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Misunderstood Biologist Quits Over Creationism Teaching Row.

 
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Misunderstood Biologist Quits Over Creationism Teaching... - 17/9/2008 4:37:24 PM   
Cruisecontroller


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http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/education/7619670.stm

Seems a bit hasty as he said he was misquoted. He was just saying it should be clarified why evolution and not creationism is the scientifically reliable theory (if asked by a pupil) as to the orgions of the universe not that creationism should be taught in science lessons. He was supporting scientific theories in science classes not religious ones when it comes to science lessons on the start of the universe etc. Does anyone reading these threads actually beleive in the Adam and Eve story as its in the bible as opposed to evolution?

< Message edited by Cruisecontroller -- 19/9/2008 3:58:44 PM >


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RE: Misunderstood Biologist Quits Over Creationism Teac... - 17/9/2008 4:59:31 PM   
clownfoot


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Creationism should be debated alongside evolution in the religious education class; not vice versa. Once people understand that there is room for this debate in schools via an alternative avenue rather than the science classroom, then hopefully such media outcries will phase out...

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RE: Misunderstood Biologist Quits Over Creationism Teac... - 17/9/2008 5:22:43 PM   
Tech_Noir

 

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Forget Creationism, teach the Hindu origin of the universe (or universes).

Vishnu is asleep on the cosmic waters of eternity, a flower grows from his belly-button every now and then, the God Brahma is sitting on the flower petals, a universe comes out of his third eye, when he closes his eye that universe ends. The cycle goes on forever.

What's not to get?

< Message edited by Tech_Noir -- 17/9/2008 5:23:46 PM >

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Post #: 3
RE: Misunderstood Biologist Quits Over Creationism Teac... - 17/9/2008 5:46:35 PM   
Wilbert


Posts: 9511
Joined: 5/10/2005
From: Dublin: Ireland

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tech_Noir

ForgetCreationism, teach the Hindu origin of the universe (or universes).

Vishnu is asleep on thecosmicwaters of eternity, a flower grows from his belly-button every now and then, the GodBrahmais sitting on the flower petals, a universe comes out of his third eye, whenhe closes hiseye that universe ends. The cycle goes on forever.

What's not to get?


That is DISGUSTING!!!

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RE: Misunderstood Biologist Quits Over Creationism Teac... - 17/9/2008 5:50:25 PM   
Tech_Noir

 

Posts: 20199
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Wilbert


quote:

ORIGINAL: Tech_Noir

Forget Creationism, teach the Hindu origin of the universe (or universes).

Vishnu is asleep on the cosmic waters of eternity, a flower grows from his belly-button every now and then, the God Brahma is sitting on the flower petals, a universe comes out of his third eye, when he closes his eye that universe ends. The cycle goes on forever.

What's not to get?


That is DISGUSTING!!!




I think it's cool.

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Post #: 5
RE: Misunderstood Biologist Quits Over Creationism Teac... - 17/9/2008 8:47:36 PM   
Woger


Posts: 3816
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By bringing creationism into a science classroom you are almost legitimising it. Anyway, would teachers have time ot go through all creation stories or had he one in mind?

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Post #: 6
RE: Misunderstood Biologist Quits Over Creationism Teac... - 17/9/2008 10:10:31 PM   
Funkyrae


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Oh dear, wasn't there a creationism thread that went very very badly wrong not so long ago?

Creationism should be taught in RE classes, Evolution in science.  The two can be taught side by side but not by the same teacher.  They are vastly different subjects.  Unfortunately, teaching just doesn't work that way and teachers are being asked to teach subjects that they don't have the necessary knowledge of.  Hence the reason one of my subjects is being taught by a music teacher! 

Petty gripes aside, by all means teach both sides.  There is room for both and I don't believe that either should be excluded.

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RE: Misunderstood Biologist Quits Over Creationism Teac... - 17/9/2008 10:48:17 PM   
Manchurian candidate


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He should not have quit, and he should not have been fired.

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RE: Misunderstood Biologist Quits Over Creationism Teac... - 17/9/2008 11:21:36 PM   
FlangeBags


Posts: 1137
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From: Preston
I do feel kinda sorry for the guy.
He didn't, from what I can make out, advocate the teaching of creationism, just that teachers should allow the debate if a pupil brings it up, as opposed to just telling the pupil that they're wrong and moving on (tough line to walk, engaging the pupil and discussing the evidence, or lack thereof, without lending any undue credence to the nonsense that is creationism).
That being said, being the head of such an organisation does mean you need to be careful about what you say and he was very naive.
As well intentioned as he was, and as much as he may have a point once you strip away the media hyperbole, his position had become untenable. The fact that he was an ordained minister didn't exactly help.
Still, it should have been handled better than it was.

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Post #: 9
RE: Misunderstood Biologist Quits Over Creationism Teac... - 17/9/2008 11:29:29 PM   
Hood_Man


Posts: 12192
Joined: 30/9/2005
quote:

ORIGINAL: Wilbert


quote:

ORIGINAL: Tech_Noir

Forget Creationism, teach the Hindu origin of the universe (or universes).

