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Rubbish Poet Laureate announced! - 1/5/2009 10:44:35 AM   
rick_7


Posts: 6151
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: The internet
http://www.guardian.co.uk/books/2009/may/01/carol-ann-duffy-poet-laureate
 
Great, the only poet who's as bad as Andrew Motion. I have a dream that one day someone will point out in public how utterly shit her work is and everyone will admit that, yes, they secretly think so as well. Here's one of her poems (note the clever heavyhandedness, artful stupidity and poohanded meter):
 
Valentine
 
Not a red rose or a satin heart.

I give you an onion.
It is a moon wrapped in brown paper.
It promises light
like the careful undressing of love.

Here.
It will blind you with tears
like a lover.
It will make your reflection
a wobbling photo of grief.

I am trying to be truthful.

Not a cute card or a kissogram.

I give you an onion.
Its fierce kiss will stay on your lips,
possessive and faithful
as we are,
for as long as we are.

Take it.
Its platinum loops shrink to a wedding-ring,
if you like.

Lethal.
Its scent will cling to your fingers,
cling to your knife.


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Post #: 1
RE: Rubbish Poet Laureate announced! - 1/5/2009 10:46:28 AM   
elab49


Posts: 54673
Joined: 1/10/2005
You may be the only person I know familiar enough with people's work to comment!

Did you have a preference?

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Deviation] LIKE AMERICA'S SWEETHEARTS TOO. IT MADE ME LAUGH A LOT AND THOUGHT IT WAS WITTY. ALSO I FEEL SLOWLY DYING INSIDE. I KEEP AGREEING WITH ELAB.


Annual Poll 2013 - All Lists Welcome

(in reply to rick_7)
Post #: 2
RE: Rubbish Poet Laureate announced! - 1/5/2009 11:27:21 AM   
rick_7


Posts: 6151
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: The internet
Yeah, me.
 
I honestly can't say who I'd be happy with, there seems to be such a complete dearth of good contemporary poetry.
 
It's partly
the way they write in prose
Their imagery culled
From lousy films
 
Like neon lights
and late-night shops
and men that booze
until they drop
 
And they're either multicultural bores
That the Guardian tiresomely adores
Or else they think that writing "piss"
Is cutting edge and not remiss
 
I wish John Betjeman
was here,
smelling of trains and whimsy and beer
 
Instead we get Duffy to lull us to sleep,
Surrounded by onions, applauded by sheep.
 
Perhaps they could just read out something by Shelley every few months.

< Message edited by rick_7 -- 1/5/2009 11:28:09 AM >


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Post #: 3
RE: Rubbish Poet Laureate announced! - 1/5/2009 11:34:29 AM   
Lazy wolf eyes


Posts: 4104
Joined: 9/9/2006
From: Royston Vasey
I had to study her at school or uni, can't remember.  Either way I wasn't a fan. She needs to get herself to the hairdressers ASAP by the looks of things. 

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Post #: 4
RE: Rubbish Poet Laureate announced! - 1/5/2009 11:57:48 AM   
Pigeon Army


Posts: 14612
Joined: 29/1/2006
From: Pixar HQ, George Lucas' Office.
quote:

ORIGINAL: rick_7

Yeah, me.
 
I honestly can't say who I'd be happy with, there seems to be such a complete dearth of good contemporary poetry.

It's partly
the way they write in prose
Their imagery culled
From lousy films

 
Like neon lights
and late-night shops
and men that booze
until they drop
 
And they're either multicultural bores
That the Guardian tiresomely adores
Or else they think that writing "piss"
Is cutting edge and not remiss
 
I wish John Betjeman
was here,
smelling of trains and whimsy and beer
 
Instead we get Duffy to lull us to sleep,
Surrounded by onions, applauded by sheep.
 
Perhaps they could just read out something by Shelley every few months.


Hey, I won $50 doing exactly that for a competition two years ago, don't knock the procedure.

To be fair, it was a strictly par-for-the-course poem, not anything flashy, just homaging the noir image of the 1940s and stuff. And it's much better than the spelled-out symbolism and lack of imagination of this Duffy character, judging by that poem. Very mediocre stuff.

