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RE: Casino Royale PT 2 - 31/10/2008 8:23:37 PM   
adambatman82

 

Posts: 11156
Joined: 15/12/2005
saw quantum of solace earlier this evening, and as someone who isnt a huge bond fan, i really enjoyed it. as far as im concerned casino royale and goldeneye are the two strongest films from the back catalogue, and while this isnt as good as those two it still beats the pants off of the horribly dated stuff from the past ("why is it that chinese girls taste so different ?" indeed). it did feel very much like the second part of a trilogy tho, something that appeals greatly to myself. for the first time ever im actually excited about seeing whats going to happen next. the tease as towards the mysterious organisation behind all of this is actually genuinely interesting.

and with regards to the naysayers (the two obvious one on this thread at least), if you dont like the film that you havent seen then why on earth would you bother posting in here? its really annoying.
Post #: 121
RE: bale for bond - 31/10/2008 8:35:47 PM   
darth silas


Posts: 4949
Joined: 1/10/2005
From: My living room
quote:

ORIGINAL: bleugh07

does anyone else feel that Christian bale has a very, very good chance of being bond after craig leaves?
No.Because a)Hes got Batman and John Connor to keep him going for the foreseeable future,and

b)Hes too big a star for Bond now.

Would have made a great 007 though.

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Post #: 122
RE: Quantum of Solace - 31/10/2008 8:36:17 PM   
Filmfan 2


Posts: 1045
Joined: 30/9/2005
Don't have time for anything more substantial just now (will post more tomorrow), but having just seen this this afternoon I'll say that it's definitely disappointing.

It has strengths, but they're outweighed by the weaknesses. Where Empire got 4 stars from for this is beyond me.

< Message edited by Filmfan 2 -- 31/10/2008 8:38:43 PM >


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Post #: 123
RE: Quantum of Solace - 31/10/2008 8:44:13 PM   
shanyi

 

Posts: 146
Joined: 28/9/2006
From: UK
My review, as posted on a Bond fansite. There are one or two mild SPOILERS in here, so be warned.

To cut to the chase, this film has a stark case of split personality. The first half, to be blunt, is diabolical. The gunbarrel's absence is felt more keenly than I expected, but that might have something to do with what followed: the car was there, the actor was there, even the gun was there (finally)... but James Bond most definitely wasn't. No matter what you look for in your 007, be he a man of suave coolness, charm, humour, an aspirational figure replete with English stiff upper-lipedness (word)... the character we have to watch for the first hour is none of these things. He's a blank, witless personality-free killing machine who slaughters his way through anyone who happens to look at him rudely. Fleming's character might have been described as a 'cardboard bobby', but he was irrevocably human: he killed but, despite his professionalism, never enjoyed or grew numb to it. He had a sense of humour, albeit one as dry as his martinis. The 'person' masquerading as Bond for the first hour is as even further away from Fleming's character than Roger Moore's- though at least Moore was fun. Any trace of character is consumed in a mess of product placement and zeitgeisty callousness that fails to see the real reasons why the Batman and (to a lesser extent) Bourne films managed to pull off their character's dark sides successfully.

The writers might have just about gotten away with it had the 'gunbarrel rush' (aka the lasting excitement from watching that iconic opening sequence and hearing that guitar riff) been in place, but without it any hint of Bond-ness is cast to the wind. It doesn't help either that the action sequences in the first hour pile up on top of each other like a car crash. The Bourne team's fingerprints are all over them, with shakycam galore making it near impossible to get a sense of what's going on, who's going where and how Bond even gets out of his various scrapes (what he does to upend the last dinghy on the boat chase with that hook, I'm hoping someone will tell me because I was utterly lost in the blur). The Siena chase should have been a thrilling vertigo-inducing run across the rooftops of a beautiful city, but is denied any sense of height, location or tension because the editing is too busy slashing away at what little sense can be made from the constantly wobbling camera. Bond races through four locations in little more than half an hour (Siena, London, Haiti, Austria, before heading back to Italy not long after), yet doesn't spend long enough in any of these places for them to register as anything other than backdrops for the various action sequences (London is the exception, though the scene takes place entirely within a rogue agent's flat and isn't greatly interesting). At the rate it was going, I was on the verge of having to suppress a yearning to return to 1985's San Francisco (I can't bring myself to say the dreadfulness of the feeling any more literally than that, as any Bond fans will quickly understand).