Vishnu is asleep on the cosmic waters of eternity, a flower grows from his belly-button every now and then, the God Brahma is sitting on the flower petals, a universe comes out of his third eye, when he closes his eye that universe ends. The cycle goes on forever.

What's not to get?


That is DISGUSTING!!!

HAHAHAHA!!!!!

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Post #: 10
RE: Misunderstood Biologist Quits Over Creationism Teac... - 18/9/2008 10:16:58 AM   
swordsandsandals


Posts: 12571
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From: A magical forest
He shouldn't have left/been fired. I agree with MC on that one.

I think creationism should be discussed if it's brought up. I think any sane person would agree with that.

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Post #: 11
RE: Misunderstood Biologist Quits Over Creationism Teac... - 18/9/2008 11:12:05 AM   
KnightofZyryab


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He shouldn't have been forced to resign by a presumptuous scientific community who in turn have shown even they can jump to spontaneous conclusions over issues such as creationism. It does amuse me though in the comments below calling scientists "close minded".

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Post #: 12
RE: Misunderstood Biologist Quits Over Creationism Teac... - 18/9/2008 12:40:11 PM   
DJ Satan


Posts: 9025
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From: White Vaart Lane
Well he was head of the Royal Society, whose purpose is to promote the advancement of science. Tolerating the teaching, or even recognition, of creationism or Intelligent Design, in science lessons is against everything the Royal Society stands for.

So IMHO he had no choice other than resign.


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Post #: 13
RE: Misunderstood Biologist Quits Over Creationism Teac... - 18/9/2008 4:03:05 PM   
Hemlock


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He could have chosen to renounce his holy orders instead if he wanted to protect his scientific credentials.

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RE: Misunderstood Biologist Quits Over Creationism Teac... - 18/9/2008 4:20:05 PM   
Tech_Noir

 

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I say we teach music in maths lessons.

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Post #: 15
RE: Misunderstood Biologist Quits Over Creationism Teac... - 18/9/2008 4:23:08 PM   
Woger


Posts: 3816
Joined: 30/9/2005

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tech_Noir

I say we teach music in maths lessons.


No, I want the theory of intelligent addition taught; 2 + 2 = 5

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Post #: 16
RE: Misunderstood Biologist Quits Over Creationism Teac... - 18/9/2008 4:23:50 PM   
Wilbert


Posts: 9511
Joined: 5/10/2005
From: Dublin: Ireland

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tech_Noir

I say we teach music in maths lessons.


Music and maths have a lot in common. Evolution and creationism do not.

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Post #: 17
RE: Misunderstood Biologist Quits Over Creationism Teac... - 18/9/2008 4:28:18 PM   
Tech_Noir

 

Posts: 20199
Joined: 12/10/2005
quote:

ORIGINAL: Wilbert


quote:

ORIGINAL: Tech_Noir

I say we teach music in maths lessons.


Music and maths have a lot in common. Evolution and creationism do not.


I post something I expect Wilbert would never disagree wth and you prove me wrong.

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Post #: 18
RE: Misunderstood Biologist Quits Over Creationism Teac... - 18/9/2008 4:29:03 PM   
Tech_Noir

 

Posts: 20199
Joined: 12/10/2005
quote:

ORIGINAL: Woger


quote:

ORIGINAL: Tech_Noir

I say we teach music in maths lessons.


No, I want the theory of intelligent addition taught; 2 + 2 = 5


You forget the invisible + 1.

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Post #: 19
RE: Misunderstood Biologist Quits Over Creationism Teac... - 18/9/2008 4:30:34 PM   
Woger


Posts: 3816
Joined: 30/9/2005

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tech_Noir

quote:

ORIGINAL: Woger


quote:

ORIGINAL: Tech_Noir

I say we teach music in maths lessons.


No, I want the theory of intelligent addition taught; 2 + 2 = 5


You forget the invisible +1.


It's not invisible, it's something I fail to understand hence it's the design of the Abrahamic god.

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Post #: 20
RE: Misunderstood Biologist Quits Over Creationism Teac... - 18/9/2008 4:32:22 PM   
Tech_Noir

 

Posts: 20199
Joined: 12/10/2005
quote:

ORIGINAL: Woger


quote:

ORIGINAL: Tech_Noir

quote:

ORIGINAL: Woger


quote:

ORIGINAL: Tech_Noir

I say we teach music in maths lessons.


No, I want the theory of intelligent addition taught; 2 + 2 = 5


You forget the invisible + 1.


It's not invisible, it's something I fail to understand hence it's the design of the Abrahamic god.


Hence you're not a religious person.

I'm sensing another religion bashing thread...

< Message edited by Tech_Noir -- 18/9/2008 4:33:12 PM >

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Post #: 21
RE: Misunderstood Biologist Quits Over Creationism Teac... - 18/9/2008 4:39:43 PM   
Woger


Posts: 3816
Joined: 30/9/2005

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tech_Noir

quote:

ORIGINAL: Woger


quote:

ORIGINAL: Tech_Noir

quote:

ORIGINAL: Woger


quote:

ORIGINAL: Tech_Noir

I say we teach music in maths lessons.


