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RE: KnightWing - 27/7/2012 7:15:07 PM

Woger

Posts: 3738
Joined: 30/9/2005

quote:

ORIGINAL: Private Hudson

Just back and I enjoyed it, though it is easily the weakest of Nolan's trilogy (BB is the best!).

I agree about how Bane got diluted... there was no pay-off. A cardinal sin in moviemaking.

There was far too much exposition and at least 30 mins could have been cut without making a dent in the movie. Plus the plane bit at the start was below par 007....

It lacked wit and imagination which was present in BB and TDK.

Maybe in the first 40 minutes they could have shaved off nearly 10 or so but I don't think they could have cut 30 out of it.

_____________________________

Eddie: "Weve been burgaled"
Richie: You may have been, but I have never in my life. As a christian I am so tightly clenched, oh you mean burgaled
- - -
There were originally five horsemen of the apocalypse. Jack Bauer said he would travel by foot

(in reply to Private Hudson)

Post #: 12061

RE: KnightWing - 2/8/2012 12:41:14 PM

Emyr Thy King

Posts: 2153
Joined: 13/4/2006
From: The Grid

quote:

ORIGINAL: jobloffski

As well as character arc stuff, there were also other payoffs in the build up to Catwoman killing Bane:

"If someone gets in the way of true justice, you just walk up behind them, and stab them in the heart" (R'as Al Ghul's daughter walked up behind Batman and stabbed him, the in the heart' part of the payoff being her making him care for her then betraying him)

I'm sure I'm not the only one who ever thought, "Yeah, he's got the armour and all, but wouldn't someone just shoot him in the exposed mouth area and fuck him right up?" and that's exactly what Bane was about to do.

Highly observant as usual mate

_____________________________

"This whole imbroglio is epiphenomenal"...."demigogic faux egalitarianism" - Will Self

(in reply to jobloffski)

Post #: 12062

RE: KnightWing - 2/8/2012 1:53:04 PM

jobloffski

Posts: 1837
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: elsewhere

Cheers

Other 'inter-film observations' I've noted include...

"You think I want to escape this? There IS no escape from this" (Talia, Bane, and all the others intended to die in Gotham, it was a suicide mission and they were taking out those that irked/hurt/betrayed them out, along with themselves (ironically, what Alfred feared Bruce intended, to commit suicide via his mission, Talia and all specifically did plan to do))

"If you want something done right, you have to do it yourself" previous attempts to bring down Gotham relied on other people falling into line with the intended consequences of the plans economic or fear toxin scenarios. In TDKR, the plan was simply to blow it up with a big bomb they were in charge of.

And an observation about the film, re giving Gotham a little hope in order to be able to punish them harder, Talia, by romancing Bruce would be giving him hope, in order to take it away, and if Bruce hadn't escaped the prison, if the plan had worked, Bruce would not only feel the pain of failing to save Gotham, he would also not have found out who 'Miranda' was, so he would have felt had another woman he believed felt something for him died because he failed them.

Also because those he would have held responsible would be dead, there would be no chance to seek justice or vengeance. The things that led to him becoming Batman used as the basis to punish him for as long as he might live/be able to go on living. Serious twisting of the knife, eventually literally, and only ended by the re-appearance of Catwoman, who unlike Rachel and 'Miranda' was able to be Bruce's chance of a normal life. So, there's more to that sudden saving of Batman than the literal event, she was the 'medicine' for all of Bruce's pain, since seeing his parents shot.

Damn, Nolan thought that through, and certainly more than those who think Bane went out like a bitch think, given he had Batman defeat Bane in Body and spirit, so had already battered Bane to the floor after returning the mask breaking favour, before either he or Bane got punked by the female cohort of their opponent.

Additionally, the desire to make Batman and everlasting symbol was totally achieved, and (IMO) the ending implies not a potential nightwing spin off, but an absolute ending to the Nolan continuity. Batman is the symbol, the identity of the person in the suit is irrelevant, and should Gotham need Batman, it would take someone worthy enough to put the suit on, but as is said in the film, 'Batman could be anyone'. Also, having created one legend, there'd hardly be any point creating a new one.

