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RE: Worst Films Made Ever In The History Of Film - 19/1/2012 2:22:05 AM   
DARKO_DONNIE_DONUT

 

Posts: 195
Joined: 14/1/2012
quote:

ORIGINAL: MonsterCat

Excuse me Donnie, but I don't watch MTV Cribs!

Never been so offended in all my life.


But you are a : teenager who can spout in film quotes on a daily basis while playing with there balls and looking at woman as if there lumps of meat.
Atleast I know where we are.

@Spaldron
Maybe you could start by watching that god-awful-shite-fest of a film

(in reply to MonsterCat)
Post #: 391
RE: Worst Films Made Ever In The History Of Film - 19/1/2012 12:53:27 PM   
Swoz_MK


Posts: 2884
Joined: 18/10/2005

(in reply to DARKO_DONNIE_DONUT)
Post #: 392
RE: Worst Films Made Ever In The History Of Film - 19/1/2012 1:18:14 PM   
Spaldron


Posts: 10485
Joined: 6/10/2006
From: Chair
quote:

ORIGINAL: DARKO_DONNIE_DONUT

@Spaldron
Maybe you could start by watching that god-awful-shite-fest of a film


Maybe you could start by shutting up and f******g off while you're at it.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Swoz_MK




Good advice.

< Message edited by Spaldron -- 19/1/2012 1:19:09 PM >


_____________________________

And I heard a voice in the midst of the four beasts
And I looked and behold, a pale horse
And his name that sat on him was Death
And Hell followed with him.

(in reply to DARKO_DONNIE_DONUT)
Post #: 393
RE: Worst Films Made Ever In The History Of Film - 19/1/2012 1:27:22 PM   
DARKO_DONNIE_DONUT

 

Posts: 195
Joined: 14/1/2012
quote:

ORIGINAL: Spaldron

quote:

ORIGINAL: DARKO_DONNIE_DONUT

@Spaldron
Maybe you could start by watching that god-awful-shite-fest of a film


Maybe you could start by shutting up and f******g off while you're at it.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Swoz_MK




Good advice.




CALM DOWN DEARS


(in reply to Spaldron)
Post #: 394
RE: Worst Films Made Ever In The History Of Film - 20/1/2012 12:04:25 AM   
scarface666brooksy!!


Posts: 3544
Joined: 24/10/2007
From: The Valley of the Wind
quote:

ORIGINAL: DARKO_DONNIE_DONUT

Seriously the only people who like scarface are MTV crib watchers or teenager who can spout in film quotes on a daily basis while playing with there balls and looking at woman as if there lumps of meat.



That's a bit of a rough generalisation there because I like De Palma's Scarface and I've never bothered to watch an MTV show minus maybe Jackass occasionally and as for the women comment, 91% of my friends are females, to the point where I have multiple females who consider me their best friend

And just so you don't call me out, my forum name refers to the 1932 classic Scarface: The Shame Of A Nation which I love

_____________________________

My Aussie Film Thread - Film #7 - Patrick (1978)


(in reply to DARKO_DONNIE_DONUT)
Post #: 395
RE: Worst Films Made Ever In The History Of Film - 20/1/2012 1:53:36 AM   
DARKO_DONNIE_DONUT

 

Posts: 195
Joined: 14/1/2012
quote:

ORIGINAL: scarface666brooksy!!

quote:

ORIGINAL: DARKO_DONNIE_DONUT

Seriously the only people who like scarface are MTV crib watchers or teenager who can spout in film quotes on a daily basis while playing with there balls and looking at woman as if there lumps of meat.



That's a bit of a rough generalisation there because I like De Palma's Scarface and I've never bothered to watch an MTV show minus maybe Jackass occasionally and as for the women comment, 91% of my friends are females, to the point where I have multiple females who consider me their best friend

And just so you don't call me out, my forum name refers to the 1932 classic Scarface: The Shame Of A Nation which I love


Never seen the orignal.Will check it out.

I basically generalized for Humours sake,but obvoiusly it wasnt..funny.

(in reply to scarface666brooksy!!)
Post #: 396
RE: Worst Films Made Ever In The History Of Film - 20/1/2012 6:01:15 AM   
scarface666brooksy!!