But then we hit Bolivia and the film chills out a bit, picking up immeasurably. Gemma Arterton makes her cameo and is utterly adorable. She has next to nothing to do, but her smile radiates and she and Bond share the closest thing the film has to the witty exchanges that kicked off the relationship with Vesper in Royale. Mathis is kept around and is equally short-lived, but his death at least gives the film a heartbeat that saves it from total cardiac arrest. Camille, the surprisingly good Olga Kurylenko, is given a greater motivation and purpose to the plot than the usual Bond girls and though tough and resourceful, doesn't sink into the Bond's-equal mire that drowned the loathsome Halle Berry. Mathieu Amalric too is a lot of sleazy goggle-eyed fun as the villainous Greene, sniffing around prospective sponsors like a Sarkozy-shaped rat (or simply like Sarkozy). Wright continues his excellent work as Felix Leiter, his split loyalties played out with far more subtlety than the limited role ought to allow. All fingers crossed that his screentime can expand even further into something approaching a friendship for he and Bond in future installments. Craig himself is given slightly more to work with in the better, later half of the picture and although he's a long way from hitting the peaks of his Royale performance (scarcely his fault as much as the writers', though if he wields as much influence as he claims then he's not entirely blameless), he manages to bring a bit of soul back into the character. His desperate, short but agressive kiss with Camille at the film's close is a powerful and poignant act between two people conquering their grief.

The slower pace allows the film time to develop a plot and thereby at last give Bond's endeavours a sense of purpose. There are some plotholes, instances of slightly over-complicated storytelling and it would have been beneficial to see some evidence of the Quantum coup d'etat in Bolivia (that takes place completely off-screen), but there's a decent story in there and the film benefits from being given a small semblance of individuality. Even the action scenes (barring the frankly appalling free-fall sequence, rivalling DAD's iceberg surfing for sheer stupidity just as M's holodesk/wall rivals the invisible car) are cut together with a bit more artistry, each one given enough space to breathe so their impact becomes more tangible. The end of the picture even achieves a completely satisfying end to Bond's emotional turmoil towards Vesper- remarkable, considering how little the topic is even touched upon for the first hour. The gunbarrel at the end is rushed (although it's great to see Craig taking a proper gunbarrel pose rather than Brosnan's empty swirl-n-shoot) but welcome, ending the film on a high note of relief that for the abominable first half, I feared would never come.

[3/5]


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Post #: 124
QoS - 31/10/2008 9:43:59 PM   
durelius


Posts: 258
Joined: 30/9/2005
Excellent follow up to Casino Royale still the no nonsense brutal bond with a more personal mission. Dan Bradley is writ large here action is just excellent. Gotta love the chemistry between M and Bond here as well. Looking forward to more.

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Post #: 125
BREAKING NEWS- QUANTUM OF SOLACE= TRIPE - 31/10/2008 9:51:38 PM   
Morganer29

 

Posts: 2
Joined: 23/3/2008
Having watched this film 20 minutes ago i can safely say that it is one of the biggest disappointments i have ever been witness to- on a par with pirates of the carribean 3 and spiderman 3. The camera shots used in this movie sum the film as a whole up perfectly: messy, annoying, extremely confusing and, ultimately, without actual purpose.

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Post #: 126
BREAKING NEWS- QUANTUM OF SOLACE= TRIPE - 31/10/2008 9:52:23 PM   
Morganer29

 

Posts: 2
Joined: 23/3/2008
Having watched this film 20 minutes ago i can safely say that it is one of the biggest disappointments i have ever been witness to- on a par with pirates of the carribean 3 and spiderman 3. The camera shots used in this movie sum the film as a whole up perfectly: messy, annoying, extremely confusing and, ultimately, without actual purpose.

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Post #: 127
RE: BREAKING NEWS- QUANTUM OF SOLACE= TRIPE - 31/10/2008 10:26:16 PM   
The Scientist


Posts: 46
Joined: 26/10/2008
As someone who has not yet seen the film, thanks to those who have signposted spoilers, but some posters seem to have forgotten to do this.

