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Empire Admin -> The Bourne Legacy (10/8/2012 11:58:05 AM)

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AxlReznor -> RE: (10/8/2012 12:15:13 PM)

I was skeptical the moment they announced a Bourne movie without Bourne in it. The trailers did look pretty damn good, though. And for the first time since the original, the movie had a title that meant something (there was no supremacy in The Bourne Supremacy, and no ultimatum in The Bourne Ultimatum).
I'm back to being skeptical now, though. Hopefully I'll enjoy the film more than the reviewers seem to have.




Harry Tuttle -> RE: 2 stars? As good as Step Up 4?? (10/8/2012 12:34:14 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: walterwhite52

This review does not surprise me at all; Empire's reviews have continuously missed the mark for a while a now, they gave the Dark Knight Rises 5 stars but upon reading the review they struggled to find praise in a movie that was a mess and did nothing but ruin an entire trilogy! Prometheus was at least a 4 star movie and got 3!
Ive almost stopped reading Empire reviews because of this and ive been reading for ove ten years! il be going to see this with an open mind as usual and then il re read this review, sort it out Empire!


Yeah Empire, sort it out and tailor your reviews to match walterwhite52's opinions damnit.




waltham1979 -> RE: 2 stars? As good as Step Up 4?? (10/8/2012 12:37:24 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Harry Tuttle


quote:

ORIGINAL: walterwhite52

This review does not surprise me at all; Empire's reviews have continuously missed the mark for a while a now, they gave the Dark Knight Rises 5 stars but upon reading the review they struggled to find praise in a movie that was a mess and did nothing but ruin an entire trilogy! Prometheus was at least a 4 star movie and got 3!
Ive almost stopped reading Empire reviews because of this and ive been reading for ove ten years! il be going to see this with an open mind as usual and then il re read this review, sort it out Empire!


Yeah Empire, sort it out and tailor your reviews to match walterwhite52's opinions damnit.


[sm=happy07.gif]




AxlReznor -> RE: 2 stars? As good as Step Up 4?? (10/8/2012 12:40:34 PM)

In response to the title of your reply, I have to point out that if you bothered to read the thread entitled "Please Read Before Posting" before posting, you'd have seen this...

quote:

The star rating system, as has been continually and repeatedly said, is not comparative. If a film gets 3 stars, then it achieved 3/5 of its potential. Not all 3 star films are going to be absolutely equal because, well, that would be silly. There are thousands of films, and only 5 stars: film quality will vary wildly within each star rating.


Pretty simple, and obvious to anyone with a hint of common sense. It's actually a shame that it has to be repeatedly stated.




BelfastBoy -> RE: Close to giving up (10/8/2012 1:16:16 PM)

Wow Ian Nathan, don't hold back now, tell us what you really think of the film!

Verdict not really surprising though. Although the Damon films had pretty meaningless titles, they at least had Jason Bourne in them! To me it was a clear case of the studio missing the point about the franchise's biggest assets (Damon, Greengrass), but trying to carry on regardless. But then without the tenuous connection to the earlier films, Legacy would just be a generic spy thriller.




Super Hans -> RE: Close to giving up (10/8/2012 1:36:18 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: DPHC1

I've been reading Empire for over 20 years now. My brother bought me the first edition in July 1989 and I've bought every copy since November 1990. However I'm close to giving up on the quality of the reviews. I've found over the last couple of years that almost every time Empire does large articles covering the making of a films due to be released later that year, when the films comes out the reviews trash the films. I was shocked to see Dark Knight got five stars. I was expecting it to get three at the most. Not because of the quality of the film but because of the amount of coverage Empire gave it during its making. Look how much coverage the magazine gave Prometheus, then when the film comes out it only gets three stars. The more coverage Empire gives a film while it's being filmed.

I think Empire giving the film two stars means I want to see the film more than if they'd given it five.




You are aware that it's possible that a film can be highly anticipated but disappointing upon delivery (TO SOME, I should add), aren't you?  This could explain the strange turn of events you describe regarding Prometheus.