In the (to be untold) future of Nolan's continuity, Blake, or whoever, could put on the suit to help Gotham and anyone facing Batman would be facing an apparently immortal hero, a wraith, a terrible thought, an idea, returning from beyond the grave to save Gotham from anyone foolish enough to trouble it. There'd be no need for any other hero figure to be created and 'Batman' would only have to 'return' once or twice to further cement the legend, that Batman is the supernatural 'gargoyle' watching over Gotham, unkillable, unstoppable, and nobody would seriously threaten Gotham again. The job is done, and there is little to no story left to tell.

Here endeth my ramblings

< Message edited by jobloffski -- 2/8/2012 2:22:04 PM >

_____________________________

Yes, dreamers dream and doers do. But if dreamers DON'T dream, doers don't have anything TO do. Everything that is only here because people exist, only exists because someone thought of it., or in other words, dreamed it.

(in reply to Emyr Thy King)

Post #: 12063

RE: KnightWing - 2/8/2012 2:31:16 PM

Emyr Thy King

Posts: 2153
Joined: 13/4/2006
From: The Grid

quote:

ORIGINAL: jobloffski
Here endeth my ramblings

"I certainly hope not"

I wonder if Talia had survived and it turned out that she and Bruce had conceived a child together. With Bruce having disappeared, John Blake would be in charge of the Wayne estate (or certainly the Batcave) and so he could have become the legal guardian of Damian Wayne. Talia could then have been imprisoned in Arkham Asylum, where the only other inmate is the Joker (as stated in the film's novelisation). Talia once again is trapped in a different pit, where the only company she has is Batman's arch-nemesis. She then could become Harlequin....perhaps a tad too left field hah.

What do you think? Too much? I understand that the trilogy ender needs to conclude things but it did get me to think a bit!

_____________________________

"This whole imbroglio is epiphenomenal"...."demigogic faux egalitarianism" - Will Self

(in reply to jobloffski)

Post #: 12064

RE: KnightWing - 2/8/2012 2:34:31 PM

FoximusPrime

Posts: 220
Joined: 11/12/2005

quote:

ORIGINAL: jobloffski

Cheers

"If you want something done right, you have to do it yourself" previous attempts to bring down Gotham relied on other people falling into line with the intended consequences of the plans economic or fear toxin scenarios. In TDKR, the plan was simply to blow it up with a big bomb they were in charge of.

On this point, it's also telling that, despite what Bane tells the world, the trigger is not in the hands of an ordinary Gothamite - they have learned from Joker's mistake with the ferries and two triggers in TDK that the people of Gotham can't be trusted to do the "right" thing so the LoS holds the only trigger, whilst still creating the same sort of nihilistic, distrustful (is that even a word?) panic that Joker craved. They get the same effect without giving up their control over the situation.

Holy shitsnacks I need to watch this film again soon - I've only watched it the once and it's still poking at my brain a week and a half later.

To the IMAX!

< Message edited by FoximusPrime -- 2/8/2012 2:35:48 PM >

(in reply to jobloffski)

Post #: 12065

RE: KnightWing - 2/8/2012 2:37:36 PM

jobloffski

Posts: 1837
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: elsewhere

In reply to Emyr's PM

Dude, the site wont let me reply for some reason, but re Batman's no-kill policy, the death of Ghul, etc, I guess it's pretty hazy morality. but semi explainable as if Batman was saying 'You wont die because of my actions, you'll die because of yours'?

The stuff about about Batman having his one rule he wont break seems pretty definitively stated in the films, so not sure Nolan wanted his morality ambiguous. Batman could just assassinate any criminal and stop them (like a ninja) but perhaps can regard deaths that result from criminal schemes as them being casualties of wars they started?