Posts: 3544
Joined: 24/10/2007
From: The Valley of the Wind
It's pretty awesome, much better then De Palma's and nah you're alright, any fan of Donnie Darko can't be too bad a person

_____________________________

My Aussie Film Thread - Film #7 - Patrick (1978)


(in reply to DARKO_DONNIE_DONUT)
Post #: 397
RE: Worst Films Made Ever In The History Of Film - 20/1/2012 12:47:46 PM   
Spaldron


Posts: 10485
Joined: 6/10/2006
From: Chair

quote:

ORIGINAL: scarface666brooksy!!

It's pretty awesome, much better then De Palma's


No it isn't, its good but De Palma's is on another level of awesome.

_____________________________

And I heard a voice in the midst of the four beasts
And I looked and behold, a pale horse
And his name that sat on him was Death
And Hell followed with him.

(in reply to scarface666brooksy!!)
Post #: 398
RE: Worst Films Made Ever In The History Of Film - 20/1/2012 12:57:19 PM   
Harry Tuttle


Posts: 7993
Joined: 12/11/2005
From: Sometime in the future.
quote:

ORIGINAL: Spaldron


quote:

ORIGINAL: scarface666brooksy!!

It's pretty awesome, much better then De Palma's


No it isn't, its good but De Palma's is on another level of awesome.


I disagree . De Palma's version is a garish, bigotted, thuggish, mysogynistic piece of crap.

It doesn't belong anywhere near a worst film list though. Just because I don't like it doesn't mean it's awful. It's just not for me.

< Message edited by Harry Tuttle -- 20/1/2012 1:00:49 PM >


_____________________________

Acting...Naturaaal

Your knowledge of scientific biological transmogrification is only outmatched by your zest for kung-fu treachery!

Blood Island. So called because it's the exact shape of some blood

(in reply to Spaldron)
Post #: 399
RE: Worst Films Made Ever In The History Of Film - 20/1/2012 1:01:00 PM   
MonsterCat


Posts: 7934
Joined: 24/3/2011
From: St. Albans, Hertfordshire

quote:

ORIGINAL: Harry Tuttle

I disagree . De Palma's version is a garish, bigotted, thuggish, mysogynistic piece of crap.


Explain?

_____________________________

"I am a writer, a doctor, a nuclear physicist and a theoretical philosopher. But above all, I am a man, a hopelessly inquisitive man, just like you."

Films watched in 2013

(in reply to Harry Tuttle)
Post #: 400
RE: Worst Films Made Ever In The History Of Film - 20/1/2012 1:09:57 PM   
scarface666brooksy!!


Posts: 3544
Joined: 24/10/2007
From: The Valley of the Wind
quote:

ORIGINAL: MonsterCat


quote:

ORIGINAL: Harry Tuttle

I disagree . De Palma's version is a garish, bigotted, thuggish, mysogynistic piece of crap.


Explain?


I would give it bloated and maybe thuggish but in my opinion, it's pretty much one of the best beer and pizza movies ever made. Perfect movie watching with the mates kind of film. And endlessly quotable too. I love Hawk's Scarface mainly due to the fact I love the 30's as a decade and Paul Muni fucking owns the role almost as much as Pacino but the pure seething hatred for the 80's Scarface on this forums is startling at times.

< Message edited by scarface666brooksy!! -- 20/1/2012 1:11:26 PM >


_____________________________

My Aussie Film Thread - Film #7 - Patrick (1978)


(in reply to MonsterCat)
Post #: 401
RE: Worst Films Made Ever In The History Of Film - 20/1/2012 1:19:02 PM   
Harry Tuttle


Posts: 7993
Joined: 12/11/2005
From: Sometime in the future.
quote:

ORIGINAL: MonsterCat


quote:

ORIGINAL: Harry Tuttle

I disagree . De Palma's version is a garish, bigotted, thuggish, mysogynistic piece of crap.


Explain?


Are you serious?

Many of the exchanges between Elvira and Tony are dripping with bigotry. Unless you think calling someone a Spic and using racial slurs is acceptable.

I'm not really sure how you've not picked up on the rampant misogyny running through the film though. Tony pretty much sees women as possessions to do whatever he wants with, even his sister. His relationship with Elvira is basically a form of ownership, a trophy taken from his former employer kept imprisoned by her addiction to Cocaine.