AxlReznor -> RE: Close to giving up (10/8/2012 1:41:07 PM)

Empire gives most coverage to the movies that most people want to read about. Another point that I thought would be pretty obvious. It's not their fault if when they're eventually finished, they're disappointed by them. I actually thought Prometheus was brilliant and one of the highlights of the year, but I'm not going to begrudge someone else thinking differently, unless they've made it clear they didn't actually pay attention when watching.




chris kilby -> RE: 2 stars? As good as Step Up 4?? (10/8/2012 1:45:01 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Harry Tuttle


quote:

ORIGINAL: walterwhite52

This review does not surprise me at all; Empire's reviews have continuously missed the mark for a while a now, they gave the Dark Knight Rises 5 stars but upon reading the review they struggled to find praise in a movie that was a mess and did nothing but ruin an entire trilogy! Prometheus was at least a 4 star movie and got 3!
Ive almost stopped reading Empire reviews because of this and ive been reading for ove ten years! il be going to see this with an open mind as usual and then il re read this review, sort it out Empire!


Yeah Empire, sort it out and tailor your reviews to match walterwhite52's opinions damnit.


Don't understand why people get all het up about reviews - especially reviews of movies they haven't even seen yet. They're just opinions and we all know what they're like - no, not fanboys... Close, though. Real close.

I'm still going to see this. I might like it. I might not. But I'm a big (fan)boy now and am perfectly capable of making my own mind up without being swayed by anyone else. And I've been reading EMPIRE since Issue #2 - it had Batman on the cover! Four stars, if I remember right. Which seems a bit generous in retrospect. Isn't 20/20 hindsight wonderful?

Yup, more than twenty years now (ULP!) and I haven't ever been tempted to cancel my subscription once. (If I had a subscription!) Not even when it gave Brazil 2 stars. 2 measly stars! Or the late Tom Hibbert said 007 had a "licence to bore," and gave Star Wars (yes, Star Wars) a begrudging - wait for it - 3 stars! I know - hard to believe, isn't it? Them were the days. At least EMPIRE had the balls to be embarrassed about the Brazil SNAFU years later when it published its first ever Top 100...




chris kilby -> RE: Close to giving up (10/8/2012 1:58:03 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: DPHC1

I've been reading Empire for over 20 years now. My brother bought me the first edition in July 1989 and I've bought every copy since November 1990. However I'm close to giving up on the quality of the reviews. I've found over the last couple of years that almost every time Empire does large articles covering the making of a films due to be released later that year, when the films comes out the reviews trash the films. I was shocked to see Dark Knight got five stars. I was expecting it to get three at the most. Not because of the quality of the film but because of the amount of coverage Empire gave it during its making. Look how much coverage the magazine gave Prometheus, then when the film comes out it only gets three stars. The more coverage Empire gives a film while it's being filmed.

I think Empire giving the film two stars means I want to see the film more than if they'd given it five.




Bye, then. Don't let the door hit on the ass on your way out.

(Personally I think it behoves EMPIRE that it doesn't let access/coverage cloud its judgement one way or t'other. Surely the more access EMPIRE gets the more you'd expect it to give the movie in question a free ride? So your point makes no sense. I used to get a bit suspicious if a movie got a high rating when there were a lot of related freebies being given away as competition prizes. I still value my Casino Royale DVD, BTW, bought and paid for with the HMV voucher I got for getting a letter printed years ago!)




chris kilby -> RE: Close to giving up (10/8/2012 2:06:29 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: AxlReznor

Empire gives most coverage to the movies that most people want to read about. Another point that I thought would be pretty obvious. It's not their fault if when they're eventually finished, they're disappointed by them. I actually thought Prometheus was brilliant and one of the highlights of the year, but I'm not going to begrudge someone else thinking differently, unless they've made it clear they didn't actually pay attention when watching.


Couldn't agree more.




Hank_Scorpio -> RE: Close to giving up (10/8/2012 2:13:36 PM)

quote:

It’s the crazy “headache” subplot from The Bourne Identity Greengrass sensibly jettisoned.


I thought Greengrass only came onboard for the Bourne Supremacy? The Bourne Identity was Doug Liman.




sowasred2012 -> RE: Close to giving up (10/8/2012 2:18:35 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hank_Scorpio

quote:

It’s the crazy “headache” subplot from The Bourne Identity Greengrass sensibly jettisoned.


I thought Greengrass only came onboard for the Bourne Supremacy? The Bourne Identity was Doug Liman.


Ultimatum and Supremacy were both Greengrass, and neither make a reference to the headaches Clive Owen's character mentions in Identity - I think that's what Ian was getting at with that comment.




Hank_Scorpio -> RE: Close to giving up (10/8/2012 2:24:00 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: sowasred2012

Ultimatum and Supremacy were both Greengrass, and neither make a reference to the headaches Clive Owen's character mentions in Identity - I think that's what Ian was getting at with that comment.


Gotcha, thanks for clearing that up!