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Post #: 128
RE: BREAKING NEWS- QUANTUM OF SOLACE= TRIPE - 1/11/2008 12:01:51 AM   
Clarence_Worley


Posts: 159
Joined: 10/3/2007
btw,...

Does anyone know the deal with the shot of Bond in a suit an tie, walking over the hill (desert) holding an assault rifle in his right hand in slow motion? I swear i can't remember it happening in the film, does anyone know if it was shot just for trailer/ promotional purposes? It's pretty iconic.

< Message edited by Clarence_Worley -- 1/11/2008 12:04:10 AM >
Post #: 129
Confused? You will be... - 1/11/2008 12:23:44 AM   
stevecrabb

 

Posts: 30
Joined: 15/1/2006
Not as good as Casino Royale, which had more to prove.
This Bond is so stripped down that there is almost nothing left.
Entertaining but left me feeling a bit empty.

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Post #: 130
RE: BREAKING NEWS- QUANTUM OF SOLACE= TRIPE - 1/11/2008 12:50:21 AM   
Goodfella


Posts: 17202
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: North Devon
quote:

ORIGINAL: Clarence_Worley

btw,...

Does anyone know the deal with the shot of Bond in a suit an tie, walking over the hill (desert) holding an assault rifle in his right hand in slow motion? I swear i can't remember it happening in the film, does anyone know if it was shot just for trailer/ promotional purposes? It's pretty iconic.


SPOILER! SPOILER! SPOILER!

After the plane fight, Bond and Camille parachute out and get stuck in the sink hole where they discover the dam that Greene is planning to use as his makeweight in his buy-out deals and they discover the tunnel that leads through to the town. The shot from the trailer is after they emerge from the tunnel and make their way back into town, it cuts in and out.

I think that QOS fails to stand out for anything in particurlar and lacks a real cutting edge, a spark if you will. The scenes with M were funny and enjoyable as always but the opening sequence lacked real momentum and tension - I think carrying it on three minutes after 'Casino Royale' was a mistake.

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Post #: 131
RE: BREAKING NEWS- QUANTUM OF SOLACE= TRIPE - 1/11/2008 12:57:55 AM   
adambatman82

 

Posts: 11156
Joined: 15/12/2005

quote:

ORIGINAL: Morganer29

Having watched this film 20 minutes ago i can safely say that it is one of the biggest disappointments i have ever been witness to- on a par with pirates of the carribean 3 and spiderman 3. The camera shots used in this movie sum the film as a whole up perfectly: messy, annoying, extremely confusing and, ultimately, without actual purpose.


it confused you??!! what on earth was remotely challenging about the film? for the record i thought the film was beautifully shot for the most part, the stuff in the desert especially.

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Post #: 132
RE: BREAKING NEWS- QUANTUM OF SOLACE= TRIPE - 1/11/2008 1:02:34 AM   
Goodfella


Posts: 17202
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: North Devon
quote:

ORIGINAL: adambatman82


quote:

ORIGINAL: Morganer29

Having watched this film 20 minutes ago i can safely say that it is one of the biggest disappointments i have ever been witness to- on a par with pirates of the carribean 3 and spiderman 3. The camera shots used in this movie sum the film as a whole up perfectly: messy, annoying, extremely confusing and, ultimately, without actual purpose.


it confused you??!! what on earth was remotely challenging about the film? for the record i thought the film was beautifully shot for the most part, the stuff in the desert especially.


It was the least confusing Bond film ever, I was still left waiting for the plot to start when the end credits rolled.

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Post #: 133
pacy? confusing and far too fast more like. - 1/11/2008 6:19:35 AM   
andy bark

 

Posts: 22
Joined: 28/5/2006
From: manchester
Sadly the Director, trying to out do Bourne, hired an editor with attention deficit disorder and the amazing stunts and action scenes are ruined in the cutting. Poor old Daniel did all his own stunts yet it really could have been anyone. Instead of getting a 'wow!' from the audience it's a puzzled 'what?' its so hard to tell whats going on. And the plot about creating a drought really does not hold water. Still there is much to enjoy but I would like to see Martin Campbell's cut of the film on DVD. His Bond films are far better than this. He knows how to get a big 'wow' from his audience.

