Hillsborough panel publishes report. (Full Version)

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steffols -> Hillsborough panel publishes report. (12/9/2012 1:23:24 PM)

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-merseyside-19543964

I think we've all known for years that something was covered up and finally the families of the victims and the people of Liverpool have finally had a formal apology from the Government after 23 years of being blamed for the disaster.

Some of what has been revealed has repulsed me. After no alcohol was found in the victims, the police pulled them up on the database to find criminal records and blood alcohol tests were done on everyone, including children and teenagers in order to implicate them. Not to mention 164 altered statements. Absolutely disgusting behaviour and maybe, hopefully sometime in the near future we will see criminal charges brought and someone being held accountable for this terrible tragedy.




Fluke Skywalker -> RE: Hillsborough panel publishes report. (12/9/2012 2:41:28 PM)

The Scum's finest moment




pocketrocket -> RE: Hillsborough panel publishes report. (12/9/2012 2:53:16 PM)

I hope a new inquest comes now.

JFT 96




Nexus Wookie -> RE: Hillsborough panel publishes report. (12/9/2012 2:57:39 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Fluke Skywalker

The Scum's finest moment


I know. I wonder what they have to say on this? Its best if they keep their trap shut.





Fluke Skywalker -> RE: Hillsborough panel publishes report. (12/9/2012 3:00:53 PM)

I bet that utter c**t Kelvin MacKenzie is keeping his head down




pocketrocket -> RE: Hillsborough panel publishes report. (12/9/2012 3:13:00 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Fluke Skywalker

I bet that utter c**t Kelvin MacKenzie is keeping his head down


I believe he's just released a statement offering a 'profuse apology'.

Three words

TOO FUCKING LATE




Harry Tuttle -> RE: Hillsborough panel publishes report. (12/9/2012 3:15:03 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Fluke Skywalker

I bet that utter cunt K****n M*******e is keeping his head down


Fixed.




horribleives -> RE: Hillsborough panel publishes report. (12/9/2012 3:38:24 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Nexus Wookie


quote:

ORIGINAL: Fluke Skywalker

The Scum's finest moment


I know. I wonder what they have to say on this? Its best if they keep their trap shut.




They tend to distance themselves from the shameful way it was reported at the time and are generally supportive of the campaign. This is probably the closest that paper will ever get to humility though safeguarding their readership in line with overwhelming public opinion may also have something to do with it.
What still really pisses me off is when I hear fans of other clubs blaming the Liverpool supporters, bringing their own blinkered prejudices into a debate in which personal allegiances are totally irrelevent. Over the past 23 years I've grown to expect that from football-hating tories and right-wing commentators but it saddens me deeply to hear such uninformed rubbish from supposed fellow fans. all of whom could have just as easily found themselves in the same horrific situation had their own club been playing in the semi final that day. Though it's worth remembering I'm talking about people on the internet with the least to say and the loudest voices here, most of whom never went to a game in the '80s and haven't a fucking clue what it was like to be penned in and treated like animals.
Anyway, hopefully the publication of this report will finally make these fuckwits realise that subscribing to that ignorant viewpoinbt instanty forfeits your right to call yourself a football fan.




pocketrocket -> RE: Hillsborough panel publishes report. (12/9/2012 3:48:21 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: horribleives
What still really pisses me off is when I hear some fans of other clubs blaming the Liverpool supporters, bringing their own blinkered prejudices into a debate in which personal allegiances are totally irrelevent. Over the past 23 years I've grown to expect that from football-hating tories and right-wing commentators but it saddens me deeply to hear such uninformed rubbish from some supposed fellow fans. all of whom could have just as easily found themselves in the same horrific situation had their own club been playing in the semi final that day.


Fixed but in general spot on. This isn't about football tribalism, it's about basic human dignity and the right to be treated fairly and with respect.




superdan -> RE: Hillsborough panel publishes report. (12/9/2012 3:58:42 PM)

It's pretty unbelievable really. I mean, most people pretty much knew the South Yorkshire police were trying to cover their arses, but the extent of it is horrifying and shows why it's been so hard for the families to break the resistance to get justice for what happened. Changing 116 statements, taking blood from dead kids for alcohol tests... it's ghastly. It seems inconceivable to me that criminal proceedings won't be brought forward at some stage.