EDIT: Also, that was awesome, rick. Just sayin'.


< Message edited by Pigeon Army -- 1/5/2009 12:00:53 PM >


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She's supposed to be 13! I'd want her to be very attractive though


quote:

ORIGINAL: MonsterCat
quote:

ORIGINAL: Pigeon Army
Stop being mean to Deviation

No.

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Post #: 5
RE: Rubbish Poet Laureate announced! - 1/5/2009 12:18:31 PM   
rick_7


Posts: 6151
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: The internet
Thanks.  
 
I think noir's ripe for investigation, because the iconography can be alluded to or subverted really effectively.
 
I won £50 for the accuracy of my shorthand transcripts. That's not as cool, is it?

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Post #: 6
RE: Rubbish Poet Laureate announced! - 1/5/2009 12:58:01 PM   
directorscut


Posts: 10891
Joined: 30/9/2005
Surely that's Rod Stewart in drag.

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Post #: 7
RE: Rubbish Poet Laureate announced! - 1/5/2009 1:33:13 PM   
Lazy wolf eyes


Posts: 4104
Joined: 9/9/2006
From: Royston Vasey
Or Brian May. 

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Post #: 8
RE: Rubbish Poet Laureate announced! - 1/5/2009 2:08:58 PM   
Amelie_Scotland


Posts: 17468
Joined: 13/10/2005
From: Take a guess.
Duffy's not that bad. Valentine's actually a cute poem. Lets not forget that most mordern poets are pretentious tossers.

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Post #: 9
RE: Rubbish Poet Laureate announced! - 10/5/2009 7:28:48 PM   
Dirty Hartigan


Posts: 5890
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Manchester
Never quite forgiven her for her poems appearing in an unseen exam, but aren't most Poet Laureates rubbish? Or has Motion just tainted the post irretriveably?

< Message edited by Dirty Hartigan -- 10/5/2009 7:29:02 PM >

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Post #: 10
RE: Rubbish Poet Laureate announced! - 13/5/2009 9:18:16 AM   
rick_7


Posts: 6151
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: The internet
Ben Jonson, Wordsworth, Tennyson, Betjeman and Ted Hughes were all pretty damn good. I suppose to some degree it's a subjective thing, but most people would take them over Motion and Duffy.

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Post #: 11
RE: Rubbish Poet Laureate announced! - 13/5/2009 10:35:50 AM   
Felix

 

Posts: 15692
Joined: 29/9/2005
From: Brighton
Is there a more pointless position that Poet Laureate?

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Post #: 12
RE: Rubbish Poet Laureate announced! - 13/5/2009 10:39:26 AM   
M


Posts: 1632
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Kilwinnkie

quote:

ORIGINAL: Felix

Is there a more pointless position that Poet Laureate?


Not for the Laureate themselves; don't they get several casks of Sherry or something??

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Post #: 13
RE: Rubbish Poet Laureate announced! - 14/5/2009 5:05:13 PM   
rick_7


Posts: 6151
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: The internet
quote:

ORIGINAL: Felix

Is there a more pointless position that Poet Laureate?

Manchester City manager?

_____________________________

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Blog: DJANGO! DUMBO! DESPICABLE ME 2! Plus: other stuff.

"Nothin's really been right since Sam the Lion died."

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Post #: 14
RE: Rubbish Poet Laureate announced! - 21/5/2009 12:47:24 PM   
clownfoot


Posts: 7934
Joined: 26/9/2005
From: The ickle town of Fuck, Austria
quote:

ORIGINAL: rick_7

quote:

ORIGINAL: Felix

Is there a more pointless position that Poet Laureate?

Manchester City manager?

Forum moderator?

(Quality poem rick).

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Post #: 15
RE: Rubbish Poet Laureate announced! - 21/5/2009 1:59:57 PM   
Dirty Hartigan


Posts: 5890
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Manchester
quote:

ORIGINAL: rick_7

Ben Jonson, Wordsworth, Tennyson, Betjeman and Ted Hughes were all pretty damn good. I suppose to some degree it's a subjective thing, but most people would take them over Motion and Duffy.


