Dredd (2012): Don't Give Up The Day Job (Full Version)

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sauchieboy -> Dredd (2012): Don't Give Up The Day Job (18/1/2012 11:14:35 AM)

 


quote:

furrybastard: (dreddhead123's) script ... sounded forced and ridiculous to me, with no sense of pacing and a tinny ear for dialogue.  Maybe you should spend more time working on your script-writing skills instead of trolling who-knows-how-many forums spewing the same crap under multiple accounts and essentially making stuff up about the production of the film in order to bash Alex Garland and others




Anyone with a macbook seems to be able to get a series in 2000ad and The Hangover 2 could have been written by the same monkey who provided most of that film's laughs; so if I was Scott, I wouldn't give up just yet.

Everyone's free to react to his stuff however they like, but I genuinely think it's entertaining. There's enough positive voices here to act as an effective counterweight to any excessive negativity he expounds and I enjoy reading the whole spectrum of opinion on the new film, not just the ones I agree with.

I wouldn't defend everything Scott says, but I have no problem defending his right to say it.



quote:

Spaldron: I've been saying this all along. Its gotten to the point where I've had to use the block function.


Actually, it got to the point where you were warned by Shool to use the Block button or you'd get the hook.

[irony]Your posts charge Scott with being a fantasist with a distorted view of events.[/irony]






sauchieboy -> Dredd (2012): I Am A 2000ad/Dredd Nut (18/1/2012 11:17:34 AM)

 


quote:

porntrooper: I'm no Dredd/2000AD nut, in fact I've never read a single one, but one thing that does worry (annoy?) me, is that this movie appears to be bringing the scope down somewhat. It's obviously due to budget reasons, but confining the movie to a single block and removing the Mega City 1 surroundings really annoys me. It's one of the things I enjoyed about the Stallone movie, the sets looked pretty good and the feel of the city was pretty good.




Cool name. No-one's delighted about the new film's Lidl version of Megacity One, but I've got to admit that I thought the catastrophic failure of the Stallone movie was the end of Dredd on film. Even if Dredd (2012) tanks, I doubt it could take the character's stock (in the eyes of the world's film financiers) any lower than it already was.

I do think this film's probably the Dredd character's last chance to make the leap from the dying comic industry to the big screen (i), though. Marvel and DC do seem to run their publishing wings as a loss-making R&D department for their more lucrative film businesses.


(i) Unless animated features become a lot cheaper and easier to make very soon.








sauchieboy -> Dredd (2012): Any Given Thirlby (18/1/2012 11:18:35 AM)

 

quote:

furrybastard: Interesting enough interview but light on details. This bit caught my attention...

"One thing I love about Dredd is its really realistic approach, it's a very dark and gritty approach, so my look is much less sexy femme fatale and a little bit more like a football player."

I Presume she means American football player!



Arf! She's certainly got Gordon Strachan's old haircut. That weird supporting structure Dredd's eagle perched upon in Dredd 1.0 was much more like US football padding than the new film's ergonomic armour, though.

I actually think the new uniform looks better on Thirlby's slender frame than on Urban, just as Diane Lane rocked the old film's threads more convincingly than Sly. Maybe the greater contrast between the attenuated frames of the Atkins-starved actresses and the one-size-fits-all armour makes it more like the exaggerated proportions of the comics.

quote:

furrybastard: It is unfortunate we don't get to see more of Mega-City One, it's arguably as big a character as Dredd in the comic and definitely as important. It's a relatively low budget film, unfortunately.



Totally true. In many stories Dredd's just a narrative device who turns up to move the real story along. In the grammar of the strip; Dredd's the capital letter that starts the story off, his investigation punctuates the story like a comma, giving it shape; and when he pops up to blow the perp away with a dry quip, it's the full stop that tells you the story's over. The real subject of the strip is the citizens.









sauchieboy -> Dredd (2012): Say Goodbye To My Lee'l Friend (18/1/2012 11:22:11 AM)

 

quote:

dreddhead123: If (audiences) wanna see blowjobs and explosions, perhaps Dredd (2012) will take some money, but I reckon most fans will feel let down and view the film as a bitter disappointment



Am I the only person who can't get enough blowjobs and explosions? I'd consider that a decent weekend.