Nexus Wookie -> RE: Hillsborough panel publishes report. (12/9/2012 4:06:04 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: horribleives

quote:

ORIGINAL: Nexus Wookie


quote:

ORIGINAL: Fluke Skywalker

The Scum's finest moment


I know. I wonder what they have to say on this? Its best if they keep their trap shut.




They tend to distance themselves from the shameful way it was reported at the time and are generally supportive of the campaign. This is probably the closest that paper will ever get to humility though safeguarding their readership in line with overwhelming public opinion may also have something to do with it.
What still really pisses me off is when I hear fans of other clubs blaming the Liverpool supporters, bringing their own blinkered prejudices into a debate in which personal allegiances are totally irrelevent. Over the past 23 years I've grown to expect that from football-hating tories and right-wing commentators but it saddens me deeply to hear such uninformed rubbish from supposed fellow fans. all of whom could have just as easily found themselves in the same horrific situation had their own club been playing in the semi final that day. Though it's worth remembering I'm talking about people on the internet with the least to say and the loudest voices here, most of whom never went to a game in the '80s and haven't a fucking clue what it was like to be penned in and treated like animals.
Anyway, hopefully the publication of this report will finally make these fuckwits realise that subscribing to that ignorant viewpoinbt instanty forfeits your right to call yourself a football fan.


THIS.

I'm a United fan, and i'm really chuffed to see United websites like RedCafe.net and Man Utd Talk and the majority of their members showing their respect and condolences to all those that lost their lives on that tragic day. Its only uninformed fuckwits with no moral compass or brain who sprout vile things about the disaster. And you find them in almost every club. Although thats nothing compared to the idiot's like McKenzie and The Scum who are partly, if not wholly responsible for all the idiots who sprout crap about Hillsborough.

R.I.P to the 96




Fluke Skywalker -> RE: Hillsborough panel publishes report. (12/9/2012 4:09:25 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: pocketrocket

quote:

ORIGINAL: Fluke Skywalker

I bet that utter c**t Kelvin MacKenzie is keeping his head down


I believe he's just released a statement offering a 'profuse apology'.

Three words

TOO FUCKING LATE


Fucking scumbag - it was his idea to label the headline ' The Truth' without actually verifying any of it.




horribleives -> RE: Hillsborough panel publishes report. (12/9/2012 4:21:29 PM)

I'd dearly love the truth to come out about Thatcher's role in exonerating the police at any cost. It's just a shame she's probably too senile to squirm.




Cruisecontroller -> RE: Hillsborough panel publishes report. (12/9/2012 4:43:46 PM)

All the genuiunly guilty who tried to frame the innocent victims of this awful diaster to cover there backs where they let them down should all be jailed sorry isn`t good enough and that includes thoe responsible for that article in The Sun. They should be struck off as journalists. [:@]




Rinc -> RE: Hillsborough panel publishes report. (12/9/2012 7:08:23 PM)

I've long been convinced the police and the stadium were to blame. However, even I didn't expect the scale of lies and the cover up.

Mackenzie can go fuck himself. What I also find galling is that people like David Cameron and the current bosses at South Yorkshire Police are having to apologise when they had nothing to do with it. I know they have to apologise and it's nice to get official apologies, but they weren't the ones who tried to cover it up.

JFT96




Keyser Sozzled -> RE: Hillsborough panel publishes report. (12/9/2012 8:17:59 PM)

I was actually impressed with Cameron's apology. It felt genuine as did his apology re Bloody Sunday. He is apologising from the office of PM, that's the best thing he can do.

And just to agree above, Kelvin MacKenzie can go fuck himself with a large stick.




elab49 -> RE: Hillsborough panel publishes report. (12/9/2012 8:28:36 PM)

I may be wrong, but I got the impression that the two main decision makers in South Yorkshire Police had died? It was something I read last time Jimmy McGovern's Hillsborough was on.




Super Hans -> RE: Hillsborough panel publishes report. (12/9/2012 9:23:16 PM)

Just been reading the BBC report - absolutely terrible. Didn't know enough about the Hillsborough disaster to really know about the cover ups that happened - really disgusting. And yes, another reason to hate The Sun, as if it was needed.