I did vaguely remember that Ted Hughes was one after I posted.

< Message edited by Dirty Hartigan -- 21/5/2009 2:01:54 PM >

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Post #: 16
RE: Rubbish Poet Laureate announced! - 30/7/2009 12:01:43 PM   
separkin

 

Posts: 88
Joined: 29/7/2009
From: sunny Yorkshire
I'm going to be controversial. I actually LIKE Carol Ann Duffy- read her 'The World's Wife' collection, especially Anne Hathaway, Mrs Herod, and The Kray Sisters- they're witty, clever and provokative and I would rather she become Poet Laureate than some of the other terrible poets we have working today. Rumours are that she was overlooked in favour of Motion last time because of concern over appointing a lesbian to the post, so she has been respected in the public consciousness for quite some time. Who would be a serious alternative?

Still, I've heard her reading her own poetry before and she managed to sap all the life from her own words, which is quite impressive.

She DOES look like Brian May though...

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Post #: 17
RE: Rubbish Poet Laureate announced! - 30/7/2009 1:57:25 PM   
BishopQuaker


Posts: 4667
Joined: 29/6/2007
From: Manchester
Just thought I'd stick my oar in here.
I despise Carol Ann Duffy as many years ago I had to analyse her shite poems, Valentine included, for GCSE English.

John Cooper Clarke should be Laureate.
That would be hilarious.

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Post #: 18
RE: Rubbish Poet Laureate announced! - 4/8/2009 9:00:30 PM   
separkin

 

Posts: 88
Joined: 29/7/2009
From: sunny Yorkshire
I would pay to see such an event.

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Imagination is more important than knowledge.
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Post #: 19
RE: Rubbish Poet Laureate announced! - 23/8/2009 4:53:34 PM   
kathryn2

 

Posts: 1513
Joined: 24/4/2006
I like Carol Ann Duffy. But then I actually enjoyed English Lit, and poetry in general. I think she's a good choice for Laureate - she has a distinctive voice, and a different point of view, and writes convincingly about modern life without being hideously pretentious.

The fact that ten years after studying her at school I can still name a number of her poems - Valentine, Prayer, Mean Time, Psychopath, Warming Her Pearls, Mrs Darwin, Mrs Aesop - says something about her work. I  can't name that many peoms by Ted Hughes, Thom Gunn, Wilfred Owen, or Seigfried Sassoon and I'm struggling to even remember the names of the other poets we studied at the time.

< Message edited by kathryn2 -- 23/8/2009 4:54:46 PM >

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Post #: 20
RE: Rubbish Poet Laureate announced! - 23/8/2009 9:45:47 PM   
richCie


Posts: 4028
Joined: 11/11/2006
From: Wells, England

quote:

ORIGINAL: separkin

I'm going to be controversial. I actually LIKE Carol Ann Duffy- read her 'The World's Wife' collection, especially Anne Hathaway, Mrs Herod, and The Kray Sisters- they're witty, clever and provokative and I would rather she become Poet Laureate than some of the other terrible poets we have working today. Rumours are that she was overlooked in favour of Motion last time because of concern over appointing a lesbian to the post, so she has been respected in the public consciousness for quite some time. Who would be a serious alternative?

Still, I've heard her reading her own poetry before and she managed to sap all the life from her own words, which is quite impressive.

She DOES look like Brian May though...


i've studied Anne Hathaway - crap
i've studied numerous others - crap
rick is better :)

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Post #: 21
RE: Rubbish Poet Laureate announced! - 23/8/2009 10:29:52 PM   
kathryn2

 

Posts: 1513
Joined: 24/4/2006
quote:

ORIGINAL: richCie

i've studied Anne Hathaway - crap
i've studied numerous others - crap
rick is better :)


Seriously, is there another living poet who you think should be laureate? Do you actually have any interest in or knowledge of poetry, other than what was forced on you at school?