I knew this couldn't last. Until lately, Scott has been on his very best behaviour here: sticking to posting photoshopped images of Karl Urban or his cat, and making asymmetrically qualified statements like 'maybe the film will be great, or maybe it will be a disaster and the children of everyone involved will die horribly as their parents watch on, helpless', represents significant personal progress for him.

I always knew he was only one late night post away from saying something that'd have him either booted off or flouncing away in the huff, because I've seen it before. I'll respect the site policy on privacy, but anyone interested in learning why he's written himself a chapter in the history of Dredd fandom can google the word 'Scojo' and do the research for themselves. It's very entertaining.

The one thing you have to admit is that he gets everyone talking. I've made this point a number of times, but this thread (i) lay dormant for months before he started posting regularly. Neither the Empire spread, nor the news of Travis being locked out of the editing suite has provoked the volume of posts we've seen since Scott started plying his trade here in December. What else changed that got you all coming here regularly?

The usual cries of 'fuck off, mongo' that greet Scott wherever he appears have provided the framework for us to have a good laugh, share information, and demonstrate the level of interest in this film (it's rarely been outside the top five of Future Films being discussed and never for very long, at that). Whatever you think of Scott, you can't deny that wasn't the case until he migrated here from IMDB last month (following events and unsubstantiated allegations he detailed on the old thread).

None of you bothered posting overnight, without Scott to wind up and laugh at. Scott's clearly not wired up right, but he's what Lenin referred to as a useful idiot. If he's really gone, I worry this thread's going to fall into the same state of neglect as its predecessor.

I suppose that's up to you lot now.



(i) Well, the previous Dredd thread







Spaldron -> RE: Dredd (2012) (18/1/2012 12:03:54 PM)

Thread title changed back. [:)]




sauchieboy -> The Thread Title Never Changed (18/1/2012 2:00:42 PM)

 


The title of an individual post is different from the thread title.








shool -> RE: Dredd (2012) (18/1/2012 2:04:28 PM)

Out of interest Sauchie. Why do you change the subject of every post?

The reason why some posters dont like it is that if you are just looking at alist of recent posts like alot use in the "My Subscripton" section its hard to see which thread it is from.




MonsterCat -> RE: Dredd (18/1/2012 2:09:43 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: sauchieboy

The title of an individual post is different from the thread title.



It makes it harder to spot a thread on the forum's main page when you're constantly changing the subject header. : )

Also - it really winds up anally retentive assholes like me.






sauchieboy -> Dredd (2012): What, even if it's preceded by 'Dredd (2012):' ? (18/1/2012 2:12:15 PM)




What, even if it's preceded by 'Dredd (2012):' ?








MonsterCat -> RE: Dredd (2012) (18/1/2012 2:16:40 PM)

Yes, it annoys me even when it's preceded by Dredd (2012).

What part of anally retentive asshole did you not understand? [:D] I know it's a silly thing to get annoyed about but there you go. That's just me.




danbo1138 -> RE: Dredd (2012) (18/1/2012 4:16:48 PM)

Everyones going stir crazy in here,we need some new pics or trailer before we eat each other alive...




sauchieboy -> Dredd (2012): What part of anally retentive asshole did you not understand? (18/1/2012 5:22:24 PM)




quote:

What part of anally retentive asshole did you not understand? [:D] I know it's a silly thing to get annoyed about but there you go. That's just me.



Arf!








sauchieboy -> Dredd (2012): Think Once, Think Twice, Think Bike (18/1/2012 5:59:24 PM)





quote:

danbo1138: Everyone's going stir crazy in here, we need some new pics or a trailer before we eat each other alive...



Good point, danbo, but unless your name's short for Danielle you don't have to worry about me chowing down on you. Your post did remind me of anal specialist Monstercat's previous plea for sanity, though:


quote:

MonsterCat: Storyboard at bottom of page. Yes, I know it's not amazingly exciting, but someone has to: http://www.movieweb.com/news/dredd-lawmaster-chase-scene-storyboard



... which everyone (including me) rudely †ignored so we could get on with calling each other Trolls. What does everyone make of that scene? It definitely suggests there'll be more of MC1 on display than the single setting talk indicated.