AxlReznor -> RE: Close to giving up (10/8/2012 2:29:04 PM)

It could be argued then, that this clears up some shortcomings of the previous two movies by finally giving some answers to what we were led to believe would be a major plot point and was subsequently ignored.

Not that I'm defending the film myself. Haven't seen it yet, and probably won't until Lovefilm streams it or it's shown on TV.




waltham1979 -> RE: Close to giving up (10/8/2012 2:33:00 PM)

So because this film got 2 out of 5...does that mean it is exactly the same film as Transformers: Revenge of the Fallen?!

I'll give the review itself 4 out of 5; and even though I haven't seen the film I am going to rate it about 3 out of 5 because I want it to be better than Transformers 2, but not as good as Indiana Jones: Kingdom of the Crystal Skull. Additionally if anyone disagrees with me I am going to call you 'fan-boy cunts' and cancel my subscription to Empire, not before I throw my issue away at home that had Jeremy Renner on because I cannot believe you were looking forward to a film that ended up shit. You utter utter bastards with your own opinions, principles and editorial integrity...

Thought I'd join in the theme of the thread before I head on back over to The Dark Knight Rises one [:D]

Ps: chris kilby you are a fucking legend. I salute you sir!!!

Peace out.




Wild about Wilder -> RE: Close to giving up (10/8/2012 3:38:46 PM)

Kermode bloged that as an action flick it was fine yet compaired to the others it left him a bit cold (not interlectual enough for "The Old Fart"!) [;)]
Guess I'll find out for myself next week?




UTB -> RE: Close to giving up (10/8/2012 3:39:38 PM)

Is Rgirvan on holiday or something?




Whistler -> RE: Close to giving up (10/8/2012 3:44:08 PM)

This is disappointing. I was never really on board with a fourth Bourne, but as it drew closer I began to warm to the idea; the cast was good, the story seemed solid, and the trailers looked promising. Of course, I never really imagined it would reach the heights of the original trilogy, but I'd hoped for more than this. Regardless, I'll check it out soon...




Rgirvan44 -> RE: Close to giving up (10/8/2012 3:51:39 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: UTB

Is Rgirvan on holiday or something?


I am wondering how many people angry at this are huge Marvel fans. Would like to see some stats comparing the two.

Where were all these Renner fans when 28 Weeks Later was getting a kicking!




dseys -> Empire wrote "SUMMER'S SMARTEST SEQUEL"... (10/8/2012 7:10:37 PM)

The problem isn't the amount of coverage, but the way this coverage is done.

I can read on the cover of issue n°278: "Hawkeye goes hardcore in SUMMER'S SMARTEST SEQUEL".

And one month later, you give the film a 2-star rating. LESS than "This Means War" which was the worst and most stupid (even if you said it was "smart", the only thing it surely wasn't) 3-star movie of the year.

That being said, i'm a HUGE fan of Empire and will continue to buy it - not for the reviews, but for the coverage and all the incredible stuff you're offering!




AxlReznor -> RE: Empire wrote "SUMMER'S SMARTEST SEQUEL"... (10/8/2012 7:12:36 PM)

I'm pretty sure "THE BOURNE LEGACY! IT MIGHT BE ALRIGHT... MAYBE!" wouldn't have gone over so well.[;)]




drews -> RE: Greengrass?? (10/8/2012 7:33:25 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: J_BUltimatum

Why haven't you mentioned Doug Liman in your sum up, who directed the best film in the original series??



True dat. Bourne Identity is the DOGS!!




chris kilby -> RE: Ha! (10/8/2012 8:27:34 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: gusbuster

I liked this review. It's well written and it made me smile. Plus it did it's job perfectly well. Surely most of just want to know whether the Bourne Legacy is a worthwhile addition to the original Bourne films? Answer: obviously not.
As for Empire's reviews in general - the quality of a review isn't measured by how much it matches your own opinion or expectations.
Personally I enjoy anticipating new films. I get excited about the casting news and the photos from set and the first trailer - just like I imagine everyone else here does. I enjoy reading Empire because they share my excitement and optimism in these things. When a film finally comes out and turns out to be a dud, there's no point blaming Empire for reviewing it honestly, or for being excited about it before release.


Absolutely goddamn right! I don't agree with a word Peter Biskind or Mark Kermode (mostly) say, but I still enjoy their books. Who wants to read (or talk to) only people they agree with all the time? Weird.




chris kilby -> RE: Close to giving up (10/8/2012 8:33:02 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: waltham1979

So because this film got 2 out of 5...does that mean it is exactly the same film as Transformers: Revenge of the Fallen?!

