SkullKassidy
Posts: 121
Joined: 7/7/2008
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ORIGINAL: fierce-hairdo
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ORIGINAL: max314
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ORIGINAL: Mycroft
Batman Begins annoys me. They set him up as a symbol of inspiration but then don't properly show what impact he's having on the city, especially from the public's perspective. We really don't have a good understanding of the city at all, the Spiderman films do a much better job of that. They also make no hay out of it being a symbol of fear that somehow inspires people.
At the end of the day the only thing we're shown of Bruce's motivation is Rachel's rant and his father's legacy, it just doesn't feel like a strong enough reason to dedicate yourself, he's living someone else's life. I've never considered his parent's morality to be the key motivator, that's much more of a Spiderman idea. What does their legacy of combatting poverty have to do with dressing up as a Bat anyway? The endless desire to prevent the same thing happening again, while at the same time it being a selfish outlet, is what makes the character interesting. I didn't get either of those things from Begins, it's pretty one-note. It isn't really the usual approach to Batman at all, this version isn't particularly dedicated, he naively thinks it'll be a short-term bit of charity work. I find versions of the character who are compelled to do it, the semi-freaks, much more interesting. The fact that Joe Chill was caught really screws up his motivation, it's much less about anger and more about altruism, he's always in control, there's no real tension there.
Fascinating insight. That might be part of the reason I could never fully get behind the protagonist in Batman Begins. The more I think about it, the more I think you're right about Bruce's motivations being poorly rendered. His motivations are generally explained in the dialogue as opposed to be properly dramatised.
Interesting.
But my biggest beef with Batman Begins is its inconsistent theme. At the end of the first act, Bruce states quite resolutely that "I'm no executioner" because "it separates us from them". At this point, we like Bruce. We think "yeah, that's what makes Batman a hero". Yet in the film's final moments, he basically betrays his own mantra. Bruce sabotages the train's controls and says to Ra's Al Ghul "I won't kill you...but I don't have to save you". What does that mean? That Bruce is looking for loopholes in his own rules? For fuck's sake, you just left a man on a death bound train. Say what you want, but thats murder. That's Bruce crossing the line. It's as though Bruce never spared that farmer's life at all, and undercuts the entire theme of the film of what makes Batman different from any other vigilante. "Justice is about more than just revenge"? Really?
Both of these comments are right on the money.
Batman Begins is certainly overrated. The so called 'inteligence' of the movie is no where to be seen by the finale. Max314 is absolutely right about the phoney-ness of Batman's line "I won't kill you...but I don't have to save you". Its a complete cop out of the "I'm no executioner" mantra throughout the film. It would have been fascinating to explore these contradictions in Batman's character, exposing his flaws but unfortunately Nolan chooses to simply assert Batman's heroic virtue ignoring the fact that Batman ends the film guilty of effective murder of Ra's Al Ghul or at least his manslaughter. We are just encouraged to think that Ra's was a bad man and got his just deserts just like Ra's claimed about the criminal Bruce refused to execute. I guess they think Ra's was right all along!?!
Also, I'm sure this was originally a 4 star review. Empire sneakily trying to rewrite history when people aren't looking again?
All of you that are complaining that Batman betrays his own no-kill mantra by letting someone die (who technically had placed themselves in that position themselves by trying to destroy a whole city) ...you might want consider avoiding reading Frank Miller's seminal "The Dark Knight Returns" it might be abit much for you to handle.
Those of us who do appreciate Miller's vision, and Batman's character in the modern day arena, know half of the attraction is how close to the edge of his own rules Batman often goes. Makes him abit more interesting than someone who does the 100% right thing ALL the time.
And I hope you are all coming down this hard, if not harder, on the Tim Burton movies as well ...if my memory serves me right there are scenes in them that include him blowing up a factory full of henchmen and attaching a bomb to some guy before kicking him down a sewer to explode. How's that for Batman ignoring his own Mantra?
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RE: Is he the Bat, or just a frail mouse with fake wings?? - 
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