< Message edited by jobloffski -- 2/8/2012 2:38:40 PM >

_____________________________

Yes, dreamers dream and doers do. But if dreamers DON'T dream, doers don't have anything TO do. Everything that is only here because people exist, only exists because someone thought of it., or in other words, dreamed it.

(in reply to jobloffski)

Post #: 12066

RE: KnightWing - 2/8/2012 2:57:29 PM

jobloffski

Posts: 1837
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: elsewhere

quote:

ORIGINAL: Emyr Thy King

quote:

ORIGINAL: jobloffski
Here endeth my ramblings

"I certainly hope not"

I wonder if Talia had survived and it turned out that she and Bruce had conceived a child together. With Bruce having disappeared, John Blake would be in charge of the Wayne estate (or certainly the Batcave) and so he could have become the legal guardian of Damian Wayne. Talia could then have been imprisoned in Arkham Asylum, where the only other inmate is the Joker (as stated in the film's novelisation). Talia once again is trapped in a different pit, where the only company she has is Batman's arch-nemesis. She then could become Harlequin....perhaps a tad too left field hah.

What do you think? Too much? I understand that the trilogy ender needs to conclude things but it did get me to think a bit!

A reboot can go there easily, but with Bruce rather than Blake, I guess?

Hopefully the reboot will hold back the Joker card for the third film, and a number of other 'special guest villains' in an up and running non-origin story prompted series can have their moment in the spotlight and create a pretty big new 'verse for the property for the Joker to then piss about with.

_____________________________

Yes, dreamers dream and doers do. But if dreamers DON'T dream, doers don't have anything TO do. Everything that is only here because people exist, only exists because someone thought of it., or in other words, dreamed it.

(in reply to Emyr Thy King)

Post #: 12067

RE: Dark Knight Rises - 2/8/2012 3:17:22 PM

Dirk Miggler

Posts: 830
Joined: 14/1/2009

I haven't read any of the posts, I havent seen the film, I understand spoilers are fairgame in here now, its enter at your own risk but, what the hell is with the Knightwing title that was just on ? This better not be in the film I kid you not !

< Message edited by Dirk Miggler -- 2/8/2012 3:18:33 PM >

(in reply to jobloffski)

Post #: 12068

RE: Dark Knight Rises - 2/8/2012 4:43:46 PM

pete_traynor

Posts: 2881
Joined: 28/11/2006
From: Balboa Towers, Balboa Island, CA

quote:

ORIGINAL: Dirk Miggler

I haven't read any of the posts, I havent seen the film, I understand spoilers are fairgame in here now, its enter at your own risk but, what the hell is with the Knightwing title that was just on ? This better not be in the film I kid you not !

You'll find out... after a dull and disappointing 2hrs 45mins if you choose to sit through the film

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(in reply to Dirk Miggler)

Post #: 12069

RE: KnightWing - 3/8/2012 1:03:14 AM

Emyr Thy King

Posts: 2153
Joined: 13/4/2006
From: The Grid

quote:

ORIGINAL: jobloffski
Dude, the site wont let me reply for some reason, but re Batman's no-kill policy, the death of Ghul, etc, I guess it's pretty hazy morality. but semi explainable as if Batman was saying 'You wont die because of my actions, you'll die because of yours'?

The stuff about about Batman having his one rule he wont break seems pretty definitively stated in the films, so not sure Nolan wanted his morality ambiguous. Batman could just assassinate any criminal and stop them (like a ninja) but perhaps can regard deaths that result from criminal schemes as them being casualties of wars they started?

No probs, not one of those error "####" whatever messages?

As I said in the P.M. Ra's was on the 'death train' as far as he was concerned as he had no way off and he did tell Batman "you can't stop this train". However, it was Batman that smashed the controls so he had a part to play. And there is the matter of causing an explosion at the 'house' of Ra's, which seemingly killed a few ninjas not to mention the falling masonry on decoy Ra's.