I haven't seen the film in a while so I'm going from memory here but the last time I watched it it left a pretty bad taste in the mouth afterwards. Mainly for the reasons I stated above.

_____________________________

Acting...Naturaaal

Your knowledge of scientific biological transmogrification is only outmatched by your zest for kung-fu treachery!

Blood Island. So called because it's the exact shape of some blood

(in reply to MonsterCat)
Post #: 402
RE: Worst Films Made Ever In The History Of Film - 20/1/2012 1:23:28 PM   
Spaldron


Posts: 10485
Joined: 6/10/2006
From: Chair

quote:

ORIGINAL: Harry Tuttle

Are you serious?

Many of the exchanges between Elvira and Tony are dripping with bigotry. Unless you think calling someone a Spic and using racial slurs is acceptable.

I'm not really sure how you've not picked up on the rampant misogyny running through the film though. Tony pretty much sees women as possessions to do whatever he wants with, even his sister. His relationship with Elvira is basically a form of ownership, a trophy taken from his former employer kept imprisoned by her addiction to Cocaine.

I haven't seen the film in a while so I'm going from memory here but the last time I watched it it left a pretty bad taste in the mouth afterwards. Mainly for the reasons I stated above.


Erm.........that's kind of the point, its his character.

There's a big difference between a film that is bigoted and misogynistic and a film about a man who is bigoted and misogynistic.

_____________________________

And I heard a voice in the midst of the four beasts
And I looked and behold, a pale horse
And his name that sat on him was Death
And Hell followed with him.

(in reply to Harry Tuttle)
Post #: 403
RE: Worst Films Made Ever In The History Of Film - 20/1/2012 1:37:35 PM   
Harry Tuttle


Posts: 7993
Joined: 12/11/2005
From: Sometime in the future.
quote:

ORIGINAL: Spaldron


quote:

ORIGINAL: Harry Tuttle

Are you serious?

Many of the exchanges between Elvira and Tony are dripping with bigotry. Unless you think calling someone a Spic and using racial slurs is acceptable.

I'm not really sure how you've not picked up on the rampant misogyny running through the film though. Tony pretty much sees women as possessions to do whatever he wants with, even his sister. His relationship with Elvira is basically a form of ownership, a trophy taken from his former employer kept imprisoned by her addiction to Cocaine.

I haven't seen the film in a while so I'm going from memory here but the last time I watched it it left a pretty bad taste in the mouth afterwards. Mainly for the reasons I stated above.


Erm.........that's kind of the point, its his character.

There's a big difference between a film that is bigoted and misogynistic and a film about a man who is bigoted and misogynistic.


No there isn't. How can a film about a man who is bigoted and misogynistic not be bigoted and misogynistic itself? The fact that he's meant to be like that doesn't stop the film from being so. Well, not to me anyway because the main thing I remember from the film is the misogyny and bigotry (as well as Pacino's ridiculous accent). Therefore Scarface, to me, = bigoted and misogynistic.

Never have variants of the words bigot and misogyny been used so much in one paragraph .

< Message edited by Harry Tuttle -- 20/1/2012 1:38:39 PM >


_____________________________

Acting...Naturaaal

Your knowledge of scientific biological transmogrification is only outmatched by your zest for kung-fu treachery!

Blood Island. So called because it's the exact shape of some blood

(in reply to Spaldron)
Post #: 404
RE: Worst Films Made Ever In The History Of Film - 20/1/2012 1:41:27 PM   
MonsterCat


Posts: 7934
Joined: 24/3/2011
From: St. Albans, Hertfordshire

quote:

ORIGINAL: Harry Tuttle

Are you serious?

Many of the exchanges between Elvira and Tony are dripping with bigotry. Unless you think calling someone a Spic and using racial slurs is acceptable.

I'm not really sure how you've not picked up on the rampant misogyny running through the film though. Tony pretty much sees women as possessions to do whatever he wants with, even his sister. His relationship with Elvira is basically a form of ownership, a trophy taken from his former employer kept imprisoned by her addiction to Cocaine.

I haven't seen the film in a while so I'm going from memory here but the last time I watched it it left a pretty bad taste in the mouth afterwards. Mainly for the reasons I stated above.