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Post #: 134
pacy? confusing and far too fast more like. - 1/11/2008 6:19:50 AM   
andy bark

 

Posts: 22
Joined: 28/5/2006
From: manchester
Sadly the Director, trying to out do Bourne, hired an editor with attention deficit disorder and the amazing stunts and action scenes are ruined in the cutting. Poor old Daniel did all his own stunts yet it really could have been anyone. Instead of getting a 'wow!' from the audience it's a puzzled 'what?' its so hard to tell whats going on. And the plot about creating a drought really does not hold water. Still there is much to enjoy but I would like to see Martin Campbell's cut of the film on DVD. His Bond films are far better than this. He knows how to get a big 'wow' from his audience.

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Post #: 135
Brillant Follow up, - 1/11/2008 9:45:42 AM   
Joker_08

 

Posts: 2
Joined: 9/7/2008
Fast paced. One of the best openings in a bond film ever if not oneof the best in any movie. I loved the way Daniel Craig isnt the posey afraid to actually pucnh some one bond that peirce Brosnon was. This is who Bond was written in the books and Bond reallly should be done.

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Post #: 136
Brillant Follow up, - 1/11/2008 9:45:58 AM   
Joker_08

 

Posts: 2
Joined: 9/7/2008
Fast paced. One of the best openings in a bond film ever if not oneof the best in any movie. I loved the way Daniel Craig isnt the posey afraid to actually pucnh some one bond that peirce Brosnon was. This is who Bond was written in the books and Bond reallly should be done.

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Post #: 137
RE: pacy? confusing and far too fast more like. - 1/11/2008 9:46:01 AM   
porntrooper

 

Posts: 2610
Joined: 6/9/2006
From: Sheffield
Some pretty minor spoilers in the post below, nothing earth shattering, but tread lightly if you haven't seen it yet............


I really liked it.  It isn't without it's flaws, but it is still a decent outing for Bond, and one which I think makes perfect sense to restart the franchise, lets not forget that this is essentially act two of Bond Begins, which is why I think the gunbarrel appears at the end. 

The final scene and dialogue between Bond and M in Russia kinda cements the fact to me that Bond has got his little bit of revenge and is at peace with the whole 'Vesper' thing, now he's ready to do what he needs to do to take out Quantum, he's Bond now, and it's hit home by having the gunbarrel as the final shot.  I'd also expect the next film to bring in Q branch.  Maybe as M now feels Bond is what she's after in her world saving secret agent, she can reveal other top secret areas of MI6 that may have been kept from him at the time.  A 'Welcome to Q Branch' scene in Craigs next movie would make perfect, perfect sense after whats gone before.  Same with the theme music, it's creeping in all through QoS, but never quite hits off as it should, but again, he's becoming Bond, earning the theme and I fully expect it to be back in full for the next movie, it just totally makes sense to me to do it this way, and I'm loving it.

QoS isn't without it's flaws, and it isn't as good as CR, but it's still one of the better films of the year for me.  The story is probably the biggest hurdle with QoS, it never really has time to explain itself, it's basic and easy to follow, but it never really lets it develop as logically as CR did.  It's not often I say it but an extra 20 minutes to develop the story out would've helped a lot. 

The other flaw, and the one I think most people will struggle with, is the editing of some of the action scenes, basically the first three (The car chase, the run around Italy and the boat chase) are striking and exciting, and have some great stunts in them, some great choreography.  However, it's hidden under bad edits and quick, confusing camera movement.  It's not enough to spoil them as such, same as it didn't spoil the action in Batman Begins or the Bourne movies, but it does make them confusing.  Marc Foster never lets the camera linger on a shot in these early sequences, other than in the hotel fight, which I thought was staged excellently (loved Bond's expression as he bleeds out his attacker).  That style is in stark contrast to Cambell's more traditional camera work in CR, and it's jars when you compare the two.  Maybe there are deleted scenes or shots that could get reworked for DVD and Blu Ray, to maybe enhance the action sequences and the story?  I for one would love to know how exactly Bond hooks the boat during the water chase, how did he get it to up end like that?!

Thankfully though, the later sequences calm down, whilst still frenetic and editing with pace, they're easier to follow and it looks like Foster is finding his stride it the edit suite.  The hotel finale was impressive, and I didn't have a problem with the constant explosions.  I was, however, sad that the villains demise doesn't equal the huge fiery set piece.  Don't get me wrong, it's a good way to off the villain, and it keeps in the style of the movie and of what the franchise feels like now, but during the fight and fisticuffs, I was thinking 'Oh Yea, Bond's going to do in a bad guy good and proper like in the old movies!', sadly he doesn't.