Yeah I'm with you on the last point. For instance if all of a criminal's actions led to their own death, then Batman wouldn't be obliged to save them. But if he had a hand in it, then he would be partly culpable at least. It is something that others have mentioned and I think it's a point worth dicussing but ultimately it's not something I have a major problem with. Just something that does puzzle me if you will.

quote:

A reboot can go there easily, but with Bruce rather than Blake, I guess?

Hopefully the reboot will hold back the Joker card for the third film, and a number of other 'special guest villains' in an up and running non-origin story prompted series can have their moment in the spotlight and create a pretty big new 'verse for the property for the Joker to then piss about with.

The thing with using Bruce Wayne again is that it would nullify his concluding story. And Emma Thomas wife of Nolan and producer of the Batman films has said that a fourth film would make it episodic. Much as I would like to see Nolan back with his Batman universe, I agree. But I would be very intrigued to see a Robin Blake as Batman!

However you're right, it does look as though the series will be rebooted. People often whinge about origin tales, I quite like them. And my view is that if you're establishing a new continuity, then it is pretty important to create a new origin tale. Afterall, you're dealing with a character who has their own motivations, fears, hopes and history. But...seeing that I do love BB and in my view it has a flawless origin story. A new origin would seem a little superfluous.

I agree, I think holding off on the Joker would be a wise move. Ledger's incarnation is still very fresh in people's minds but it also leaves the door open for other hitherto unused villains to make an appearance. I do think it was quite clever of Goyer and Nolan to use Ra's and the Scarecrow as Batman's first antagonists and how they fitted in with the theme of fear. I would like to see that level of thinking applied to the next batch of villains and not simply a blind mining of the Rogues Gallery.

I do like the idea of Arkham Asylum being cleaned out of low-level scum and mental patients and instead only being used to house the most dangerous of villains. Such as the Joker, Bane, Deadshot et al.

Just a question on BB and TDKR. We know that Lucius Fox was responsible for pretty much everything that's housed in the old Applied Sciences 'vault' shall we say (later merged with 'Archives' of course!). Now, Fox said that he had taken that department "off the books" - presumably after he took over as CEO from Mr. Earle. The three tumblers we saw, were they part of a prototype batch with the original BB/TDK Tumbler?

Fox's lab in BB, was that underneath the older Wayne Tower? As it appears that the Applied Sciences warehouse in TDK look the same as the one in TDKR and not the one in BB. I know that with each production they won't always use the same building, but just curious.

One last thing! Towards the end of BB, did you find the scene with the elder socialite and Ra's al Ghul a bit strange? She's very keen for Bruce to meet the decoy Ra's (a bit too keen). Then Bruce -- right in front of her -- tells him he's not the real Ra's as he watched him die. Then the Ducard Ra's speaks and the decoy one ushers away the lady who just looks blankly. Very odd. Either she was somehow a member or affiliated with the LoS, seeing as Ra's later said "we have infiltrated every level of its (Gotham's) infrastructure". Perhaps it seems a bit too far fetched that someone of her age would be working for them seeing as she couldn't do much. Then again someone of her position and status would be above suspicion and she could provide access to the upper echelons of Gotham's high society. What do you think?

Oh and for the love of god. In the next Batman film...please, please, please do not trash the Batmobile! 'Batcycle/Batpod' yes fine...but not the car!

< Message edited by Emyr Thy King -- 3/8/2012 1:05:09 AM >

_____________________________

"This whole imbroglio is epiphenomenal"...."demigogic faux egalitarianism" - Will Self

(in reply to jobloffski)

Post #: 12070

RE: KnightWing - 3/8/2012 10:36:43 AM

FoximusPrime

Posts: 220
Joined: 11/12/2005

quote:

ORIGINAL: Emyr Thy King

One last thing! Towards the end of BB, did you find the scene with the elder socialite and Ra's al Ghul a bit strange? She's very keen for Bruce to meet the decoy Ra's (a bit too keen). Then Bruce -- right in front of her -- tells him he's not the real Ra's as he watched him die. Then the Ducard Ra's speaks and the decoy one ushers away the lady who just looks blankly. Very odd. Either she was somehow a member or affiliated with the LoS, seeing as Ra's later said "we have infiltrated every level of its (Gotham's) infrastructure". Perhaps it seems a bit too far fetched that someone of her age would be working for them seeing as she couldn't do much. Then again someone of her position and status would be above suspicion and she could provide access to the upper echelons of Gotham's high society. What do you think?