I too haven't seen the film in quite sometime (Well, about a few months ago I guess), so I'm going from memory, too.

Right from the off the film makes no bones about how much of an unpleasant character Montana is, and he definitely has some pretty serious issues with the women in his life, but I wouldn't call the film misogynist.

I suppose you could call the film misogynist if the film celebrated Montana's way of life and depicted him as a hero, but I don't think it does really.

Seriously, Harry, if I thought the film was misogynist in anyway I wouldn't find any entertainment value in it at all. Or maybe I'm just a bit thick and I haven't picked up on the things that you pointed out, which is entirely possible.




_____________________________

"I am a writer, a doctor, a nuclear physicist and a theoretical philosopher. But above all, I am a man, a hopelessly inquisitive man, just like you."

Films watched in 2013

(in reply to Harry Tuttle)
Post #: 405
RE: Worst Films Made Ever In The History Of Film - 20/1/2012 1:43:14 PM   
Spaldron


Posts: 10485
Joined: 6/10/2006
From: Chair

quote:

ORIGINAL: Harry Tuttle

No there isn't. How can a film about a man who is bigoted and misogynistic not be bigoted and misogynistic itself? The fact that he's meant to be like that doesn't stop the film from being so. Well, not to me anyway because the main thing I remember from the film is the misogyny and bigotry (as well as Pacino's ridiculous accent). Therefore Scarface, to me, = bigoted and misogynistic.

Never have variants of the words bigot and misogyny been used so much in one paragraph .


That's utterly ridiculous. So by this logic Psycho is a sick and twisted film because its about a man who is sick and twisted?

_____________________________

And I heard a voice in the midst of the four beasts
And I looked and behold, a pale horse
And his name that sat on him was Death
And Hell followed with him.

(in reply to Harry Tuttle)
Post #: 406
RE: Worst Films Made Ever In The History Of Film - 20/1/2012 1:48:04 PM   
MonsterCat


Posts: 7934
Joined: 24/3/2011
From: St. Albans, Hertfordshire
quote:

ORIGINAL: Harry Tuttle


How can a film about a man who is bigoted and misogynistic not be bigoted and misogynistic itself?


By not revelling in a character's misogynist behaviour?

It's entirely possible for a film to depict sexism or misogyny in film and not be sexist and misogynist at the same time.

The first fifteen minutes of The Social Network is really good example of that.

< Message edited by MonsterCat -- 20/1/2012 1:52:19 PM >


_____________________________

"I am a writer, a doctor, a nuclear physicist and a theoretical philosopher. But above all, I am a man, a hopelessly inquisitive man, just like you."

Films watched in 2013

(in reply to Harry Tuttle)
Post #: 407
RE: Worst Films Made Ever In The History Of Film - 20/1/2012 1:59:54 PM   
Harry Tuttle


Posts: 7993
Joined: 12/11/2005
From: Sometime in the future.
quote:

ORIGINAL: Spaldron


quote:

ORIGINAL: Harry Tuttle

No there isn't. How can a film about a man who is bigoted and misogynistic not be bigoted and misogynistic itself? The fact that he's meant to be like that doesn't stop the film from being so. Well, not to me anyway because the main thing I remember from the film is the misogyny and bigotry (as well as Pacino's ridiculous accent). Therefore Scarface, to me, = bigoted and misogynistic.

Never have variants of the words bigot and misogyny been used so much in one paragraph .


That's utterly ridiculous. So by this logic Psycho is a sick and twisted film because its about a man who is sick and twisted?


Are you seriously comparing De Palma to Hitchcock? Seriously?

The bigotry and misogyny (as well as the garishness, thuggishness etc) is palpable throughout the film and I don't think De Palma does anything to temper this therefore I think I'm justified in calling the film out on it. I wouldn't say the film glorifies it per se but it certainly doesn't condemn it at any point either. It's not a particularly controversial view, in fact there are loads of articles to be found about the rampant misogyny running through De Palma's work. That's not a view I particularly agree with but I do in the case of Scarface.

I have strong views against a film you like, so what. It's not the end of the world bro.

And I do see the irony in a proponent of the Yo Mama jokes being offended by misogyny

_____________________________

Acting...Naturaaal

Your knowledge of scientific biological transmogrification is only outmatched by your zest for kung-fu treachery!

