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SWOTBM -> The British Politics Thread (29/3/2010 9:34:42 PM)

Since most of the parties are already starting their election campaigns, I thought it would be a good idea to set up a thread for events relating to the election or if people just want to discuss how they are going to vote. 

So, did anyone watch the Chancellor debate on Channel 4?  I thought they all came across pretty well (I liked Darling's quip about cross-party consensus), I would rate them Cable>Darling>Osbourne.  I really think Vince Cable would make a good Chancellor; he knows what he is talking about and he has some pretty good policies as well (he made a very convincing closing statement). It's just a shame that he probably wont get the chance to implement any of the policies (though I did read an Observer article a couple of weeks ago about Vince having talks with Treasury officials in the event of a hung Parliament). 

I dont like Nick Clegg, but I'm still going to vote Lib Dem because they have some interesting policies and I refuse to vote for Labour/Conservative




Felix -> RE: The General Election (29/3/2010 9:45:02 PM)

I'm voting for Obama.




Rinc -> RE: The General Election (29/3/2010 9:52:56 PM)

Well I believe I'll vote for a third-party candidate.

Go ahead, throw your vote away!




matty_b -> RE: The General Election (29/3/2010 10:16:58 PM)

Lib Dem at the moment, unless there's an independent candidate in my area. I've voted Labour the past two times, but don't think I can do again in all good conscience. I did something I thought I never would, and actually listened to the Tories, prepared to give them a chance, but I really, really do not like Cameron or Osbourne and get a very bad feeling from the pair of them.




Rinc -> RE: The General Election (29/3/2010 10:29:28 PM)

I have always been a Labour man, but in this election I will vote for whoever has the best chance of deposing the Tory in my constituency. That's me voting Labour then!

And there's no way the Tories will lose in my constituency. Even in 97 they still smashed it here. [:-]




sanchia -> RE: The General Election (29/3/2010 10:38:34 PM)

I have a problem in that I don't really like any of them. I need to find a nice independent.




JoeyPottr -> RE: The General Election (30/3/2010 2:47:02 AM)

Yeah like I would really discuss that here [8|]




matty_b -> RE: The General Election (30/3/2010 12:36:13 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Rinc

I have always been a Labour man, but in this election I will vote for whoever has the best chance of deposing the Tory in my constituency. That's me voting Labour then!

And there's no way the Tories will lose in my constituency. Even in 97 they still smashed it here. [:-]


Luckily I don't have that problem. Coming from a northern ex-mining village the Tories won't get a sniff round here, which is why I don't feel beholden to vote Labour to keep them out. If the BNP have a candidate here, I'd change my vote to keep them out just in case, but even if they had a candidate I can't seem doing well.




Keyser Sozzled -> RE: The General Election (30/3/2010 12:46:14 PM)

quote:

Yeah like I would really discuss that here [8|]


Then don't. Simple.

From a non UK point of view it appears that the UK electorate has to make a choice between the lesser of two evils.




shatnerhamster -> RE: The General Election (30/3/2010 12:56:46 PM)

A technical question - now that Labour and Conservatives have become exactly the same, what should they be called? Conbour? Labservatives?




moontheloon -> RE: The General Election (30/3/2010 3:07:21 PM)

I've just watched the debate. First of all where does George Osbourne get off saying there won't be a Liberal Democrat Government. With the amount of people I know who were Tory but hate Cameron, or were Labour but are dissatisfied with them I think there's always a chance, a slim one admitedly, but a chance none the less.

As for those involved, I think Darling had the toughest job of the three as he has to not only talk about what he's planning on doing in the future, but also what he has done in the last two years. I wasn't really his biggest fan before but I thought he spoke with knowledge and experience and came off very well. Vince Cable I've seen speak before and he was impressive then too, I felt as though he laid down specific plans for the future if the Lib Dems came in and came across as very knowledgeable as he is. Osbourne I felt came across awfully. After specifically ruling out the so called death tax he went on to say that no chancellor would ever rule out any tax options. He was very vague on a few areas I would love him to be more specific on. He says he supports the NHS and will put more money into it, but says it needs reform and more power in the hands of the doctors. this sounds good, but I would love to know how he plans this and what specific reforms he plans. Based purely on that debate my vote would be torn between Labour and the Lib Dems. If George Osbourne becomes our chancellor then we're screwed. If the Tories do come in in a coalition, I hope that they get Vince Cable to be chancellor as I genuinely think he'd do a good job. It was more interesting than I was expecting it to be though. Can't wait for the next two.




Flatulent_Bob -> RE: The General Election (30/3/2010 3:27:24 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: moontheloon

I've just watched the debate. First of all where does George Osbourne get off saying there won't be a Liberal Democrat Government. With the amount of people I know who were Tory but hate Cameron, or were Labour but are dissatisfied with them I think there's always a chance, a slim one admitedly, but a chance none the less.