I'm glad the victims and their families have finally seen the truth aired in full - I hope true justice follows.




steffols -> RE: Hillsborough panel publishes report. (12/9/2012 9:51:45 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: elab49

I may be wrong, but I got the impression that the two main decision makers in South Yorkshire Police had died? It was something I read last time Jimmy McGovern's Hillsborough was on.


I think the one person everyone would like to see go down is Duckenfield, who outright lied about the fans rushing the gates when in fact he opened them. That one decision was probably the death knell in the whole disaster. Is he dead now?

Also, whos taking guesses at The Suns frontpage tomorrow? I can't see how they will be able to ignore it, its a huge story. I was really impressed with Cameron and his apology earlier but then he started skirting round the issue of a full apology from The Sun and it stunk of trying to keep them sweet. So he's still playing that game.

EDIT

The Suns front page tomorrow.

[image]http://i.imgur.com/XEBih.jpg[/image]




elab49 -> RE: Hillsborough panel publishes report. (12/9/2012 9:54:27 PM)

The Mirror have apparently gone for 'The Truth'.




Fluke Skywalker -> RE: Hillsborough panel publishes report. (12/9/2012 9:55:41 PM)

Thatcher was surely aware of the cover up? Is this going to be looked at




steffols -> RE: Hillsborough panel publishes report. (12/9/2012 10:08:39 PM)

I would like to know why the Ambulance Service have been held accountable. As far as I've read, the ambulances were stopped from getting onto the pitch by the police and were told that the fans were fighting. One ambulance managed to get on the pitch with only one paramedic on the scene because of what the police told them. Why are they to blame?




jonson -> RE: Hillsborough panel publishes report. (13/9/2012 7:40:27 AM)

What a shocking set of lies. We all knew there was more to it than this. I suspected it was a catalogue of errors along the way, one bad decision led to another, led to another and then too late.
I'm not sure what could have been done to prevent this, but the scale of the cover up and the finger being pointed in other direction is shocking.
I won't tar all of the current Sun reporters with the same brush, more specifcally Mackenzie and the journalists at the time, they'll be hanging their heads in shame (or will they??)

quote:

ORIGINAL: horribleives

Though it's worth remembering I'm talking about people on the internet with the least to say and the loudest voices here, most of whom never went to a game in the '80s and haven't a fucking clue what it was like to be penned in and treated like animals.


To be fair, and I'm not trying starting an argument here, but I stood in Kop ends for most of the 80's, and I'd say there were far more than their fair share of "animals". I've been crushed, trod on, pissed on and elbowed nearly unconscious by 80's "football" hooligans, non-fans who didn't give a shit about the football or the supporters. Even the stewards used to tell us we were taking "our lives in our own hands" queueing up for Leicester's Kop 2 (or 3 depending on the size of the away following)
Multiply that by about 10 and you have the scale of the problem on that tragic day.




pocketrocket -> RE: Hillsborough panel publishes report. (13/9/2012 9:00:41 AM)

Jonson, I'm also not wishing to argue as the truth is out there for all to read for themselves in the HIP report which I've linked here: http://hillsborough.independent.gov.uk/

Hillsborough was a catalogue of errors pre, during and post the disaster. It was more than just volume of fans, which I am (may be incorrectly) getting from your post.

As i said I'm not looking to stir up argument, there's been too much of that.

If anyone hasn't read this, please do. I was in bits after reading it. http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/hillsborough-documents-released-brian-reade-1318730




boaby -> RE: Hillsborough panel publishes report. (13/9/2012 9:51:19 AM)

Errors?

Generous in the extreme.

Errors by some, yes. Seems that there were many more deliberate and criminal acts in the hope of self-preservation, self-aggrandisement and both political and financial gain.

Add on top of that willingness of the police and the government to let it stand for this long, not to mention in the first place.

Seems to me that we cannot ever rely on our systems of governance doing what's right when there's slightest hint that corruption or ineptitude or wanton c*ntishness might be exposed.

Won't change. Hasn't yet.




Hobbitonlass -> RE: Hillsborough panel publishes report. (13/9/2012 9:54:36 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: pocketrocket

If anyone hasn't read this, please do. I was in bits after reading it. http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/hillsborough-documents-released-brian-reade-1318730

[:(] Heartbreaking!  I can see exactly what I was doing when news of this came through.  I was putting together an essay for a degree I was doing and sat at the living room table trying to write it and listening to the match on the radio. 