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Post #: 22
RE: Rubbish Poet Laureate announced! - 23/8/2009 10:36:50 PM   
richCie


Posts: 4028
Joined: 11/11/2006
From: Wells, England

quote:

ORIGINAL: kathryn2

quote:

ORIGINAL: richCie

i've studied Anne Hathaway - crap
i've studied numerous others - crap
rick is better :)


Seriously, is there another living poet who you think should be laureate? Do you actually have any interest in or knowledge of poetry, other than what was forced on you at school?



no i'm not a huge poetry fan -never gotten into it, been intending to for a while - bits and pieces here adn there, but i don't see why i can't judge it - if that's good poetry then i dont think i'd bother. but then i dont think it is good poetry so i'm not put off.

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Post #: 23
RE: Rubbish Poet Laureate announced! - 24/8/2009 12:15:47 PM   
kathryn2

 

Posts: 1513
Joined: 24/4/2006
quote:

ORIGINAL: richCie


quote:

ORIGINAL: kathryn2

quote:

ORIGINAL: richCie

i've studied Anne Hathaway - crap
i've studied numerous others - crap
rick is better :)


Seriously, is there another living poet who you think should be laureate? Do you actually have any interest in or knowledge of poetry, other than what was forced on you at school?



no i'm not a huge poetry fan -never gotten into it, been intending to for a while - bits and pieces here adn there, but i don't see why i can't judge it - if that's good poetry then i dont think i'd bother. but then i dont think it is good poetry so i'm not put off.


I don't want to put you off poetry, and of course you can judge what you like and what you don't, but the thing is laureate is a particular position that gets filled by a living poet, and involves writing about modern life - it's meant to involve comemorating public events, among other things. It's a bit of a poisoned chalice.

You may find that you prefer poetry by someone who is not living, and not writing about modern life in the modern (or post-modern) style - there are fashions in poetry that have developed and changed over the years. Duffy is a very good poet, but there are other very good poets who write in very different ways. There is no right or wrong answer, there's just preference.

So, what do you like, of the bits and pieces you've seen?

< Message edited by kathryn2 -- 24/8/2009 12:17:00 PM >

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Post #: 24
RE: Rubbish Poet Laureate announced! - 24/8/2009 12:49:51 PM   
richCie


Posts: 4028
Joined: 11/11/2006
From: Wells, England

quote:

ORIGINAL: kathryn2

quote:

ORIGINAL: richCie


quote:

ORIGINAL: kathryn2

quote:

ORIGINAL: richCie

i've studied Anne Hathaway - crap
i've studied numerous others - crap
rick is better :)


Seriously, is there another living poet who you think should be laureate? Do you actually have any interest in or knowledge of poetry, other than what was forced on you at school?



no i'm not a huge poetry fan -never gotten into it, been intending to for a while - bits and pieces here adn there, but i don't see why i can't judge it - if that's good poetry then i dont think i'd bother. but then i dont think it is good poetry so i'm not put off.


I don't want to put you off poetry, and of course you can judge what you like and what you don't, but the thing is laureate is a particular position that gets filled by a living poet, and involves writing about modern life - it's meant to involve comemorating public events, among other things. It's a bit of a poisoned chalice.

You may find that you prefer poetry by someone who is not living, and not writing about modern life in the modern (or post-modern) style†- there are fashions in poetry that have developed and changed over the years. Duffy is a very good poet, but there are other very good poets who write in very different ways. There is no right or wrong answer, there's just preference.

So, what do you like, of the bits and pieces you've seen?


Poe, that guy who wrote Mercy Seat um..i dont really remember names - thats only stuff ive read in the last week or so. I'm trying to get hold of Romantic Dogs - Bolano's collection but it aint cheap or easy to find.

you're probably right bout the Poet Laureate - and about the modern aspect - it's not like i read a huge amount of contemprary authors and those i do arent British usually.