My favourite part of the film?  The set up of Quantum, easily.  It's an idea that, for me personally, works perfectly.  I love the idea, and I love how it's revealed during the Tosca scene (my favourite of the whole movie) and how Bond teases them that he's onto them.  Great stuff.  So all in all, a good, if flawed, movie.  It's isn't as good as Casino Royale, and it isn't quite classic Bond but I've a feeling this will work better in two or three ways.  Firstly, I think it will be easier to follow the action on second viewing and on Blu Ray.  Secondly, I've a feeling it will work better when we see the next movie, as I am almost certain the traditional Bond elements will start to emerge more.  I think the CHUD.com review is spot on in it's claim that this works better as a middle act of three movies, or as an extended epilogue to Casino Royale.  It'll be enjoyable to watch CR and QoS back to back.

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Post #: 138
Wait to see what comes next!! - 1/11/2008 9:51:47 AM   
martint39

 

Posts: 2
Joined: 9/7/2008
QOS needs to viewed as the link between Casino Royale and whatever comes next, only then can it be fairly appraised. Daniel Craig is still settling into the role but is clearly capable. However, I'm not sure that Bond should be trying to out-do Bourne, the close up fight scenes and rooftop action had very strong echoes of Bourne Ultimatum and yet didn't deliver such impact. QOS continues to recreate the Bond legend and pays homage to Ian Flemmings original story-lines (refer to OHMSS and Diamonds Forever) but some of the magic is lost without the jokes, girls, gadgets, Q and Moneypenny, bring these back and the next film could be the best Bond ever.

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Post #: 139
RE: pacy? confusing and far too fast more like. - 1/11/2008 10:01:57 AM   
adambatman82

 

Posts: 11156
Joined: 15/12/2005
double post.

< Message edited by adambatman82 -- 1/11/2008 10:04:22 AM >

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Post #: 140
RE: pacy? confusing and far too fast more like. - 1/11/2008 10:03:44 AM   
adambatman82

 

Posts: 11156
Joined: 15/12/2005

quote:

ORIGINAL: andy bark

Sadly the Director, trying to out do Bourne, hired an editor with attention deficit disorder and the amazing stunts and action scenes are ruined in the cutting. Poor old Daniel did all his own stunts yet it really could have been anyone. Instead of getting a 'wow!' from the audience it's a puzzled 'what?' its so hard to tell whats going on. And the plot about creating a drought really does not hold water. Still there is much to enjoy but I would like to see Martin Campbell's cut of the film on DVD. His Bond films are far better than this. He knows how to get a big 'wow' from his audience.



what on earth has martin campbell got to do with this, and why would he want to recut someone else's film?? just bizarre a notion, possibly the oddest idea iv read in this thread, which is saying something. would you like to see martin campbells cut of anything else while were at it? how about goldfinger? or dr no? or transformers?

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Post #: 141
Mr Crash Crash, Bang Bang - 1/11/2008 10:41:01 AM   
elzupasmonkey


Posts: 277
Joined: 30/9/2005
Boring as fuck.

Tedious action sequences, risible dialogue ("I can't find my stationary."Ugh!), an effete villain and henchman, pointless female characters and it's all wrapped with a climax in an empty hotel.

Not Die Another Day bad, but close.



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Post #: 142
RE: Mr Crash Crash, Bang Bang - 1/11/2008 10:59:05 AM   
The Gaffer

 

Posts: 40
Joined: 8/7/2008
From: Cork,Ireland
Saw it las night.Not great.Liked CR for doing away with the fantastical crap (never watched a bond movie start to finish before CR),but QoS seems to be drawing this stuff back in. see the plane scene and subsequent parachute from said plane for example. Plus the 'Minority Report' style touch screens at MI6 hq (I'm aware ye have a decent intelligence service over there but c'mon surely that stuff doesn't exist.
Anyway...3stars from me.

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Post #: 143
Stunning! - 1/11/2008 11:09:20 AM   
Jim Bob


Posts: 178
Joined: 8/10/2005
From: Rotherham
I went in expecting to be disappointed and came out feeling throroughly elated. I found Solace to be an absolute joy from start to finish.