Sorry mate, he's right there is no change in reality of us seeing a Liberal government. Although it would be funny to see them shit themselves at actually having to make the big decisions rather than sitting on the fence.

I know you can argue that if a freak series of events occur then yes they could get in but so could the BNP.




Fluke Skywalker -> RE: The General Election (30/3/2010 3:44:41 PM)

I'll be voting Lib Dem as usual - personally I hope there's a hung parliament and Vince Cable somehow becomes chancellor




moontheloon -> RE: The General Election (30/3/2010 4:04:21 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Flatulent_Bob


quote:

ORIGINAL: moontheloon

I've just watched the debate. First of all where does George Osbourne get off saying there won't be a Liberal Democrat Government. With the amount of people I know who were Tory but hate Cameron, or were Labour but are dissatisfied with them I think there's always a chance, a slim one admitedly, but a chance none the less.


Sorry mate, he's right there is no change in reality of us seeing a Liberal government. Although it would be funny to see them shit themselves at actually having to make the big decisions rather than sitting on the fence.

I know you can argue that if a freak series of events occur then yes they could get in but so could the BNP.


I'd say that there was a much better chance of us seeing a Liberal Government than a BNP government... I know the chances are very slim, but there is also the distinct chance of a Liberal coalition government, which would in effect put them in government and in a massive position of power, to rule them out as being in government seemed foolish on Osbournes part.




Fluke Skywalker -> RE: The General Election (30/3/2010 4:18:22 PM)

If there's a hung parliament they'll have a lot more of say which is a good thing considering Labour and the Tories are effectively twinned.

On another note Tony Blair has waded in - can't stand the guy but he's right about the Tories IMO

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/election-2010/7537829/Tony-Blair-Gordon-Browns-leadership-led-us-out-of-economic-peril.html




HIM -> RE: The General Election (30/3/2010 4:48:01 PM)

Possibly stupid question, but I've never voted before - either in general or local elections - so do I need to register to vote or as a British citizen am I automatically able to? How does voting work? Do I just rock up to a polling station and put a tick next to the party of my choice?

On a related note, I have no idea who I want to vote for but I do want to vote. I'm kind of sick of Labour and want them out, but I'm not sure if I want to vote for the Tories. I don't like Cameron but I dislike him less than Brown. Also, I don't want my vote to be wasted by voted for Lib Dems or UKIP or someone. Though I guess with that attitude the Labour/Tory strangehold will never be broken. Can someone give me some impartial advice? I have a cat if that makes any difference?




Tech_Noir -> RE: The General Election (30/3/2010 4:59:39 PM)

Everyone should vote for David Cameron, he has "Change" in the party slogan, just like Obama did.

Plus his wife is having a baby.




matty_b -> RE: The General Election (30/3/2010 4:59:56 PM)

HIM - I think you should first and foremost look at your own situation. How much do you earn? What profession are you currently in etc? Those types of issues very much affect the way that I look at parties - which one is going to best for me? It may sound selfish, but that's how I start. Of course, I do take into account wider policies, how they affect society in general and which ones I agree/disagree with and build my opinion from that.

Ultimately, you got to remember that you're voting for your MP, not the PM (despite what I said in my first post[:)]). I'd guess a lot of people's voting doesn't really take that into account too much, but that's the problem with the voting system we have and also leads uneducated people to trumpet "I didn't vote Blair/Brown/Cameron!" Well, no. Unless you're in their constitutency, you clearly didn't.

You should get something through the post HIM, telling you you're eligible to vote and where you can do it.




moontheloon -> RE: The General Election (30/3/2010 5:07:16 PM)

you can register to vote through the electoral commissions website. here

As for who to vote for only you can make that decision. As you've stated the two major parties are the Tories and Labour, however don't let the fact they're the two most likely to win put you off voting for someone else for fear of wasting your vote. In Parliament when it comes to a vote it doesn't always go the way the government wants it to, despite them having a majority. There will always be those in the party who may not agree with a certain policy, just as there will be those in other parties who do agree with the policy. There are party whips who will try and get those in each party to vote along the party lines, but the MPs can go against this if they wish. It can quite often be the case that a vote in Parliament will be a very close call, therefore every MPs vote can count, so I wouldn't discredit any party from having an influence.

I'm not going to tell you to vote one way or the other but I will recommend going through each parties manifesto. It's worth seeing what each party plans to do on a broad scale as far as the country is concerned. As well as looking at your individual candidates in the area, they will sometimes differ, and the candidate in your area may offer specific things for your area which will not be covered in the General manifesto. Of course if you take a specific hatred towards one group you could always use your vote tactically voting for the person most likely to keep the person you hate so much out of power, say parties X & Y were always close at the top, but you hated party Y but actually supported Party Z who had no chance of winning you might want to vote for party X as the lesser of two evils. (Sorry if that sounds condescending, didn't mean it that way).