Blood Island. So called because it's the exact shape of some blood

(in reply to Spaldron)
Post #: 408
RE: Worst Films Made Ever In The History Of Film - 20/1/2012 2:06:39 PM   
MonsterCat


Posts: 7934
Joined: 24/3/2011
From: St. Albans, Hertfordshire
DePalma would have a full on chubby if he knew someone was comparing him to Hitchcock.

_____________________________

"I am a writer, a doctor, a nuclear physicist and a theoretical philosopher. But above all, I am a man, a hopelessly inquisitive man, just like you."

Films watched in 2013

(in reply to Harry Tuttle)
Post #: 409
RE: Worst Films Made Ever In The History Of Film - 20/1/2012 2:13:38 PM   
Harry Tuttle


Posts: 7993
Joined: 12/11/2005
From: Sometime in the future.


I would like to highlight this edit from my original post that may have been missed.

quote:

It doesn't belong anywhere near a worst film list though. Just because I don't like it doesn't mean it's awful. It's just not for me


_____________________________

Acting...Naturaaal

Your knowledge of scientific biological transmogrification is only outmatched by your zest for kung-fu treachery!

Blood Island. So called because it's the exact shape of some blood

(in reply to MonsterCat)
Post #: 410
RE: Worst Films Made Ever In The History Of Film - 20/1/2012 2:16:54 PM   
Spaldron


Posts: 10485
Joined: 6/10/2006
From: Chair

quote:

ORIGINAL: Harry Tuttle

quote:

ORIGINAL: Spaldron


quote:

ORIGINAL: Harry Tuttle

No there isn't. How can a film about a man who is bigoted and misogynistic not be bigoted and misogynistic itself? The fact that he's meant to be like that doesn't stop the film from being so. Well, not to me anyway because the main thing I remember from the film is the misogyny and bigotry (as well as Pacino's ridiculous accent). Therefore Scarface, to me, = bigoted and misogynistic.

Never have variants of the words bigot and misogyny been used so much in one paragraph .


That's utterly ridiculous. So by this logic Psycho is a sick and twisted film because its about a man who is sick and twisted?


Are you seriously comparing De Palma to Hitchcock? Seriously?

The bigotry and misogyny (as well as the garishness, thuggishness etc) is palpable throughout the film and I don't think De Palma does anything to temper this therefore I think I'm justified in calling the film out on it. I wouldn't say the film glorifies it per se but it certainly doesn't condemn it at any point either. It's not a particularly controversial view, in fact there are loads of articles to be found about the rampant misogyny running through De Palma's work. That's not a view I particularly agree with but I do in the case of Scarface.

I have strong views against a film you like, so what. It's not the end of the world bro.

And I do see the irony in a proponent of the Yo Mama jokes being offended by misogyny


No, if you had read my post properly you would know I was not comparing De Palma to Hitchcock, seriously. I was using Psycho (the film, not the director) as an example to show how stupid your logic is in this debate. Nowhere did I compare the two directors, I think you have to accept that a film can portray its subject without becoming or glorifying it. If that were the case then Tony Montana would have lived happily ever after (SPOILER, he doesn't).

_____________________________

And I heard a voice in the midst of the four beasts
And I looked and behold, a pale horse
And his name that sat on him was Death
And Hell followed with him.

(in reply to Harry Tuttle)
Post #: 411
RE: Worst Films Made Ever In The History Of Film - 20/1/2012 2:19:33 PM   
MonsterCat


Posts: 7934
Joined: 24/3/2011
From: St. Albans, Hertfordshire

quote:

ORIGINAL: Harry Tuttle

And I do see the irony in a proponent of the Yo Mama jokes being offended by misogyny


I blame Rawlinson and Matty. I was such a sweet and innocent boy until I started talking to those two jokers.


_____________________________

"I am a writer, a doctor, a nuclear physicist and a theoretical philosopher. But above all, I am a man, a hopelessly inquisitive man, just like you."