No, I want the theory of intelligent addition taught; 2 + 2 = 5


You forget the invisible +1.


It's not invisible, it's something I fail to understand hence it's the design of the Abrahamic god.


Hence you're not a religious person.

I'm sensing another religion bashing thread...


No need for one, there is a search function on the forum.

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Post #: 22
RE: Misunderstood Biologist Quits Over Creationism Teac... - 18/9/2008 4:42:47 PM   
Tech_Noir

 

Posts: 20199
Joined: 12/10/2005
quote:

ORIGINAL: Woger

No need for one, there is a search function on the forum.


Really?

There's a Jennifer Connelly thread I've been meaning to revisit.

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Post #: 23
RE: Misunderstood Biologist Quits Over Creationism Teac... - 18/9/2008 6:37:30 PM   
sanchia


Posts: 18340
Joined: 3/1/2006
From: Norwich

quote:

ORIGINAL: Tech_Noir

quote:

ORIGINAL: Woger

No need for one, there is a search function on the forum.


Really?

There's a Jennifer Connelly thread I've been meaning to revisit.


If you find it let me know

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Post #: 24
RE: Misunderstood Biologist Quits Over Creationism Teac... - 19/9/2008 3:37:32 PM   
Cruisecontroller


Posts: 4447
Joined: 28/4/2006
quote:

ORIGINAL: Wilbert


quote:

ORIGINAL: Tech_Noir

I say we teach music in maths lessons.


Music and maths have a lot in common. Evolution and creationism do not.


Sorry Wilbert but I have to disagree with you there. Evoloution and creationism are about the same thing how the universe and everything in it started they have a lot in common evolution from a scientific therotical point of view and creationism from a religous Christian/Judiasm point of view. Music and maths I suppose both involve formula`s, maths with numbers and music with musical notes so I suppose they have connections too as well.

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RE: Misunderstood Biologist Quits Over Creationism Teac... - 19/9/2008 3:40:39 PM   
Tech_Noir

 

Posts: 20199
Joined: 12/10/2005
Creationism should be taught in history.

Religion has had a huge influence on history (goof and bad - although I'm sure Dawkinites will claim it's only the latter).

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Post #: 26
RE: Misunderstood Biologist Quits Over Creationism Teac... - 19/9/2008 4:11:57 PM   
Cruisecontroller


Posts: 4447
Joined: 28/4/2006
quote:

ORIGINAL: Tech_Noir

Creationism should be taught in history.

Religion has had a huge influence on history (goof and bad - although I'm sure Dawkinites will claim it's only the latter).


Creationism is about the start of history as we know it yes but from a religous point of view of two major religions it isn`t historical fact backed up with historical records or physical evidence. Just because say the oceans are there doesn`t necessarily prove God put them there. You may well beleive its a fact but historically it isn`t one and so shouldn`t in my view be discussed in History lessons. That also should include faith based schools.     

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RE: Misunderstood Biologist Quits Over Creationism Teac... - 19/9/2008 4:33:49 PM   
Woger


Posts: 3816
Joined: 30/9/2005

quote:

ORIGINAL: Cruisecontroller

quote:

ORIGINAL: Wilbert


quote:

ORIGINAL: Tech_Noir

I say we teach music in maths lessons.


Music and maths have a lot in common. Evolution and creationism do not.


Sorry Wilbert but I have to disagree with you there. Evoloution and creationism are about the same thing how the universe and everything in it started they have a lot in common evolution from a scientific therotical point of view and creationism from a religous Christian/Judiasm point of view. Music and maths I suppose both involve formula`s, maths with numbers and music with musical notes so I suppose they have connections too as well.


The basis is completely different.

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Post #: 28
RE: Misunderstood Biologist Quits Over Creationism Teac... - 19/9/2008 4:40:38 PM   
Tech_Noir

 

Posts: 20199
Joined: 12/10/2005
Creationism (whatever the culture) reflects so much about the psychological nature of the people of the time, it has historical significance on what they did, etc.

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Post #: 29
RE: Misunderstood Biologist Quits Over Creationism Teac... - 20/9/2008 10:37:24 PM   
Wilbert


Posts: 9511
Joined: 5/10/2005
From: Dublin: Ireland

quote:

ORIGINAL: Cruisecontroller

quote:

ORIGINAL: Wilbert


quote:

ORIGINAL: Tech_Noir

I say we teach music in maths lessons.


Music and maths have a lot in common. Evolution and creationism do not.


Sorry Wilbert but I have to disagree with you there. Evoloution and creationism are about the same thing how the universe and everything in it started they have a lot in common evolution from a scientific therotical point of view and creationism from a religous Christian/Judiasm point of view. Music and maths I suppose both involve formula`s, maths with numbers and music with musical notes so I suppose they have connections too as well.


The only thing they have in common is that they are theories that try to explain why we are here. One relies on scientific evidence and the other doesn't. Therefore the one that doesn't (Creationism) has no place in a Science class beyond being ridiculed as gibberish.

Disagree if you want to. That's your right.

Music and maths have far more in common than both involving formulas. Music is incredibly mathematical.

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