Now I've got over my disappointment that this movie's lawmaster is just a modified street bike (that batpod showed the way to go for anyone with the processing power) I'm trying to content myself with the thought that the film will be cut so fast that the production design won't really be so much of an issue.

How do you think the bike will work in context? (http://www.comicbookmovie.com/fansites/rorschachsrants/news/?a=28507 )

Do you think that scene will work well in 3D? My understanding is that the process is still at the stage of seperating the image into a background and foreground layer. So Dredd on his bike with the city whizzing by in a blur behind him should be an ideal use of 3D, no?









danbo1138 -> RE: Dredd (2012) (18/1/2012 6:02:56 PM)

Danakin Thunderpants esq.




sauchieboy -> Dredd (2012): Showing Off To Myself (18/1/2012 6:21:33 PM)





quote:

shool: Out of interest Sauchie. Why do you change the subject of every post?

The reason why some posters dont like it is that if you are just looking at alist of recent posts like alot use in the "My Subscripton" section its hard to see which thread it is from.



Showing off, shool. Showing off to myself. Maybe I'm a frustrated sub-editor. If anyone else had bothered to explain what the problem was I would have stopped before. I can't decide whether the fact changing the title annoys Spaldron is reason enough to persist, or whether the delight he takes in changing the title back means I should stop immediately.


I'm assuming you mean the 'My Forums' menu under 'My Subscription'. I didn't know about that option, but I checked it out and it still doesn't seem to cause any confusion as to which film is being discussed. There's no other Dredd thread currently running, so the opportunities for confusion are, like Rob Shneider's career options, limited. Severely limited.


Obviously, I don't want to be an arsehole, so if it's a major problem of course I'll stop.








dreddhead123 -> RE: Dredd (2012) (18/1/2012 10:51:55 PM)

Sauchieboy wrote:

quote:

maybe I'm a frustrated sub-editor.


Sauchieboy, I remember being at school and I had this friend called Duncan Clarence Thomson. We abbreviated it to DC Thomson. He loved 2000AD and Judge Dredd. He also loved classical music. His favourite composer was Wagner. I can't remember what happened to DC, but he had an interest in journalism or publishing.




sauchieboy -> Dredd (2012): Very clever, Scott. (19/1/2012 9:36:49 AM)





Very clever, Scott.








furrybastard -> RE: Dredd (2012) (19/1/2012 10:39:58 PM)

Interview with (the real) John Wagner about the Dredd film and the characters creation...

http://herocomplex.latimes.com/2012/01/19/judge-dredd-creator-three-reasons-im-excited-about-new-film/




sauchieboy -> Dredd (2012): Cheers, furrybastard. (20/1/2012 10:26:41 AM)




Cheers, furrybastard.








sauchieboy -> Dredd (2012): Jackanory (21/1/2012 10:34:45 AM)




"When I went up to Shepperton the first thing I told Danny Cannon was that he was filming the wrong script, but I could see he didnít want to know. Theyíd already invested too much in the silly story they had. And anyway, what did I know, I was only a comic writer?". John Wagner, interviewed by W R Logan (i)




Dredd's creator's concerns in adapting his work for the screen are primarily with story, so John Wagner choosing the fact that Dredd (2012)'s script "homes in on the essential job of judging Ė instant justice in a violent future city" (ii) as one of the things that makes him feel optimistic about the new film should come as a relief to everyone.

Wagner's identified the plot as the weakest link of the Stallone film before, saying "the real problem was that they were making the wrong movie. Dredd was never meant to be a dynastic power struggle. Dredd is down on the streets breaking heads and being a bastard" (iii), which sounds a lot like the premise of Dredd (2012) to me.

Wagner's assessment of whether DNA had improved on 1995's late-term abortion of a movie was that Garland and Travis's efforts were "in terms of the plot, the structure of the story ... much more representative of Dredd as he is" (iv). He's seen some working edits of Dredd (2012), but the only other qualitative assessment Wagner's offered of the new film is describing it as "the high-octane version" (v) of his work.