I'll give the review itself 4 out of 5; and even though I haven't seen the film I am going to rate it about 3 out of 5 because I want it to be better than Transformers 2, but not as good as Indiana Jones: Kingdom of the Crystal Skull. Additionally if anyone disagrees with me I am going to call you 'fan-boy cunts' and cancel my subscription to Empire, not before I throw my issue away at home that had Jeremy Renner on because I cannot believe you were looking forward to a film that ended up shit. You utter utter bastards with your own opinions, principles and editorial integrity...

Thought I'd join in the theme of the thread before I head on back over to The Dark Knight Rises one [:D]

Ps: chris kilby you are a fucking legend. I salute you sir!!!

Peace out.



I thought you had to be dead to be a legend? Uh-oh... Do you know something I don't? Why? What have you heard? Did my results come back? It's bad, isn't it...?

(A bell end, mair like! [:D] )




cerebusboy -> RE: 2 stars? As good as Step Up 4?? (11/8/2012 7:34:40 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: walterwhite52

This review does not surprise me at all; Empire's reviews have continuously missed the mark for a while a now, they gave the Dark Knight Rises 5 stars but upon reading the review they struggled to find praise in a movie that was a mess and did nothing but ruin an entire trilogy! Prometheus was at least a 4 star movie and got 3!
Ive almost stopped reading Empire reviews because of this and ive been reading for ove ten years! il be going to see this with an open mind as usual and then il re read this review, sort it out Empire!


"spectacle in abundance" "superhero filmmaking on an unprecedented scale" etc

All the Bourne fans I've spoken too thought going the quasi-superhero route (with the pills) was a mistake. They should reboot the franchise in a more realistic direction [;)]




cerebusboy -> RE: Ha! (11/8/2012 7:36:29 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: chris kilby


quote:

ORIGINAL: gusbuster

I liked this review. It's well written and it made me smile. Plus it did it's job perfectly well. Surely most of just want to know whether the Bourne Legacy is a worthwhile addition to the original Bourne films? Answer: obviously not.
As for Empire's reviews in general - the quality of a review isn't measured by how much it matches your own opinion or expectations.
Personally I enjoy anticipating new films. I get excited about the casting news and the photos from set and the first trailer - just like I imagine everyone else here does. I enjoy reading Empire because they share my excitement and optimism in these things. When a film finally comes out and turns out to be a dud, there's no point blaming Empire for reviewing it honestly, or for being excited about it before release.


Absolutely goddamn right! I don't agree with a word Peter Biskind or Mark Kermode (mostly) say, but I still enjoy their books. Who wants to read (or talk to) only people they agree with all the time? Weird.



Well said. Ian Nathan is probably still the best writer Empire have had. Even if he's eviscerating a movie I love, there will always be brilliant turns of phrase (I don't tend to remember film reviews - who does? - but Nathan's pieces on Tree of Life and Super 8 were superb)




cerebusboy -> RE: Close to giving up (11/8/2012 8:40:41 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: chris kilby


quote:

ORIGINAL: waltham1979

So because this film got 2 out of 5...does that mean it is exactly the same film as Transformers: Revenge of the Fallen?!

I'll give the review itself 4 out of 5; and even though I haven't seen the film I am going to rate it about 3 out of 5 because I want it to be better than Transformers 2, but not as good as Indiana Jones: Kingdom of the Crystal Skull. Additionally if anyone disagrees with me I am going to call you 'fan-boy cunts' and cancel my subscription to Empire, not before I throw my issue away at home that had Jeremy Renner on because I cannot believe you were looking forward to a film that ended up shit. You utter utter bastards with your own opinions, principles and editorial integrity...

Thought I'd join in the theme of the thread before I head on back over to The Dark Knight Rises one [:D]

Ps: chris kilby you are a fucking legend. I salute you sir!!!

Peace out.



I thought you had to be dead to be a legend? Uh-oh... Do you know something I don't? Why? What have you heard? Did my results come back? It's bad, isn't it...?

(A bell end, mair like! [:D] )



A hero can be anyone....even someone who does something as simple as spend all day on the internet

[;)]




Cool Breeze -> RE: Close to giving up (12/8/2012 11:47:46 AM)

HAWKEYE GOES HARDCORE IN SUMMERS MOST DISAPPOINTING SEQUEL!




MonsterCat -> RE: The Bourne Legacy (13/8/2012 12:34:24 PM)

Even with someone as talented as Jeremy Renner in the lead role, my interest in this film has seriously dwindled.




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