I thought the very same thing when I recently watched BB again! Although, even if she was a member of the LoS, Bruce doesn't know that (considering how she introduces "Ra's" why would he?) so she takes his statement about watching someone die rather well.

I can only infer that a common pastime of the Gotham Elite is to hunt man for sport.

< Message edited by FoximusPrime -- 3/8/2012 10:37:07 AM >

(in reply to Emyr Thy King)

Post #: 12071

RE: KnightWing - 9/8/2012 10:53:23 PM

Dirk Miggler

Posts: 830
Joined: 14/1/2009

quote:

ORIGINAL: jobloffski

Cheers

Other 'inter-film observations' I've noted include...

"You think I want to escape this? There IS no escape from this" (Talia, Bane, and all the others intended to die in Gotham, it was a suicide mission and they were taking out those that irked/hurt/betrayed them out, along with themselves (ironically, what Alfred feared Bruce intended, to commit suicide via his mission, Talia and all specifically did plan to do))

"If you want something done right, you have to do it yourself" previous attempts to bring down Gotham relied on other people falling into line with the intended consequences of the plans economic or fear toxin scenarios. In TDKR, the plan was simply to blow it up with a big bomb they were in charge of.

And an observation about the film, re giving Gotham a little hope in order to be able to punish them harder, Talia, by romancing Bruce would be giving him hope, in order to take it away, and if Bruce hadn't escaped the prison, if the plan had worked, Bruce would not only feel the pain of failing to save Gotham, he would also not have found out who 'Miranda' was, so he would have felt had another woman he believed felt something for him died because he failed them.

Also because those he would have held responsible would be dead, there would be no chance to seek justice or vengeance. The things that led to him becoming Batman used as the basis to punish him for as long as he might live/be able to go on living. Serious twisting of the knife, eventually literally, and only ended by the re-appearance of Catwoman, who unlike Rachel and 'Miranda' was able to be Bruce's chance of a normal life. So, there's more to that sudden saving of Batman than the literal event, she was the 'medicine' for all of Bruce's pain, since seeing his parents shot.

Damn, Nolan thought that through, and certainly more than those who think Bane went out like a bitch think, given he had Batman defeat Bane in Body and spirit, so had already battered Bane to the floor after returning the mask breaking favour, before either he or Bane got punked by the female cohort of their opponent.

Additionally, the desire to make Batman and everlasting symbol was totally achieved, and (IMO) the ending implies not a potential nightwing spin off, but an absolute ending to the Nolan continuity. Batman is the symbol, the identity of the person in the suit is irrelevant, and should Gotham need Batman, it would take someone worthy enough to put the suit on, but as is said in the film, 'Batman could be anyone'. Also, having created one legend, there'd hardly be any point creating a new one.

In the (to be untold) future of Nolan's continuity, Blake, or whoever, could put on the suit to help Gotham and anyone facing Batman would be facing an apparently immortal hero, a wraith, a terrible thought, an idea, returning from beyond the grave to save Gotham from anyone foolish enough to trouble it. There'd be no need for any other hero figure to be created and 'Batman' would only have to 'return' once or twice to further cement the legend, that Batman is the supernatural 'gargoyle' watching over Gotham, unkillable, unstoppable, and nobody would seriously threaten Gotham again. The job is done, and there is little to no story left to tell.

Here endeth my ramblings

Take a bow son, hit the nail on the head there, pretty much exactly how I felt about the ending and I couldn't have been more satisfied with it, thematically you couldn't ask for a better ending.