What I find most interesting about Wagner's focus on the story as the most important aspect of adapting Dredd for the screen is that, according to his long-time collaborator Alan Grant, he and Wagner "actually did an outline for the (1995) Dredd movie, but producer Ed Somebody told us we were only worth 20% of the going Hollywood rate, so we told him to fuck off" (vi).

An outline's very different from a full script, but I'd be interested in knowing what form of story Dredd's most experienced writers thought would work with the Stallone film's larger budget.



(i) http://www.2000ad.nu/classof79/jw_interview.htm

(ii) http://herocomplex.latimes.com/2012/01/19/judge-dredd-creator-three-reasons-im-excited-about-new-film/

(iii) http://www.2000ad.nu/classof79/jw_interview.htm

(iv) Wagner, speaking at Dundee Comics Day, November 2011 (http://www.comicbookresources.com/?page=article&id=35243)

(v) Empire[/], September 2011

(vi) Alan Grant, interviewed by Edward Burridge for 2000ad Review (http://www.2000adreview.co.uk/features/interviews/2005/grant/grant1.sh tml)










sauchieboy -> Dredd (2012): A Poor Player, That Struts And Frets His Hour Upon The Stage (21/1/2012 10:36:55 AM)






"I like the actors, theyíre well cast and they handled their parts well. Olivia Thirlby is perfect as Anderson, the young psi judge. She gives the character a touching vulnerability. Karl Urban will not remove his helmet and will not kiss his co-star." (i)




I'm sure Urban and Thirlby will be just fine, and John Wagner's approving words for the cast of Dredd (2012) would be unqualified good news, if it wasn't for his unstinting generosity towards Stallone's performance in Judge Dredd (1995). How can you take anything Wagner says about the on-screen talent at face value when he says things like "I donít think Stallone was a bad Dredd ... (h)e was just Dredd in the wrong story" (ii)?

The man who's written Dredd for thirty-five years has a much better handle on the character than I can ever pretend to, but did anyone really think Sly filled the judge's (platform) boots at all well? The normally gruff and straight-shooting Wagner's got a history of baffling politeness in this regard.

Stallone might have spent most of Judge Dredd (1995) cheesily mugging and stripping to his long underwear, "But letís get one thing straight, there would never have been a movie if it hadnít been for Stallone. Pressman had had the rights for several years before that, heíd have gone on prevaricating if Stallone hadnít agreed to do it, so Iím not going to criticise him" (iii).

If Stallone had prevented the 1995 movie being made, I would have been eternally grateful, and it would have made DNA's job easier too. I suppose Wagner can't afford to say anything too impolitic about anyone whose name can get a film made, at least while there are still options on his other work (iv).†††



(i) http://herocomplex.latimes.com/2012/01/19/judge-dredd-creator-three-reasons-im-excited-about-new-film/

(ii) http://herocomplex.latimes.com/2012/01/19/judge-dredd-creator-three-reasons-im-excited-about-new-film/

(iii) http://www.2000ad.nu/classof79/jw_interview.htm

(iv) Securing funding for a future adaptation of Strontium Dog could be made easier if Stallone agreed to try on Middenface's Scottish brogue and heid lumps; after Get Carter, Sly could have a bash at de-Anglicising another classic UK story in Wagner and Ranson's Button Man; and, after demonstrating his deft comic touch in Stop Or My Mom Will Shoot, surely Stallone's only a convincing Bogart impression away from being the natural pick to star in and direct a Bogie Man film. Some of the preceding paragraph may contain sarcasm.










Marwood -> RE: Dredd (2012) (21/1/2012 10:44:45 AM)

Yeah to be honest I wasn't going to actually pay much attention to Wagner as he's actually been involved in the production on a consultant basis so like anyone else working on the film in any capacity when interviewed he's going to say positive things. Same reason I never really believe actors, directors or producers when they're updating on a film's progress pre-release; "It's going great" well, fuck me that's a surprise I thought you were going to be honest about those script arguments or XXXX storming off the set.