Films watched in 2013

(in reply to Harry Tuttle)
Post #: 412
RE: Worst Films Made Ever In The History Of Film - 20/1/2012 2:30:55 PM   
Harry Tuttle


Posts: 7993
Joined: 12/11/2005
From: Sometime in the future.
quote:

ORIGINAL: Spaldron


quote:

ORIGINAL: Harry Tuttle

quote:

ORIGINAL: Spaldron


quote:

ORIGINAL: Harry Tuttle

No there isn't. How can a film about a man who is bigoted and misogynistic not be bigoted and misogynistic itself? The fact that he's meant to be like that doesn't stop the film from being so. Well, not to me anyway because the main thing I remember from the film is the misogyny and bigotry (as well as Pacino's ridiculous accent). Therefore Scarface, to me, = bigoted and misogynistic.

Never have variants of the words bigot and misogyny been used so much in one paragraph .


That's utterly ridiculous. So by this logic Psycho is a sick and twisted film because its about a man who is sick and twisted?


Are you seriously comparing De Palma to Hitchcock? Seriously?

The bigotry and misogyny (as well as the garishness, thuggishness etc) is palpable throughout the film and I don't think De Palma does anything to temper this therefore I think I'm justified in calling the film out on it. I wouldn't say the film glorifies it per se but it certainly doesn't condemn it at any point either. It's not a particularly controversial view, in fact there are loads of articles to be found about the rampant misogyny running through De Palma's work. That's not a view I particularly agree with but I do in the case of Scarface.

I have strong views against a film you like, so what. It's not the end of the world bro.

And I do see the irony in a proponent of the Yo Mama jokes being offended by misogyny


No, if you had read my post properly you would know I was not comparing De Palma to Hitchcock, seriously. I was using Psycho (the film, not the director) as an example to show how stupid your logic is in this debate. Nowhere did I compare the two directors, I think you have to accept that a film can portray its subject without becoming or glorifying it. If that were the case then Tony Montana would have lived happily ever after (SPOILER, he doesn't).


My logic isn't stupid in this debate because Hitchcock was able to craft a film about a sick and twisted individual without it being sick and twisted whereas I don't think the same can be said about De Palma and misogyny/bigotry. Not in this case anyway because, like I said above, I don't believe De Palma does anything to temper it.

Granted this comment " How can a film about a man who is bigoted and misogynistic not be bigoted and misogynistic itself" doesn't get my point across as well as I'd like and is a bit silly if applied to everything, I'll give you that, but in this case I think I'm justified in saying it. I believe that the film displays the same weakness as it's protagonist.

And are you suggesting that Montana died because he was a misogynistic bigot? Because my recollection of the film is that he died because he was a greedy cunt who wanted more than he could handle. Not at one point does his fate feel like a comeuppance for his treatment of the women in his life.

_____________________________

Acting...Naturaaal

Your knowledge of scientific biological transmogrification is only outmatched by your zest for kung-fu treachery!

Blood Island. So called because it's the exact shape of some blood

(in reply to Spaldron)
Post #: 413
RE: Worst Films Made Ever In The History Of Film - 20/1/2012 5:11:02 PM   
jonson


Posts: 9150
Joined: 30/9/2005
None of this debate is making me want to see it again although I suppose this thread is supposed to put us off watching certain films.

I'll add Cowboys and Aliens to the list. The worst film I've seen in 12 months.

_____________________________

I've got all the Barbie ones!!!

Yeah but you're old. Really old. Old. Old. Old. Old.

(in reply to Harry Tuttle)
Post #: 414
RE: Worst Films Made Ever In The History Of Film - 13/3/2012 3:42:19 AM   
threshold


Posts: 319
Joined: 26/10/2010
From: Sydney, Austraiia
^Cowboys and Aliens was disgraceful.

Honestly, the worst film ever made is Good Luck Chuck.
Never before have I hated film-makers in such a way

Michael Bay, Uwe Boll, Paul WS Anderson etc are all hilarious if you're in the right mood, but this is not.

-111111111100000000000000000000000000000000/5

(in reply to jonson)
Post #: 415
RE: Worst Films Made Ever In The History Of Film - 13/3/2012 8:48:06 AM   
jobloffski

 

Posts: 1895
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: elsewhere
quote:



And are you suggesting that Montana died because he was a misogynistic bigot? Because my recollection of the film is that he died because he was a greedy cunt who wanted more than he could handle. Not at one point does his fate feel like a comeuppance for his treatment of the women in his life.