(in reply to jobloffski)

Post #: 12072

RE: The Dark Knight Rises - 14/8/2012 9:56:30 AM

FoximusPrime

Posts: 220
Joined: 11/12/2005

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rob

My thoughts were there were more than one Bat vehicle.

"Yes Mr Wayne it comes in black" would indicate that was the case. Also it's referred to as a software patch meaning the Autopilot facility could have been downloaded to all Bats.

If that's the case Batman flies over the ocean, engages autopilot, ejects, bomb explodes (clearly more than 6 miles away and underwater ), everyone wins, Bruce survives...easy peasy.

Why didn't Bane use the Bat in that case - no idea

It seemed to me that those engineers who mentioned the software patch weren't working in a complete Bat, but a cockpit attached to the frame of one so I just assumed that Bruce's was the only assembled Bat.

Or maybe I'm remembering it wrong.

(in reply to Rob)

Post #: 12073

RE: The Dark Knight Rises - 14/8/2012 10:18:40 AM

dolfinack

Posts: 73
Joined: 20/7/2011
From: Belfast

SPOILERS

It was a bit rubbish. Also why all the hype about the ambiguity off the ending? It's obvious the studios wouldn't kill off the cash cow.

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Post #: 12074

RE: The Dark Knight Rises - 15/8/2012 6:21:54 PM

jon5000

Posts: 1087
Joined: 29/3/2007
From: LA

'Batman can be anyone.'

Except copycats in the second movie... who I will beat up on sight.

(in reply to dolfinack)

Post #: 12075

RE: The Dark Knight Rises - 15/8/2012 7:04:53 PM

AxlReznor

Posts: 1095
Joined: 2/12/2010
From: Great Britain

They were wearing hockey pads.

_____________________________

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Post #: 12076

RE: The Dark Knight Rises - 6/9/2012 5:14:00 PM

Woger

Posts: 3738
Joined: 30/9/2005

Ant ti Cool has a story about an additional 30 minutes for a directors cut, has anyone heard anything about it?

_____________________________

Eddie: "Weve been burgaled"
Richie: You may have been, but I have never in my life. As a christian I am so tightly clenched, oh you mean burgaled
- - -
There were originally five horsemen of the apocalypse. Jack Bauer said he would travel by foot

(in reply to AxlReznor)

Post #: 12077

RE: The Dark Knight Rises - 13/9/2012 4:08:10 PM

Discodez

Posts: 777
Joined: 2/9/2010

quote:

ORIGINAL: Woger

Ant ti Cool has a story about an additional 30 minutes for a directors cut, has anyone heard anything about it?

only that we wont be seeing it....

http://www.empireonline.com/forum/tm.asp?m=3466689

(in reply to Woger)

Post #: 12078

RE: The Dark Knight Rises - 16/9/2012 6:27:11 PM

Locog18

Posts: 8
Joined: 16/9/2012

So what are the chances of John Blake being introduced as batman in the planned Justice League film? That could then lead into a new batman trilogy

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(in reply to Discodez)

Post #: 12079

RE: The Dark Knight Rises - 23/9/2012 3:05:52 AM

KnightofZyryab

Posts: 5767
Joined: 26/12/2005

quote:

ORIGINAL: Locog18

So what are the chances of John Blake being introduced as batman in the planned Justice League film? That could then lead into a new batman trilogy

Probably 0. It will be a different canon to Nolan's so a different Batman without the history establised from BB to TDKR.

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(in reply to Locog18)

Post #: 12080

KnightWing - 5/10/2012 5:31:58 PM

Macavity

Posts: 419
Joined: 14/4/2006

quote:

ORIGINAL: KnightofZyryab

quote:

ORIGINAL: Locog18

So what are the chances of John Blake being introduced as batman in the planned Justice League film? That could then lead into a new batman trilogy

Probably 0. It will be a different canon to Nolan's so a different Batman without the history establised from BB to TDKR.

I'd go see a JGL-leading batman film. The 'hothead' character would clash brilliantly with the likes of The Riddler.