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Post #: 25
RE: Rubbish Poet Laureate announced! - 24/8/2009 1:41:36 PM   
kathryn2

 

Posts: 1513
Joined: 24/4/2006
quote:

ORIGINAL: richCie
Poe, that guy who wrote Mercy Seat um..i dont really remember names - thats only stuff ive read in the last week or so. I'm trying to get hold of Romantic Dogs - Bolano's collection but it aint cheap or easy to find.

you're probably right bout the Poet Laureate - and about the modern aspect - it's not like i read a huge amount of contemprary authors and those i do arent British usually.


I'm not familiar with Bolano, or Norman Dubie (The Mercy Seat - I googled)  but then I've lost touch with modern poetry since I finished my degree. I suspect we have fundamentally different tastes though - I was never crazy about Poe. I didn't hate him, though.

I keep meaning to pick up Simon Armitage's translation of Sir Gawain and The Green Knight,  but have never quite got round to it.

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Post #: 26
RE: Rubbish Poet Laureate announced! - 24/8/2009 2:51:51 PM   
richCie


Posts: 4028
Joined: 11/11/2006
From: Wells, England

quote:

ORIGINAL: kathryn2

quote:

ORIGINAL: richCie
Poe, that guy who wrote Mercy Seat um..i dont really remember names - thats only stuff ive read in the last week or so. I'm trying to get hold of Romantic Dogs - Bolano's collection but it aint cheap or easy to find.

you're probably right bout the Poet Laureate - and about the modern aspect - it's not like i read a huge amount of contemprary authors and those i do arent British usually.


I'm not familiar with Bolano, or Norman Dubie (The Mercy Seat - I googled)††but then I've lost touch with modern poetry since I finished my degree. I suspect we have fundamentally different tastes though - I was never crazy about Poe. I didn't hate him, though.

I keep meaning to pick up Simon Armitage's translation of Sir Gawain and The Green Knight,† but have never quite got round to it.


Bolano is a latin american writer - famous for his novels but he spent much of his time writing poetry - he only turned to novels as he needed the money to support his family. he's the finest novelist i've ever read so as you can imagine i'm fairly eager to read his poetry. there's a thread in bookworms thats been largely ignored :(

if anyone does have any poetry recommendations that are available online or whatever- i'm up for giving it a go.

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Post #: 27
RE: Rubbish Poet Laureate announced! - 25/8/2009 9:44:35 PM   
separkin

 

Posts: 88
Joined: 29/7/2009
From: sunny Yorkshire

quote:

ORIGINAL: richCie


quote:

ORIGINAL: kathryn2

quote:

ORIGINAL: richCie
Poe, that guy who wrote Mercy Seat um..i dont really remember names - thats only stuff ive read in the last week or so. I'm trying to get hold of Romantic Dogs - Bolano's collection but it aint cheap or easy to find.

you're probably right bout the Poet Laureate - and about the modern aspect - it's not like i read a huge amount of contemprary authors and those i do arent British usually.


I'm not familiar with Bolano, or Norman Dubie (The Mercy Seat - I googled)††but then I've lost touch with modern poetry since I finished my degree. I suspect we have fundamentally different tastes though - I was never crazy about Poe. I didn't hate him, though.

I keep meaning to pick up Simon Armitage's translation of Sir Gawain and The Green Knight,† but have never quite got round to it.


Bolano is a latin american writer - famous for his novels but he spent much of his time writing poetry - he only turned to novels as he needed the money to support his family. he's the finest novelist i've ever read so as you can imagine i'm fairly eager to read his poetry. there's a thread in bookworms thats been largely ignored :(

if anyone does have any poetry recommendations that are available online or whatever- i'm up for giving it a go.


Simon Armitage's Sir Gawain is great; I preferred it to the edition I had to study this year as part of my degree course.

There's an anthology I recommend called Staying Alive, and the sequel, Being Alive. Actually, Being Alive is better, now I think about it: it's a huge collection of poems encapsulating pretty much everything, featuring a wide range of poets. It might be quite a big investment, so if you can go somewhere like Borders where you can sit and read a bit before you actually buy it. It's brilliant, and might be a great introduction to modern poetry for you.