I would say that Wagner's comments are quite muted rather than the usual hype bullshit though so he may well be genuine about what he's saying; although like sauchie says it's only his opinion.




sauchieboy -> Dredd (2012): Arse Latitudes (21/1/2012 11:03:06 AM)






Absolutely, Marwood. I'd never accuse Wagner of being disingenuous, but his comments are equivocal enough to give him some latitude (in the future) to praise exactly those things he does in the article furrybastard was kind enough to link to, while being more forthcoming about the nature of the 'problems' he thought the rough cut of the film showed (i).



It's like complimenting a girl's hair, while neglecting to mention the size of her arse.




(i) Wagner, speaking at Dundee Comics Day, November 2011 (http://www.comicbookresources.com/?page=article&id=35243)










dreddhead123 -> RE: Dredd (21/1/2012 12:02:41 PM)

quote:

Absolutely, Marwood. I'd never accuse Wagner of being disingenuous, but his comments are equivocal enough to give him some latitude (in the future) to praise exactly those things he does in the article furrybastard was kind enough to link to, while being more forthcoming about the nature of the 'problems' he thought the rough cut of the film showed (i).

It's like complimenting a girl's hair, while neglecting to mention the size of her arse.


If Wagner were to post on this thread I'm sure he'd echo much of what Sauchieboy has just written. [:D]

Since mentioning he was going to see the final cut (in November), Mr Wagner hasn't posted on his Facebook page. I'm guessing he no longer posts because Rebellion or DNA don't want him to answer direct questions from fans, such as

"John, you said you've were going to see the final cut in November, have you seen it, and if so, can you tell us more about it?"

If he's seen the final cut (give or take a few last minute changes prior to its release) and he wasn't that excited by it then he's not going to say so, well... not for a while. For what my opinion is worth...I'll make a few predictions...

A) John Wagner does not rate the first or final cut. I reckon he considers the storyline too generic, too unimaginative.

B) He doesn't believe it's a particularly faithful adaptation. He believes DNA's film lacks any social observation or humour.

C) He will remain silent about the final cut of the film until the film is released.

D) He will give a review after the film is out where he will praise DNA Films for making a new Judge Dredd film but he will be slightly negative about elements of the story. How critical he will be will depend on the box office gross of the film. If the film flops then he will be totally open, if the film guarantees a sequel, he will be more guarded in his comments. [;)]

quote:

I suppose Wagner can't afford to say anything too impolitic about anyone whose name can get a film made, at least while there are still options on his other work


Revealing comment, Sauchieboy!

quote:

The man who's written Dredd for thirty-five years has a much better handle on the character than I can ever pretend to,


LOL! Amusing comment, Sauchieboy. I'm sure some people are still fooled by your act. [:'(] Nice to see you still quoting all those old interviews.

quote:

2000ad.nu/classof79/jw_interview.htm

(ii) http://herocomplex.latimes.com/2012/01/19/judge-dredd-creator-three-reasons-im-excited-about-new-film/

(iii) http://www.2000ad.nu/classof79/jw_interview.htm

(iv) Wagner, speaking at Dundee Comics Day, November 2011 (http://www.comicbookresources.com/?page=article&id=35243)

(v) Empire[/], September 2011

(vi) Alan Grant, interviewed by Edward Burridge for 2000ad Review (http://www.2000adreview.co.uk/features/interviews/2005/grant/grant1.sh tml)


I'm amazed a fan has the time and inclination to find all those interviews. I'm sure the real John Wagner* would be grateful for a fan like you. [:D]













*Sauchieboy.







sauchieboy -> Dredd (2012): Ol' Faithful (21/1/2012 12:23:06 PM)






quote:

dreddhead123: A) John Wagner does not rate the first or final cut. I reckon he considers the storyline too generic, too unimaginative.

B) He doesn't believe it's a particularly faithful adaptation. He believes DNA's film lacks any social observation or humour.

C) He will remain silent about the final cut of the film until the film is released.