No, it's a comeuppance for his treatment of EVERYONE in his life. A film would only be misogynistic and bigoted if it CELEBRATED those things. Whatever the merits of Scarface as a film, it is to a small degree correct to depict some women as being impressed by the trappings of a criminal life, because some ARE. But the attitude displayed by Montana that Miami is like "...a big pussy waiting to be fucked" reflects his view of everything, and he effectively goes insane with paranoia by the end of ther film, having gotten high on his own supply (drugs and ego wise) and having gotten too big for his boots, is taken out by people with more than their word and their balls to back up their position in the underworld.

There's a bit more skill to De Palma's direction than he is often given credit for here, for example, when meeting the drug cartel guys, the framing of the shot at one point makes Motana look tiny compared to the bigger fish he is trying to bite, and that is a big part of the story right there. A little man, talks big, takes no shit, which gets someone so far, but without respecting anyone else at all (which extends to his views on women too) he geos too far, and gets the fate his actions deserve, in the context of the film.

Additionally, Rudyard Kipling's poem if is rather neatly reference by the film, in terms of Montana's desire for 'The world, and everything in it'. The poem lists a lot of things necessary to becoming a man (if you can keep your head when all around you are losing theirs/if you can face victory and defeat and treat those two impostors the same/etc you will be a man and the worlds is yours, and everything in it).

Montana completely fails to be the kind of man referred to in 'If' and suffers the consequences.

Conclusion, brash and trashy it may be, but that is the CHARACTER of the main character and thereby the film itself, which is not the same as saying anything done by the main character is condoned and celebrated by the film, because the final final judgement on him by the film is he gets what he spent the entire film asking for, very loudly.

My copy of the DVD features rappers who idolise Scarface for 'living the dream' but they're kinda missing the point. Guts, and taking things upon yourself to achieve something = good. Being a total cunt who takes everything and destroys everyone he cares about, and his own soul (which he didn;t have much of in the first place) in the process = bad. I find it pretty hard to believe people misinterpret the film that completely, but that's not the film's fault, because it;s about as unsubtle in it's condemnation of Montana as it's possible to imagine. He's relatively sharp and understands how to get to the top in one respect. But he's a total moron when it comes down to it, and the further the film goes along, the more that is revealed as the simplicity of his single mindedness, strand, by strand, weaves the length of rope that eventually strings him up.

The film is a portrait of a prick who thinks he's 'the man'. With content that could only be celebrated by people just like him, because like many an anti-hero tale, it's intent is to say 'behave like this, then you deserve the same kind of fate'. Which makes it the most basic of morality tales, filtered through extreme content, maybe, but still a simple tale, in the mould of Icarus: try to fly higher than your wings can safely carry you, you will fall.

And far from being one of the worst films ever made..

< Message edited by jobloffski -- 13/3/2012 8:50:14 AM >


_____________________________

Yes, dreamers dream and doers do. But if dreamers DON'T dream, doers don't have anything TO do. Everything that is only here because people exist, only exists because someone thought of it., or in other words, dreamed it.

(in reply to Harry Tuttle)
Post #: 416
RE: Worst Films Made Ever In The History Of Film - 13/3/2012 9:12:14 AM   
DazDaMan


Posts: 10109
Joined: 8/9/2006
From: Penicuik - a right shithole
Anyway, I heard rumour that there's another Garbage Pail Kids movie on the horizon.

If memory serves correctly, the original was beyond shite. Even more so than some of the shit we watch over on the Shark Attack 3 thread.

How can a remake/revamp/reimagination of one of the worst films of all time be a good thing?

_____________________________

You fucking fuckers are gonna do what I say or I'm going to stick my foot so far up your assholes you'll rue the day you crawled out of your mother's twat!

(in reply to jobloffski)
Post #: 417
RE: Worst Films Made Ever In The History Of Film - 13/3/2012 9:22:03 AM   
Snake-Eyes


Posts: 9970
Joined: 1/10/2005
From: ZONE 2
quote:

ORIGINAL: DazDaMan

Anyway, I heard rumour that there's another Garbage Pail Kids movie on the horizon.

If memory serves correctly, the original was beyond shite. Even more so than some of the shit we watch over on the Shark Attack 3 thread.

How can a remake/revamp/reimagination of one of the worst films of all time be a good thing?