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Post #: 144
Beautifully shot, badly edited... - 1/11/2008 11:31:00 AM   
Cameron1975Williams

 

Posts: 205
Joined: 5/12/2005
From: Cardiff
...The pre-credit car chase is a good example of this. It's practically unintelligible, it reminded me of the fight sequences from Batman Begins. Like this review, the film is very uneven but does have a couple of great moments in it. The relationship between Olga Kurylenko's character and Greene is ridiculous but Olga Kurylenko is very impressive in the movie. I hope to see her in the next one. Gemma Arterton's character was just irritating. Like the Gaffer says below, too much fantastical stuff that reminded me of the bad old days. The Art Director should get an Oscar, it's just beautiful to look at. Although it's the shortest Bond, it still dragged in places (I had people sleeping and texting in the movie theatre with me), you could take out another 20 mins and it would be a better movie. Overall, a bit of a step backwards. For the love of film, Barbara Broccoli, get a decent director!



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Post #: 145
Beautifully shot, badly edited... - 1/11/2008 11:46:15 AM   
Cameron1975Williams

 

Posts: 205
Joined: 5/12/2005
From: Cardiff
...The pre-credit car chase is a good example of this. It's practically unintelligible, it reminded me of the fight sequences from Batman Begins. Like this review, the film is very uneven but does have a couple of great moments in it. The relationship between Olga Kurylenko's character and Greene is ridiculous but Olga Kurylenko is very impressive in the movie. I hope to see her in the next one. Gemma Arterton's character was just irritating. Like the Gaffer says below, too much fantastical stuff that reminded me of the bad old days. The Art Director should get an Oscar, it's just beautiful to look at. Although it's the shortest Bond, it still dragged in places (I had people sleeping and texting in the movie theatre with me), you could take out another 20 mins and it would be a better movie. Overall, a bit of a step backwards. For the love of film, Barbara Broccoli, get a decent director!



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Post #: 146
Further thoughts... - 1/11/2008 11:47:46 AM   
Cameron1975Williams

 

Posts: 205
Joined: 5/12/2005
From: Cardiff
...The stuff with Felix and Mathis was top notch. We needed more of this, to give the movie heart, and fewer badly cut action sequences.

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Post #: 147
RE: Humourless, Impenetrable and Rushed - 1/11/2008 12:31:08 PM   
Hughnon

 

Posts: 3
Joined: 23/10/2008
quote:

ORIGINAL: Chris66
it was pretty strange how Bond knew how to fly a plane all of a sudden

You're right, of course.

It's unthinkable that he could have learned how to do that before the events of the film.

I mean, it starts with him driving a car, and yet we never see him taking his theory test.

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Post #: 148
RE: Beautifully shot, badly edited... - 1/11/2008 12:33:44 PM   
Stewie_Griffin


Posts: 6968
Joined: 3/10/2005
From: St.Albans, Hertfordshire
quote:

ORIGINAL: Cameron1975Williams
For the love of film, Barbara Broccoli, get a decent director!



They did, they just picked one that doesn't really understand action.

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Post #: 149
RE: BREAKING NEWS- QUANTUM OF SOLACE= TRIPE - 1/11/2008 12:53:16 PM   
Hughnon

 

Posts: 3
Joined: 23/10/2008
quote:

ORIGINAL: Goodfella

quote:

ORIGINAL: Clarence_Worley

btw,...

Does anyone know the deal with the shot of Bond in a suit an tie, walking over the hill (desert) holding an assault rifle in his right hand in slow motion? I swear i can't remember it happening in the film, does anyone know if it was shot just for trailer/ promotional purposes? It's pretty iconic.


SPOILER! SPOILER! SPOILER!

After the plane fight, Bond and Camille parachute out and get stuck in the sink hole where they discover the dam that Greene is planning to use as his makeweight in his buy-out deals and they discover the tunnel that leads through to the town. The shot from the trailer is after they emerge from the tunnel and make their way back into town, it cuts in and out.

Except for the facts that in that bit of the film, he (a) didn't have a tie, (b) didn't have an assault rifle and (c) was walking with Camille, this is entirely accurate.

Which is to say that it is in no way accurate.

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Post #: 150
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