But in the end the choice is completely up to you...




dh_19 -> RE: The General Election (30/3/2010 5:55:35 PM)

Hmmm, who to vote for...

Does anyone remember the presidential election scene in Futurama where, initially, people could only vote for the identical John Jackson or Jack Johnson? Kinda feels like that.




jediwarrior -> RE: The General Election (31/3/2010 4:43:28 PM)

I shall be voting Tory.

Down with Brown




jamesbondguy -> RE: The General Election (31/3/2010 4:59:08 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: jediwarrior

I shall be voting Tory.

Down with Brown


When we're living in the middle of the next couple of decades of dark Tory reign, I'll know who to blame, then. [;)]




matty_b -> RE: The General Election (31/3/2010 5:01:29 PM)

Does anyone else think the Tories will be regretting not giving David Davis the leadership over Cameron, now? I think he would have had a much more popular touch than Cameron, and probably avoided all the toff references that hang around him.




elab49 -> RE: The General Election (31/3/2010 5:02:10 PM)

Before deciding on voting I would genuinely recommend checking Channel 4 online and watching the Chancellors' Debate - and think very carefully if you want that young idiot in charge of the countries finance. Leave all pithy comments about current states aside, and just think of the cockups, the screwups and his basic inability to look like a grown-up beside Cable and Darling. And consider the judgement of a man who's kept him in post.




Tech_Noir -> RE: The General Election (31/3/2010 5:05:08 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: jediwarrior

I shall be voting Tory.

Down with Brown


I can picture all the young tory supporters chanting "Yes we can! Yes we can!"

Then driving back home from the rally in the new car mum and dad got them for their 18th.




Dirty Hartigan -> RE: The General Election (31/3/2010 5:11:23 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: matty_b

Does anyone else think the Tories will be regretting not giving David Davis the leadership over Cameron, now? I think he would have had a much more popular touch than Cameron, and probably avoided all the toff references that hang around him.


He seemed to have a bit more about him, yeah. He also grew up on a council estate IIRC, so any toff allegations would have been ridiculous.




jamesbondguy -> RE: The General Election (31/3/2010 5:13:41 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: elab49

Before deciding on voting I would genuinely recommend checking Channel 4 online and watching the Chancellors' Debate - and think very carefully if you want that young idiot in charge of the countries finance. Leave all pithy comments about current states aside, and just think of the cockups, the screwups and his basic inability to look like a grown-up beside Cable and Darling. And consider the judgement of a man who's kept him in post.


Osborne was actually embarrassing to watch throughout. He doesn't appear to have a single idea, or even thought, beyond the populist propaganda/barely worked-out Cameron-ite lines. The actual idea of him having a say, any kind of say, in the economy is scary.

Or, as someone else famously summed it up:

[image]http://mydavidcameron.com/images/osborne2b.jpg[/image]




matty_b -> RE: The General Election (31/3/2010 5:30:22 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: elab49

Before deciding on voting I would genuinely recommend checking Channel 4 online and watching the Chancellors' Debate - and think very carefully if you want that young idiot in charge of the countries finance. Leave all pithy comments about current states aside, and just think of the cockups, the screwups and his basic inability to look like a grown-up beside Cable and Darling. And consider the judgement of a man who's kept him in post.


This ^^^^  to the power of 1,000.




matty_b -> RE: The General Election (31/3/2010 5:31:35 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Dirty Hartigan

quote:

ORIGINAL: matty_b

Does anyone else think the Tories will be regretting not giving David Davis the leadership over Cameron, now? I think he would have had a much more popular touch than Cameron, and probably avoided all the toff references that hang around him.


He seemed to have a bit more about him, yeah. He also grew up on a council estate IIRC, so any toff allegations would have been ridiculous.



Exactly. I mean, I had never considered Tory in my life, but I have to say, I did like the look of Davis. And not just cos he looked like he could take anyone in a fight [:D]




sanchia -> RE: The General Election (31/3/2010 5:46:12 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: jamesbondguy


Osborne was actually embarrassing to watch throughout. He doesn't appear to have a single idea, or even thought, beyond the populist propaganda/barely worked-out Cameron-ite lines. The actual idea of him having a say, any kind of say, in the economy is scary.

Or, as someone else famously summed it up:

[image]http://mydavidcameron.com/images/osborne2b.jpg[/image]


Although to be fair Brown's PHD in history and lack of economic training prior to becoming Shadow Chancellor also showed a severe lack of knowledge of economics.




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