(in reply to KnightofZyryab)

Post #: 12081

RE: KnightWing - 27/11/2012 8:39:55 AM

mysterious

Posts: 45
Joined: 16/1/2008

Joseph Gordon-Hewitt the next Batman?

http://uk.ign.com/articles/2012/11/27/joseph-gordon-levitt-to-play-batman-in-justice-league

_____________________________

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(in reply to Woger)

Post #: 12082

RE: The Dark Knight Rises - 27/11/2012 9:18:12 AM

Invader_Ace

Posts: 1524
Joined: 31/7/2008

quote:

ORIGINAL: KnightofZyryab

quote:

ORIGINAL: Locog18
So what are the chances of John Blake being introduced as batman in the planned Justice League film? That could then lead into a new batman trilogy

Probably 0. It will be a different canon to Nolan's so a different Batman without the history establised from BB to TDKR.

or maybe...

http://www.chud.com/118288/nolans-dark-knight-may-join-the-justice-league-after-all/

(in reply to KnightofZyryab)

Post #: 12083

RE: The Dark Knight Rises - 27/11/2012 9:33:27 AM

jobloffski

Posts: 1837
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: elsewhere

Neat compromise if it happens. Can't see any JGL led Batman films being made. Effectively, the JL stuff can have the JGL Batman and WB can reboot the 'Bruce Wayne is Batman' situation very easily here. It wouldn;t even contravene Nolan's 'realism; philosophy, because although there weren't other superheroes in Bale's time as Batman, this use of JGL would very easily permit them to be added to the future development of the continuity, they just haven;t shown up YET, sort of thing.

One reason I don;t see JGL solo Batfilms being made is that Nolan did what he did so well he has effectively made Batman a 'Bond style ' franchise meaning recasting the lead/other roles is as much a part of the hype machine as the films themselves, and a new take on Bruce Wayne each time makes more sense than dumping the Wayne character. Also, unless there is an intent to make Batman a continuous continuity with new people taking on the mantle as time goes on, you really do actually need Bruce Wayne in the story. So rebooting Batman with a new Bruce for another iteration of the legend seems the most likely to me, not least because that also allows rebooting of the rogues gallery too..

< Message edited by jobloffski -- 27/11/2012 9:45:49 AM >

_____________________________

Yes, dreamers dream and doers do. But if dreamers DON'T dream, doers don't have anything TO do. Everything that is only here because people exist, only exists because someone thought of it., or in other words, dreamed it.

(in reply to Invader_Ace)

Post #: 12084

RE: KnightWing - 27/11/2012 10:35:35 AM

giggity

Posts: 240
Joined: 4/3/2012

I hope it's not true, and if it is I hope that the casting was just inspired by dark knight rises and JGL is Bruce Wayne and not returning as John Blake. I like the idea of the ending of Dark Knight Rises with John Blake continuing the mantle of the bat and the legend, but I don't actually want to see it happen because that takes away the impact slightly. Justice League could be a spiritual sequel with JGL playing Batman but not an actual sequel with Blake as batman.

One of the things I like about the nolan films is that they were their own self contained universe. It made what Bruce Wayne did and the idea of Batman that much more powerful. In terms of a film-making point of view it was also very comforting that a director could make the films he wanted to do and a studio was not going to milk them for all their worth creatively after he left. Obviously if Blake is Batman in JL then it's more like WB are saying "We appreciate what you did and we like you Nolan...but Money! Money! Money!"

Thing is, if the JGL Batman is Blake then that makes all of the Nolan films canon which means that for future batman films they can't use Ra's Al Ghul, Harvey Dent, Scarecrow, Carmaine Falconi, Sal Maroni or any of the mob after the Harvey Dent act stopped all crime almost, Bane or Talia Al Ghul. Plus it would be really hard to bring back Catwoman for any logical reason after the ending of DKR and if they ever brought back The Joker he would be Nolan's joker and obviously with Heath Ledger no longer here, the actor they got would have to do an imitation of his Joker.