Ha Ha Ha! I don't think it can be a good thing mate! I used to LOVE the trading cards/stickers - still do; nice slice of 80's pop culture but that film was beyond AWFUL wasn't it?

_____________________________

"When you have to shoot, shoot don't talk."

http://www.expendablespremiere.com/index.html

(in reply to DazDaMan)
Post #: 418
RE: Worst Films Made Ever In The History Of Film - 13/3/2012 4:08:14 PM   
Spaldron


Posts: 10485
Joined: 6/10/2006
From: Chair

quote:

ORIGINAL: jobloffski

quote:



And are you suggesting that Montana died because he was a misogynistic bigot? Because my recollection of the film is that he died because he was a greedy cunt who wanted more than he could handle. Not at one point does his fate feel like a comeuppance for his treatment of the women in his life.


No, it's a comeuppance for his treatment of EVERYONE in his life. A film would only be misogynistic and bigoted if it CELEBRATED those things. Whatever the merits of Scarface as a film, it is to a small degree correct to depict some women as being impressed by the trappings of a criminal life, because some ARE. But the attitude displayed by Montana that Miami is like "...a big pussy waiting to be fucked" reflects his view of everything, and he effectively goes insane with paranoia by the end of ther film, having gotten high on his own supply (drugs and ego wise) and having gotten too big for his boots, is taken out by people with more than their word and their balls to back up their position in the underworld.

There's a bit more skill to De Palma's direction than he is often given credit for here, for example, when meeting the drug cartel guys, the framing of the shot at one point makes Motana look tiny compared to the bigger fish he is trying to bite, and that is a big part of the story right there. A little man, talks big, takes no shit, which gets someone so far, but without respecting anyone else at all (which extends to his views on women too) he geos too far, and gets the fate his actions deserve, in the context of the film.

Additionally, Rudyard Kipling's poem if is rather neatly reference by the film, in terms of Montana's desire for 'The world, and everything in it'. The poem lists a lot of things necessary to becoming a man (if you can keep your head when all around you are losing theirs/if you can face victory and defeat and treat those two impostors the same/etc you will be a man and the worlds is yours, and everything in it).

Montana completely fails to be the kind of man referred to in 'If' and suffers the consequences.

Conclusion, brash and trashy it may be, but that is the CHARACTER of the main character and thereby the film itself, which is not the same as saying anything done by the main character is condoned and celebrated by the film, because the final final judgement on him by the film is he gets what he spent the entire film asking for, very loudly.

My copy of the DVD features rappers who idolise Scarface for 'living the dream' but they're kinda missing the point. Guts, and taking things upon yourself to achieve something = good. Being a total cunt who takes everything and destroys everyone he cares about, and his own soul (which he didn;t have much of in the first place) in the process = bad. I find it pretty hard to believe people misinterpret the film that completely, but that's not the film's fault, because it;s about as unsubtle in it's condemnation of Montana as it's possible to imagine. He's relatively sharp and understands how to get to the top in one respect. But he's a total moron when it comes down to it, and the further the film goes along, the more that is revealed as the simplicity of his single mindedness, strand, by strand, weaves the length of rope that eventually strings him up.

The film is a portrait of a prick who thinks he's 'the man'. With content that could only be celebrated by people just like him, because like many an anti-hero tale, it's intent is to say 'behave like this, then you deserve the same kind of fate'. Which makes it the most basic of morality tales, filtered through extreme content, maybe, but still a simple tale, in the mould of Icarus: try to fly higher than your wings can safely carry you, you will fall.

And far from being one of the worst films ever made..


This is exactly my feelings on the film and also my frustration that so many people completely miss the point of it all. Well done jobloffski.

_____________________________

And I heard a voice in the midst of the four beasts
And I looked and behold, a pale horse
And his name that sat on him was Death
And Hell followed with him.

(in reply to jobloffski)
Post #: 419
RE: Worst Films Made Ever In The History Of Film - 13/3/2012 6:32:02 PM   
rich


Posts: 5088
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Neo Kobe
Scarface is a good film, but it's about how if a man is a massive twat, he will remain a massive twat even if he obtains enough cocaine to construct a small igloo. The problem is the fans that think it's awesome because being a gangsta is awesome.

_____________________________

Meanwhile...

(in reply to Spaldron)
Post #: 420
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