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Post #: 28
RE: Rubbish Poet Laureate announced! - 1/9/2009 1:23:50 AM   
SadFace

 

Posts: 1816
Joined: 1/1/2008
From: Derbyshire / Leicester
quote:

ORIGINAL: separkin


quote:

ORIGINAL: richCie


quote:

ORIGINAL: kathryn2

quote:

ORIGINAL: richCie
Poe, that guy who wrote Mercy Seat um..i dont really remember names - thats only stuff ive read in the last week or so. I'm trying to get hold of Romantic Dogs - Bolano's collection but it aint cheap or easy to find.

you're probably right bout the Poet Laureate - and about the modern aspect - it's not like i read a huge amount of contemprary authors and those i do arent British usually.


I'm not familiar with Bolano, or
Norman Dubie (The Mercy Seat - I googled)  but then I've lost touch with modern poetry since I finished my degree. I suspect we have fundamentally different tastes though - I was never crazy about Poe. I didn't hate him, though.

I keep meaning to pick up Simon Armitage's translation of Sir Gawain and The Green Knight,  but have never quite got round to it.


Bolano is a latin american writer - famous for his novels but he spent much of his time writing poetry - he only turned to novels as he needed the money to support his family. he's the finest novelist i've ever read so as you can imagine i'm fairly eager to read his poetry. there's a thread in bookworms thats been largely ignored :(

if anyone does have any poetry recommendations that are available online or whatever- i'm up for giving it a go.


Simon Armitage's Sir Gawain is great; I preferred it to the edition I had to study this year as part of my degree course.

There's an anthology I recommend called Staying Alive, and the sequel, Being Alive. Actually, Being Alive is better, now I think about it: it's a huge collection of poems encapsulating pretty much everything, featuring a wide range of poets. It might be quite a big investment, so if you can go somewhere like Borders where you can sit and read a bit before you actually buy it. It's brilliant, and might be a great introduction to modern poetry for you.


I've been studying Armitage and Duffy for my English GCSE this year and earlier (April, I think), a few friends and I went to see a performance of Sir Gawain and the Green Knight at our local village community centre, and who should be sitting in the row in front if us? None other than Armitage himself! We were like schoolchildren who had just experienced their first orgasm. He even agreed to have his photo taken with us. I still have it somewhere. A very nice man. I even like some of his poems.

And then there's Duffy. Her poems, in my opinion, are only okay. We went on a school trip to a poetry convention for GCSE students and Duffy just put us all to sleep. She is possibly the most boring woman on the face of the planet. She reads her poems with no enthusiasm and no passion and she has no charm whatsoever. She can stick her Laureate title up her boring, hairy arse for all I care. /rant



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quote:

ORIGINAL: rawlinson

That's the most wrong I've ever seen someone be on this forum. And both Gimli and Elab post here.

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Post #: 29
RE: Rubbish Poet Laureate announced! - 1/9/2009 2:04:03 AM   
paul_ie86


Posts: 11422
Joined: 4/1/2007
From: Chelsea Hotel #2

quote:

ORIGINAL: rick_7

http://www.guardian.co.uk/books/2009/may/01/carol-ann-duffy-poet-laureate

Great, the only poet who's as bad as Andrew Motion. I have a dream that one day someone will point out in public how utterly shit her work is and everyone will admit that, yes, they secretly think so as well. Here's one of her poems (note the clever heavyhandedness, artful stupidity and poohanded meter):

Valentine

Not a red rose or a satin heart.

I give you an onion.
It is a moon wrapped in brown paper.
It promises light
like the careful undressing of love.

Here.
It will blind you with tears
like a lover.
It will make your reflection
a wobbling photo of grief.

I am trying to be truthful.

Not a cute card or a kissogram.

I give you an onion.
Its fierce kiss will stay on your lips,
possessive and faithful
as we are,
for as long as we are.

Take it.
Its platinum loops shrink to a wedding-ring,
if you like.

Lethal.
Its scent will cling to your fingers,
cling to your knife.



I like that poem

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