures beautiful surroundings, exotic and native incredibly realistic Pandora arrest the senses, visual, aural and emotional.

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Post #: 165
RE: Avatar - 3/2/2011 6:03:44 PM   
rich


Posts: 5041
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Neo Kobe
Just saw the BD version. This is is still a decent movie, mainly due to Stephen Lang and Sigourney Weaver (and the extended cut is better soley for more her) but it's still a shame to think what should have followed from Cameron's early sci-fi classics. There really isnt enough character and depth for such an interesting subject (being in another body, stuck on a hostile planet). They still should have had Grace and Neytiri vs the Company though and left out boring Sam Worthington altogether along with all the clichés and tropes of joining another culture and making out with one of their women despite them knowing hes an alien with no personality. And I seriously dont get all the "oh it's like another world" stuff because it's really, really not. It's an earth jungle with a bunch of undersea stuff thrown on. Luckily the finale shows all the useless Michael Bay's out there what a real action sequence should be like.

< Message edited by rich -- 3/2/2011 6:05:46 PM >


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Post #: 166
RE: Avatar - 3/2/2011 6:06:09 PM   
Tech_Noir

 

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I can't bring myself to rewatch the film, not a bad film but just not memorable.

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Post #: 167
RE: Avatar - 4/2/2011 12:27:43 AM   
chambanzi


Posts: 441
Joined: 31/8/2010
It kind of irritates me when people say that once you get past the graphics the movie is shallow because a whole planet was created with unique looking creatures and plants. The small things like the way they ride the flying creatures etc is just so detailed and adds whole new layers of meaning to the film.
In my opinion movies simply based on narrative are shallow.

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Post #: 168
RE: Avatar - 4/2/2011 7:58:49 PM   
rich


Posts: 5041
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Neo Kobe
I'm not sure what you mean by "shallow" since the quality of creature animation has no bearing on the film's depth. What else is there to a film but narrative - we are being told a story. If that story is told poorly or without proper characterisation then it doesn't matter how much money they spend on visual effects. What sort of layers do you think it has? I found very little complexity. 

< Message edited by rich -- 4/2/2011 7:59:08 PM >


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Post #: 169
RE: Avatar - 4/2/2011 8:39:59 PM   
Rgirvan44


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From: Punishment Park
It isn't a poorly told story. It is just a basic story with not much depth. 

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Post #: 170
RE: Avatar - 5/2/2011 2:18:53 PM   
chambanzi


Posts: 441
Joined: 31/8/2010

quote:

ORIGINAL: rich

I'm not sure what you mean by "shallow" since the quality of creature animation has no bearing on the film's depth. What else is there to a film but narrative - we are being told a story. If that story is told poorly or without proper characterisation then it doesn't matter how much money they spend on visual effects. What sort of layers do you think it has? I found very little complexity. 


The creature animation does have a bearing on the films depth- the fact that they made the world look so beautiful is vital to the film's narrative as the humans come and destroy it which is horrible to watch sending a message about the environment as well as how destructive humans can be.
And how about the fact the main character was paralysed and this was his escape?
Please there was enough depth in the movie, people just hate on it to be cool but it is a visually stunning film with a message.

Every part of a film is vital to the film's depth and not just the narrative. Cinematography, safe space, narrative, visuals and sound are all as important as one another.

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Post #: 171
RE: Avatar - 5/2/2011 11:38:59 PM   
rich


Posts: 5041
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Neo Kobe
quote:

ORIGINAL: Rgirvan44

It isn't a poorly told story. It is just a basic story with not much depth. 


Just generalising when I said poorly told. But yes. Guess we're all just "acting cool" though and this film is really a rich and multi-layered masterpiece!


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Post #: 172
RE: Avatar - 6/2/2011 3:24:39 AM   
chambanzi


Posts: 441
Joined: 31/8/2010
Woah now you are putting words in my mouth. I never said this was a masterpiece and I never said you specifically were trying to be cool. Please don't exaggerate and dramatise things to make a point.

My point is that it irritates me that people constantly complain this movie has nothing to it just because it has special effects and is a blockbuster when there are films with far less substance out there.
And no I'm not saying it's a masterpiece but there was depth to it and I explained my reasonings for this already. If you want to disagree with me then that is fine.



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Post #: 173
RE: Avatar - 4/1/2012 4:41:52 PM   
Timon


Posts: 14588
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Bristol
So I watched the extended edition again over Christmas, and I personally think it holds up really well. Plus the scene where Jake is 'gathering the clans' coupled with Horner's score does send shivers down the old spine.



Shame the horse tribe get completely shafted in the final battle. Whose fucking idea was that?!



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Post #: 174
RE: Avatar - 4/1/2012 4:56:29 PM   
superdan


Posts: 8279
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I watched the Extended Edition over Christmas, the first time I've seen the full film since it was in the cinema, and I still think it is little more than a pretty but completely hollow kids cartoon. It's interminable at times, you could go and make your dinner and when you get back virtually nothing would have happened.

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Post #: 175
RE: Avatar - 4/1/2012 5:09:32 PM   
Tech_Noir

 

Posts: 20199
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The more time that passes the more I'm disappointed by this film.