Creatively, for future films it's just a bad idea.

(in reply to Woger)

Post #: 12085

RE: The Dark Knight Rises & Future Batman Films - 30/11/2012 1:20:56 PM

mysterious

Posts: 45
Joined: 16/1/2008

Interesting that Nolan originally approached Heath Ledger for the role of Bruce Wayne/Batman for Batman Begins.. Ledger did 'not want to make this type of movie'...

http://uk.ign.com/articles/2012/11/30/christopher-nolan-wanted-heath-ledger-to-play-batman

< Message edited by mysterious -- 30/11/2012 1:24:40 PM >

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Post #: 12086

RE: KnightWing - 4/12/2012 2:59:35 PM

spark1

Posts: 5790
Joined: 18/11/2006

hathaway still up for more selina kyle-

http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/movies/news/a442804/dark-knight-rises-anne-hathaway-still-keen-for-catwoman-spinoff.html

(in reply to Woger)

Post #: 12087

RE: KnightWing - 10/12/2012 1:10:23 PM

spark1

Posts: 5790
Joined: 18/11/2006

a 'catwoman' spin off would be a great way to reboot the batman saga, setting up a gotham that chimes with MOS and JLA.

(in reply to Woger)

Post #: 12088

RE: Dark Knight Rises - 10/12/2012 10:00:53 PM

rich

Posts: 4138
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: Neo Kobe

Thread title reset, seriously

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THINGS
WRITINGS

(in reply to pete_traynor)

Post #: 12089

RE: Dark Knight Rises - 11/12/2012 2:58:23 AM

jobloffski

Posts: 1837
Joined: 30/9/2005
From: elsewhere

On second viewing, and third, increasingly better film. TDK feels very small once you've got into TDKR.

And, entering smug mode, a long time ago I suggested that the ultimate defeat of Bane would involve the blades on Batman's gauntlets, just like they got him the advantage over his mentor and the Joker. Only on third viewing did I hear the sound of Banes mask being sliced by the gauntlet blades. Go me, etc

Seriosly, though, the scope of this film, once you;ve got used to the new faces and they're no longer new faces, and the soundtrack, with the Deshi Deshi Bashra Bashra chant being all over the film, as a symbolic memory for Bane's despair in the prison he couldn't escape, symbolising inspiration and triumph for Bruce and as rhythmic drum version of the chant symbolising the struggle/climb against Bane, pretty fucking stirring stuff.

Could go on, wont. Except to say:

In pure filmmaking terms, TDKR soars above every other blockbuster this year, for the story it tells and in it's confidence as a film (that it is a film that will work better once you know who the new characters are and how they fit into the overall scheme of things) is Nolan's great achievement, Bruce Wayne's need to be Batman to survive, and ultimately his need to be free of Batman to actually live is masterfully realised, with an unambiguously happy ending that will only frustrate people who want to see heroes make the ultimate sacrifice, changing nothing on the process and don't really understand the story Nolan announced in BB, developed in TDK and brought to fruiting in TDKR: the creation of an everlasting symbol to inspire good, not merely the putting on of a costume to hunt down criminals and beat the crime out of them

How does Batman survive the explosion? It doesn't really matter, but he could have simply released the cable, dropping the bomb into the water, 'dampening' the explosion enough to make it possible (because his armoured military craft was flying hundred of miles per hour, away from the explosion)'The Bat' would not be blown up as onlookers assumed. Or, given the point of flagging up the auto pilot had been repaired before the first fight with Bane,, he could even have baled out before the bat headed out to sea (using the explosion he caused as cover.

Theatricality and deception, powerful agents, and all that...

< Message edited by jobloffski -- 11/12/2012 3:53:38 AM >

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Yes, dreamers dream and doers do. But if dreamers DON'T dream, doers don't have anything TO do. Everything that is only here because people exist, only exists because someone thought of it., or in other words, dreamed it.

(in reply to rich)

Post #: 12090