Astounded (but shouldn't be that surprised) at the scale of the cover up and glad that it has finally come to light and hope that the families can get some comfort that everyone now knows what really happened.  Words can't describe what I feel about those who lied........  The Scum should now disappear off the face of the planet.




pocketrocket -> RE: Hillsborough panel publishes report. (13/9/2012 10:13:20 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: boaby

Errors?

Generous in the extreme.

Errors by some, yes. Seems that there were many more deliberate and criminal acts in the hope of self-preservation, self-aggrandisement and both political and financial gain.

Add on top of that willingness of the police and the government to let it stand for this long, not to mention in the first place.

Seems to me that we cannot ever rely on our systems of governance doing what's right when there's slightest hint that corruption or ineptitude or wanton c*ntishness might be exposed.

Won't change. Hasn't yet.


Agreed.



quote:

ORIGINAL: Hobbitonlass

Heartbreaking! I can see exactly what I was doing when news of this came through. I was putting together an essay for a degree I was doing and sat at the living room table trying to write it and listening to the match on the radio.


I was 15 and playing football with my brother outside and my Dad called us in to see the news on TV, I was devastated. I am glad now that the whole country can see the truth and the hideous lies and cover up that the families of the 96, survivors, families of survivors who have since taken their lives, Liverpool City, Merseyside, LFC and Liverpool fans have had to endure in the last 23 years.

Justice is now required.




Harry Tuttle -> RE: Hillsborough panel publishes report. (13/9/2012 10:23:05 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: pocketrocket


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hobbitonlass

Heartbreaking! I can see exactly what I was doing when news of this came through. I was putting together an essay for a degree I was doing and sat at the living room table trying to write it and listening to the match on the radio.


I was 15 and playing football with my brother outside and my Dad called us in to see the news on TV, I was devastated. I am glad now that the whole country can see the truth and the hideous lies and cover up that the families of the 96, survivors, families of survivors who have since taken their lives, Liverpool City, Merseyside, LFC and Liverpool fans have had to endure in the last 23 years.

Justice is now required.



I was 11. I remember the report coming on the news and looking back at my dad, who's brother was there, who was totally ashen faced. Within a couple of minutes they showed a picture of my uncle being treated on the pitch by St John's Ambulance. I remember the mad rush then of my mum and dad trying to find someone to watch me and my sisters so that they could go to Sheffield to find him.

My uncle's life was ruined that day, I hope he gets some closure out of this and manages to start piecing his life back together. It's doubtful though, 23 years is a horrifically long time to have to wait for the the truth and vindication.




Hobbitonlass -> RE: Hillsborough panel publishes report. (13/9/2012 10:50:51 AM)

[sm=sad.gif] Harry.  What a horrible way for your family to find out as well.

Hope that your Uncle can get some sort of closure but I guess living that long knowing the lies that have been told and suffering because of it will be hard for him to let go (as with all of the survivors).  Tragic situation..




Fluke Skywalker -> RE: Hillsborough panel publishes report. (13/9/2012 1:27:23 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Harry Tuttle


quote:

ORIGINAL: pocketrocket


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hobbitonlass

Heartbreaking! I can see exactly what I was doing when news of this came through. I was putting together an essay for a degree I was doing and sat at the living room table trying to write it and listening to the match on the radio.


I was 15 and playing football with my brother outside and my Dad called us in to see the news on TV, I was devastated. I am glad now that the whole country can see the truth and the hideous lies and cover up that the families of the 96, survivors, families of survivors who have since taken their lives, Liverpool City, Merseyside, LFC and Liverpool fans have had to endure in the last 23 years.

Justice is now required.



I was 11. I remember the report coming on the news and looking back at my dad, who's brother was there, who was totally ashen faced. Within a couple of minutes they showed a picture of my uncle being treated on the pitch by St John's Ambulance. I remember the mad rush then of my mum and dad trying to find someone to watch me and my sisters so that they could go to Sheffield to find him.

My uncle's life was ruined that day, I hope he gets some closure out of this and manages to start piecing his life back together. It's doubtful though, 23 years is a horrifically long time to have to wait for the the truth and vindication.


I don't know what to say this is just horrendous - sorry to hear this Harry and glad your uncle made it out alive.




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