Look at the prison escape scene with Trudy saving our "heroes", seems like something out of any generic TV action series. And when it's revealed that Weaver is shot she says a line which I assume was thrown in for comedic value ("This is gonna ruin my day").


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Post #: 176
RE: Avatar - 7/1/2012 10:06:39 PM   
Nexus Wookie


Posts: 2326
Joined: 24/9/2011
From: the Godcity
I've already put my feelings about this film across in The Abyss thread.

Its not perfect. Far from it. But it does have its moments. There are key scenes for me, which sum up a sense of wonder. As a sci-fi film it works because the sole purpose is for the viewer to escape, and experience another world, in another galaxy. Avatar is a visual experience first, and then everything else afterwards. Whether narrative, acting. But visually it is an impressive achievement.

From the very first shot of Pandora, a tiny blue planet against the back drop of its much larger moon, reflected off the ships solar screen. Its an awesome touch, re-watch it again, notice how Horner's music swells up perfectly in sync with the shot. We're experiencing Pandora like Jake for the first time. Up till then we've heard about it, like Jake (as he too mentions in the film).

The other scene which is amazing for me, is when Jake is lost in the forests, and we see Neytiri for the first timee. A close up of her alien face, which looks SO photo real you 'believe' that we are in fact seeing an alien species for the first time. The visual effects within those shots is amazing. Its a shame that the same doesnt go for the rest of the film because Avatar's visual effects is only 98% photo real. Maybe the sequel will have finally mastered 'real' effect?

I also love the scene of the Banshee, atop Aiywa, The Mother Tree. When Neytiri rides her, Jake watches in astonishment, as do we the viewer. Again the scene looks very photo real. And with the back drop of the forest it is a truly awesome. Thats the thing, for me Avatar as a 'whole' may not be satisfactory, but there are parts, like the few i mentioned, which are simply superb.

The evidence that Avatar is a visual achievement was demonstrated to me by my 3 year old boy. He watched it with me a couple of times. And normally , he is always talkative during watching a movie. He'll ask me 'dad, why is this like that? Why is that 'man' green? Why is Woody upset?'' and so on (you get the picture!). But with Avatar, he watched it in stunned silence. Just taken aback by the sounds, and sights of Pandora. I feel the generation growing up now will be more appreciative of Avatar.

But it is far from a poor film. It has its moments. But Avatar still retains the power to dazzle. It is perfect escapism. And as a sci-fi nut i quite like it!

Some might say well how can you be astonished by a film which is 95% visual effects? Well the dinosaurs in Jurrasic Park were visual effects too, that didnt stop us going apeshit did it? Especially when the T-Rex rears its huge head! Or feel a little sympathy for King Kong even though he was ALL CGI? We have to accept that visual effects has more or less become part and parcel of the film industry today, especially with the summer blockbusters. Even a film which might not seem CGI orienatated, has been 'touched up'.





< Message edited by Nexus Wookie -- 7/1/2012 10:15:44 PM >


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RE: Avatar - 7/1/2012 10:25:04 PM   
rich


Posts: 5041
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Neo Kobe
Yeah but you're talking up the visual effects, I wasn't impressed by how it dazzled or how it scenes looked - because the problems are basically everything else. I don't care how things look when they feel so wrong. Jurassic Park works today when the effects have aged because it's not a movie about dinosaurs (whole 15 minutes of them), but one about people.

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Post #: 178
RE: Avatar - 7/1/2012 10:45:20 PM   
Nexus Wookie


Posts: 2326
Joined: 24/9/2011
From: the Godcity
quote:

ORIGINAL: rich

Yeah but you're talking up the visual effects, I wasn't impressed by how it dazzled or how it scenes looked - because the problems are basically everything else. I don't care how things look when they feel so wrong. Jurassic Park works today when the effects have aged because it's not a movie about dinosaurs (whole 15 minutes of them), but one about people.


Yeah, as a 'whole' it might not be that impressive. In fact i found it quite jarring at times when watching it in the cinema. But in parts, i think it is very impressive. Like the night scenes in Avatar when all the fauna light up, it IS dazzling to watch.

The effects HAVE aged for Jurassic Park, but when it first came out the dinosaurs looked very real hence I'm referring to JP then. I agree JP worked well because of the people, afterall it was they who made the Dino's seem all the more real, due to their reactions and interactions. BUT i doubt we went to the cinema's to see people (acting)! Again, the key factor here was the VISUAL EFFECTS via the dinosaurs.

And so i have to disagree with the last line, it may only have '15 mins' of dino action, but it STILL a film ABOUT dinosaurs, people are secondary.

< Message edited by Nexus Wookie -- 7/1/2012 10:50:17 PM >


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RE: Avatar - 8/1/2012 12:35:00 PM   
NCC1701A


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Have to disagree with you Nexus I don't  think that the effects have aged in Jurassic Park they still look stunning even now. And while the effects in Avatar are fine I felt that Star Trek or District 9 had much better effects work then Avatar. And I would also say the Jurassic Park is about both dinosaurs and people. You care about the people in Jurassic Park.

Not having a go and respect your opinion.



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