D) He will give a review after the film is out where he will praise DNA Films for making a new Judge Dredd film but he will be slightly negative about elements of the story. How critical he will be will depend on the box office gross of the film. If the film flops then he will be totally open, if the film guarantees a sequel, he will be more guarded in his comments.




Scott, none of us know Wagner's thoughts on the new film. But, as far as how 'faithful' an adaptation the new film is (and what does 'faithful' mean, exactly?) you have to take the man at his word when he says "Iím very satisfied with the way itís going but itís not going to fulfill everyoneís hopes and Ödreams Ė that would be impossible with so many diverse demands upon it. Letís say that itís a damned good start and my guess is that most fans are going to like it a lot" (i).




(i) http://www.bleedingcool.com/2011/01/19/dredd-creator-john-wagner-visits-dredd-movie/











dreddhead123 -> RE: Dredd (2012) (21/1/2012 12:24:22 PM)

John, how long do you plan to maintain this funny deception?

You're gonna keep this up for eight more months? Man, that's dedication! [:D]




Dirk Miggler -> RE: Dredd (2012) (21/1/2012 12:37:08 PM)

Think I may stay out of this thread until there is some actual news on this film, trailer NOW please DNA !

Feels like Groundhog Day whenever I decide to enter this thread. Dreddhead being the threads equivelant of Ned Ryerson [:D]




dreddhead123 -> RE: Dredd (2012) (21/1/2012 12:43:30 PM)

Sauchieboy is John Wagner and he (more or less) admitted it here on this very thread.

John Wagner used to work for comic publisher DC Thomson:

quote:

DC Thomson is a long established and successful company which has been publishing newspapers and magazines for well over 100 years.

Titles in the newspaper field are The Courier and The Evening Telegraph both daily papers circulating in the Dundee, Angus, Fife and Perth areas and national papers the Sunday Post and the Weekly News. The company also publishes a range of magazines for both adults and children ranging from The People's Friend to The Beano.


In the 1960s Wagner worked for DC Thomson as a sub-editor.

quote:

Wikipedia:

Early career

Wagner started his career as a sub-editor at D. C. Thomson & Co. Ltd in the 1960s, where he met Pat Mills.


Sauchieboy made a sly reference to this in an earlier post:

quote:

Maybe I'm a frustrated sub-editor.


When I mentioned this in my post:

quote:

Sauchieboy, I remember being at school and I had this friend called Duncan Clarence Thomson. We abbreviated it to DC Thomson. He loved 2000AD and Judge Dredd. He also loved classical music. His favourite composer was Wagner. I can't remember what happened to DC, but he had an interest in journalism or publishing.


... Sauchieboy replied with:


quote:

Very clever, Scott.


... which was his admission that he knew what I was going on about. He knew I was referring to his earlier job as sub-editor for DC Thomson. When he said "very clever" he was admitting he's John Wagner. If he were a regular Empire boarder posting here he wouldn't have replied with

"Very clever, Scott"

... because he wouldn't have got the references. Any other fan would have reacted with: "what the ***** is this guy talking about? Who the heck is Duncan Clarence Thomson and what has he got to do with this new Dredd film?"

... but Sauchieboy didn't, he knew what I was going on about and praised me for my deduction! It's reasonable to assume Sauchieboy is a real sub-editor and once worked for DC Thomson. That makes him John Wagner.[:D]

By the way, Empire, I am referring to an earlier quote posted by Sauchieboy on this forum - not on any other forum - so I think this full post should remain and not be edited or removed. [;)]

As Inspector Clouseau would say...

"I gather the facts... and the case is sol....ved!"

[;)]







dreddhead123 -> RE: Dredd (2012) (21/1/2012 1:11:08 PM)

A bit of geeky trivia....

In the first part of Day of Chaos (Prog 1743) - final page, final panel - artist Ben Willsher drew Sov assassin, Nadia, in front of some city blocks. One of the blocks is named Peach Trees - which is the name of the city block in the new Judge Dredd film.

[;)]





danbo1138 -> RE: Dredd (2012) (21/1/2012 5:54:44 PM)

I knew what you were on about...read the BEANO as a kid...proves nothing.




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